Shit... your asking a lot of things in one post :winkwink:

OK.. I'll throw my own shit into the pot. You got two people, the leaders of both Lebanon and Israel. Neither of them are stupid men. Both may have a wish to have some life with peace. Meantime, there is a problem - not necessarily caused by either leader, but with internal issues. Both these guys have "internal issues" - whether that comes from "terrorist orgs" or within members of their own cabinet.

While attempting to keep the world all cool and living in lala land, both leaders were blessed with a brain and a mouth. There is/was nothing to hinder either arranging constant and regular communication towards having peace. In the background, it may well be that "incidents" are occuring and this is not helpful. However, the main goal is a peace settlement and not the daily rabble of aggression. Both need to understand that fully - and little doubts both do in reality.

Then Mr Stupid creeps under the door. Why would any leader who wants to work with another then launch a missle strike on the offices of the other??? DUH? Got to be one of the dumbest diplomatic moves in history.

From that point, it just set any prospect of peace back.. dunno.. 20 years.

Truth is man... I don't believe there was any desire on the part of the current Israeli govt to have any peace. There are others in the background who also have no desire for peace and they are being guided by advisors with an agenda on a bigger scale. There is war going on - the bullets may be flying in Lebanon, but the main front is elsewhere and more closer to home.

What? Was that English? No hablo espanol.



They should have done another prisoner exchange like they have done many times. The last one being in 2002. Israel has way more prisoners than Hamas and Hezbollah combined.

The sorry excuse of the war monger. "We don't live in a shinny happy world", so all wars started by our side are justified. I'm sure Bin Laden tells people the exact same thing.



Al -Jazeer? What the fuck is that? You think the news wires are called "Al -Jazeer"? Where I live they're called AP and Reuters.

And, CNN is not "the rest of the world". The only people in the world who blindly support Israel are the Americans. The vast majority of people around the world do not support this invasion.

:thumbsup

It's is also not nicely cut and dried as is portrayed in the US media in particular, and, slightly surprised on this, but CNN editors were instructed to change terminology to suit the occasion with reference the Israeli/Lebanon situation.

Fortunately there are other countries and international orgs stepping in to offer help - without the crap baggage and simpleton propaganda attached.

Yes I'm sure there is some connections closer to home.. I posted it earlier that I'm sure we will find out soon enough if the Bush admin has plans to go after Syria or Iran. If they really have that agenda this will be the time they do it, because they have the perfect cover to do it.

Top that off with the fact that Israel is already in the fight so we could use them as an ally instead of keeping them out like it happened in Iraq. I have no arguments on that matter at all and I don't support it in any way. Belive me I don't support what our govt does in some of these matters in any way shape or forum.

The argument I have is when you guys are acting like this entire deal is all Israel's fault. Then saying the civilian deaths are all their fault when it's not. There maybe agenda's on our side and the Israeli's side.. but Hezbollah has a equally evil agenda and they are at fault in this matter as much as anyone.

Also I don't buy it for one damn minute that Lebanon "coundn't" do anything about Hezbollah. They allowed them to operate within their boarders as 'juz" said, if they couldn't control their own country then they shouldn't have it.

You are talking about diplomacy but what would Lebanon have done about it? They wouldn't have done shit, just like always. The other issue about prisoner trades, the Israli's already did that with Hezbollah in the past they traded over 1k prisonors for 3 Israeli's solders. What did Hezbollah do? They kidnapped 2 more, so why shouldn't Israel of dsone what they have done?

Should they just keep letting them kidnapp their troops?

btw it's been fun but I'm going to bed..

I'm not saying anything - for one side of the other. I really have no clue about the intentions of either the Israeli, Lebanese govts or Hezbollah and doubt I'll ever have the occasion for a face-to-face to find out :winkwink:

The only constructive thing - tho this will be learned after many more die, is that there is a need to talk and on the basis no other party/govt is involved in the background.

But hell.. humans are stupid, so this will last generations yet.

If they didn't want their troops to be taken hostage, they shouldn't have continued taking hostages themselves. Amazing how you only see Arabs doing bad things. It sounds like to you, everything Israel does is justified. That's fucked up. Israel is allowed to take hostages and launch attacks, but when Arabs do it, it's unjustified? Honestly how do you convince yourself to accept that? How can wrap your head around that warped, undefendable world view?

What the fuck is the point of even talking about this. You're just going to justify any Israeli action because of your preconcived biases againt Arabs.

Thank God your parents finally inforced your bed time. I was getting a serious headache from your war mongering bullshit.

Have you every read the Koran? If you have, what did you think of it? I have read the Koran because I was interested in seeing what it was all about...after reading it you get the distinct impression that the hatred for the Jew has existed since the ink dried in the Koran. Long before the new Israel state was established, long before 1947 when it was created, and it would exist even if the Jews decided to leave Israel tomorrow. It isn't just limited to the Jews though, Christians are grouped in the same cluster and the intolerance for non-believers are laced throughout the Koran.

Another thing...as porn webmasters, how do you think a Muslim country would view our chosen occupation? I don't think 2257 would compare to what a Muslim nation would do to porn and it's webmasters :)

One final thing, I pretty much can't stand established religion. I think it's the true bane of civilization because it leads to close minded hate and intolerance. I pessimistically realize that there is no viable solution in the middle east because it's driven by archaic beliefs in invisible deities.

Here are some rational Israelis:

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7...279792,00.html

"The protestors held up signs with slogans against the war and called for an immediate ceasefire.

According to the demonstrators, a prisoner exchange deal with Hizbullah must be struck, as well as a similar deal with Hamas."


Too bad, like in my country (USA), these rational, not hateful, peace loving people are the minority. God bless us all (except Muslims, Jews, and Christians... fuck them).

Got to say Mr Blue, I've never read the Koran :winkwink:

Oh.. I'm sure good "Christians" have some extreme views on our chosen occupation and USC 2257 is but a droplet in an ocean if they could have their way:) They know above all others what is best.

I used to have these "discussions" with a prominent "public protector". She would issue press statements over almost every movie released and blasting them to hell and back. She was a charming old lady who dearly loved her cats - and, in fairness, she did to a degree, represent "some" members of society. In the end, can't remember the movie, but had to ask her if she had even seen the movie she is blasting. Turns out it was "too much" for her to watch, so she avoided going to screenings :)

Meanwhile, religon seems to take a back seat when sheer lust takes over :winkwink: even with followers of the Muslim, Jewish or any other faith. In Saudi there seems to be two different levels - one for "us" and one for "them". "Us" get special whoring privileges and "them" get executed for even thinking about it.

Odd the way people think - religon seems to have played some part in the removal of logic - tho it prob was never *actually* part of the religon in the first instance :)

lol, yes, that's why I said I can't stand all established religions. Christians are just as intolerant, but their method of converting non-believers, at least the written word on the topic (this wasn't always practiced), is through missionary work, etc.

If you really read through the Koran the whole middle east thing gets put into the perspective of a religious war. No matter what Israel did...they would still be hated by the Muslim. Let me get out the Koran for a minute and just type out a few bits from it:

"Allah stamped wretchedness upon the Jews because they killed the prophets and disbelieved Allah's revelations."

"Jews are the greediest of all humankind."

"Kill disbelievers wherever you find them. If they attack you, then kill them. Such is the reward of disbelievers."

"For the wrongdoing Jews, Allah has prepared a painful doom"

"Allah has cursed the Jews and hardened their hearts. Nearly all of them are treacherous."

That's just a little bit, there's quite a lot to do with the punishment of "disbelievers"...How will there ever be peace in the Middle East when fundamentalism like that grips it so hard? There won't be peace. If Israel turned a new leaf over tomorrow, if they refused to attack, refused to defend itself, what would happen to them?

I'm not condoning what's happening, but its happening because of a hatred that's been there for thousands of years. No one is going to be able to stop it. They can maybe contain it, but it will never end as long as people grasp onto myths to guide their lives.

Whats with all the facts and logic? People want to blame Israel, nothing more.

Sorry pelle pales but this throw is out by Far fetch.....Going back and to get back at the Isreals are pretty Tuff mission considering the fact that they send messages without dropping a single Clouds.....Newclear attack might be an options to the rest of Creole speaking people butt the world will not tolerate the action against Isrealights....Then again they brought you the real construction of the western criticisms to the critics from 38° 51' N 77° 2' W and beyond......From BC to AD, Western worlds been following the cookie trails of the Isreallights......

<be>/_\<realistic>/_\<before>/_\<beeing>/_\<pratical>

?Eye don't Bow cuz I'm not Buddhist?

Kid Wave 0/1 won

How insightful. Let me guess, high school dropout?

Everything is extremely simple, when you are a simple man.

I'm glad you have everything figured out in your own mind. Must feel great to know everything, while never having opened a book in your life. I'm actually jealous. Sometimes I wish I were stupid and could convince myself that the entire world was as simple as my simple mind. Have fun with that. Maybe one day someone will hit me in the head with a baseball bat and I'll be able to have a conversation on your level. I hope. Having to think things through before you speak and use logic in your arguments becomes a real pain in the ass.

I could not agree more. I think Israel has put up with a lot shit over the years. They just need to take out Hamas and Hezbollah. They would be doing the world a favor.

For all the racist fuck heads and all Israel and jew haters on this board, you might not understand a simple thing...

We won before in just about anything we did, and you know what no matter what you think or say we will win again at this conflict and on future conflicts.

Get this through your thick skulls.


So all I have to say about all the Jew haters here is :1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

you people all need to do some background reading, and when you do, depending on the source you will find that there is no unbiased material out there.

Zionistic documentation will tell you of the struggle the Zionists had in the early 1900's of bringing an abandoned land so abused and neglected that it took decades to clear it of all the swamps and landfills it had become after the locals completely trashed the place for centuries. Other non - zionistic and more arab leaning docs will tell a story similar to America's past of an invading people killing off and abusing the native people.

Whatever the case is, Israel was declared a country in 1948 by the rest of the UN, and they had to fight off Arab countries who refuse to reckognize her as a country and tried several times to wipe it off the face of the earth in 1948-1949, 1956, 1967, 1973-1974 and 1982.

These Islamic groups soul purpose is to destroy the state of ISrael, Hammas, Hezbolah, it wasn't till a few years ago that there were any Arab nations that would refer to "Israel" as a county, they would just call it "The Occupied land" or when they were being nice "Palestine".

There is no "Cease Fire" with any of these Anti-Israeli groups. They will not stop till Israel is gone. Everytime there is pressure for a cease fire or cessation, ISrael gives up some little piece of land to one group or country or another and a few days, weeks or months later, they are getting rocketed, stoned, from that place.

Israel arrest known terrorist in Gaza, or anywhere else, and they are accused of "kidnapping" a civilian and locking them up. They blow up a Hezbolah or hammas building, and they are accused of killing civilians.. why? Because these groups are made up of civilians. Because these groups know that if they blend in with civilians, civilians die, and ISrael looks bad. And it works very well. Nothing like seeing a family of 20 getting blown up and showing how it's all just women and children and husbands and dads to get more people to join your cause. You think hammas or hezbolah will say a few of those family members were hezbolah, they had missles under their bed, in the basement.. nope...

Bottom line there will never be peace until Israel is wiped off the face of the earth, it may take 5 years, it may take 100, the only way ISrael has a chance of making it is if the US continues to be a super power, as soon as US isn't powerful or cuts ties with Israel, it's days are numbered... you can only fight off so many countries and so many people within your country that are sworn to destroy you for so long.

oh and could you imagine if there was a tribe of Native American Indians in Mexico vowed to destroy the US being financed by Mexico and shooting missles into texas? How long would it take the US to blow the fuck out of every Native american in Mexico, let alone the Mexican goverment? If that happened and my country didn't act 10x as harsh as Israel is now I'd be pissed.

fuck, can't believe I'm arguing politics on GFY at 5am, I'm going back to bed, would you guys please stop setting off my "Jewdar" and waking me up!

Don't bother sending the money to Arabs, just help organisations who oppose Zionist power in the United States. There are left-wing and right-wing groups that are openly against Zionist control of US politics, so take your pick. Believe me when I say the absolute BEST way you can help the Arabs (as well as helping your country at the same time) is to remove the stranglehold Zionists have over US foreign policy through their media and lobby groups.

here's a page about the formation of Israel from some non denominational religious wackos:

http://www.thesilvertrumpets.info/en...ottcotmsoi.htm

theu didn't write alot about it, but the jews were fighting British occupation along with the Arabs when the first zionist were "Zionizing"

Damn British, trying to snaatch up all the good stuff back then

100

woj's bot is asleep?

I should've added sarcasm tags... :)

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh

And as of yet no reply from the 'know it all' Manhatten liberal to my post.

Wow, you're so clever and witty.

The news wires are the best place we have to get news. I said that already in this thread. Excuse me for not feeling the need to address every idiot who posts stupid bullshit expecting me to answer them like what they said has any meaning.

belive it or not there are alot of people in israel that arent jews.assloads of catholics and christians live there too..not sure if and what religion you may or may not practice..but theres an shitloadd of churches there too..and if the arabs actually took israel those churches would be firewood for the bon fire that the nuns and priests would be roasting on a spit over...:2 cents:

Dvae, you don't have the mental capacity to spell Manhattan, even when it's right there in my location. I'm supposed to waste my time on you? I think I've already wasted enough of my time here on idiots like alexg and crockett. You guys can keep spitting out made up statistics and hate speech, what the fuck do I care. I'm about to go for a jog in the greatest park in the history of mankind with my hot wife. I have better things to do than to hold your hand and tell you where to find information without CNN.

Oh my God, the ignorance here is shocking sometimes. Some of you zionists sound worse than the fucking KKK. It makes me sick to think that people actually spread hate speech like this.

I suppose all the Christians who live in Lebanon have their churches burned to the ground every day, right? And the Arabs who control that country burn the nuns and priests alive? Same thing with the Christians in Iran. All Arabs are just so barbaric, they can't live with people of other races without setting them on fire.

Fucking idiot.

Honestly, how stupid do you have to be to say something like that?

Maybe your ignorant ass should move to the Middle East so you can hang with your Arab 'brothers' :321GFY

Oh, and by the way "DEA", a lot of Palestinians are Christian. Something like ten percent. Of course, I don't expect anyone ignorant enough to say what you just said to have any grasp on reality, or even a desire to get one.

Seek therapy immediately, please. Just let them dope you up with whatever they're selling. It's clear that your brain does not function like that of a normal human being in modern society.

Yea Webby I know you weren't saying that, my commits were mainly directed at Mr Soul as he keeps talking about how bad Israel's actions are but fails to see any wrong with what Hezbollah does.

IMO both sides are wrong, but if I support one side it will be Israel simply because they fight as an army should and they aren't deliberately targeting civilians like Hezbollah does.

Armegeddon is upon us. Save the birthplace of Jesus or burn in hell heathen:firehair

lol ok you got me, because I was like there is no way someone is posting those news two news stations weren't biased. :upsidedow

Thank god im a buddhist!

Oh my God I've been found out. I'm a mental midget.
Blah, Blah,Blah, Blah who cares about spelling or any of your other self gloating pablum.
And yes, this post contains mispelled words so don't bother.

You say newswires but thats extremely vague. Give me one that you use. I want the unbiased truth.

That statement is very misleading thats 10% worldwide.
Do you think for a second that any Christian would be tolerated in the midst of the Hammas or Hezballa. The wouuld kill'em on the spot.

Thanks for the link to backup your vast knowledge ... :thumbsup


In Lebanon :
As for Palestine, since it is not considered a COUNTRY, there is no statistics published as such...

If you have any, please do post them.

Did I say anything about Lebanon. Read my post again.

I said Hammas and Hezballa And I mean within the organization.

Apparently you are too lazy to look it up yourself. I even agreed with Mr.S on the 10% figure, it was just that he made it sound as though that was within the ranks of Hammas, Hezballa and the PLO.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Christian

No you didn't... But you said:


Now, Hezbollah is located and operating in Lebanon ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hezbollah ). So pretty logical assumption that you were referring to Lebanon ...

Or you weren't ????

If Israel were just going after Hezbollah, you would have a point.

Instead, Israel has made all of Lebanon a target. Remember, Hezbollah is only a small minority in Lebanon, yet Israel has decided to destroy all of Lebanon's infrastructure.

You're right in saying that Israel and Hezbollah are equally evil. The problem is that the innocent people of Lebanon are caught in the crossfire.

How is this thread racist?

If you do not agree with AlexG, you ARE a racist .... simple no ???


reminder:

" You are either with us, or you are a racist " .... sounds familiar ...