How could a new affiliate program prove to you that they dont shave signups? - GoFuckYourself.com

drama · 06-01-2006, 10:19 PM

I am planning on launching a new affiliate program and sites and i am using a completely custom wrote script which i will be writing myself.

I also want to put out any fires before they start so that i have proof that the code is shave free and no one can say jack shit and everyone knows i am honest!

What i am thinking is this. I will fly in a well respected GFY member who is an expert programmer and DBA. I will let them audit the code (with me watching every move they do) and once they say that it looks good and is shave free i will compile the php code, generate a HASH/SHA256 hash and post it for every file linked to my affiliate program.

The hash codes will be made public by me for all these files. The person i fly in will also make the hash codes they got while they were here public so that everyone can see absolutely nothing has changed since the code was audited.

Any changes to the code and/or recompiles will change the hash code and affiliates will know that the hash has been changed and the code has been updated/altered.

Obviously this will not work during beta testing as any bugs need to be worked out and would only be done when it is launched. Another/same person would be flown in to validate any changes to anyting once the site has gone public so that you can be assured it is all legit.

I was also thinking of them writing a tech doc on it all so that all affliates know how shit works, exactly how hits are tracked, etc etc.

What do you guys think?

drama · 06-01-2006, 10:20 PM

Also, who would you recommend to audit the code? I was thinking of SMokeyTheBear since he seems to be the brightest and has no problems creating drama should there be any!

pussyluver · 06-01-2006, 10:27 PM

There is always a way to cheat.

RevShare takes away some of the need to cheat. I prefer it over PPS anyway.

nestle · 06-01-2006, 10:32 PM

Wow, talk about dedication.

First problem I sense is how are you going to prove that the code that is running on your server is the same code that has been hashed and provided to the public?

Food for thought, is it the proof that your program does not shave stats that will make your affiliate program successful? Or is it something else (or a combination of something else?)

WarChild · 06-01-2006, 10:34 PM

Why not just use existing affiliate software instead of going through all that trouble?

Juilan · 06-01-2006, 10:41 PM

Honorable but a waste of money IMHO, you either earn trust or you don't and with your emphasis on fairness at the onset I bet you'll do fine

fuzebox · 06-01-2006, 10:59 PM

It's not just the code though.

How is an expert programmer going to figure out if you change linkcodes in the FHGs for a little while? Or changing the tour files?

Love Sex · 06-01-2006, 11:00 PM

nobody is really going to care, 90% of the people arent going to understand it including myself. the bottom line people see if it makes money and that will determine how good it is. Also alot of people with their own tracking software will know how many hits they send you to compare.

drama · 06-01-2006, 11:15 PM

one of the keys to any new affiliate program is trust. Look at what happened to PIB. They made peole more money than other programs but also shaved and when they got caught they were finished.

You prove the code by the hash code generated for the file. If the file changes so does the has code and then it wont match what the person who i flew down has and then there would be explaining to do as well as another audit.

You guys are right, you can always cheat some how but now matter "how" you cheat your affiliates you still get the reports for the total sales in the site, sure, i could "alter code" but then the hash value wont match the 3rd party.

I believe a company named Click Trust is doing sometihng liek it but i could be wrong.

drama · 06-01-2006, 11:20 PM

You are right. I could change html pages, use JS code to change link codes as well as about 100 other shady things but hopefully going through this effort proves that the program would not be about that

flashbang · 06-01-2006, 11:36 PM

anyone who know's their traffic, knows who's shaving, simple as that

drama · 06-01-2006, 11:48 PM

Not really, no one has a clue about PIB!

BigBen · 06-02-2006, 01:26 AM

And everytime you fix a bug or make any change to the code, you're going to have it re-audited? Most custom affiliate programs are constantly being worked on.

Rice_Master · 06-02-2006, 01:47 AM

save yourself the trouble... nobody is going to care, cool idea though.

Paul Markham · 06-02-2006, 03:32 AM

There is absolutely no way to tell that people are shaving and if you can write a program then you must know that.

So what is the point of this thread?

And if people were making more money with PIB they would still be here, shaving or not.

Gaybucks · 06-02-2006, 05:30 AM

You want to have credibility at the outset, use ccbill, MPA3, Executive Stats, or NATS. Save yourself the hassle, and get the benefit of input from thousands of sponsor programs that have helped to shape the affiliate software used by those programs.

Nobody will believe or buy the business about having someone audit the code anyway, and there are plenty of people with traffic who have no idea who is whom on GFY.

Ultimately, your credibility lies in the rest of how you act as well as the hoops you jump through, but don't try and reinvent the wheel when there are already several great options out there.

drama · 06-02-2006, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

There is absolutely no way to tell that people are shaving and if you can write a program then you must know that.

So what is the point of this thread?

And if people were making more money with PIB they would still be here, shaving or not.

You are right mr Paul Markham, and i do believe some people continued to promote PIB even after they got caught with their hand in the cookie jar because of their ratios and the numbers were better than what they were getting elsewhere (i guess).

But while you might never know the whole truth as to whether a program is shaving it doesn't mean that you can't take measures to help build the integrity of the program up, especially for when you launch it.

Let say I went with got a well respected person from a well respected company to confirm everything, sure it would mean that any updates to the
code would have to be re-verified but that is only if I continued to go that route. Hopefully the webmasters would have had enough trust established in the program itself.

The goal is to build up a trust with the affiliates for the initial launch since I'm not very well known in this biz because I'm anti-social programmer

As for NATS/MPA3 they dont quite do what i need them to do and as for ES, well, have you logged in to a site which is running that? I would need to buy their source for 20k and then spend the next couple of months modding it when i could build my own affil program with exactly what it is that i need.

KRL · 06-02-2006, 05:58 AM

I think an affiliate program would have to hook up a live web cam with audio into their CFO's or accounting dept office before anyone would really believe everything is being distributed 100% exact.

There's just been too much of it for too long and everyone just accepts it has common practice now.

lloyd · 06-02-2006, 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaybucks

You want to have credibility at the outset, use ccbill, MPA3, Executive Stats, or NATS.

uh didn't MPA2 have a built in shave feature? seems to be something i'm missing here. i'm not bagging on Manson, but i just dont see how it establishes credibility. God knows shaving is as easy as writing a db trigger or any of the other ways outlined above.

one eight · 06-02-2006, 08:39 PM

I run a new program. CCBill is virtually shave proof, because it's 3rd party and affiliates know that. Also, I give away tons of stuff- like we just installed some software we had for one affiliate. I gave another a list of better places to buy paid spots. When you go out of your way to help affiliates, and give each personal attention, and build their business with them, shaving is the last thing that comes to mind when thinking about you/your program.

Just be honest, and generous.. then you dont have to prove anything.
2cents.

madawgz · 06-02-2006, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pussyluver

There is always a way to cheat.

RevShare takes away some of the need to cheat. I prefer it over PPS anyway.

seriously, pps always gets shaved

lloyd · 06-02-2006, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madawgz

seriously, pps always gets shaved

thats such a load of shit. if it always got shaved then a program would come along that doesnt and everyone would use them cos they convert so much better. if anything shaving on a revshare would make more sense because people dont watch as closely on their rebills. the reality is if anything programs would shave your clicks to make your sales ratios look better. same shit? not really cos any competent webmaster should be tracking their own clicks and can see right away if a program is fucking them on the clicks.

Rochard · 06-02-2006, 09:44 PM

Seems to me like someone is way too concerned about being accused of shaving long before they open up their own program.

Which makes me wonder why.

J.R. · 06-02-2006, 10:44 PM

I once used MPA2, it had a shave feature.. and I heard MPA 3
is better with no shave option.

As for other programs, I can bet just about anyone paying $40 or more is likely doing something shady. I've been around too long to be that ignorate.

my 2 .50 cents

drama · 06-03-2006, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Seems to me like someone is way too concerned about being accused of shaving long before they open up their own program.

Which makes me wonder why.

Actually, dickhead, trust is the one major thing that any new program doesnt have. Now, i could sit here and have the program running for what, 6 months before people warmed up to it/began to see its a legitimate program OR find a way to establish trust with the affiliates right from the get go.

Wait 6 months to be trusted/promoted by affiliates or find a way to prove yourself to them even before you're program is launched.. the answer is pretty clear isnt it?

Rui · 06-03-2006, 09:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Seems to me like someone is way too concerned about being accused of shaving long before they open up their own program.

Which makes me wonder why.

I actualy think you are pretty offbase on this one...

What if lets say he actualy cares and is focusing on this particular subject rather than offer useless shit or a gazzilion cookie-cutter aswell traffic leaks sites like most?

MaddCaz · 06-03-2006, 09:42 AM

can they???

06-01-2006, 10:19 PM	#1
drama Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 847	How could a new affiliate program prove to you that they dont shave signups? I am planning on launching a new affiliate program and sites and i am using a completely custom wrote script which i will be writing myself. I also want to put out any fires before they start so that i have proof that the code is shave free and no one can say jack shit and everyone knows i am honest! What i am thinking is this. I will fly in a well respected GFY member who is an expert programmer and DBA. I will let them audit the code (with me watching every move they do) and once they say that it looks good and is shave free i will compile the php code, generate a HASH/SHA256 hash and post it for every file linked to my affiliate program. The hash codes will be made public by me for all these files. The person i fly in will also make the hash codes they got while they were here public so that everyone can see absolutely nothing has changed since the code was audited. Any changes to the code and/or recompiles will change the hash code and affiliates will know that the hash has been changed and the code has been updated/altered. Obviously this will not work during beta testing as any bugs need to be worked out and would only be done when it is launched. Another/same person would be flown in to validate any changes to anyting once the site has gone public so that you can be assured it is all legit. I was also thinking of them writing a tech doc on it all so that all affliates know how shit works, exactly how hits are tracked, etc etc. What do you guys think?

06-01-2006, 10:34 PM	#5
WarChild Let slip the dogs of war. Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Bermuda Posts: 17,263	Why not just use existing affiliate software instead of going through all that trouble? __________________ .

06-01-2006, 10:41 PM	#6
Juilan Sultan of Swing Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: XXXodus Posts: 15,141	Honorable but a waste of money IMHO, you either earn trust or you don't and with your emphasis on fairness at the onset I bet you'll do fine __________________ My Best Converting VOD Sponsor \|

06-02-2006, 01:47 AM	#14
Rice_Master Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2001 Posts: 1,582	save yourself the trouble... nobody is going to care, cool idea though. __________________ Icq: 31706665

06-02-2006, 03:32 AM	#15
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	There is absolutely no way to tell that people are shaving and if you can write a program then you must know that. So what is the point of this thread? And if people were making more money with PIB they would still be here, shaving or not. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

06-01-2006, 10:20 PM	#2
drama Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 847	Also, who would you recommend to audit the code? I was thinking of SMokeyTheBear since he seems to be the brightest and has no problems creating drama should there be any!

06-01-2006, 10:27 PM	#3
pussyluver Clueless OleMan Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ICQ - 169903487 Posts: 11,009	There is always a way to cheat. RevShare takes away some of the need to cheat. I prefer it over PPS anyway.

06-01-2006, 10:32 PM	#4
nestle Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 647	Wow, talk about dedication. First problem I sense is how are you going to prove that the code that is running on your server is the same code that has been hashed and provided to the public? Food for thought, is it the proof that your program does not shave stats that will make your affiliate program successful? Or is it something else (or a combination of something else?)

06-01-2006, 10:59 PM	#7
fuzebox making it rain Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: seattle Posts: 22,227	It's not just the code though. How is an expert programmer going to figure out if you change linkcodes in the FHGs for a little while? Or changing the tour files?

06-01-2006, 11:00 PM	#8
Love Sex Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,905	nobody is really going to care, 90% of the people arent going to understand it including myself. the bottom line people see if it makes money and that will determine how good it is. Also alot of people with their own tracking software will know how many hits they send you to compare.

06-01-2006, 11:15 PM	#9
drama Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 847	one of the keys to any new affiliate program is trust. Look at what happened to PIB. They made peole more money than other programs but also shaved and when they got caught they were finished. You prove the code by the hash code generated for the file. If the file changes so does the has code and then it wont match what the person who i flew down has and then there would be explaining to do as well as another audit. You guys are right, you can always cheat some how but now matter "how" you cheat your affiliates you still get the reports for the total sales in the site, sure, i could "alter code" but then the hash value wont match the 3rd party. I believe a company named Click Trust is doing sometihng liek it but i could be wrong.

06-01-2006, 11:20 PM	#10
drama Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 847	You are right. I could change html pages, use JS code to change link codes as well as about 100 other shady things but hopefully going through this effort proves that the program would not be about that

06-01-2006, 11:36 PM	#11
flashbang Confirmed User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 767	anyone who know's their traffic, knows who's shaving, simple as that

06-01-2006, 11:48 PM	#12
drama Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 847	Not really, no one has a clue about PIB!

06-02-2006, 01:26 AM	#13
BigBen Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: scv Posts: 2,299	And everytime you fix a bug or make any change to the code, you're going to have it re-audited? Most custom affiliate programs are constantly being worked on.

06-02-2006, 05:30 AM	#16
Gaybucks Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 451	You want to have credibility at the outset, use ccbill, MPA3, Executive Stats, or NATS. Save yourself the hassle, and get the benefit of input from thousands of sponsor programs that have helped to shape the affiliate software used by those programs. Nobody will believe or buy the business about having someone audit the code anyway, and there are plenty of people with traffic who have no idea who is whom on GFY. Ultimately, your credibility lies in the rest of how you act as well as the hoops you jump through, but don't try and reinvent the wheel when there are already several great options out there. __________________ Gaybucks.com 100% exclusive American guys - hosted movie galleries - NATS - Boyfunk.com - Boysfeetclub.com - AJsCloset.com- SkylerDeVoss.com ICQ 272-995-402

06-02-2006, 05:58 AM	#18
KRL Entrepreneur Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 31,429	I think an affiliate program would have to hook up a live web cam with audio into their CFO's or accounting dept office before anyone would really believe everything is being distributed 100% exact. There's just been too much of it for too long and everyone just accepts it has common practice now. __________________ If you would like to develop your domains, you can lease inexpensive foreign labor from the leaders in the field at iWebmasters.com TO LOWER YOUR COSTS AND INCREASE YOUR PRODUCTION! * * * * * * * * * * * * Domains Adult News KRL's Newsletter Biz Tips Just Listed Domains

06-02-2006, 08:39 PM	#20
one eight Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Costa Rica & San Francisco Posts: 1,941	I run a new program. CCBill is virtually shave proof, because it's 3rd party and affiliates know that. Also, I give away tons of stuff- like we just installed some software we had for one affiliate. I gave another a list of better places to buy paid spots. When you go out of your way to help affiliates, and give each personal attention, and build their business with them, shaving is the last thing that comes to mind when thinking about you/your program. Just be honest, and generous.. then you dont have to prove anything. 2cents. __________________ -more than a number

06-02-2006, 09:44 PM	#23
Rochard Jägermeister Test Pilot Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: NORCAL Posts: 75,073	Seems to me like someone is way too concerned about being accused of shaving long before they open up their own program. Which makes me wonder why. __________________ “The choice is no longer between right or left. The choice is between normal and crazy.” - Sarah Huckabee Sanders

06-02-2006, 10:44 PM	#24
J.R. WantBoobs.com Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Calif & Washington Posts: 3,472	I once used MPA2, it had a shave feature.. and I heard MPA 3 is better with no shave option. As for other programs, I can bet just about anyone paying $40 or more is likely doing something shady. I've been around too long to be that ignorate. my 2 .50 cents

06-03-2006, 09:42 AM	#27
MaddCaz Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 9,483	can they??? __________________ BigCocks.com - MatureWomen.com - Tranny.com - DrunkGirls.com - TeenGirls.com - MonsterCock.com and many more... Click here to see them all!