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oops, i just started advertising for freezinebucks, i retract my last for fear of shaving ;-)

I want reparations because the government ENDED slavery.
do you have any idea how much work I could get done with a pack of slaves?

that shit cracks me up

I remember working in Bedford Sty. in Brooklyn, and having black people call me "white devil" when I got out of the truck.

I told them to eat me, my family came over here way after they were freed, I don't owe them a fucking thing. Never heard of Italian cotton barons, or Polish slavers down south, did ya?!


Fuck, I'm so tired of this oppression shit. Every wave of immigrants is fucked for the first generation, get over it. The Irish, the Italians, the Germans, Poles, etc in the 1800's now we get to the Chinese, Indians, Koreans, Vietnamese, the Cubans, the Guatamalans....

all these people hit the USA, bust their ass and what do you know, they intergrate into society, and seem to do pretty good. Big fucking difference in Bed Sty and West New York (heavy duty Cuban population - perhaps second only to Cuba)

stop crying... :sadcrying

Oh sorry.. Ithought it said slavery.. SLAYER ROCKS.

Amen man.

My best friend is black, and it pisses me off to no end the minute someone starts talking about "blacks". Who the fuck cares! We got all these people (many and most are black) screaming that people need to look past "color", yet every time you turn around their are Black Sororities or Black Groups. And then we have Halle Berry going crazy because she "opened the gates to black children". Fuck that. They aren't closed. Open your eyes and get a grip on reality. And I absolutely loved how she kept saying "black" "black" "black" "African-American". I think "black" people are much more fixated on "color" than "white" people. On top of all that, her mom is "white"!

Somebody stop me before I have a heart attack.

Who's bullets are they dodging? Surely not mine. Where are they getting AIDS? Surely not from me.

You see, black people aren't the only ones who are murdered. Remember Columbine? And of all the black people who are killed, who's killing them? Ever read the statistics? "Races" kill within their own "races". It's somewhat rare to go outside of your "race".

Again, black people aren't the only ones to have AIDS. In fact, most the people that I have ever met with AIDS were white. So what in the hell are you talking about? I realize that you're disputing another post, but come on man!

Ok, let's talk about me for a second. My ancestors were Irish and German. Came over in the late 1800s on ships. They had very, very little money. I'm sure they were starving and treated poorly on the ships, but I can't say for sure. I'm sure as hell glad they moved here. Why in the hell would I want to be in Ireland or Germany (no offence to any Irish or Germans)? But since I've been here in the States, myself and other people like me have been treated like absolute shit, ignored, segregated, locked up for no reason, and given away as babies. Just last week I was segregated. Last week man! Someone set me aside from the others because of certain characteristics that I have. So, who should I sue? I am being directly affected by something here. It wasn't my ancestors. It was ME. But I won't sue anyone. Why? There's no laws against it right now. When there is laws will I sue? Hell no! Why? Because I don't believe that the general population should be held responsible and liable for something that they have little control over. Just like you should and so should everyone else. Don't you fucking people have brains? Or do you just think about yourself and your fucking pocket book? Talk about fucking ignorance.

Am I pissed because I'm "white" and you may be "black"? Fuck no. I've never heard such a false and stupid accusation. You have to be racist to even make a comment like that. I'm pissed because of fucking stupid Americans trying to find a way to screw someone over for an easy buck. Fucking lazy ass bastards.

Go fuck yourself.

The "Reparations for slavery" issue is just like so many others, it doesn't have a real "right" or "wrong" answer or solution...and as time goes on it all just gets more blurred. I did see the following article ran in Playboy a while back, though. I'm not sure of it's accuracy, but it points out a different perspective on the subject.




Ten Reasons Why Reparations for Slavery is a Bad Idea


One

There Is No Single Group Clearly Responsible For The Crime Of Slavery

Black Africans and Arabs were responsible for enslaving the ancestors of African-Americans. There were 3,000 black slave-owners in the ante-bellum United States. Are reparations to be paid by their descendants too?

Two

There Is No One Group That Benefited Exclusively From Its Fruits

The claim for reparations is premised on the false assumption that only whites have benefited from slavery. If slave labor created wealth for Americans, then obviously it has created wealth for black Americans as well, including the descendants of slaves. The GNP of black America is so large that it makes the African-American community the 10th most prosperous "nation" in the world. American blacks on average enjoy per capita incomes in the range of twenty to fifty times that of blacks living in any of the African nations from which they were kidnapped.

Three

Only A Tiny Minority Of White Americans Ever Owned Slaves, And Others Gave Their Lives To Free Them

Only a tiny minority of Americans ever owned slaves. This is true even for those who lived in the ante-bellum South where only one white in five was a slaveholder. Why should their descendants owe a debt? What about the descendants of the 350,000 Union soldiers who died to free the slaves? They gave their lives. What possible moral principle would ask them to pay (through their descendants) again?

Four

America Today Is A Multi-Ethnic Nation and Most Americans Have No Connection (Direct Or Indirect) To Slavery

The two great waves of American immigration occurred after 1880 and then after 1960. What rationale would require Vietnamese boat people, Russian refuseniks, Iranian refugees, and Armenian victims of the Turkish persecution, Jews, Mexicans Greeks, or Polish, Hungarian, Cambodian and Korean victims of Communism, to pay reparations to American blacks?

Five

The Historical Precedents Used To Justify The Reparations Claim Do Not Apply, And The Claim Itself Is Based On Race Not Injury

The historical precedents generally invoked to justify the reparations claim are payments to Jewish survivors of the Holocaust, Japanese-Americans and African- American victims of racial experiments in Tuskegee, or racial outrages in Rosewood and Oklahoma City. But in each case, the recipients of reparations were the direct victims of the injustice or their immediate families. This would be the only case of reparations to people who were not immediately affected and whose sole qualification to receive reparations would be racial. As has already been pointed out, during the slavery era, many blacks were free men or slave-owners themselves, yet the reparations claimants make no distinction between the roles blacks actually played in the injustice itself. Randall Robinson's book on reparations, The Debt, which is the manifesto of the reparations movement is pointedly sub-titled "What America Owes To Blacks." If this is not racism, what is?

Six

The Reparations Argument Is Based On The Unfounded Claim That All African-American Descendants of Slaves Suffer From The Economic Consequences Of Slavery And Discrimination

No evidence-based attempt has been made to prove that living individuals have been adversely affected by a slave system that was ended over 150 years ago. But there is plenty of evidence the hardships that occurred were hardships that individuals could and did overcome. The black middle-class in America is a prosperous community that is now larger in absolute terms than the black underclass. Does its existence not suggest that economic adversity is the result of failures of individual character rather than the lingering after-effects of racial discrimination and a slave system that ceased to exist well over a century ago? West Indian blacks in America are also descended from slaves but their average incomes are equivalent to the average incomes of whites (and nearly 25% higher than the average incomes of American born blacks). How is it that slavery adversely affected one large group of descendants but not the other? How can government be expected to decide an issue that is so subjective - and yet so critical - to the case?

Seven

The Reparations Claim Is One More Attempt To Turn African-Americans Into Victims. It Sends A Damaging Message To The African-American Community.

The renewed sense of grievance -- which is what the claim for reparations will inevitably create -- is neither a constructive nor a helpful message for black leaders to be sending to their communities and to others. To focus the social passions of African-Americans on what some Americans may have done to their ancestors fifty or a hundred and fifty years ago is to burden them with a crippling sense of victim-hood. How are the millions of refugees from tyranny and genocide who are now living in America going to receive these claims, moreover, except as demands for special treatment, an extravagant new handout that is only necessary because some blacks can't seem to locate the ladder of opportunity within reach of others -- many less privileged than themselves?

Eight

Reparations To African Americans Have Already Been Paid

Since the passage of the Civil Rights Acts and the advent of the Great Society in 1965, trillions of dollars in transfer payments have been made to African-Americans in the form of welfare benefits and racial preferences (in contracts, job placements and educational admissions) - all under the rationale of redressing historic racial grievances. It is said that reparations are necessary to achieve a healing between African-Americans and other Americans. If trillion dollar restitutions and a wholesale rewriting of American law (in order to accommodate racial preferences) for African-Americans is not enough to achieve a "healing," what will?

Nine

What About The Debt Blacks Owe To America?

Slavery existed for thousands of years before the Atlantic slave trade was born, and in all societies. But in the thousand years of its existence, there never was an anti-slavery movement until white Christians - Englishmen and Americans -- created one. If not for the anti-slavery attitudes and military power of white Englishmen and Americans, the slave trade would not have been brought to an end. If not for the sacrifices of white soldiers and a white American president who gave his life to sign the Emancipation Proclamation, blacks in America would still be slaves. If not for the dedication of Americans of all ethnicities and colors to a society based on the principle that all men are created equal, blacks in America would not enjoy the highest standard of living of blacks anywhere in the world, and indeed one of the highest standards of living of any people in the world. They would not enjoy the greatest freedoms and the most thoroughly protected individual rights anywhere. Where is the gratitude of black America and its leaders for those gifts?

Ten

The Reparations Claim Is A Separatist Idea That Sets African-Americans Against The Nation That Gave Them Freedom

Blacks were here before the Mayflower. Who is more American than the descendants of African slaves? For the African-American community to isolate itself even further from America is to embark on a course whose implications are troubling. Yet the African-American community has had a long-running flirtation with separatists, nationalists and the political left, who want African-Americans to be no part of America's social contract. African Americans should reject this temptation.

For all America's faults, African-Americans have an enormous stake in their country and its heritage. It is this heritage that is really under attack by the reparations movement. The reparations claim is one more assault on America, conducted by racial separatists and the political left. It is an attack not only on white Americans, but on all Americans -- especially African-Americans.

America's African-American citizens are the richest and most privileged black people alive -- a bounty that is a direct result of the heritage that is under assault. The American idea needs the support of its African-American citizens. But African-Americans also need the support of the American idea. For it is this idea that led to the principles and institutions that have set African-Americans - and all of us -- free.

If it were to fly, I'd love to see the American Indians sue to get their land back. Now THAT is one that makes sense.

no shit man! we'd all have to move, cuz we stole the whole damn country.

I agree...we gave them a couple thousand shitty acres and a few casinos, then just called it even. Of course, I've got some Cherokee in me, maybe I'd cash in...LoL.

If this logic ever prevails then there will be a lot of moving going on.

Let's take Italians for example. Under this logic the following would take place.

Southern Italians move back to North Africa and Southern Spain.
Move in Moroccans and Scandinavians. Move them out again to make way for people from Spain [Andalusian region--the Vandals settled there]. Move these people out again to make way for Central Italians. Move these people out to to make way for German people. Move these out to make way for Swedes. Move them out due to Slovenes... etc etc ad nauseum.


HISTORY is about movement and conquest. Nobody "owns" anything.

well how about we should be thanking the black ancestors for building this country.... cuz its a proven fact without the black slaves there wouldn't be the US of today,,,this idea of still living in africa can work both ways

there is alot of generalization here,,, you shouldn't classify the whole race,,, i mean if you see someone black you automatically gonna assume there on welfare or being lazy? any person with common sense knows this frivolous lawsuit,,, wow a grouped class action suit,,, hmm 33 million blacks,, what does that mean everyone will get $50.00

**If it were to fly, I'd love to see the American Indians sue to get their land back. Now THAT is one that makes sense.**

Thats the bent my previous post was angling at. The old man is Shawnee-Cherokee and he's actual chuckling over this suit. His thoughts are, we'll have the Summer home around Xenia Ohio where his faamily on his Mom's side lived and the Winter home down in the Carolinas where his Dads family lived. lol

Odd thing, both sides of his family fought for the North. There is a church in Alabama that was used as a civil war hospital, and it was left as it was then. Museum style. And in candle soot on one of the angled ceilings where the cots were placed, is his family name. That man almost died in Andersonville for that war. Several others DID die. He owes what to whom?

We owe who WHAT? BS! He holds no grudges to be truthful so why are they? More Indians suffered than the Slaves of African ethninticity. <sp?> Ahh but he has abit of the Irish blarney in him too. Also his Irish ancestor was beknighted in England so they have a Brit coat of Arms. Maybe THAT keeps him from being upset that his tribes were both forced to march a thousand miles on foot IN the Winter so that the slaves HAD fields to work in.


His only statement has been let the wasitay set precedence and we will own Ohio once again. He just got back from tinkering with yet ANOTHER war. Seems these Injuns just love a good fight and will travel.
:winkwink:

its funny how slavery was such a big issue when more salved where sent to brazil than any other country, and yet people plame the whites for it when it was the blacks selling there own people to white buyers.

If only people in Africa would have thought of it first... they could have bought white people and then there might have been a United States of Africa.

As human beings, I don't feel people are responsible for what their ancestors did. This seems simlar to discovering that an ancestor from 137 years ago committed murder, so you get life in prison. It's different times now, different generations of people, and there have been advances in medicine, technology, etc. Basically this influences how people act... they are not the same as people were a century ago.

If you are a U.S. citizen, unemployment and welfare is equally available to you no matter what your race is. And the laws are the same for us all now. If something like slavery happened to you personally then you should have to right to make things even. The person(s) suing my not even have known their ancestors which were in slavery.