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http://www.who.int/whosis/database/c...nguage=english Look who spent twice that of Canada..... Surprise Surprise |
I dont want to pay for all you fatties ...
We pay people not to work and get fat and have babies with welfare, and now you want us to pay for their bad health as well ? |
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Under the universal system you would be down 40% at least in money spent over time. There would be time where it would be more costly due to trying to get people that neglected their health due under the old system to get healthier and practicing preventative medicine. People who say they don't want to pay for other people, you already do. In taxes you pay more than any other country per capita. In insurance costs you pay more every couple years in dues for every person in your HMO that got very sick and cost them more money then they planned for their 4th quarter profits. |
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Let me share another story with you, my Dad is a republican and he was always people going broke from health care its liberal bullshit. My Dad had started with a new company 5 months ago,did so well they had him interview for a management job ( my dad works in the ins industry).Well then the cancer came,he gets a call from his boss at the sales meeting we all prayed for you and in the next breath HR has to talk to you. Hr says we are putting you on short term disability(6 weeks) then your terminated and your health insurance is canceled you can cobra if you want. Now he is lucky he is being switched to my moms plan.Now in a family where the hubby only works, they are in a world of shit in the middle of cancer and God only knows what the cobra would of cost. This really opened his eyes.
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I am betting that his COBRA would have cost less than what they are going to pay out for his cancer treatment. |
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lets say his Mom hasn't worked in 5-10-15 years and has been raising kids and taking care of the house. she is in her 50's now. you think she can just run out and get a job that will not only pay all there bills but also allow her to take care of her sick husband. hell it took him 30-40 years to get to where they are in life, I'm sure she can run out with little to no work experience or skills and pick up right where he left off. And yes the Cobra would be cheaper but if you are a middle class person living basically paycheck to paycheck like most middle class your not going to be able to afford the Cobra either. many families lose everything they've worked for because of that exact situation his parents are in. Tony ... I wish your dad the best .. in most countries a man works all his life and comes down with an illness like that and his government and countrymen would make sure he doesn't lose what he's worked for and can get the treatment he needs without debt and worry. |
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You know what...i keep hearing about how taxes would have to be increased to bring universal healthcare to the USA, blah blah blah. And even though i don't want that ofcourse, if you think about it, with all the fucking high-ass healthcare rates i pay right now for my family, it would mostly likely come to being the same cost anyway. AND, no matter how much i currently spend right now as is, they still can deny me treatment on top of that...lol. Decisions by a CEO = Fucked....that's nothing new.
I can't give a true opinion as my research is very limited...ie; how much taxes would be increase, as compared to what i pay a month for health in it's current state, etc etc. Would be interesting to see... |
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lol..maybe? US society health care for the elderly is so fucking disgusting that words can't even make light of it. I witness this first hand with my girls father and all the issues we went through for 4 years up until his death. The best insurance, didn't make a difference...ppo, hmo AND motion picture....they fucked him every which way and then fucked him so more. You guys have no idea. We got a grade A lesson from the "school of hard knocks" on how the healthcare system works (at least in California). It's nasty, it's disgusting, and it's embarassing. |
I get my health insurance through my wife's work. We just got married and previously I was her domestic partner. That made for interesting calls to HR & the insurance companies -- I basically had to stress that I wasn't gay.
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Bumping to see if we can find one person who lives in a country with universal healthcare who thinks their country would be better off without it.
Surely they exist? |
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I actually think 'sicko' has the potential to force a few changes due to public pressure. Even being an Aussie I was pretty shocked at what I saw on it. |
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I've had the top of the line BlueCross/BlueShield insurance since college. I had to spend 2 nights in the hospital and the insurance company threatened to not pay for the 2nd night because they didn't feel it was necessary. I was just listening to what my doctors thought was best. It took a couple months of fighting with them to finally get them to pay for a portion of it. I'm not saying I support national healthcare, but saying that insurance companies don't tell doctors what to do is just being blind to our current healthcare system. |
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The far right loves fetuses but healthcare for a person thats already born?
Forget it. :1orglaugh |
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I would venture to guess most of them have systems that are not perfect yet they still wouldn't trade it in for the HMO system. |
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Probably the fundamental difference is tied to a profit element with HMO's - they exist to earn money and not surprising they try to maximize their bottom line - along with insurance companies. It has probably already mentioned - but the main users of heathcare are the elderly and it is important that they get a good level of healthcare without having to concern themselves with money. |
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So where does a person who wants to shrink the government make cuts? I'd say these are our top candidates for sure making up over 80% of the US budget. (2006 budget) Health and human services 23.1% Social security 20.5% Military 19.2% Treasury 16.6% Compare these same items to 1962 for kicks. Military 47% Social security 13% Treasury 7.9% Health and human services 3.3% So yes, I'd shrink the military. I'd shrink healthcare. I'd raise the age of retirement. I'd definitely cut down over at the IRS. |
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Anyone? :winkwink: |
A lot of people have posted in favor of universal health care using the point that they want doctors, not insurance companies making decisions.
It might work in some other countries, but the last thing I want is some far right slanted government (like we had for the first 6 years of W's admin) deciding that since the church says abortion is bad, and we should only teach abstinance that abortion and birth control are no longer covered by our health care system. Even better, I do not want the "approved" and paid for proceedures and medications to be determined by which company sent the most money to the current administration's campaign. I have dealt with the US Health care system on pretty much all level, as a welfare recipient as a child, as a soldier, as a HMO member, as a person without coverage, and as a person with a GOOD health care package. I have never been denied treatment anywhere. Yes most insurance companies suck to deal with, but dealing with the government ALWAYS sucks more. |
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Results? 29 no, 0 yes. |
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In reality, people see the value in the system, how it makes their society a better place and that it works better than the alternatives. But I suppose you would have to live in a country that had it to understand that. |
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Perhaps what is more amazing is some of the ones that can't. |
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Why stop there? We can have socialized food too. Let the government run big cafeterias. We can all show up whenever we are hungry and eat "for free". Surely some people can't afford to eat. This would make sure that no one goes hungry. |
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My head is spinning. I have an idea. Why not privatize fire departments? Better yet, why not privatize the police department? |
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Why don't you want to privatise the fire department and the police? |
There should never be room for the word “profit” when you are trying to make a decision whether or not to provide somebody care when they get sick.
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So lower taxes, cut back IRS expenses, raise the retirement age and get rid of 3-6 aircraft carriers. I'd be down with that. Where there is a reasonable opportunity for privatization of any government service I would be in favor of doing such things in test markets. Baby steps. Again, I am not in favor of no government. Nor do I think government is horrible at everything it does. UPS and Fed Ex are great services that compete against the postal service. The postal service does a great job too, No complaints there. Police and fire? I don't know how to do that from here. Education? I don't know how that can be done either. Some things we are probably stuck with. |
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If I get seriously ill my wife shouldn't have to work. I would want her by my side and the children. In the universal healthcare model, this scenario is possible. |
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I was also thrown back by her post. Someone must have hacked her account on GFY. |
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You think you have a RIGHT to healthcare? Well, fine. I think i should have a RIGHT run my business for a profit without 50 cents of every dollar I spend (federal taxes, state taxes, city taxes, property taxes, sales tax) being "redistributed". It's straight-up robbery! How far we've come since feudalism. Now instead of the local lord forcefully taking half of everything I earn a buncha dudes in Washington DC VOTE to forecfully take half of everything I own. :1orglaugh |
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Here's some information from Lance Armstrong's site: http://www.livestrong.org/site/c.jvK...nformation.htm |
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1. Having the wife get a job 2. Having good health insurance in the first place 3. Saving throughout your life so you have money to pay for your own medical care 4. Getting private donations You guys CONSTANTLY complain about how horrible the elected officials are, what horrible decisions the government makes, how they are too big and into too much, BUT you want them to come running and make decisions on your health and the health of your loved ones??!! I just don't get it. I wouldn't trust the government to take care of my dogs. :disgust |
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So you're saying that by not saving for the $500,000+ operations, it's their fault for being irresponsible? Or are you saying that we should just let people die? In a perfect world, sure.. we should be able to pay for our own healthcare. But because of the current system, hospitals have to charge 200%+ for procedures, in the hopes that HMO's will pay half of what they ask for. This drives prices up so far that it's impossible to pay the bills (for an average family). And, I know you're going to say "it's your fault for not having insurance." So what about those people that can't get decent insurance due to "pre-existing" conditions? Again, please watch the movie. It might not change your mind, but I'd at least like to hear your thoughts afterwards. I've always hated Michael Moore, but this topic was hot before he brought it into the spotlight. Most Americans have been too complacent to do anything about it, hopefully this will light a torch under our asses. |
100 commies!
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