Is this a solution for some affiliates regarding 2257?

[Paul Markham]

The law is for those with control over erotic content. So in effect if you design and host a gallery with porn, you need to have the documents ready for inspection at a place you work.

So I design the gallery, to your choice and you can put in the text, I host it on your or our URL on our servers, you have an email address connected to the URL. At no time do you have the content, control it or host it.

You submit it where you want.

Downside.
You no longer control the traffic.
Cost. It will cost more to do this and will cost you less. Something has to be done to balance this out or affiliates will be left with smaller selection of sponsors to promote.

Upside.
US affiliates stay in business.
The sponsors who do it get more traffic, but it costs more.

OK haters why will this not work?

[mikeyddddd]

It would have to be on the sponsor's domain. If it is on a US affiliate's domain, it does not matter where it is hosted. The affiliate would need the docs.

The US affiliate would not be able to display an explicit pic or crop of an explicit pic from the gallery domain on any of their domains without docs.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by mikeyddddd

It would have to be on the sponsor's domain. If it is on a US affiliate's domain, it does not matter where it is hosted. The affiliate would need the docs.

The US affiliate would not be able to display an explicit pic or crop of an explicit pic from the gallery domain on any of their domains without docs.

So I buy the domain?

Would need to be new ones. But I think it would need to new ones as well.

However the way I read the law it does not say that, but no one wants to be a test case.

Can anyone see anymore problems?

[Bloomer]

lol someones always trying to out think the thinker

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Bloomer

lol someones always trying to out think the thinker

So what are you driving at?

[Paul Markham]

Well at least no one is shooting it down, will bump it for the US guys.

[Bloomer]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

So what are you driving at?

I mean your the best Paul.
You inspire meaning into the life of all that is within me.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Bloomer

I mean your the best Paul.
You inspire meaning into the life of all that is within me.

Well so far the only solutions I've heard are these.

Give models IDs to affiliates, that's the most stupid. Can't see decent models turning up when they know their IDs are being spread like confetti and I don't see many sponsors wanting to be on the TV becasue they gave out IDs.

Do without US affiliates. Being said privately. The traffic stays the affiliates steering it are non US ones.

So what's your solution?

[vod]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

So what's your solution?

I would suggest to offer a free limited host that you own and then allow affiliates an ftp account to put there domain, files and use your video's / images etc...

[shoeaholicanon]

bump for you

[Tom_PM]

Some say it doesnt matter who owns the domain, it's the person who actually has control over the content of the domain that needs to have records. I'm sure opinions vary on that.

But if sponsor A gives me ftp access to a domain I dont own, on a host I dont pay for, BUT I can alter anything on it, I SHOULD be the one responsible, dont you think?

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by vod

I would suggest to offer a free limited host that you own and then allow affiliates an ftp account to put there domain, files and use your video's / images etc...

I suggest you run that pass a lawyer first, it might be illegal.

My understanding is the person with control over the image is the one responsible for the 2257 docs.

This is just taking FHGs to the next level, the only problem I see is if I employ someone to support webmasters how much will he cost against how much will he earn?

If I have US webmasters costing 5% to keep in business then who pays, if it's 10% it gets worse. A guy sending 10 sign ups a day asking for one gallery a day it.s not a problem. A guy asking for one gallery a day and sending 10 sign ups a month it becomes a cost.

Not looked at the cost so far just a gem of an idea.
Trust me nothing in life is free.

[NinjaSteve]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Well so far the only solutions I've heard are these.

Give models IDs to affiliates, that's the most stupid. Can't see decent models turning up when they know their IDs are being spread like confetti and I don't see many sponsors wanting to be on the TV becasue they gave out IDs.

Do without US affiliates. Being said privately. The traffic stays the affiliates steering it are non US ones.

So what's your solution?

I think everything but name and DOB is blacked out on the IDs.

[RawAlex]

Paul, news flash for you: the rules have changed, and you either have to provide model IDs (blacked out in all the good places) with your content or specifically forbid the use of the content by US based webmasters and companies.

There would appear to be no other choices at this point.

All the dancing around trying to find tricky sideways solutions to the issue won't help you out. Your competition will ship the IDs (as required) without issue, and they will take you business.

The goal posts have been moved. You have to adjust to them.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Paul, news flash for you: the rules have changed, and you either have to provide model IDs (blacked out in all the good places) with your content or specifically forbid the use of the content by US based webmasters and companies.

There would appear to be no other choices at this point.

All the dancing around trying to find tricky sideways solutions to the issue won't help you out. Your competition will ship the IDs (as required) without issue, and they will take you business.

The goal posts have been moved. You have to adjust to them.

Let my opposition ship them out and let them take the risks of being exposed for it. From a competing website, pissed off model, pissed off models boyfriend, pissed off affiliate or someone just wanting to make trouble.

How many sponsors will be giving out Jemma Jameson's or any porn stars IDs, do you see Lightspeed giving out Tawnee Stones IDs? This is of course assuming they have a model release that states they can do this. If not they are fucked. Or in court and in the US that can mean the same.

If I want to hurt a site I register, send a few sign ups, (assuming they do any vetting) ask for the models IDs and hey presto I find the models, to shoot, harass or just to give the info to a TV station. I will not do this but others will.

And for what is a sponsor giving out IDs for? To protect the little bit of traffic coming from the US affiliates living off free content. Those with big enough balls to put their address on a TGP. Let's see how much traffic that is worth.

Yes the big affiliates will comply, but for most of them, they have to find a way around the law or comply with it.

Anyone who wants to find a way around it hit me up on ICQ.

I will continue to give out IDs to customers of the content stores. Any customer who gives those IDs to an affiliate might find himself in court. It's simple I sell a license, the license says no giving out models IDs, break the license and you remove the content or go to court. I'm controlled by the law in CZ.

If you want to buy a new license that changes the first one hit me up on ICQ. I had this out with people last time it raised it's head. I stick by my license and I expect my clients to do the same.

Your goal posts were moved, you need to rethink your plan. I'm rethinking my plan and it does not need me putting models safety in jeopardy. I suggest you do the same.

Now I know a lot of sponsors will kiss your ass, while they are looking for non US people to replace you. I'm just giving it to you straight. You can go with the few sponsors who will give you models IDs, that will thin the herd fast.

[spacedog]

How's this for a plan..

Modify affiliate program TOS to include that use of FHG is to be utilized via TEXT LINKING ONLY for USA based affiliates.

Also, include stipulation that if USA based webmasters wish to host content on their own server that they must make X # of sales prior to content being given to them for this purpose & that they must remit via postal delivery a signed & notorized license agreement & non-disclosure agreement along with a copy of their photo id in order to obtain 2257 docs..

Otherwise, simply tell them to buy a $5 or $10 set.

[After Shock Media]

Paul, one very simple question.

How will a models name and date of birth put her at risk?

Please note her city, state, even country could be blocked. Along with her address, any id numbers or anything else to track someone with.

They only thing it does is blow the antiquated alias system that was primarily used as a bad attempt to side step any prosecution for obscenity laws.

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

Paul, one very simple question.

How will a models name and date of birth put her at risk?

it doesn't.. but acknowledging it deprives him of the opportunity for arguing.

[Paul Markham]

So who here wants to risk dealing with a company that will go to the wall in a few months? Imagine this scenario.

A model did work and never signed a model release that SPECIFICALLY stating his/her IDs can be given out. The model finds out the IDs are being given out. They contact a lawyer who sees a nice class action (BIG $$$$$) in the making and signs up as an affiliate, gets lots of IDs, contacts lots of models and the sponsor is sued.

It's by no means a frivolous case so the sponsor as defendant has two options. Contest it or pay out. Both very expensive.

How long before the gravy train lawyers jump on this one?

Plaintiffs lawyers have to prove damages to the plaintiff, I think the stress of being stalked covers that one.

Of course this does not include sponsors with content on a license that forbids giving out the models ID getting sued or told to take down the content.

I have been told that with a models DOB and name you can trace them and 2257 will also need proof of the day of the shoot. So a shooters location is a good indication.

I know you and I bang heads, but think of what can go wrong before making a decision. I for one would be very worried giving out models IDs to affiliates. The problems could be enormous.

If I was a US affiliate I would be worried about promoting a company that does give out IDs.

The time for a rethink is now, hard thinking is needed.

Spacedog has a solution. But if I wanted to get models IDs how many sign do I have to make before I'm allowed them? Let's face it the business is based on an open door to affiliates, most complain if you want to verify them before they get content. So this option is still tricky.

What truly amazes me is in a business plagued with scammers and cheats sponsors are meant to give out a models ID and model release to anyone who sends a few sign ups. That is not funny, it's scary.

I know this sounds harsh if it's your business under threat. But think about it this way. I will give out your ID to any affiliate I want to. Like that idea?

I had a hole torn in my ass a few years ago for posting a guys Whois info. Alex and AFS, can I post your Whois?

[Brad Mitchell]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

it doesn't.. but acknowledging it deprives him of the opportunity for arguing.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

it doesn't.. but acknowledging it deprives him of the opportunity for arguing.

Can I find a person in the US with their real name and DOB?

I think you can do this. Anyone want to chip in how it's done. I'm off to shower to go to the office.

[spacedog]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Can I find a person in the US with their real name and DOB?

I think you can do this. Anyone want to chip in how it's done. I'm off to shower to go to the office.

I know exactly how it's done. I've done plenty of searching skiptracing down bail jumpers, deadbeat dads & credit debtors & done so for 11 years & found over 95% of the people who did not want to be found.

All the tools used for this are cross referenced to multiple indexes & with your name & date of birth I can obtain your SSN, your drivers license #, your vehicle registration info, professional license info, hunting license info, last known addresses going back to 20 years, as well as all the same info for your entire family, as well as any business info, locate owned real estate as well as your entire credit history & all the account numbers, your unpublished phone numbers too & even your cell phone numbers & even aliases & akas

[Pleasurepays]

Paul... please stop being a moron. if you dont want to give out sanitized ID's... don't give out sanitized ID's. its your business. the adult industry isn't going to base its behavior on what you do and don't do and they DEFINATELY aren't going to modify their behavior based on your mind numbingly moronic rants. There are still hosted galleries, non 2257 thumbs, text links etc.

That terrible swooooshing noise you hear isn't the sky falling, its the sound of the collective IQ of this forum plummeting with each word you post.

the good news is that no one really needs ID's from you. they can just buy content from your competitors. they will probably have great big "Paul is a Jackass" sales.

Listening to you babble about anything serious (besides shooting content) is like listening listening to a retarded 3rd grader who hasn't slept in a week, give lectures on quantum physics.

[Pleasurepays]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Can I find a person in the US with their real name and DOB?

I think you can do this. Anyone want to chip in how it's done. I'm off to shower to go to the office.

sure. you can also find hobbits and unicorns here in the magical kingdom of information. there are no state and federal privacy laws... you can just look them up in the universal hobbit and unicorn registry of america.

[After Shock Media]

A name and date of birth far from risks anyone from stalking let alone stress unless that very person also goes through life never telling anyone their real name.

Then again maybe those money hungry lawyers may want to target the fast food industry for obtaining social security numbers to ensure those applying for jobs are allowed to work in the US. Anyone shmuck that happens to be a manager or hell even an assistant manager of one of those places can not only stalk those poor women yet steal their identies and learn much much more. Specially considering there are more fast food managers and assistant managers in the US than adult webmasters. Yet oh yeah, they collect those numbers because it is required by law. Hmm wonder if I can typically be sued for following the law.

[UncutBucksMike]

In most cases you would have a name, year of birth and know the state where the ID was issued. You could reasonably assume that the person must at some time have lived in that state. With that info, you could do a search at someplace like http://www.zabasearch.com/ which then leads to paid background checks that could be purchased.

[pussyluver]

Paul, Do you have a US law degree? Do you practice law in the US with a speciality anywhere near the subject? Didn't think so.

If you intend to do biz in the US in this now sensitive area, I suggest you hire a US attorney to advise you. Then you can stop wasting time with the speculation.

[candyflip]

Charly is a douche.

[PowerCum]

Well, there be law problems against that.

For example... here in Spain it would be ilegal to share the model IDS because it breaks the local laws. Our solution is to offer free hosting to our affiliates (under their own domains).