Yes he actually can. Read up on it a bit. Has 90 days to even consult congress.

Did you hear recently that there's supposedly a memo out there now that outlines a meeting between Bush and Blair where Bush said that they "the US" had considered making a spy plane look like a UN plane, fly it over Iraq to try and get them to shoot at it and thus they'd be in violation and they could go to war.

Umm retard. They already we're shooting at planes in the safe zone.


I love this though.

there's SUPPOSEDLY a memo. :1orglaugh

I couldn't imagine being faced with the option, it would be soooo incredibly terrible. But if I was then I would have to say jump.
RIP to all those that lost their lives on that horrific day.

Military plane, not UN planes ...

Talking about retard ...


BTW, the so called " safe-zone " were a unilateral US-Britt thing, in violation of all international law .

Didn't link to the Guardian, because you would say it is not a " credible " source ,.. ( contrary to yourself :1orglaugh , after all, you are the SPOON specialist... )

Full article on the memo showing how Bush is a liar

All the BS of " war last ressource ", we are negotiating, Saddam has to come clean, and so on was just , as I said 3 years ago, just a stalling measure to prepare the invasion ( oups, I meant " liberation " ).

Article about people who jumped (around 200 jumped)

Desperation forced a horrific decision

By Dennis Cauchon and Martha Moore, USA TODAY

At first, it seemed like debris. Large objects were falling from the top of the World Trade Center's north tower, just a few minutes after American Airlines Flight 11 hit.

The sight of people plunging from the north tower compelled hundreds in the south tower to flee before the second jet struck the building.
Richard Drew, AP

"It took three or four to realize: They were people," says James Logozzo, who had gathered with co-workers in a Morgan Stanley boardroom on the 72nd floor of the south tower, just 120 feet away from the north tower. "Then this one woman fell."

She fell closer to the south tower, he recalls. Logozzo saw her face. She had dark hair and olive skin, a white blouse and black skirt. She fell with her back to the ground, flat, staring up.

"The look on her face was shock. She wasn't screaming. It was slow motion. When she hit, there was nothing left," Logozzo says.

Logozzo cried, "Oh my God!" and raced for the stairs. When he got to the street 45 minutes later, he looked up. By then, his building had been struck by United Airlines Flight 175. From the ground, he saw two more people jump. This time, they were from his building.

The story of the victims who jumped to their deaths is the most sensitive aspect of the Sept. 11 tragedy. Photographs of people falling to their deaths shocked the nation. Most newspapers and magazines ran only one or two photos, then published no more. USA TODAY ran one photo Nov. 16.

Still, the images resonate. Many who survived or witnessed the attack say the sight of victims jumping is their most haunting memory of that day.

It was worse than people realize.

USA TODAY estimates that at least 200 people jumped to their deaths that morning, far more than can be seen in the photographs taken that morning. Nearly all were from the north tower, which was hit first and collapsed last. Fewer than a dozen were from the south tower.

The jumping started shortly after the first jet hit at 8:46 a.m. People jumped continuously during the 102 minutes that the north tower stood. Two people jumped as the north tower began to fall at 10:28 a.m., witnesses said.

For those who jumped, the fall lasted 10 seconds. They struck the ground at just less than 150 miles per hour hahaha8212; not fast enough to cause unconsciousness while falling, but fast enough to ensure instant death on impact. People jumped from all four sides of the north tower. They jumped alone, in pairs and in groups.

Most came from the north tower's 101st to 105th floors, where the Cantor Fitzgerald bond firm had offices, and the 106th and 107th floors, where a conference was underway at the Windows on the World restaurant. Others leaped from the 93rd through 100th floor offices of Marsh & McLennan insurance company.

Intense smoke and heat, rather than flames, pushed people into this horrific choice. Flight 11 struck the 94th through 98th floors of the north tower, shooting heat and smoke up elevator shafts and stairways in the center of the building. Within minutes, it would have been very difficult to breathe. That drove people to the windows 1,100 to 1,300 feet above ground.

There were several reasons more people jumped from the north tower than from the south. The fire was more intense and compact in the north tower. The jet hit higher, so smoke was concentrated in 15 floors compared with 30 floors in the south tower, which was hit on the 78th through 84th floors. The north tower also stood longer: 102 minutes vs. 56 minutes. And twice as many people were trapped on the north tower's upper floors than in the south tower, where occupants had 161/2 minutes to evacuate before the second jet hit.

The New York medical examiner's office says it does not classify the people who fell to their deaths on Sept. 11 as "jumpers."

"A 'jumper' is somebody who goes to the office in the morning knowing that they will commit suicide," says Ellen Borakove, spokeswoman for the medical examiner's office. "These people were forced out by the smoke and flames or blown out."

She says the medical examiner's office couldn't determine who jumped because the injuries were similar to those suffered by the people killed in the collapse of the towers. The manner of death for all those who died was listed as homicide on death certificates.

To make its estimate of the number of people who plunged from the Trade Center, USA TODAY reviewed videos and photographs, interviewed witnesses and analyzed the time and location of the jumping. The newspaper discussed its conclusion with officials in the fire department and medical examiner's office who, while not making calculations of their own, deemed an estimate of 200 jumpers as accurate.

The New York Times counted 50 different jumpers in a review of photographs and videotapes. USA TODAY's estimate attempts to include people whose falls were not documented. Nearly all photos were of the north tower's north and east faces, which were more accessible to photographers coming from uptown Manhattan. But witnesses reported that numerous people leapt from the north tower's south and west sides as well.

On the south side, firefighters reported 30 to 40 bodies on the roof of the 22-floor Marriott Hotel, adjacent to the north tower.

On the west side, falling bodies crashed onto the awning covering the circular VIP driveway. The thudding of bodies at this entrance can be heard on a video taken near there by French cameraman Jules Naudet, whose footage was broadcast on CBS on March 11.

On the east side, people plummeted into the plaza, best known for its globe sculpture. Blood covered the glass walls and revolving doors that led to the plaza from the second-floor mezzanine in the north tower. People evacuating the north tower walked by this horrible sight.

"The windows were red ... and bits of bodies were outside. We were stunned and amazed," says Richard Moller, who escaped from the 78th floor.

After the first jet crash, Port Authority police Officer David Lim took an escalator from the lobby of the north tower to the plaza level, one floor above. He saw a disfigured body near a stage where musical groups performed on the plaza. "I said, oh my God! I've got to call this in. 'I've got a DOA on the plaza.' The desk officer said, 'Are you sure he's dead?' As I'm retransmitting, another body falls."

To be sure, some who fell didn't jump. Witnesses say a few people seemed to have stumbled out of broken windows obscured by smoke. But most say those jumping appeared to make a conscious choice to die by falling rather than from smoke, heat or fire.

Ultimately, they were choosing not whether to die but how to die. Nobody survived on the floors from which people jumped.

Victims who jumped had a profound influence on the evacuation. Firefighters moved their command post away from the building to avoid them. A falling body killed a firefighter. Fire Commissioner Thomas Van Essen, rushing out of the north tower to meet Mayor Rudy Giuliani, was nearly killed when a body landed 15 feet away.

To safeguard people from falling bodies and debris, authorities blocked the main exits from the lobbies to the street. Instead, people escaping from both towers were sent through an underground shopping mall and under the outdoor plaza where bodies were falling.

The sight of people jumping saved lives, too. In the south tower, people had a close-up view of people plunging to their deaths from a building that was a mirror image of their own. "I looked at a couple of people jumping, and that was it. I'd seen enough. I said, 'We've got to get the hell out of here,' " says Jaede Barg, who worked for Aon on the south tower's 100th floor.

Many south tower survivors say the sight of people jumping created an urgency that caused them to leave immediately and ignore announcements that it was safe to return to their desks. About 1,400 people evacuated the upper floors before the second jet hit.

Eric Thompson, who worked on the 77th floor of the south tower, went to a conference room window after the first jet hit. He was shocked when a man came to a north tower window and leapt from a few floors above the fire. Thompson looked the man in the face. He saw his tie flapping in the wind. He watched the man's body strike the pavement below. "There was no human resemblance whatsoever," Thompson says.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/sept11/...2-jumper_x.htm

Maybe Im missing it, but where did this "memo" appear from? Was it typed out on a typewriter using special fonts only available on 2 typewriters in the world like the last one? :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Wouldnt the U.N. know if it was one of their planes? This is the dumbest thing ever. How would disquising a plane as a U.N. plane work.... :uhoh Grasping at straws folks. .lol :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

intersting perspective..let us know when you take your head out of yor ass

Easy answer : look who is the brilliant author of that plan ...

That should be enought to answer your question :1orglaugh

Has anyone read the 9/11 Commission report from cover to cover?

I'm starting to get tired of this. Does anyone honestly think that thousands of people - mostly government employees - can pull off something like this without someone leaking something?

I'd imagine it's a very simple matter for a $60k a year to just scramble jets at a moment's notice because someone somewhere thinks something might be wrong. Not to mention I doubt anyone at this level would have the authority to just randomly shoot down jets filled with innocent passengers. Fuck, I sure don't want to be the one to have to make that decision.

This has been covered before. The building was made to withstand the impact of a jet airliner. If I recall correctly, after the planes hit the towers did in fact remain standing. It wasn't the impact of the crash that took the towers down, it was the resulting fire from tens of thousands of gallons of jet fuel that took the building down.

This is a valid question. However, chances are it would do nothing but start another round of further questions.


We've had an explanation, in fact, more than one. The 9/11 Commission Report was one and there have been others.

Any time there is an "event" (such as a car accident) that is witnessed by multiple people, everyone sees differnet things. And there will always be things that can't be explained.

But the notion that thousands of people have taken part in this and covered it up is just plain silly. Why would they do it - So the US can attack Afganistan?

Has anyone read the 9/11 Commission report from cover to cover?
im starting to get tired of people who cant read. Did ANYONE claim ANYTHING even close to what you just described ?


I dont think anyone would shoot down random people either but the fact remains they did scramble jets on on numerous occasions BEFORE 9/11. They had a slower response during a real threat.. someone should be fired for that..

I thought you said you read the report ? you obviously haven't , or you misundertood the physics..

The jet fuel by all accounts burned up well before the towers came down. Office material couldnt sustain a high enough heat to both melt the columns yet leave people directly in the impact zone unburned as it has been explained..

wtc7 couldnt even be explained in the official report and suggested further investigation be done to determine the cause


Thats the whole point of an investigation.. :thumbsup



And the 9/11 commision was incomplete, its time to complete the unanswered questions
not ONE person has said anything even close to this.. where did you come to this conclusion .

even after CLEARLY explaining that this thread has NOTHING to do with WHO did 9/11 you somehow claim theres a notion of "thousands " of people being involved..

im sorry but its like you have ignored the tons and tons of scientific proof just to keep a cosy bead on your own version of reality.

jet fuel cant burn hot enough to melt steel.


they did it so they can build a pipe for oil...in fact the taliban had just left from turning down the oil pipe.....you people have no memory of events at all...unless they agree with your own personal reality

It was not tens of thousands of gallons of fuel. A 767 fuel capacity is a little under 24,000 gallons, and they are not normally fueled to capacity on intercontinental flights. Most of the fuel was burned off in the explosion, and the fuel that wasnt would have burned itself off quickly.

If burning jet fuel was capable of melting metal why in the hell doesnt it burn the inner components of a jet engine?

But wait I thought he was a diabolical Genius... A FUCKING GAIN wtf good would it have done to fake a U.N. plane getting shot down? The U.N. would say wait thats not our plane. Stupidest fucking shit ever. And make up your minds if he is an idiot, or out to rule the planet. :1orglaugh

Wow! You should pick a side and stick with it.. You said in your last post,
".... (well we must be attacked of course)."
Word games? You're the one that referenced the link..

Funny how the UN violation is used as an excuse to attack, yet Bush can just ignore the UN's majority vote to send the inspectors back.
And he also ignored the 182-4 vote in favor of a Cuban resolution demanding the US end its unilateral and extra-territorial blockade.

I guess Bush is the only one that allowed to ignore the UN..

And when did I give you any shit about WMD? Never even brought up..

There is absolutely no trying to reason with some people Rochard. There will always be people that no matter what, there is a conspiracy. No matter how much information there is otherwise, they will always see it there way.

I for one having lived it, read the 9-11 report front to back. Most questions were answered. Basically we have been fucking these people so long, that the lashed out. Kind of like a nice dog that you kick every day, sooner or later it's gonna bite.I'm not saying we deserved it, but our foreign policies in this area of the world, have sucked for decades. There was a total and complete failure on the Bush admin to see the signs that something was coming. Then they used it as and excuse to start a war in Iraq, that the conservative think tanks had planned for years.

There has also been the covering of their asses afterwards. For an administration that said they were gonna bring honor and integrity to the white house, they sure have a hard time testifying under oath. They never testify under oath at all!

Anything beyond that is just plain folly, but like I said, some people need to live their lives in fear. It makes them feel important, as other parts of their lives have no meaning.

I will tell you this. Since making it thru 9-11 with my son, I spend every moment hugging him and my wife. I don't take shit from anyone anymore, and when I see someone spreading shit about that day, that literally knows nothing about it, I will call them on it every time.

there will always be people like yourself that dont understand what the word conspiracy means , i have stated it several times, you need to go look it up , your using the term out of context, seriously.. go learn something..
you might be satisfied with having "most" of the questions answered because YOU LIVED , if it had been your son that died , do you think you would be OK with "most" of the questions being answered ? biggest attack on american soil since PH and you are satisfied with "most".. sorry but the rest of americans arent so easily appeased , i respect your right to be easily appeased , respect the families of those who have died to want the COMPLETE truth. not just parts of it.. the 9/11 report was inconclusive, if you had read it you would knopw that..

lol.. sorry, too easy. 24,000 = 2.4 x 10,000. So yeah.. it was 2.4 tens of thousands of gallons.. :1orglaugh

Also, please learn about how jet-engines function before using the [ /b ] command for such a statement. :1orglaugh

And I think anyone who is really interested in 9/11 needs to read the 9/11 commission report, even if they disagree. To dismiss it as 'part of the conspiracy' or 'a bunch of crap written by beaurocrats' is ignorant.

Amazon link to 9/11 commission report

hopefully this will put to silence once and for all , all the people who use the word conspiracy incorectly when referring to 9/11 because they are to lazy or stubborn to look it up themselves
-------------------------
CONSPIRACY ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kn-sphahaha238;r-s)

Law. An agreement between two or more persons to commit a crime or accomplish a legal purpose through illegal action.
------------------------

What this means is JFK theories WERE conspiracy theories because they involved MORE than the official story of ONE guy. THUS any theory involving MORE than one person would be a conspiracy.

With 9/11 EVERY theory includes a conspiracy because even the official story is that MORE than ONE person was involved..

So 9/11 WAS a conspiracy using every available theory i have ever heard INCLUDING the official one..


So to all the misinformed people that keep spouting the same retard party line "it wasnt a conspiracy" your a moron. If it ISNT a conspiracy then your saying 1 person was involved or several people that didnt communicate with each other about the illegal plan..

give up on these people smokey

they refuse to see the truth...it doesnt sit well with them

God thats dumb. A conspiracy is more than one person CONSPIRING to do something yes.

conspiracy

n 1: a secret agreement between two or more people to perform an unlawful act [syn: confederacy] 2: a plot to carry out some harmful or illegal act (especially a political plot) [syn: cabal] 3: a group of conspirators banded together to achieve some harmful or illegal purpose [syn: confederacy]

There are many different definitions of it. Maybe you didnt know it, but many words have more than one meaning, and its often the context in which they are used that defines the intended meaning. :winkwink:

:1orglaugh

nobody is claiming that or anything of the sort..

Ill explain , and since you say you have read the report you will understand.

The report itself states on NUMEROUS occasions the findings were INCONCLUSIVE or REQUIRED MORE INVESTIGATION.

All i am asking for is a CONCLUSION to the INVESTIGATIONS that were CLEARLY stated.. and to hold those accountable that neglected to do their job properly..

Thats not very hard to understand , and no reason why it shouldn't be done.

Now come on Brad.. would you at least agree that even you dont know 'the truth'? I dont think you can really say that you know all the events that happened prior, during and after 9/11.

..see you in phoenix

I don't want to get all up in your ass on this one, but do a search on Israel's violation of UN security resolutions. I don't recall seeing the USA ramming a foot up their ass and they HAVE nukes.

In fact the USA is in violation of UN security resolutions with its unauthorized actions against Iraq. the UN didn't sign off on this war.

They haven't brought any valid proof forward about Iraq working on its nuke program. of course then the WMD banner gets spread a little thin to cover other items. The WMD argument is pointless.

This all has nothing to do with 9/11, I just wanted to make the point.

ok wheres the definition that means BUSH DID IT ? :1orglaugh

Show me any definition that doesnt mean exactly what i said.. lol itsa funny you would try to argue a dictionary LOL

so explain to me ANY definition that wouldnt be INCLUSIVE of the official story ( of the hijackers )

i.e. in laymans terms explain to me how 9 hijackers conspiring to hijack planes ISNT a conspiracy..

Yep, I agree with you. That wasnt directed to anyone in particular. All I was saying is that it should be required reading for anyone who is serious about investigating and questioning the events on 9/11.

i find it awfully amusing that someone could seriouslt think that they can argue against a dictionary . sorry had to point that out..

stickyfingerz just posted 3 definitions all of them including the official story then tells me its about context . hahahha

its not about context , well it is actually its about them being used in the WRONG context.

i.e. when someone says " anyone who thinks this is a conspiracy is an idiot" is wrong

when someone says " anyone who thinks BUSH was involed IN the conspiracy" is using it properly.

thats where my definition came from
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=conspiracy

conspiracy

n 1: a secret agreement between two or more people to perform an unlawful act [syn: confederacy] 2: a plot to carry out some harmful or illegal act (especially a political plot) [syn: cabal] 3: a group of conspirators banded together to achieve some harmful or illegal purpose [syn: confederacy]


Now to further the case. What is the movie Conspiracy Theory about? Is it about a group of people getting together and conspire to plant a flower garden? lol

Okay dumbass, so the plane was fully loaded with fuel, none was used in the flight, and none burned in the explosion. You may be able to add 2+2, but you seem to have a problem with subtraction.

Lets hear your experience with jet engines. A good friend who is a mechanic at United made that statement to me.

FYI, it wasnt the [ /b ] command, it was the [ font ] command. Learn some html while you're at it. :1orglaugh

so your saying that none of those 3 definitions include hijackers planning to hijack planes..

what world are you living on ?

Lets go over your points one by one

hmm hijackers planning on hijacking planes certainly couldnt fit that definition :1orglaugh
hmm hijackers planning on hijacking planes certainly couldnt fit that definition :1orglaugh

hmm hijackers planning on hijacking planes certainly couldnt fit that definition :1orglaugh

i want some of what stickfingerz is smokin bwahaha sorry but how old are you ?

This is one of several issues that some people refuse to address because it will interfere with their ability to yell, 'conspiracy theorist'..

The minimum temperature required to melt steel is about 2750 F..
The maximum temperature of any fuel, including jet fuel is about 1500 F ..

The fuel couldn't have melted the steel, but that matters not.. It still melted the steel and caused 3 buildings to free fall.. That's it.. no other possibilites..

Some folks just refuse to look at facts..

Here are your FACTS buddy
http://www.civil.usyd.edu.au/wtc.shtml

did you happen to read the disclaimer on those FACTS
-----------------------------------
(This is an initial suggestion, originally written on Sept 11 2001 (with some minor subsequent changes) on one possible reason for failure, and should not be regarded as official advice.)
-----------------------------------

how anyone could believe engineering "FACTS" based on assumptions made without even looking at the structure is insane. Dont you think you would want to maybe look at the steel beams to figure out what happened ? your telling me in LESS than 12 hours , without even looking at the debris they figured out the wtc collapse bwahaha, its one thing to discuss things amongst your partners its a whole different thing to publish them and refer to them in ANY way as facts

Dude isnt this what you wanted? You wanted people who actually KNOW about this shit to give thier opinion. That link did and if you notice he says this at the bottom of the page(obviously anticipating people like you):

The author respect people's right to question theories, but at the present time the author does not believe there is enough evidence for him to change his views on this incident.