How to structure pricing and referral %s? - GoFuckYourself.com

gothweb · 06-30-2002, 02:24 PM

I have been here for just a few days, but I recenty saw a post on a topic that got me thinking. The issue is pricing levels and how much of a payout to offer. My basic question is what we should charge for membership, and how much we should offer referrers. I guess I should start with some background.

My two sites are both based wholly on original content, made by me, with only occasional guests for cross-promotion. We are positioned mostly in the "personal artistic erotica" area, something starting to do well, but we're still finding our feet. These aren't sites with tons of traffic, licensed content, and so forth. We don't offer outside video feeds and pics, as most of our customers associate those features with annoying "corporate porn" sites.

We currently offer only 25% as a base rate for our referral program. I gather that most people on GFY are in markets where much higher rates are expected. However, referral traffic is a bit different in our area, I think. Most partners are people with related sites who would link us anyhow, so a high rate could be tough on us. Rather than feature a high rate, we offer to up the rate if people are interested in sending good traffic to make money off of our referral program.

So, my first question is: What should our referral rate be? Will raising it make a difference, if it isn't the sort of site where the referral program catches a lot of outside webmaster attention?

That leads into pricing. The more we offer partners, the more we need to charge. Right now, our standard monthly price for both sites is $16.95, with sales and multi-month memberships costing less, etc. We do not offer a trial, and don't intend to. My worry is that if we charge more, we price ourselves out of the market, as we compete with individual amateur sites, and other personal erotica sites, that charge $15-20 most of the time.

Then again, I see so many sites charging $39.95 or whatever per month. So I am curious what this sort of rate would do to our sales... The sites make just enough to live on, so I'm wary of risking a month's food-money to try out anything drastic.

Any thoughts on pricing and referral payout for sites like ours?

The urls for the sites, if anyone wants to look for more detail, are...
http://www.blood-dolls.com/
and
http://www.gothicamateur.com

--Ian X.

Jak · 06-30-2002, 03:10 PM

Hey we're going through the same thought processes right now. I'm coding our referral program web site even as we speak.

In our case it's been difficult coming up with a good referral percentage because of the nature of our product. It's a one time software purchase and we don't have a recurring plan just yet.

We have a free downloadable demo on the site and so far (since we launched last week) sales have been really good at a demo download-to-purchase ratio of 1:55. We'll have other girls available soon and a lot of our customers have emailed letting me know that they're looking forward to the new ones. The software sells for $19.97 and so far everyone seems to like what they get. We got a great review the other day at one site so that helps out for anyone joining our referral program because the more good reviews we get the more people will know about the software.

We're going to start with a 30-40% commission on all referred sales. It's hard to come up with a good figure because a lot of the larger places are offering insane payouts that we just can't compete with yet. At the same time we can't go too low or no one will want to promote us. The way we basically have to figure is that these are sales we probably wouldn't get otherwise so it's not really as if it's money lost. We want people who promote us to feel like they can make some serious cash.

Anyway I'm very interested to hear what you come up with. I should be done coding our "Kitten Cash" program site today so we'll see how that does. It's comforting to know we're not the only ones wrestling with this subject.

- Jak

Theo · 06-30-2002, 03:15 PM

don't start with less than 50% if you are seriously looking for webmasters.

Jak · 06-30-2002, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel
don't start with less than 50% if you are seriously looking for webmasters.

Here's a question...

If we offer 50%, which is entirely possible and something we have thought of, after our CC processing cost comes into play we'd actually make less per sale than the referrer did. If we had a recurring plan that wouldn't really matter but since our software is a one time purchase it's more of an issue.

We do however want to offer something that will make people want to promote (obviously). If 40% isn't enough then we'll have to go with 50. Not too big of a deal but it's the first time we've run an affiliate plan for any of our software so it's a little bit of a nervewracking process.

- Jak

PS - Gothweb - sorry to jump into the thread like this, lol.

Wizzo · 06-30-2002, 03:56 PM

Most Sites make much less on a member, than the webmaster reffering the sale, but they make up for it in mass volume...

TFCash · 06-30-2002, 04:06 PM

You could also start another site with the same content and use that as your partner site. Charge a higher rate and thus you can offer to payout more

Dax · 06-30-2002, 04:41 PM

In short:

The more $ the webmasters make, the more webmasters that will sign up.

If you pay $1 per sign up, but the conversions are 1:10 then you will get a lot of webmasters. If you pay $80 sign up but your conversions are 1:50'000 I do not think many ppl would push your program.

You should try some beta testers, and then from that take a clue and make a decision!

beemk · 06-30-2002, 04:49 PM

the affiliate doesnt always make more. do you think everyone gives the webmaster that referred the member money for the upsells. assuming you are going to be doing some upselling....

nocostporn · 06-30-2002, 04:52 PM

nobody will promote you for 50% of $16.95... Just not worth it.. so you will either have to hike up your product cost or give a larger percentage...

partnership you should always make less than the webmaster...just the way it is until you switch to per signup payout and then your in business

good luck

gothweb · 06-30-2002, 05:09 PM

Where does this trend come from? I understand that it is what a lot of people expect, and therefore something people will often have to do... but how did it get that way?

I guess what I am asking is this: Why should someone make more money for putting up a link, than I do for shooting the photos, prepping the photos, building the website, and updating the website?

Yes, I know it is the way it is. But I think the way it is is on crack.

Mr.Fiction · 06-30-2002, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gothweb
Where does this trend come from? I understand that it is what a lot of people expect, and therefore something people will often have to do... but how did it get that way?

I guess what I am asking is this: Why should someone make more money for putting up a link, than I do for shooting the photos, prepping the photos, building the website, and updating the website?

Yes, I know it is the way it is. But I think the way it is is on crack.

Why does Walmart make more on a product than the guy who made it in a third world country? Why does a record label make more than a band? Why do you make more than your models? Why is the sky blue?

Tipsy · 06-30-2002, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gothweb
Where does this trend come from? I understand that it is what a lot of people expect, and therefore something people will often have to do... but how did it get that way?

I guess what I am asking is this: Why should someone make more money for putting up a link, than I do for shooting the photos, prepping the photos, building the website, and updating the website?

Yes, I know it is the way it is. But I think the way it is is on crack.

It's been explained I thought. You earn less than the individual webmaster, but the volume should more than make up.

However, it's all money you simply would not have otherwise so why the confusion? A guy spends his time getting traffic to your site (and often money too) to get you a signup he deserves the reward. As long as it costs you less in BW/admin than you earn from the signup where's the problem? Again, it's a signup you would not have had without him. He's done the work to get the sale (other than your tour pages) and you've done little other than sit back and say 'thanks for the extra $'s '. You can't really lose.

gothweb · 06-30-2002, 05:23 PM

More traffic = more bandwidth = higher expenses. It's not like I can know in advance if the traffic converts well, and I don't want to get hit with empty traffic because I offered a high payout.

I mean, I do get what you are saying. This is just the counterpoint. My real question is, even given all that you have said, is it really reasonable that the standard is now "the referrer should make more than the provider"?

I would say that's a pretty sad sign of how corporate porn is getting. I mean, I'm not the only person on this list who makes his own content, am I? This must seem a little odd to other people. Shouldn't the money in a creative industry be going to creative people, too?

That said, I am glad to offer 50% to anyone who can sent good traffic... I'd even take a shot and say I'd offer it based on *lots* of traffic (there is a difference) coming from people from GFY. Any takers? My sites are unique niche sites that convert well if sent good traffic.

06-30-2002, 02:24 PM	#1
gothweb Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Back in the USSA Posts: 8,849	How to structure pricing and referral %s? I have been here for just a few days, but I recenty saw a post on a topic that got me thinking. The issue is pricing levels and how much of a payout to offer. My basic question is what we should charge for membership, and how much we should offer referrers. I guess I should start with some background. My two sites are both based wholly on original content, made by me, with only occasional guests for cross-promotion. We are positioned mostly in the "personal artistic erotica" area, something starting to do well, but we're still finding our feet. These aren't sites with tons of traffic, licensed content, and so forth. We don't offer outside video feeds and pics, as most of our customers associate those features with annoying "corporate porn" sites. We currently offer only 25% as a base rate for our referral program. I gather that most people on GFY are in markets where much higher rates are expected. However, referral traffic is a bit different in our area, I think. Most partners are people with related sites who would link us anyhow, so a high rate could be tough on us. Rather than feature a high rate, we offer to up the rate if people are interested in sending good traffic to make money off of our referral program. So, my first question is: What should our referral rate be? Will raising it make a difference, if it isn't the sort of site where the referral program catches a lot of outside webmaster attention? That leads into pricing. The more we offer partners, the more we need to charge. Right now, our standard monthly price for both sites is $16.95, with sales and multi-month memberships costing less, etc. We do not offer a trial, and don't intend to. My worry is that if we charge more, we price ourselves out of the market, as we compete with individual amateur sites, and other personal erotica sites, that charge $15-20 most of the time. Then again, I see so many sites charging $39.95 or whatever per month. So I am curious what this sort of rate would do to our sales... The sites make just enough to live on, so I'm wary of risking a month's food-money to try out anything drastic. Any thoughts on pricing and referral payout for sites like ours? The urls for the sites, if anyone wants to look for more detail, are... http://www.blood-dolls.com/ and http://www.gothicamateur.com --Ian X.

06-30-2002, 03:10 PM	#2
Jak So Fucking Banned Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: ripenedpeach.com Posts: 1,143	Hey we're going through the same thought processes right now. I'm coding our referral program web site even as we speak. In our case it's been difficult coming up with a good referral percentage because of the nature of our product. It's a one time software purchase and we don't have a recurring plan just yet. We have a free downloadable demo on the site and so far (since we launched last week) sales have been really good at a demo download-to-purchase ratio of 1:55. We'll have other girls available soon and a lot of our customers have emailed letting me know that they're looking forward to the new ones. The software sells for $19.97 and so far everyone seems to like what they get. We got a great review the other day at one site so that helps out for anyone joining our referral program because the more good reviews we get the more people will know about the software. We're going to start with a 30-40% commission on all referred sales. It's hard to come up with a good figure because a lot of the larger places are offering insane payouts that we just can't compete with yet. At the same time we can't go too low or no one will want to promote us. The way we basically have to figure is that these are sales we probably wouldn't get otherwise so it's not really as if it's money lost. We want people who promote us to feel like they can make some serious cash. Anyway I'm very interested to hear what you come up with. I should be done coding our "Kitten Cash" program site today so we'll see how that does. It's comforting to know we're not the only ones wrestling with this subject. - Jak Last edited by Jak; 06-30-2002 at 03:11 PM..

06-30-2002, 03:56 PM	#5
Wizzo 2011 GFY Hall of Fame! Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Back in Texas! Posts: 15,224	Most Sites make much less on a member, than the webmaster reffering the sale, but they make up for it in mass volume... __________________ Looking for Opportunity!

06-30-2002, 04:49 PM	#8
beemk CLICK HERE Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 20,829	the affiliate doesnt always make more. do you think everyone gives the webmaster that referred the member money for the upsells. assuming you are going to be doing some upselling.... __________________ I host with Vacares

06-30-2002, 04:52 PM	#9
nocostporn Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Maryland Posts: 5,228	nobody will promote you for 50% of $16.95... Just not worth it.. so you will either have to hike up your product cost or give a larger percentage... partnership you should always make less than the webmaster...just the way it is until you switch to per signup payout and then your in business good luck __________________ CashTheChecks.com -coming soon- "Exclusive sites for Exclusive Webmasters" ICQ-119966868,add me first don't message

06-30-2002, 03:15 PM	#3
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	don't start with less than 50% if you are seriously looking for webmasters.

06-30-2002, 04:06 PM	#6
TFCash Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 1,738	You could also start another site with the same content and use that as your partner site. Charge a higher rate and thus you can offer to payout more

06-30-2002, 04:41 PM	#7
Dax Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: USA Posts: 3,161	In short: The more $ the webmasters make, the more webmasters that will sign up. If you pay $1 per sign up, but the conversions are 1:10 then you will get a lot of webmasters. If you pay $80 sign up but your conversions are 1:50'000 I do not think many ppl would push your program. You should try some beta testers, and then from that take a clue and make a decision!

06-30-2002, 05:09 PM	#10
gothweb Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Back in the USSA Posts: 8,849	Where does this trend come from? I understand that it is what a lot of people expect, and therefore something people will often have to do... but how did it get that way? I guess what I am asking is this: Why should someone make more money for putting up a link, than I do for shooting the photos, prepping the photos, building the website, and updating the website? Yes, I know it is the way it is. But I think the way it is is on crack. __________________ Photos by Ian X.: Distinctive photos of goth babes. Blood Money:Your traffic, my sites, our money. MojoHost: Still the best.

06-30-2002, 05:23 PM	#13
gothweb Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Back in the USSA Posts: 8,849	More traffic = more bandwidth = higher expenses. It's not like I can know in advance if the traffic converts well, and I don't want to get hit with empty traffic because I offered a high payout. I mean, I do get what you are saying. This is just the counterpoint. My real question is, even given all that you have said, is it really reasonable that the standard is now "the referrer should make more than the provider"? I would say that's a pretty sad sign of how corporate porn is getting. I mean, I'm not the only person on this list who makes his own content, am I? This must seem a little odd to other people. Shouldn't the money in a creative industry be going to creative people, too? That said, I am glad to offer 50% to anyone who can sent good traffic... I'd even take a shot and say I'd offer it based on lots of traffic (there is a difference) coming from people from GFY. Any takers? My sites are unique niche sites that convert well if sent good traffic. __________________ Photos by Ian X.: Distinctive photos of goth babes. Blood Money:Your traffic, my sites, our money. MojoHost: Still the best.