Hey Anthony RE:MMA - GoFuckYourself.com

After Shock Media · 01-26-2007, 12:20 PM

We have never really spoke much, just occasional passing in threads. You seem to have great insight and understanding of the assorted MMA type organizations (UFC, Pride, so forth). You also seem to be able to explain things a little better to some of us that are really just getting into this sport as a spectator.

I have been watching this for the last year. Used to watch it years ago when anything went like repeated punches to the family jewels ect. Before it was banned or whatever.

Ok naturally I have seen the numerous arguments on here in regards to UFC fighters and Pride fighters. Now I will admit I have not caught any Pride fights myself. So I felt I would ask something here to better understand something. I do get that Pride uses a few different rules and a more boxing style ring.

After watching the UFC fight last night on Spike TV. They were bringing in (introducing) a former Pride fighter into his first UFC fight. Everyone had speculated that his opponent was meant to be a easy victim. Now anyone that watched the fight also watched what appeared to be an average at best UFC fighter manhandle and just out right dominate the former Pride fighter. It became painfully obvious that the former Pride fighter was actually acting like a pussy begging the referee to stand them back up. The former Pride fighter aside from having no noticeable ground game in the least, it also was very apparent he had zero take down defense as well. Of course he bitched to Rogan at the end of the fight about wanting to stand and fight and this is not supposed to be some wrestling match.

Now having watched such fighters as Lidel and such who are strikers and do not want shit on the ground. All of them seem to have very strong take down defenses as well as at least ok to decent ground defense. They know how to keep a fight on their feet.

So I ask is this a look into what I should expect when other Pride fighters come into the UFC, is stand up the norm and expected there? Do they possess ground skills or at least take down defenses? Yeah I know even I appreciate a good knockout, but I appreciate a good submission or ground and pound just as much. Was this a fluke, or a wake up call to some to get some more ground training?

K thanks for your time.

CybermedAndy · 01-26-2007, 12:24 PM

He was alarmingly out of shape, who knows why

Heath was once an A list fighter. Too many years in Holland training, obviously he's ignored his ground game. imo

01-26-2007, 12:26 PM

Who was the Pride fighter in question? I missed this fight.

After Shock Media · 01-26-2007, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by evildick

Who was the Pride fighter in question? I missed this fight.

As stated above, Heath.

Doctor Dre · 01-26-2007, 12:40 PM

You are comparing to Lidell...

Just to give you an example, Rampage won to Lidell. Lidell's corner threw in the towel... he was owned REALLY badly from A to Z. You can watch the fight on youtube, it's a great fight.

Heath Hearing was a Pride B fighter. A couple ago he lost a championship fight to Noguerra. I like him but he's never gonna be a champ

I wanna see the fight now

After Shock Media · 01-26-2007, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor Dre

Ugh ? Where did you see that fight ? Rampage lost ?

You are comparing him to Lidell...

Just to give you an example, Rampage won to Lidell. Lidell's corner threw in the towel... he was owned REALLY badly from A to Z. You can watch the fight on youtube, it's a great fight.

No no I am not comparring him to Lidell. I was saying Lidell likes to strike, that is what he is good at. So he has in my eyes at least developed a great take down defense to keep the fight standing up.

Doctor Dre · 01-26-2007, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoneyBetsAndy

He was alarmingly out of shape, who knows why

Heath was once an A list fighter. Too many years in Holland training, obviously he's ignored his ground game. imo

He had a pretty good ground game... He was B+ at most... Once he lost the Pride org started getting much better. (I have seen every fight in the Pride org since the beginning... all the DVDs at home)

Doctor Dre · 01-26-2007, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

No no I am not comparring him to Lidell. I was saying Lidell likes to strike, that is what he is good at. So he has in my eyes at least developed a great take down defense to keep the fight standing up.

I editted my post... thought you were talking about Rampage at first...

Just watch Crocop come in the ring next UFC... and Rampage. That will give you a good example.

After Shock Media · 01-26-2007, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor Dre

I editted my post... thought you were talking about Rampage at first...

Just watch Crocop come in the ring next UFC... and Rampage. That will give you a good example.

I hope so cause damn the guy heath lost too was not in my opinion even that good of a UFC fighter and it was like big time domination.

Doctor Dre · 01-26-2007, 12:49 PM

P.S. If I remember right the championship fight for Heath VS Noguerra was at Pride 17. (same time as Saku's loss to Wanderlei). At that time there was no other championships in pride then there normal event except the GP so this was like the 19 or 20th event... There have been 45+ events since that happened... so claiming he was an A fighter isn't really what it is... He was a good fighter a long time ago, and the sport has changed a LOT since then.

I could see him getting back in shape and giving UFC heavyweight fighters a run for their money thought.

After Shock Media · 01-26-2007, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor Dre

I could see him getting back in shape and giving UFC heavyweight fighters a run for their money thought.

If you saw the fight he needs a lot more than getting into shape or he may have a hard time giving a highschool varsity wrestler a run for his money.

Lance69 · 01-26-2007, 02:48 PM

I think he was way out of shape, but that said he has never been a top tier fighter. There have always been holes in his game.
He was just brought in as advertising draw in my eyes. Due to that pre-fight knockout of the Japanese guy who kissed him.
Wait for Cro Cop, and Ramage. Well mostly Crocop! Did I mention by the end of '07 he'll be the HW and the LHW champ? (Or well on the way if the UFC drags it's feet?)

dig420 · 01-26-2007, 02:51 PM

I know Heath, I've trained with him at Las Vegas Combat Club. He's a bad dude and once was one of the baddest and has a very solid ground game, but coming in out of shape will get you killed against any fighter who's prepared and motivated.

After Shock Media · 01-26-2007, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dig420

I know Heath, I've trained with him at Las Vegas Combat Club. He's a bad dude and once was one of the baddest and has a very solid ground game, but coming in out of shape will get you killed against any fighter who's prepared and motivated.

By all accounts it looks like he could hit very well.
I was just taken a back by what looked like zero defense and him actually pleading to the ref to stand them up.

Poor man was on his back or on all fours more often than the only hooker in a 5 mile radius of a naval ship during shore leave.

01-26-2007, 12:20 PM	#1
After Shock Media It's coming look busy Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn". Posts: 35,299	Hey Anthony RE:MMA We have never really spoke much, just occasional passing in threads. You seem to have great insight and understanding of the assorted MMA type organizations (UFC, Pride, so forth). You also seem to be able to explain things a little better to some of us that are really just getting into this sport as a spectator. I have been watching this for the last year. Used to watch it years ago when anything went like repeated punches to the family jewels ect. Before it was banned or whatever. Ok naturally I have seen the numerous arguments on here in regards to UFC fighters and Pride fighters. Now I will admit I have not caught any Pride fights myself. So I felt I would ask something here to better understand something. I do get that Pride uses a few different rules and a more boxing style ring. After watching the UFC fight last night on Spike TV. They were bringing in (introducing) a former Pride fighter into his first UFC fight. Everyone had speculated that his opponent was meant to be a easy victim. Now anyone that watched the fight also watched what appeared to be an average at best UFC fighter manhandle and just out right dominate the former Pride fighter. It became painfully obvious that the former Pride fighter was actually acting like a pussy begging the referee to stand them back up. The former Pride fighter aside from having no noticeable ground game in the least, it also was very apparent he had zero take down defense as well. Of course he bitched to Rogan at the end of the fight about wanting to stand and fight and this is not supposed to be some wrestling match. Now having watched such fighters as Lidel and such who are strikers and do not want shit on the ground. All of them seem to have very strong take down defenses as well as at least ok to decent ground defense. They know how to keep a fight on their feet. So I ask is this a look into what I should expect when other Pride fighters come into the UFC, is stand up the norm and expected there? Do they possess ground skills or at least take down defenses? Yeah I know even I appreciate a good knockout, but I appreciate a good submission or ground and pound just as much. Was this a fluke, or a wake up call to some to get some more ground training? K thanks for your time. __________________ [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

01-26-2007, 12:24 PM	#2
CybermedAndy Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Vancouver Posts: 4,170	He was alarmingly out of shape, who knows why Heath was once an A list fighter. Too many years in Holland training, obviously he's ignored his ground game. imo __________________ Add some upsell items to your pages here!

01-26-2007, 02:48 PM	#12
Lance69 Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 2,266	I think he was way out of shape, but that said he has never been a top tier fighter. There have always been holes in his game. He was just brought in as advertising draw in my eyes. Due to that pre-fight knockout of the Japanese guy who kissed him. Wait for Cro Cop, and Ramage. Well mostly Crocop! Did I mention by the end of '07 he'll be the HW and the LHW champ? (Or well on the way if the UFC drags it's feet?) __________________ Sonarcash Competitive Content Shooting Handgasm HD Handjobs Janessa Jordan Ultimate Wife Make Money Fucking Blog ICQ: 307 975 028 lance {at} sonarcash {dot} com (<- Need amateur content? Email or ICQ)

01-26-2007, 12:26 PM	#3
evildick Guest Posts: n/a	Who was the Pride fighter in question? I missed this fight.

01-26-2007, 02:51 PM	#13
dig420 Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 9,240	I know Heath, I've trained with him at Las Vegas Combat Club. He's a bad dude and once was one of the baddest and has a very solid ground game, but coming in out of shape will get you killed against any fighter who's prepared and motivated.