Once and for all: THE chameleon vs Dreamsubmitter thread - this is all you need

[Dirty F]

I'm tired of the weekly comparison threads. A few people swear by chameleon and a few say you wont make money without dreamsubmitter.

I wrote this last month on another board. This was before Chameleon upgraded with new options. Read it and at the bottom i will add the options in the review.

When i submit i used chameleon. A few people kept mentioning DS and how all the big guys use it. Finally, after months i decided to switch last week. I was hesitating because Chameleon did everything i needed so i had no real reason to switch. But i decided to give it a try anyway.

The first thing you have to notice when opening DS is the HUGE fucking amount of options compared to CS. It scared me at first but i didnt wanna give up already so i downloaded the tutorials and started working on the dbase. In 1 word: Horrible. Everything that could go wrong went wrong. I followed the tutorial step by step and still nothing did what i wanted it to do. Still i didnt give up. I worked with it for 2 days, hours in a row. I really needed to know why the big guys were using it and what i was missing using CS.

Well, now a few days later im back at using CS.

The things i personally will miss not using DS:
1: Sheduling submissions upfront. Not being a big submitter i totally can live with that. Maybe thats different for you, if you need something like that then consider DS.
2: Apparently DS can auto submit to sites using passphrases and CS cant do that.
Depending on how many sites you submit to using phrases this can save you anywhere from 1 min to 1 hour. Do you have 500 sites on your list using phrases then DS is the tool you want.
3: Maybe some small stuff like different templates for the same submit session. TGP a accepts 3 outgoing links, TGP b only 1. DS can do this for you. It has a lot of small detail options like this. If your daily job is submitting galleries you might need all this stuff.

Other than that CS does everything DS can and not to forget its 50x times easier to work with.
A lot of people mention you can build your own dbases with DS. Well, you can do exactly the same thing with CS. If youre a lazy guy, CS updates the dbase a few times a week, you dont have to do shit if you dont want to.

In the end i'm pretty positive i can get the same results as the big submit guys using DS with CS. Maybe a bit more work but certainly EASIER work.

For me, getting to learn DS is simply not worth my time.

1 thing i do have to mention. The DS support was awesome. I had a few questions and stuff and they helped me right away! So dont let that stop you from buying it.

Conclusion:

You are a full time submitter. Submitting is your only income. You take it very seriously and want to make every penny possible with it. You want to shedule galleries. You want to work with different templates for different tgps. You want the smallest details accessible in a script? Youre not afraid to spend quite some time figuring it out? Buy DS.

You want something you can learn in 2 hours? You want a constantly updating dbase.
You want the program to think for you yet getting good to very good results? CS is the way to go. Once again, im pretty sure with the right lists and partner passes anyone using CS can make as much money as someone using DS.

Update december 14th:

Chameleon submitter added passphrase automatisation. So 99% of the submits where you had to fill in a pass manually can now be put on the auto submit list. This was one of the biggest pro's Dreamsubmitter had compared to Chameleon.
Also added scheduling. I never use this but i think its only up to 1 gallery. So you can go to bed and shedule a gallery for 5 in the morning for example. Also with the option to shut down the puter after the submit.
Also it now has the option to use different recips for different categories. One of the options Dreamsubmitter had that could be a reason for some people to switch to Dreamsubmitter.

With these 2 options added i personally don't see a reason anymore to buy Dreamsubmitter. It still has a few really small detail options but honestly, you can live without that. Missing those really small detail options but using a program that is 50 times easier to work with - well figure it out for yourself. I know what i would chose.

There are some people here who claim you cant make the same $ using chameleon to submit is (certainly now with the new options) complete BS.

Both products are awesome but with the updated version of Chameleon Dreamsubmitter has to simplify their product in order to get more people to use it because right now theres no reason to master it while you can start submitting with Chameleon in a hour and make the same amount of money.

[darksoul]

I haven't used DS because they dont take epass and ccbill sucks.
But so far two things I don't like about CS
everytime I get a new license the software tells me to contact
them to get a full database update. Fuck that, so far I paid 2 months and didn't used it.
And 2nd they collect data about your submissions which kinda invades your privacy.

[BigBen]

Good review. Have you ever used Advanced Submitter? How does that compare?

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by BigBen

Good review. Have you ever used Advanced Submitter? How does that compare?

I used that over a year ago and never much. Just for the odd submit so i cant judge about it. But i think the race is between the 2 mentioned in this thread.

[hjnet]

Quite good comparison, in the end all three top submission softwares (Chameleon-, Dream- and Advancedsubmitter) are easily worth their money.

Chameleon is easy to handle, but you'll not get as good results as if you put some more time in with Dreamsubmitter or Advancedsubmitter.

Dreamsubmitter is a great autosubmitter, but you'd have to put in some time to keep your database fresh.

Advancedsubmitter is IMHO the best manual submission tool, and it's the only one that can handle linklists to. And it's the only one ATM that can handle my Databases at http://updates.advancedsubmitter.com

So there isn't a "best" submitter, it depends on everybodys personal preferences.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by hjnet

Chameleon is easy to handle, but you'll not get as good results as if you put some more time in with Dreamsubmitter or Advancedsubmitter.

Why not?

Dreamsubmitter is a great autosubmitter, but you'd have to put in some time to keep your database fresh.

Just like any other submitter?

And it's the only one ATM that can handle my Databases at http://updates.advancedsubmitter.com

Just like Chameleon is the only one to handle my Chamleon dbase?

Im happy i wrote the review and not you

[hjnet]

Originally Posted by Franck

Why not?



Just like any other submitter?



Just like Chameleon is the only one to handle my Chamleon dbase?

Im happy i wrote the review and not you

1.) Cause you're submitting to one and the same DB as ~500-800 other chameleon users every day. And I have a few of my own fake Sites in their DB, some since more than a year, so I know pretty well how good it is maintained. But as I said, it's good for what it costs.

2.) No, it would take ages to explain that here, but shortly said dreamsubmitters database structure doesn't allow and submission failure. Therefore it "forces" you to keep your database maintained if you want to autosubmit. That requires lot's of work, but it also gives back autosubmission results which are nearly as good as a manual submission.

3.) Shortly said, see 1.).


I didn't criticize your review, I've only added something to it. And since I've worked with more submission tools, Databases, TGPs, MGPs, LinkLists that any other adult webmaster in the last 1.5 years I'm pretty sure that my experience in that area isn't completely worthless

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by hjnet

1.) Cause you're submitting to one and the same DB as ~500-800 other chameleon users every day. And I have a few of my own fake Sites in their DB, some since more than a year, so I know pretty well how good it is maintained. But as I said, it's good for what it costs.

2.) No, it would take ages to explain that here, but shortly said dreamsubmitters database structure doesn't allow and submission failure. Therefore it "forces" you to keep your database maintained if you want to autosubmit. That requires lot's of work, but it also gives back autosubmission results which are nearly as good as a manual submission.

3.) Shortly said, see 1.).


I didn't criticize your review, I've only added something to it. And since I've worked with more submission tools, Databases, TGPs, MGPs, LinkLists that any other adult webmaster in the last 1.5 years I'm pretty sure that my experience in that area isn't completely worthless

Answer to 1, 2 and 3. I use my own submission list.
How is this different than your own list with Dreamsubmitter.

Sorry, but youre talking out of your ass

[hjnet]

Originally Posted by Franck

Answer to 1, 2 and 3. I use my own submission list.
How is this different than your own list with Dreamsubmitter.

Sorry, but youre talking out of your ass

My reply was based on the assumption that you're using chameleons updated database like 99% of their users. Sure with your own costum built database everything equals out a bit more, but you should mention that in your comparison, since the DB is the heart of the submitter, and is responsible for the results.

The points that I've mentioned are valid for the submission softwares as they are delivered, and mostly used. If you ask yourself why you're not using their updated DB you'll agree with me.

Again, I've never said that you're wrong, I've just added my opinion...

[hjnet]

BTW, I honestly don't think that this thread will change anything, people will still start "what's the best submitter" threads, so I think we can consider this one as another one

[wallst]

bumpity bump...

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by hjnet

BTW, I honestly don't think that this thread will change anything, people will still start "what's the best submitter" threads, so I think we can consider this one as another one

In that you are correct

[Broda]

One thing you're forgetting. They both come at a cost and both depend on your PC being switched on to perform the submissions, even when scheduled.

GallerySubmitter.com will earn you just as much money, but it's free and submits off your server so scheduling is entirely hands-off.
And there's no updating, no trying to mess with rules or anything of that crap on your end. We mantain the database so all you need to do is add galleries, schedule them and forget them. Pretty simple ;)

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Broda

One thing you're forgetting. They both come at a cost and both depend on your PC being switched on to perform the submissions, even when scheduled.

GallerySubmitter.com will earn you just as much money

I HIGHYL doubt that.

[Nylz]

Originally Posted by hjnet

2.) No, it would take ages to explain that here, but shortly said dreamsubmitters database structure doesn't allow and submission failure. Therefore it "forces" you to keep your database maintained if you want to autosubmit.

True, but isn't that a good thing?
Also, it's VERY easy to change things in your database in DS imho

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Nylz

True, but isn't that a good thing?
Also, it's VERY easy to change things in your database in DS imho

How is this different with Chameleon submitter?

I manually checked submission results from the autosubmitter and yes i found a total of 1 or 2 sites that didnt go through. I do those manually now. As lnog as you check your shit every once in a while this is just as good as dreamsubmitter.

And yes, everything is very easy customizable as well in the Chameleon dbase. Actually 10 times as easy as Dreamsubmitter.

[Nylz]

Originally Posted by Franck

How is this different with Chameleon submitter?

I manually checked submission results from the autosubmitter and yes i found a total of 1 or 2 sites that didnt go through. I do those manually now. As lnog as you check your shit every once in a while this is just as good as dreamsubmitter.

And yes, everything is very easy customizable as well in the Chameleon dbase. Actually 10 times as easy as Dreamsubmitter.

I'm actually commenting on hjnet, he said it takes some time to keep your database fresh ;)

[Dirty F]

ok.


8 chars

[Nylz]

Oh btw.. the most important part of submitting is your database

if you have a shitty database, it doesn't matter what software you use..

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Nylz

Oh btw.. the most important part of submitting is your database

if you have a shitty database, it doesn't matter what software you use..

Absolutely true.

[hjnet]

Originally Posted by Nylz

True, but isn't that a good thing?
Also, it's VERY easy to change things in your database in DS imho

I meant it as a good thing

The biggest problem with autosubmitters is that people quickly get too lazy to maintain their databases, they just start to fart out one crappy gallery after another, wonder why they get crappy results, and come to the boards and blame everybody but themselves for their failure. DS actually solves that problem, but as I said it requires much work (for a bigger DB)

For that reason I'm still submitting manually with AdvancedSubmitter, cause it takes me less time to submit manually and maintain the DB at the same time, as to autosubmit and maintain the DB later on.

But in the end I think results for each submitter (I've used both and built/maintained Databases for them), may it be AS or DS are pretty much the same as long as you put enough effort into your database. And both submitters force you one way or another to do so.

[Broda]

Originally Posted by Franck

I HIGHYL doubt that.

Ofcourse you do.

[Quotealex]

Originally Posted by hjnet

Advancedsubmitter is IMHO the best manual submission tool, .... And it's the only one ATM that can handle my Databases at http://updates.advancedsubmitter.com

Why don't they make it a very good auto-submission tool as well instead of just best manual submission tool? At the end of the day, most of us bought it to auto-submit and not realy to just fill out forms....

[Harmon]

If you can not pull at least 5 sales out with Chameleons stock db, then you need to rethink your gallery building ideas and schemes. I can get 5 sales a day no problemo with their database

[SilverTab]

5 sales with chamelon stock db and one gallery submission? jeez not bad...

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Broda

Ofcourse you do.

Im not saying theres something wrong with your product but tools like that cant beat a list you made yourself. You too little control to get the max out of it. And you know that pretty damn well.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Harmon

If you can not pull at least 5 sales out with Chameleons stock db, then you need to rethink your gallery building ideas and schemes. I can get 5 sales a day no problemo with their database

5 sales per day per gallery with their dbase untouched by you?

BS.

[hjnet]

Originally Posted by Alex from Montreal

Why don't they make it a very good auto-submission tool as well instead of just best manual submission tool? At the end of the day, most of us bought it to auto-submit and not realy to just fill out forms....

AdvancedSubmitter is a good autosubmitter too, you can schedule your submission tasks, you can use proxies, it stores the size of each submission form to compare it for any changes at your next submission, etc. etc.


But I'm using it only for manual submission, cause I have to maintain big Databases at the same time, therefore autosubmission wouldn't make much sense for me.

[dissipate]

Originally Posted by Harmon

If you can not pull at least 5 sales out with Chameleons stock db, then you need to rethink your gallery building ideas and schemes. I can get 5 sales a day no problemo with their database

that's pretty damn good.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by dissipate

that's pretty damn good.

It it were true yeah. But its not.

[Nicky]

Originally Posted by Harmon

If you can not pull at least 5 sales out with Chameleons stock db, then you need to rethink your gallery building ideas and schemes. I can get 5 sales a day no problemo with their database

Thats highly unlikely...... Most people should be happy if they can get 1 sale a day from that.....

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Nicky

Thats highly unlikely...... Most people should be happy if they can get 1 sale a day from that.....

Exactly.

[Tapaz]

Franck is one of the smartest and cool guys on this board , thank you dude it was amazing thread .

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by Tapaz

Franck is one of the smartest and cool guys on this board , thank you dude it was amazing thread .

Haha cool yes, smartest no. But glad you liked the post.

[AmateurFlix]

I've used both, one issue I noticed with CS though is where some of the sites it claimed to have submitted galleries to, the galleries were never actually received by the TGP. CS would report that the submission went normally, however the TGP would not have the url in their DB.

[Jer]

Very good post, Franck. I haven't tried DS, but I used CS a long time ago and it was a great software. I didn't have my own database and/or submit passes, so I'm sure results could have been much better.

[hjnet]

Originally Posted by AmateurFlix

I've used both, one issue I noticed with CS though is where some of the sites it claimed to have submitted galleries to, the galleries were never actually received by the TGP. CS would report that the submission went normally, however the TGP would not have the url in their DB.

Hmm, not the first time that I've heard about that. Did it actually happen to you?

[justsexxx]

Originally Posted by Franck

Haha cool yes, smartest no. But glad you liked the post.

Don't be shy. You are the SMARTEST person of GFY. Maybe even of the whole world@

[Nifield]

Originally Posted by Franck

I'm tired of the weekly comparison threads. A few people swear by chameleon and a few say you wont make money without dreamsubmitter.

I wrote this last month on another board. This was before Chameleon upgraded with new options. Read it and at the bottom i will add the options in the review.

When i submit i used chameleon. A few people kept mentioning DS and how all the big guys use it. Finally, after months i decided to switch last week. I was hesitating because Chameleon did everything i needed so i had no real reason to switch. But i decided to give it a try anyway.

The first thing you have to notice when opening DS is the HUGE fucking amount of options compared to CS. It scared me at first but i didnt wanna give up already so i downloaded the tutorials and started working on the dbase. In 1 word: Horrible. Everything that could go wrong went wrong. I followed the tutorial step by step and still nothing did what i wanted it to do. Still i didnt give up. I worked with it for 2 days, hours in a row. I really needed to know why the big guys were using it and what i was missing using CS.

Well, now a few days later im back at using CS.

The things i personally will miss not using DS:
1: Sheduling submissions upfront. Not being a big submitter i totally can live with that. Maybe thats different for you, if you need something like that then consider DS.
2: Apparently DS can auto submit to sites using passphrases and CS cant do that.
Depending on how many sites you submit to using phrases this can save you anywhere from 1 min to 1 hour. Do you have 500 sites on your list using phrases then DS is the tool you want.
3: Maybe some small stuff like different templates for the same submit session. TGP a accepts 3 outgoing links, TGP b only 1. DS can do this for you. It has a lot of small detail options like this. If your daily job is submitting galleries you might need all this stuff.

Other than that CS does everything DS can and not to forget its 50x times easier to work with.
A lot of people mention you can build your own dbases with DS. Well, you can do exactly the same thing with CS. If youre a lazy guy, CS updates the dbase a few times a week, you dont have to do shit if you dont want to.

In the end i'm pretty positive i can get the same results as the big submit guys using DS with CS. Maybe a bit more work but certainly EASIER work.

For me, getting to learn DS is simply not worth my time.

1 thing i do have to mention. The DS support was awesome. I had a few questions and stuff and they helped me right away! So dont let that stop you from buying it.

Conclusion:

You are a full time submitter. Submitting is your only income. You take it very seriously and want to make every penny possible with it. You want to shedule galleries. You want to work with different templates for different tgps. You want the smallest details accessible in a script? Youre not afraid to spend quite some time figuring it out? Buy DS.

You want something you can learn in 2 hours? You want a constantly updating dbase.
You want the program to think for you yet getting good to very good results? CS is the way to go. Once again, im pretty sure with the right lists and partner passes anyone using CS can make as much money as someone using DS.

Update december 14th:

Chameleon submitter added passphrase automatisation. So 99% of the submits where you had to fill in a pass manually can now be put on the auto submit list. This was one of the biggest pro's Dreamsubmitter had compared to Chameleon.
Also added scheduling. I never use this but i think its only up to 1 gallery. So you can go to bed and shedule a gallery for 5 in the morning for example. Also with the option to shut down the puter after the submit.
Also it now has the option to use different recips for different categories. One of the options Dreamsubmitter had that could be a reason for some people to switch to Dreamsubmitter.

With these 2 options added i personally don't see a reason anymore to buy Dreamsubmitter. It still has a few really small detail options but honestly, you can live without that. Missing those really small detail options but using a program that is 50 times easier to work with - well figure it out for yourself. I know what i would chose.

There are some people here who claim you cant make the same $ using chameleon to submit is (certainly now with the new options) complete BS.

Both products are awesome but with the updated version of Chameleon Dreamsubmitter has to simplify their product in order to get more people to use it because right now theres no reason to master it while you can start submitting with Chameleon in a hour and make the same amount of money.

Hey Franck, first off i would like to thank you for trying dreamsubmitter, although i wish you would have taken me up on the 1 on 1 walkthrough of dreamsubmitter, i teach most users the ins and outs of the program in less than 2 hours.

Not taking this walkthrough allows you to miss many of the functions offered in DS.

You also mentioned that CS has updated databases, so does dreamsubmitter just an fyi.

As for everything else, I don't publicly list the ways that dreamsubmitter is better anymore, because it just gives chameleon and easy way to catch up to us in technology. I personally am tired of coming up with break through technology only to have it copied by other submitters.

I can assure you that dreamsubmitter has 10 times the capabilities of chameleon submitter even after their new update. And i challenge any person out there that favours CS to come take a 1 on 1 personal walkthrough with me of DS and see what they are missing. I will also give you a free 1 month subscription to do so.

You also mentioned dreamsubmitter is too complicated, we realize that it is very advanced, and this is why we offer 1 on 1 walkthroughs and video help files. We are also working on some new stuff with oiur new version to allow users to submit much easier.

No other submit software will actually take the time to train you one on one on all the functions and capabilities of their software, so please, take dreamsubmitter up on the offer and learn why all the biggest gallery submitters out there are using dreamsubmitter!

Dreamsubmitter is also built BY gallery submitters.


ICQ9635421
reilly at dreamsubmitter dot com

[Nifield]

Originally Posted by hjnet

Quite good comparison, in the end all three top submission softwares (Chameleon-, Dream- and Advancedsubmitter) are easily worth their money.

Chameleon is easy to handle, but you'll not get as good results as if you put some more time in with Dreamsubmitter or Advancedsubmitter.

Dreamsubmitter is a great autosubmitter, but you'd have to put in some time to keep your database fresh.

Advancedsubmitter is IMHO the best manual submission tool, and it's the only one that can handle linklists to. And it's the only one ATM that can handle my Databases at http://updates.advancedsubmitter.com

So there isn't a "best" submitter, it depends on everybodys personal preferences.

Just an FYI dreamsubmitter does have updated databases, and also is MUCH more customizable and diverse for manual submissions. Dreamsubmitter will also submit to link lists blog and any other type of form.

[Violetta]

Nice read! I have tried them all, and my conclusion is that it is harder to make money now with submitting than it was one year ago. There are too many gallerysubmitters now, and too few good tgp's that dont require $ for galleryspots

[Nifield]

Originally Posted by darksoul

I haven't used DS because they dont take epass and ccbill sucks.
But so far two things I don't like about CS
everytime I get a new license the software tells me to contact
them to get a full database update. Fuck that, so far I paid 2 months and didn't used it.
And 2nd they collect data about your submissions which kinda invades your privacy.

Adding epass is on my list of things to do, we also take paypal and wire or you can send us a check in snail mail.

[Nifield]

Originally Posted by Broda

One thing you're forgetting. They both come at a cost and both depend on your PC being switched on to perform the submissions, even when scheduled.

GallerySubmitter.com will earn you just as much money, but it's free and submits off your server so scheduling is entirely hands-off.
And there's no updating, no trying to mess with rules or anything of that crap on your end. We mantain the database so all you need to do is add galleries, schedule them and forget them. Pretty simple ;)

you say free, yet if i were to use one of the sponsors you dont list on your site how much would it cost me per submission?

[Mighty Chin]

I find this pretty funny. DS is not complicated at all and I'm pretty much legally retarted. I figured it out pretty quickly and If I ever had an issue I would just hit Nifield or Tom up and they would show me the way.

Just wait until 2.0 it will blow you away.

[Nifield]

Originally Posted by Harmon

If you can not pull at least 5 sales out with Chameleons stock db, then you need to rethink your gallery building ideas and schemes. I can get 5 sales a day no problemo with their database

i call bullshit. you start someone off with no partner accounts and chameleon database and they wont get anywhere near that. You wont get anywhere near that with any submitter right off the bat.

[Nifield]

Originally Posted by AmateurFlix

I've used both, one issue I noticed with CS though is where some of the sites it claimed to have submitted galleries to, the galleries were never actually received by the TGP. CS would report that the submission went normally, however the TGP would not have the url in their DB.

And this is why dreamsubmitter is more accurate, this will not happen with DS, it is the most accurate submit software on the market. (i've heard of the same problem happening with advanced submitter)

[AmateurFlix]

Originally Posted by hjnet

Hmm, not the first time that I've heard about that. Did it actually happen to you?

Yes

this wasn't a matter of not being listed, it's just that the url never went through the submit page correctly

[onno]

I dont think DS is so complicate to use, at least fopr the basis. I didnt tried all functions yet, but it works fine for me and i learned how to use it from the first day. They have good people helping out by icq. About data base... yes, if someone give you a data base is good, but these days with all the shit of partners accounts you need to update you data base by yourseld. I started with the DB that they gave me and i modiffied to my neededs and i submit my galleries to lots of sites with no problems and much faster than before use it. So i think is a good idea get dream submitter if you are goiong to do galleries

[hjnet]

Originally Posted by Nifield

(i've heard of the same problem happening with advanced submitter)

Calm down a bit Reilly, everybody was treated quite fair in this thread, so there's no need to start some mud-wrestling just because you want to sell a copy of DS. You know quite well that's not true

[V_RocKs]

I like em both and for the same reasons as the thread starter.