whoo whoo someone let some deep seeded resentment of Indians slip out.

How do you argue with that logic and example eh? Brilliant.

Speaking for myself in the 2+ years that I have been on the net, I have never used mp3. Wouldn't know it if I saw it to tell you the truth. Never even copied CD. If I want a CD I go to the store and BUY it.

It's one thing to pay for music or whatever then copy it for you to use in another form, it something else for you to copy something for free without permission then give it out to all your buddies.

Maybe if there wasn't so much "stealing" going on, music labels could lower the costs of CD's so poor asses that can't make $15 a week don't have to steal it in the first place.

Good points.

Ever notice that when a nincompoop hasn't a leg to stand on, he resorts to insults?

Well, first of all, the expression is "deep seated," not "deep seeded." Not understanding that, I wouldn't expect you to understand what she was getting at, either.

Another good point. Music theft can hardly be expected to drive the price of CD's down.

Leg to stand on. I wasnt aware I was arguing a position.

I already admitted I am a hypocrite. And so is 90% of the world.




Whooa settle down there grampy, dont give yourself a heart attack over this.

Ever notice that when a nincompoop hasn't a leg to stand on, he resorts to insults?

Oh, do tell... what exactly was the tirade against the indians all about.

i dont want to say kazaa rocks but...
well

Well, first off, if anyone might take umbrage, it would probably be "poor white farmer" or Republicans. I don't see that Native Americans have that much to complain about.

LMAO!
this poor guy just wanted to get some music....now he is in the middle of "MusicGate", the biggest controvercy to hit GFY yet!

Are you a complete MORON? No genocide is nothing to complain about. the fact that there are less than 10% the number of indians in the US than there were 150 years ago is nothing to complain about. Having your land stolen stolen, having your men, women and children killed by soldiers, and being hearded off to reservations like cattle is nothing to complain about.

Reservations? I believe the Nazis called them concentration camps.

Its like a god damned big retard sandwhich.

and we have a winner. tell him what he has won john
well metaform, unseenworld has just won a trip to stupidville, where he will stay at stupid 6 FOR 6 STUPID NIGHT AND STUPID DAYS. His airfare will be provided by Stupid Airlines.

this program has been brought to you by Stupid Airline - At Stupid Airline, we bring stupid people closer!

I believe music file sharing promotes music sales. The bands I've worked with over the last three years also believe making their music available over the internet will promote sales of both CDs and tickets.

This is a link to a Wired article, dated April 2000, that states sales rose despite digital piracy.

This is a link to a Salon article, dated July 2001, that states CD sales declined since Napster's file sharing was limited by the courts.

During the Napster proceedings many artisit supported the file sharing software and came out against the recodring companies.
Done Henley came out against the industry claims of copyright infringement on a work for hire endeavor, reported in November 2001 in this CNET article. And there's an impressive list of Napster supporters available on the software maker's site featuring quotes by Chuck D, Dave Matthews and Madonna here.

Music file sharing can, and does, promote a stronger music industry.

Great thread and a lot of good points being made here. Obviously people love things for free but as someone who works in content production, copyright issues are very important to me personally.

On another note. The record companies have done things in their business that does piss off a lot of consumers and artists. Case in point, this week I purchased 4 cds. One cd was a soundtrack and though the soundtrack overall is good, "Romeo Must Die", There are songs missing from it and in particular the one that I purchased the CD for in the first place. Do you think they would allow me to return it for false advertising??? Not a chance in fucking hell. A sountrack is a soundtrack plain and simple and all the songs should be on there. Or there should be a clear warning indicating what songs are missing. I shouldn't have to research before making a purchase. No fucking money & marketing games please... This particular incident has pissed me off and I believe this industry has its own issues to work out before they demand moral compliance from their customers.

Also they are toying with copy protection which (at least for a while) will prevent paying customers from making their own copies. This is 100% complete bullshit and will obviously be challenged by consumer groups...

Okay guys carry on, just my:2 cents: .

G'nite
LD:thumbsup

I second that...

AudioGalaxy used to kick so much ass before the lawyers got em.. you could search and queue up songs soo fast, and they'd download faster than any other p2p program I tried.. it sucks now though, since just about all the songs by any well known artist are disabled, you have to look for typos and shit..

that must be why EMI and others are laying off staff. The industry is booming. And the real way to get us all to be millionaaires on the net is to give it away.

Watsonian you must be giving away advertising as well. No, then why EMI give away THEIR records.

downloading mp3's has given my money to artists who would never have had my wallet opened for previously...

pretty much all the analogies about mp3's and content have been pretty vacuous.... when content is stolen it's to make a profit from it - using your work to make money from.. it's VERY far removed from someone downloading an mp3 of a band for personal use that they may actually buy the CD of at a later date... and if a paysite operator gave free access to someone he's actually forking out with his credit card for bandwidth.. not a nebulous and hard to quantify loss or increase in future profit..

i hope you don't record anything off TV with your VCR.

**it's VERY far removed from someone downloading an mp3 of a band for personal use that they may actually buy the CD of at a later date...**

Thats why they play it on radio stations free... NOT for you to make the CD all over again for 25 cents worth of disk.

Upcoming bands allowing their music to be scammed off of sites is one thing, they NEED that exposure and its a great medium for a much better chance to get a following. But well known bands? There is no excuse for that. Listen to the radio (y'all brag on your car stereos and spkrs) and make your decision there if you want the album.

The bands don't make THAT much from albums... their income is from concerts etc. So you want to take the little bit from each album they might sell?

And please do NOT tell me that you just 'might' buy that album if you get to rip it off, burn it and all of a sudden need to see the pretty little CD jacket in the box, so you rush out and pay 17 bucks or whatever. lol :1orglaugh

hehe in denmark we have a new law - ITS LEGAL TO COPY UR CDS FOR OWN USE. (backups, and if u live in same house u can make a copy of ur GF cds !)

so if they make some sh!t failproof copy protection I'll fucking sue em' :thumbsup

Originally posted by Gemini

Thats why they play it on radio stations free... NOT for you to make the CD all over again for 25 cents worth of disk.

radio bites dick.. i'd much rather listen to my cd's..


The bands don't make THAT much from albums... their income is from concerts etc. So you want to take the little bit from each album they might sell?

i know.. im a wannabe muso..
thats why i buy shirts and go to gigs. im not taking anything.. i'm downloading a shitty copy of someone's songs to listen/evaluate.... if i like it i'll buy. to tell you the truth, the greatest thing i've noticed with napster et al is the kick ass rarities you'd NEVER be able to get your hands on.. whether it's unreleased stuff of live versions.. it's good shit..

And please do NOT tell me that you just 'might' buy that album if you get to rip it off, burn it and all of a sudden need to see the pretty little CD jacket in the box, so you rush out and pay 17 bucks or whatever. lol :1orglaugh

why NOT?? i buy FUCKLOADS of cd's.. just because YOU wouldn't doesn't mean I won't.. i NEED the little jacket.. I want the liner notes.. I NEED the lyrics.. and the bloody obvious -I NEED my bitrate above 128.. i recently bought the special edition of "petsounds".. 3 cd's.. booklet.. all tracks in mono.. all in stereo.. vocals only.. brian's live studio notes.. everything...
when i go to the store i'll get maybe 10 cd's at a time.... usually with at least 2 i've never heard of before.. or look like a good "bet".. mp3's keep my "shite percentage" down.. and let me check out so many more bands than a record store can..
i don't burn mp3's to cd.... music plays an incredibly large part of my existence.. i don't skimp on it.

If you think what isnt played on the radio, MTV, VH1, ect.., isnt prepackeged by those in the Music Industry, then you need to do a hell of alot more research... Those on top are there because that is what those in the Music Industry Want you to here...

If you think an excelent Indie Label has a shot at there artists getting exposer on TRL, the Radio or whetever your wrong.

The Music/Recording industry fucks Artists just as hard as it fucks consumers... They are not getting ripped off in the least bit because poeple are downloading a couple of MP3s

my :2 cents:

what kinda riot did i start?

bunky

The point of my post, which you obviously didn't understand, was that music sales were up when Napster was heavily used and down now that it's been hogtied by the industry.

How about you try this experiment, Charly:

Don't show thumbnails on your website. When you get a new shoot done show your potential buyers just the model's face and maybe one thumbnail if you feel like it. See how your sales do and then let me know.

Hell yeah! I give away advertising. I spend hundreds of dollars a year helping out the local music scene by printing flyers, designing web site ads and printing the annual tabloid music magazine. I eat all that to support local indy bands.
I know what they want and I know how to get people to the shows.

That's good.

Unfortunately that doesn't give you the right to tell every band in the world they have to give away stuff if they don't want to.

I still luv ya Bunky
ps, have someone else start your car for awhile tho LOL

I never claimed it did. Did you think I said that?

Easy one.

Ok, let's rewind the situation, back approximately, what 100 years ago it seems like. ;> Walt Disney is making his first cartoons - he is using Grimms Fairy Tales (PD), and the Jungle Book (PD).. Now, where would he be if that material was still copyrighted? Not producing Snow White or the Jungle Book, that's for sure.

Now, your "incentive to create" - Right now, anything you create not only gives YOU royalties for your ENTIRE LIFE, it gives your children, and probably your grandchildren royalties as well. Is that fair? I don't think so, and neither did the framers of the US Constitution:

"The Congress shall have power . . . to promote the progress of science and useful arts . . . by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive rights to their respective writings and discoveries."

Limited times was 14 years. Now it's 90-150, depending on who you are and how long you live. Do you really think that having limited copyrights is hurting you? No, it's not - Disney just thinks it will hurt them, which is why they keep buying legislation, and will do so until the Supreme Court steps on it.

Cheers,
Backov

Yes, that doesn't have ANYTHING to do with the $50m loss they took getting rid of Mariah Carey.

You gotta love the music industry apologists. EMI lost money because it cranked out crap, and for once it was too crappy and the market actually worked.

At least TRY not to talk out of your ass.

Cheers,
Backov

I go without sleep all too often wondering why the first place the idiot adult webmaster get's told to go is Burger King ... I think college or even like one of those ITT Tech or DeVry places would be better ... and probably give the guy/gal more of a future than flipping burgers ...

So to all of those who can't make it in the adult biz ... go to college .. not burger king ... you'll get fat no matter which route you choose ... but hopefully you'll learn more in school than you would trying to bandage your grease burns :/

:thumbsup

Did you read what I wrote? Did you read what Gem wrote?

Can you read?

The reference to Native Americans not having much to complain about was not in general (as you stupidly seem to have taken it), but to what she wrote. I was saying that *in what she wrote* there was not much to complain about. She was insulting poor white trash, not Native Americans.

Where anywhere in what either one of us wrote was there anything approaching approval of the way Indians were treated. She was pointing out some of the injustices, not supporting them.

Now WHO is the moron?

So what if it's true? I'm not talking about helping the music industry, I'm talking about what owning something means. Which apparently isn't much to you.

As someone with a merchant account, let me inform you that as long as you pay with a credit card, you never need to pay for anything you're dissatisfied with. You may have to tell your bank to charge it back, but you will eventually get your money back. You might even end up with your money back AND the CD.

The problem with copy protection, as I see it, is that if it works (and most copy protection schemes in the past have not done so very well), the courts have supported the right of people to make copies FOR THEMSELVES. This is where Napster ran afoul of the law: by providing a means for people to make copies for nonpurchasers.

Once again, the issue isn't how it benefits musicians or the industry, it is what is it to own a piece of property, if that property is music?

Basically, that's how US courts have been interpreting copyright law. If you buy a CD for yourself and want to make a copy for YOUR car, or just want to back it up in case of damage to the original, it's not a copyright violation. However, if I make a copy for YOU, that IS a copyright violation.

Napster wasnt a ripper. Napster just let you share what was on your drive.

Ripping the cd was up to the individual with the cd. Napster just provided the means for me to take it off the persons hard drive who had either ripped it, or downloaded it from someone else.