Hentai and 2257A: Is there a record requirement? - GoFuckYourself.com

gox · 11-20-2006, 10:05 AM

Hey guys, I'm a long time lurker, first time poster.

I was wondering if anyone know whether 2257A applies to hentai. For the last couple of years, people have always said that 2257 doesn't apply because how can you get consent forms and ID from a cartoon right?

But now with the "simulated" language of 2257A, I'm not so sure. Is there a place (an attorney's website perhaps?) that has a definitive answer to this?

I've heard several rumors floating around. I think on one podcast, an attorney said that 2257A doesn't apply to hentai unless your characters are photorealistic.

Of course, a lot of hentai programs are advertising themselves as the "no hassel affiliate program" because supposedly they claim 2257 and 2257A don't apply.

I'm so confused. Help!

marko13 · 11-20-2006, 10:08 AM

welcomen to gfy... and i think the 2257 for hentai is not requered...

BoyAlley · 11-20-2006, 10:09 AM

Uhm, you've got to be kidding, right? You're asking if you need to get a government issued ID from your cartoon characters and keep it on file to prove that they were 18 or older at the time of coloring?

Am I getting this right?

I guess if you're actually concerned about this, like, for real, you could always draw them driver's license to go along with the sketches you make...

pornguy · 11-20-2006, 10:09 AM

I think instead of asking here, you should speak with an attorney.

munki · 11-20-2006, 10:11 AM

All toons must be over the age of 18+, and have current photo id as of time being drawn/rendered.

pornguy · 11-20-2006, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyAlley

Uhm, you've got to be kidding, right? You're asking if you need to get a government issued ID from your cartoon characters and keep it on file to prove that they were 18 or older at the time of coloring?

Am I getting this right?

I guess if you're actually concerned about this, like, for real, you could always draw them driver's license to go along with the sketches you make...

Actually BA its not that bad of a question. There was a woman that was arrested because some stories on her site talked about a minor having sex.

With the disclaimer that the stories were all fictional

GooSearch · 11-20-2006, 10:15 AM

hentai i doubt it...

Theo · 11-20-2006, 10:16 AM

toons need to sign releases

gox · 11-20-2006, 10:26 AM

Thank you for the great answers and for the warm welcome guys!

I expected a little hazing for asking this question. IDs for toons: that really sounds ridiculous! :D

However, 2257A is a brand new regulation. I found this comment from an attorney on this subject:

Quote:

Of course, this is a brand new law, and no part of it has yet been tested, however, as I read the law, the simulation part still refers to and requires a real live person. In otherwords, it is protecting against the situation where someone takes the image of a real child, and then manipulates that image to simulate an explicit act with that child.

Again, this has to be tested, and I’m sure that it will be, but provided that the Lolikon or Lolicon in question are truly animations, and not based even remotely on a real person, then the existence of them alone should not trigger the Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act of 2006.
Source: dearesq (sorry, I don't have authority to post links yet)

Sounds like this attorney thinks it is unlikely that hentai/lolicon will require record keeping. But she doesn't know for sure, nor does anyone else, because this law is relatively new and untested.

On rumor I heard is that the more realistic your character is, the more likely you will have to keep records.

Obviously, we can't have actual ID or records. But I heard (rumors again) maybe you need to keep records of the artist and their statement that their work is in no way based no an actual minor.

pornguy · 11-20-2006, 10:29 AM

I think that your best bet is to talk with an attorney. Then keep recorde of where you got the content, or who drew it. Cover your ass.

BoyAlley · 11-20-2006, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornguy

Actually BA its not that bad of a question. There was a woman that was arrested because some stories on her site talked about a minor having sex.

With the disclaimer that the stories were all fictional

She was arrested for obscenity, not 2257.

WiredGuy · 11-20-2006, 11:01 AM

Who would you get the release from, the cartoon artist?
WG

pornguy · 11-20-2006, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyAlley

She was arrested for obscenity, not 2257.

Yeah I recall that now, but keeping any and all docs that you can is always a good practice. In this industry we have all learned that the VERY BEST THING TO DO IS SPEAK WITH AN ATTORNEY FIRST!

crockett · 11-20-2006, 12:07 PM

Yes you must prove the artist was over 18

Pleasurepays · 11-20-2006, 12:20 PM

oh my god.

hahahahahaha

someone is asking if he needs a government issued ID from a cartoon and others are arguing that he might.

this biz cracks me up.

jesus!!!

Pleasurepays · 11-20-2006, 12:32 PM

if you had any smarts, you would add a layer of protection by drawing a cartoon and then designate him to be the Custodian of Records.

MyNameIsNobody · 11-20-2006, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyAlley

...at the time of coloring?

HAHAHA!

RyuLion · 11-20-2006, 12:49 PM

Ask your attorney damn it!

L-Pink · 11-20-2006, 01:49 PM

Are you fucking goofy?

gox · 11-21-2006, 01:28 AM

Speaking of attorneys, does anyone have a recommendation for one in the Los Angeles area?

How much does a decent attorney charge for a consultation? A retainer?

fallenmuffin · 11-21-2006, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyAlley

..to prove that they were 18 or older at the time of coloring?

OMG

StickyGreen · 11-21-2006, 01:30 AM

lmfao..........

Pleasurepays · 11-21-2006, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gox

Speaking of attorneys, does anyone have a recommendation for one in the Los Angeles area?

How much does a decent attorney charge for a consultation? A retainer?

will you be paying in real currency, or just currency you draw?

bobby666 · 11-21-2006, 01:33 AM

you are not allowed to use new cartoons for 18 years ! so take a break :-)

NemesisEnforcer · 11-21-2006, 02:40 AM

The hand of an artist can capture an image. The law applies in the sense that you use the exempt language and state why you?re exempt, i.e. fictional, does not represent anyone known, etc.

An attorney can give you the proper language if you?re uncomfortable with making the statement.

HomeFry · 11-21-2006, 02:43 AM

Not the brightest bulb in the bunch.

Kimo · 11-21-2006, 03:20 AM

lol move along noob

King of Queens · 11-21-2006, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

will you be paying in real currency, or just currency you draw?

11-20-2006, 10:05 AM	#1
gox Registered User Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 3	Hentai and 2257A: Is there a record requirement? Hey guys, I'm a long time lurker, first time poster. I was wondering if anyone know whether 2257A applies to hentai. For the last couple of years, people have always said that 2257 doesn't apply because how can you get consent forms and ID from a cartoon right? But now with the "simulated" language of 2257A, I'm not so sure. Is there a place (an attorney's website perhaps?) that has a definitive answer to this? I've heard several rumors floating around. I think on one podcast, an attorney said that 2257A doesn't apply to hentai unless your characters are photorealistic. Of course, a lot of hentai programs are advertising themselves as the "no hassel affiliate program" because supposedly they claim 2257 and 2257A don't apply. I'm so confused. Help!

11-20-2006, 10:08 AM	#2
marko13 Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: www.lvpshosting.com Posts: 7,512	welcomen to gfy... and i think the 2257 for hentai is not requered... __________________ We are responsible for your hosting ... Enjoy in your life. Shared hosting from $3.95 Europe Linux VPS plans from $11.37 http://www.LVPSHosting.com

11-20-2006, 10:09 AM	#3
BoyAlley So Fucking Gay Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 19,714	Uhm, you've got to be kidding, right? You're asking if you need to get a government issued ID from your cartoon characters and keep it on file to prove that they were 18 or older at the time of coloring? Am I getting this right? I guess if you're actually concerned about this, like, for real, you could always draw them driver's license to go along with the sketches you make... Last edited by BoyAlley; 11-20-2006 at 10:11 AM..

11-20-2006, 10:09 AM	#4
pornguy Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Homeless Posts: 62,911	I think instead of asking here, you should speak with an attorney. __________________ PornGuy skype me pornguy_epic AmateurDough The Hottes Shemales online! TChicks.com \| Angeles Cid \| Mariana Cordoba \| MAILERS WELCOME!

11-20-2006, 10:11 AM	#5
munki Do Fun Shit. Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OC Posts: 13,393	All toons must be over the age of 18+, and have current photo id as of time being drawn/rendered. __________________ “I have the simplest tastes. I am always satisfied with the best.” -Oscar Wilde

11-20-2006, 10:15 AM	#7
GooSearch Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: FLA Posts: 2,538	hentai i doubt it... __________________ GooSearch Real Text Ads Without The Drama Coming Back Bigger and Better Then Ever

11-20-2006, 10:16 AM	#8
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	toons need to sign releases

11-20-2006, 10:29 AM	#10
pornguy Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Homeless Posts: 62,911	I think that your best bet is to talk with an attorney. Then keep recorde of where you got the content, or who drew it. Cover your ass. __________________ PornGuy skype me pornguy_epic AmateurDough The Hottes Shemales online! TChicks.com \| Angeles Cid \| Mariana Cordoba \| MAILERS WELCOME!

11-20-2006, 11:01 AM	#12
WiredGuy Pounding Googlebot Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 34,482	Who would you get the release from, the cartoon artist? WG __________________ I play with Google.

11-20-2006, 12:07 PM	#14
crockett in a van by the river Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 76,806	Yes you must prove the artist was over 18 __________________ In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.

11-20-2006, 12:20 PM	#15
Pleasurepays BANNED - SUPPORTING TUBES Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I live in a pile of boogers Posts: 11,913	oh my god. hahahahahaha someone is asking if he needs a government issued ID from a cartoon and others are arguing that he might. this biz cracks me up. jesus!!!

11-20-2006, 12:32 PM	#16
Pleasurepays BANNED - SUPPORTING TUBES Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I live in a pile of boogers Posts: 11,913	if you had any smarts, you would add a layer of protection by drawing a cartoon and then designate him to be the Custodian of Records.

11-20-2006, 12:49 PM	#18
RyuLion ClubDomCash.com Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: San Diego Posts: 32,265	Ask your attorney damn it! __________________ Adult Biz Consultant A tech head since 1995

11-20-2006, 01:49 PM	#19
L-Pink working on my tan Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Florida/Kentucky Posts: 39,151	Are you fucking goofy?

11-21-2006, 01:28 AM	#20
gox Registered User Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 3	Speaking of attorneys, does anyone have a recommendation for one in the Los Angeles area? How much does a decent attorney charge for a consultation? A retainer?

11-21-2006, 01:30 AM	#22
StickyGreen . Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 13,076	lmfao.......... __________________ Refer Cam Girls and Take Home 10% of Everything They Make For Life

11-21-2006, 01:33 AM	#24
bobby666 boots are my religion Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Heart of europe Posts: 21,765	you are not allowed to use new cartoons for 18 years ! so take a break :-) __________________

11-21-2006, 02:40 AM	#25
NemesisEnforcer Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vegas and Los Angeles Posts: 2,122	The hand of an artist can capture an image. The law applies in the sense that you use the exempt language and state why you?re exempt, i.e. fictional, does not represent anyone known, etc. An attorney can give you the proper language if you?re uncomfortable with making the statement.

11-21-2006, 02:43 AM	#26
HomeFry Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 1,062	Not the brightest bulb in the bunch.

11-21-2006, 03:20 AM	#27
Kimo ... Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Maryland ICQ:87038677 Posts: 11,542	lol move along noob __________________ ...