I think he did ;)

You can buy quality text links and banner spots on http://www.thumbzilla.com right now. Hit us up!!

http://www.gallerytrafficservice.com/thumbzilla.htm

Thanks,
DH

Example 4: Pure rip of content no links to the source
http://www.allthepink.com/album.php?id=224

... that's the only one in that post I agree is abusing...

While I do agree that you have every right to require anything out of anyone using your content, I do believe you conducted yourself here in a very unprofessional manner.

Sites like bodsforthemods, badgirlsblog and glam0ur make up a large portion of your traffic and sale. And to call them out in public like theyre scam artists looking to cheat you, rather than emailing them and talking to them on an individual basis is bad business.

You have every right to be upset and I'm not going to argue against you on that, however, these are some of your biggest accounts and you're treating them like they don't help you pay your bills. That's biting the hand that feeds you.

You shouldnt have made a drama thread on GFY to handle this situation, each one of these webmasters is reachable by email and ICQ. You have their information and you should have used it.

How would you feel if babebloggers started posting 1 in 2227 twistys stats all over the place without trying to work something out with you or your staff first? This type of action is something that should be avoided, especially by someone that has so many people invested in them that they should really start taking the higher road more often.

Flu, I think it is an issue for public consumption because (a) many sponsors content is being used in a similar manner, and (b) morons are ripping off the concept and fucking it up even more.

http://www.allthepink.com/foto.php?p...3/&name=01.jpg

Do you really think this is a valid use of sponsor content?

Alex

shaps, while you're here, when do you payout the $150 for Webmaster Referral? Just how many sales does it take for them to be "Active" ?

Thanks!

That's for the sponsor to decide. But I don't think the place for decisions should be made in a drama thread on GFY. If sponsors want to set rules, then set rules, its your content. But to drag the name of babeblogs through the mud, when theyre not breaking any existing rules (at this time), is ridiculous.

Ahh, so let's not discuss anything in public. Many, GFY is going to be a boring series of "would you hit it" threads for sure now.

Alex

Maybe you don't realize this, but a lot of people do this for a living and it should be somewhat of a professional enviroment, especially if youre going to be calling people scammers. And maybe you don't realize this either, but some babeblogs do upwards of over $20k-40k a month in conversions to sponsors.

From what I understand, theres no existing rule set that these blogs have broken. So why try and tarnish their reputation?

I believe that Shap was entirely correct to use this forum to ask the question he did - he didnt start a drama thread - simpy asked a business question that is a valid question.

I do have one additional question for you Shap - how do you feel about your content being used for skimming purposes on TGPs? I know that recently a few paysite owners have added rules disallowing this practice as their feeling is that if a thumb of their content is shown, the surfer clicking the thumb ought to get their gallery/pic - not thrown off to another site for a trade.

Flu, take this example from Nasty Dollars:

Now, do you really think that any ND content could appear on that site without it being in violation? Think about it, I found a 25:1 ratio of links off that didn't go to the sponsor on the "gallery" pages.

I agree it isn't for us to say "yes or no" here and now, but it is an issue facing the programs that provide promotional content, and is something that should be talked about. I didn't see this thread as drama at all, but rather a pretty open discussion about a new-ish issue.

Alex

Well... apparently you dont own one of the honest sites that got called out in this thread.

Flu, do you consider galleries with 3 X 4 adbrite ads on it acceptable use of content? Perhaps 15 cam girl pictures? Maybe some combination thereof?

http://www.dailywenches.com/ariel-re...room-pictures/

I am curious... explain how you think this is an acceptable use of the content... I would love to hear it :)

Alex

That's neither your place or my place to say. Quit trying to put words in my mouth and stop trying to change the subject of my concern. I can understand if you're backing an anti-babeblog sentiment, I could careless if you have zero foresight and don't understand that fact that these sites, unlike TGPs, are built to provide traffic and conversions to sponsors, but I'm not here to argue with you.

So, stop trying to troll me into a reply, I have no opinion on how these guys are advertising for sponsors, its not my concern.

This thread will do nothing to the honest sites. What 99% of the people posting in this thread don't realise is program owners know and conduct business with the honest sites daily. There is a reason you havn't seen any of the major single girl and teen sponsors posting in this thread. They are on a first name basis with the honest sites listed in this thread. The people that matter are the ones not posting in this thread. As the real business is done outside of GFY on a personal level. Much like what has taken place with Twistys behind the scenes (which none of you will ever know about).

What potter said...

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showpo...&postcount=115

http://dailyhotties.net/ariel_rebel/ <<adbrite ads/dating gold/adengage and links to 20 other babelogs and ariel rebel is converting 1:226. I think thats fair as the links to panchodog are displayed IMO very prominantly above the fold.

Restricting affiliates usage of content is beneficial to the program owner and those that actually want to make money. People are going to goto a babelog and get 139879835 images instead of my blog to get 3 or 4.

Shap not to be rude but whats the big deal? I can see u named bods which is one of the biggest porn blogs on the net today. Everyone has a right to make their galleries anyway they like. Rules from paysite companies state, you need at least a banner or link with the pictures or videos of the company you promote doesnt it? If you look around more, you will see that is pretty much how every blog promotes. Content pics and a link and or a banner at the bottom. These blogs are making u money and ur arguing because they are using ur content with ONLY 1 banner? Does not make sense at all. U still see sales from it right? Blogs are in my opinion different then tgps in that way. No fhgs are allowed unless the owners put there own up. To be honest most just make their own galleries and plug them for surfers to see and sign up with. Im just really confused on your complaint.

I'm surprised this is even a question. I remember when the T&C of every program had a pretty clear rule that when using free content you were not allowed to have links to ANY other sponsor on the same page. Some sponsors may be willing to look the other way, but that rule has always been in place.

exactly my point. Shap, u named off one of the biggest babe sites. You probably make an extra grand or more a month from his site. Babe sites/blogs are unique in which they are set up however the site owner feels is comfortable for him. As long as it stays within the rules where no one is using ur content to promote another site/company it shouldnt be a problem. Maybe im wrong. I do not agree with the glam0ur site with that 95% AFF.

If someone links the content directly to your paysite with their affiliate code, that would be ok? I agree it is not honest to use the paysite content supplied by the owner to promote his/her site to promote some other site.

One thing Shap do you screen new affilates?
Maybe if you pulled there accounts and stoped paying them they may stop useing your content.
How did they get the content in the first place?

These days most Paysites seem to give away to much content to stupid newbies who have no idea in how to market.All you seem to do to be able to get access to a shitload of content is simply signup to the affilate programe.

Maybe its about time paysite owners start looking at the amount of free shit they do give away.

Anyone with half a brain know's that 5% of your affilates base make you 95% of your affilate sales.
The rest are just used as sheep to brand name your shit out there.
If you dont like it then do something about it.
Ive even had paysites owners tell me when I have reported thiefed to them thats its ok because they left the watermarks on.

Well it's simple ... in the article, there should be only links to twisty. there can be a header, side bars and footers, but there gotta be at least 25 % of the article's space spent for advertising.

And by 25 %, I mean 25 % of the total space the blog is taking ... like most galleries. Not just a small banner at top and bottom.

Im just really appalled that this is how a program owner with a problem was conducted. Contact people 1 on 1. If you have ever dealt with bods you would know things get accomplished very fast with communication. Blasting someone who is as upstanding as he is, is completely uncalled for. With that said im sure twistys just lost a crapload of sales due to other blog owners now reading this, no matter if they are galleries are fine under twistys rules. I feel that this is a open attack because people do not understand the whole "Blog" thing. TGP's have been doing worse for years and no complaints. But my advice to shap and twisty's is either talk to the owners of these sites and more you find, or just close the accounts. No need for this whole outburst.

Amen my man. Nothing more to say!

Most of these so called "blogs" are nothing but a mix of tgp's with cj's (when it comes to sponsor link-farms)...

I can understand the issue with some of those sites, but I don't see the badgirlsblog as being all that bad. You click the thumb, you get the full size pic, you click the pic you get the sponsor. Yeah, the "selling" aspect is practically non-existent but frankly I don't see it much different than all the TGP galleries out there with links that are barely visible or that are limited to 1-3 by the TGP rules. And those crap TGP galleries get seen by a shit load more freeloaders than the majority of the babelogs. Most of the people in this biz don't sell.. they slap some shit together, shove it out the door and hope it makes some money.

As for the other banners (AFF) on the page. Come on... For YEARS people used free hosts with a shit load of other banners on the page as well. As a marketer, my job is to get the surfer to buy something to make me some money. So yeah, my main focus on a page is to try and get them to buy from the primary sponsor. But not putting up a couple links for other things like dating sites, enhancement products or similar themed pay sites etc. is just idiotic. Yes.. They shouldn't be the main focus of the page and should be limited in quantity, but if they don't buy from the main promotion, I need to try and get them to buy something else.

They would probably feel the same way they do as when sponsors put email collection boxes on FHGs and try to sell videos and dvds to surfers prior to the purchase of a membership. They would say screw that sponsor I'll just make my own galleries. Oh wait a minute -- that is what these "babelogs" are doing.

Just fyi blogs make up less than 2% of all our signups. Truth is blogs could not send me another sale and I would not lose any sleep at night. That is a fact. There is not a single blog that is even near our top 10 biggest affiliates.

This thread came after months of the same shit happening over and over. I got fed up and had to post to see if I was alone feeling these babelogs were getting way out of hand.

You are wrong. The examples I posted are breaking most of the rules those sponsors have in place. Ask penthouse if they like their content being used that way.

If there is nothing wrong with what they are doing then there is nothing wrong with me posting their links. Right?

Well... I guess that's where we're different. I would infact ASK PENTHOUSE, 1 on 1 through their contact information and not make a thread on GFY whilst dragging their name throught the mud.

I guess that's how we're different in business. You find it logical and ethical to mistreat people that are attempting to promote your site, even if you don't agree with how theyre doing. You find it to be good business to label them scammers and fuskers on a public forum, rather than having your staff email them.

The fact that your site has any growth with these morals is beyond me, but once again, that's how we're different.

You also believe its Good Business to LOSE INSTANTLY an alleged and projected 2% of your sales without losing any sleep over it. That doesnt reflect someone that has any kind of intergrity or... place any value into their affiliates.

If you anlienate the babeblogs... whose next? Like I said... you have every right to do anything you want with your content. But how you handled the situation was a definate "F- Wouldn't Buy Again, Buyers Beware."

http://goddam.net/orly.jpg

So you closed the Twistys affiliate accounts of the sites you posted here in this thread?

LOL :1orglaugh Do some research on me. If I'm someone you aren't going to do business with because I'm a jackass and I don't know how to handle my business then I think you'll run out of people to do business with in a hurry. There are not many people in the industry that care for affiliates, surfers and for the good of this industry as much as I do.

Thanks Linkster. I believe in being reasonable. I started as a cj site. I know what goes thru the minds of free site, cj, tgp, blog, owners. I try to accomodate their needs as best I can. I personally believe sponsors getting their panties in a bunch over a 100x150 thumbnail are going a little overboard. My position is simple as long as you send 60+% of the clicks to the gallery of that thumb I'm cool.

I find that ironic since you essentially told 2% of your sales to fuck off. You basically told babe bloggers that you could care less if they promote your content. That doesnt seem like you care for your affiliates that much.

I'd like to see some evidence that it's just 2%.

All the bloggers have come out to call me out and say I handled this the wrong way. Hey look back at the first post. I stated my opinion on the subject. I posted examples to see what other paysites thought. This has been bothering me for a while and I wanted to see what the rest of the industry thought. I didn't call anyone names. I just asked what others thought. If the links I posted were ok then there would be no issue and I'd look like a moron for posting them. Obviously since you are all upset because I'm touching on something you feel you have to defend.

LOL where did I tell 2% of my affiliates to fuck off? LOL.

You can pick on me all you want. Instead of attacking me why don't you research the posts I've made in the past and sitback and learn something. I'm sure you'll see I'm someone not worth wasting time attacking.

Flu,

If I didn't care about my affiliates and if I was an asshole I'd terminate their accounts and keep the money. I don't do that. Instead we contact each of them one by one and explain what we are looking for and work with our affiliates to make things right. In this thread I did not sling shit at one single Twistys affiliate. All I did was post links. Please show me one example where I talked shit and told a Twistys affiliate to F off.

We work day and night for our surfers and affiliates. There are not many other companies that care like us that I can 100% guarantee. That is why I'm sitting here debating and replying to posts. Most other companies would have said f-off newbie or ignored the negative comments. Instead I'm replying and with every reply working to understand the mindset of those that disagree.

Through all of this we've already developed a number of potential solutions to what I feel is a problem (abuse of promo content use) and none of the solutions involve us telling anybody to F off.

That's strange. Because, you say..

Yet, you called the sites fusker sites/galleries. And I clearly posted this was purely name calling. So, if you would as you say "research the posts I've made in the past and sit back and learn something". You would see you did indeed name call.

well.....

Its funny how AFF pops up everytime there is problems with stolen content, I guess they accept everyone into their program

btw... Flu you are a young guy breaking into the industry. I can tell by your work that you have some talent and that you are original and like to try new things. That's real good. Now I know you think I'm the big bad wolf here but I'm not. You made assumptions in this thread that were very far from the truth and I believe were made simply because you might not know better.

With or without blog sales we are doing very well. I did well before blogs came out. I'll probably do well well after blogs have matured and are no longer the fad. My point is I don't need blogs to be successful. That doesn't mean I'm turning them away. That means they don't play a huge role in the success of Twistys. You made a post indicating you felt blogs were a big part of our sales. They are not. In fact here check out the stats I posted earlier this year. These were taken way before any porn blogs existed.
http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=558484

You agree to comparing the babeblogs to the forums/communities that post and allow stolen and ripped content. :helpme

jesus. i'm not "dissing" anyone, nor am I kissing anyones ass. bodsforthemods IS one of the better babeblogs and as far as I know, a lot of the other babeblogs are crap. Never once did I name names or talk shit about anyone else. Read into what I said all you want. But the truth is that what I said is MY opinion. It may be wrong, but that's what I think.

Don't know how to sell anything? :helpme

Dude I'm not even going to waste time nitpicking on this anymore. Honestly we both have money to make and discussing what i called a fusker and what wasn't and blahblahblah is not making either of us a dime.

When i said research i meant research stuff like
http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=558484

and

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=473292

I'm wasting my time debating with two guys named potter and flu. <sigh> I'm losing my touch. I've gone from the Mallicks, JoeEs, 12Clicks to potter and flu. I'm not sure if that is a good thing or a bad thing.

If you don't see how you saying "i wouldnt lose sleep if I lost 2% of my sales" telling babeblogs to fuck off, then I'm just at a loss for words. That's definetly not "tuned in customer service".

I'm not going to continue this discourse, I don't feel like arguing point and counter point on the same topic all night long. I feel how you handled this situation was uncalled for and wrong. You say you contact your affiliates 1 on 1 but you didnt do that here.

Anyway... you have every right to do what you want, it's your content, you could cancel accounts posting more than 1 pic in galleries for all I care. Just try to be a bit more tasteful and tactful from now on.

Babe blogs drive sales. It may be a fact that you and a lot of people in the industry aren't ready to admit yet, but its true. If you don't understand the marketing theory behind how blogs reach a potential that is possibly light years ahead and superior to that of TGPs and Free Sites when it comes to conversions, then you have a lot of catching up to do.

The only proof I need in this statement rests in all of the other programs that validated your claim that initiated this thread and agreed with how you called out those blogs today.