Dot XXX: Do You Think Adult Webmasters Are Stupid?...YNOT BOB SPEAKS ON .XXX

[MikeHawk]

Dot XXX: Do You Think Adult Webmasters Are Stupid?
by YNOTBob

Internext, Miami, 2005? I made it back and consider this year to be, once again, another great show. There were the usual complaints you get from any show. Lower attendance, too expensive, blah blah blah. My opinion is: until you put together a large event such as this, don?t bitch about it. You don?t like it, don?t attend ? or better yet, develop your own large scale convention. Kudos and props to AVN for providing yet another professional arena where adult webmasters could learn and network.

Myopic and minority complaints on this year?s Internext can be duly ignored. There was a panel which should have been attended by every webmaster at Internext. This seminar alone paid for my entire expense list for the week. Those of you who chose to sleep in, were hung-over, or simply did not attend, will have nothing to complain about if you missed the .XXX seminar. If you had attended, you?d know how this issue could shape up to destroy the flow of our industry?s growth. This should have been a mandatory seminar?get your pass, go to this seminar, learn, now fight back.

As monster as the topic of .XXX is, and how it will affect our industry, I was shocked there were probably less than 100 people in attendance. Here is the true threat to our industry. Forget about Acacia, 2257, Visa regulations, the Protect Act, whatever? think thoughts of .XXX and how your life will be drastically changed if this goes through.

But before I get to the emails stacking up, before I return any calls or messages, I still have one question left. This question is eating and burning at me in a way I haven?t felt since the acquittal of O.J. Simpson?

My question, and it is a simple one, is this: Jason Hendeles and Stuart Lawley, the two visible promoters and founders of the .XXX initiative, do you think adult webmasters are stupid?

Yeah I know, such a simple question. Yet one which has gone unanswered in all conversations with the .XXX peeps? so once again, do you gentlemen think adult webmasters are stupid?


read the rest here: http://www.ynot.com/modules.php?op=m...cle &sid=9663

[MikeHawk]

Originally Posted by MikeHawk

Dot XXX: Do You Think Adult Webmasters Are Stupid?
by YNOTBob

Internext, Miami, 2005? I made it back and consider this year to be, once again, another great show. There were the usual complaints you get from any show. Lower attendance, too expensive, blah blah blah. My opinion is: until you put together a large event such as this, don?t bitch about it. You don?t like it, don?t attend ? or better yet, develop your own large scale convention. Kudos and props to AVN for providing yet another professional arena where adult webmasters could learn and network.

Myopic and minority complaints on this year?s Internext can be duly ignored. There was a panel which should have been attended by every webmaster at Internext. This seminar alone paid for my entire expense list for the week. Those of you who chose to sleep in, were hung-over, or simply did not attend, will have nothing to complain about if you missed the .XXX seminar. If you had attended, you?d know how this issue could shape up to destroy the flow of our industry?s growth. This should have been a mandatory seminar?get your pass, go to this seminar, learn, now fight back.

As monster as the topic of .XXX is, and how it will affect our industry, I was shocked there were probably less than 100 people in attendance. Here is the true threat to our industry. Forget about Acacia, 2257, Visa regulations, the Protect Act, whatever? think thoughts of .XXX and how your life will be drastically changed if this goes through.

But before I get to the emails stacking up, before I return any calls or messages, I still have one question left. This question is eating and burning at me in a way I haven?t felt since the acquittal of O.J. Simpson?

My question, and it is a simple one, is this: Jason Hendeles and Stuart Lawley, the two visible promoters and founders of the .XXX initiative, do you think adult webmasters are stupid?

Yeah I know, such a simple question. Yet one which has gone unanswered in all conversations with the .XXX peeps? so once again, do you gentlemen think adult webmasters are stupid?


read the rest here: http://www.ynot.com/modules.php?op=m...cle &sid=9663

YNOT Bob Rocks...........
I sat next to Bob at the AVN show durring the .XXX discussion, I know he feels as stongly against this .XXX as I do. I like this point he makes in the artticle:

Let us start with the .XXX panel at Internext. The panel was supposed to be set up on an even scale ? two pro, two con, and two middle ground. On the ?pro side? there were the two proponents of .XXX, Mr. Hendeles and Mr.Lawley. On the ?con side? there was Connor Young of YNOT and Tom Hymes of the FSC. In the ?supposed? middle were Monte Cahn and Greg Piccionelli. Did I mention Hendeles and Lawley ?appointed? Piccionelli and Cahn as the middle ground? I?m told they wouldn?t attend the seminar unless these two were on the panel. This also meant a previously chosen panel member was left off the seminar.

I also say ?supposed? because it seemed that Mr. Moniker himself, Monte Cahn, had more at stake financially in this than almost Lawley and Hendeles? I mean, where are you going to go to register these .XXX domains? Ahh yes!!! Moniker! Having Monte be neutral in this panel would be similar to having Donald Trump try and tell you real estate is not a profitable investment.


Good stuff YNOT Bob.......

.XXX
.XXX we dont need it...

[Cains]

Originally Posted by MikeHawk

[B] I was shocked there were probably less than 100 people in attendance. Here is the true threat to our industry. Forget about Acacia, 2257, Visa regulations, the Protect Act, whatever? think thoughts of .XXX and how your life will be drastically changed if this goes through.

How is it such a threat to the adult industry as a whole? .XXX is voluntary and people will keep their .com addresses, how is it such a threat?

Perhaps the reason for such poor attendance is that most people see .XXX for what it is, another TLD, rather than some fantasy threat to the industry.

[RuthB]

interesting article.. thanks for the link Mike

[MikeHawk]

Originally Posted by Cains

How is it such a threat to the adult industry as a whole? .XXX is voluntary and people will keep their .com addresses, how is it such a threat?

Perhaps the reason for such poor attendance is that most people see .XXX for what it is, another TLD, rather than some fantasy threat to the industry.

Cains...do me a favor and say hi to Jason and Stuart for all of us....and tell them

[Connor]

Originally Posted by Cains

How is it such a threat to the adult industry as a whole? .XXX is voluntary and people will keep their .com addresses, how is it such a threat?

Perhaps the reason for such poor attendance is that most people see .XXX for what it is, another TLD, rather than some fantasy threat to the industry.

I found the above statement to be, to say the least, uninformed.

[Harley Girl]

Originally Posted by MikeHawk

Cains...do me a favor and say hi to Jason and Stuart for all of us....and tell them

[TheGoldenChild]

My question to YNOT Bob is ...

Do you know how much Andy Edmond did to support .XXX?
For newbies asking
Who is Andy Edmond?
Andy Edmond was CEO of Flying Crocodile- and acquired YNOT back in 2000.

He of course is no longer active with YNOT or FCI- however I recall a time when Otto ( Greg Geelan) former Presidennt of YNOT, fully believed his bullshit.

Where is Greg these days???

hmmmmmmmmmmm

[Connor]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

My question to YNOT Bob is ...

Do you know how much Andy Edmond did to support .XXX?
For newbies asking
Who is Andy Edmond?
Andy Edmond was CEO of Flying Crocodile- and acquired YNOT back in 2000.

He of course is no longer active with YNOT or FCI- however I recall a time when Otto ( Greg Geelan) former Presidennt of YNOT, fully believed his bullshit.

Where is Greg these days???

hmmmmmmmmmmm

I should know better than to respond, but call it a lapse in judgement... so I'll ask, what does your above post have to do with anything? I guess I'm not understanding the inference. Are you trying to suggest that Edmond was a dot-xxx supporter? And if he was, that the information is somehow relevant to this thread? I believe Edmond was last seen hanging out in adult industry circles in, what, 2001? You're an interesting man, KB.

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by Connor

I should know better than to respond, but call it a lapse in judgement... so I'll ask, what does your above post have to do with anything? I guess I'm not understanding the inference. Are you trying to suggest that Edmond was a dot-xxx supporter? And if he was, that the information is somehow relevant to this thread? I believe Edmond was last seen hanging out in adult industry circles in, what, 2001? You're an interesting man, KB.

Andy not only supported .XXX, he testified as part of the COPA proceddings.

[MikeHawk]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

My question to YNOT Bob is ...

Do you know how much Andy Edmond did to support .XXX?
For newbies asking
Who is Andy Edmond?
Andy Edmond was CEO of Flying Crocodile- and acquired YNOT back in 2000.

He of course is no longer active with YNOT or FCI- however I recall a time when Otto ( Greg Geelan) former Presidennt of YNOT, fully believed his bullshit.

Where is Greg these days???

hmmmmmmmmmmm

KB....just repeat after me......... .XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD! .XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!VV.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!

very bad!

[Dalai lama]

Good read thanks Mike.

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by MikeHawk

KB....just repeat after me......... .XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD! .XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!VV.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!.XXX IS BAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!

very bad!

We know this Mike.
I am just educating people a little more that's all.
People want to know how it got this bad- and I am sharing my experience and my knowledge of the matter that's all.

[Connor]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

Andy not only supported .XXX, he testified as part of the COPA proceddings.

Okay... but why does this matter?

[MikeHawk]

Originally Posted by kBizzle

We know this Mike.
I am just educating people a little more that's all.
People want to know how it got this bad- and I am sharing my experience and my knowledge of the matter that's all.

Hey KB...check this out, this i thought was very interesting:

Jason Hendeles
> A Technology Company, Inc."
>
> In other words, the belief that an objective way forward on extending
> the namespace for the public good can be compromised by applying
> financial pressure on ICANN, which is heavily dependent on the
> Registrar community for revenue.
>
> The allocation of the previous NewTLDs greatly favoured people like
> Ken Stubbs who were closely involved with ICANN, in favouring what
> could be called the 'insider' bid of the Registrars' Cartel who were
> granted .info ... in addition to this, when the public protested at
> the abuse of process and the profit-making that occurred during the
> moneyfest that was the launch of .info and .biz, ICANN refused to
> intervene and some registrars got away with daylight robbery.
>
> Jason Hendeles' own company was involved in the very short lists
> submitted by a few registrars to exploit registrar privilege by
> gaining advantage over the general public in the round-robin exercises
> through which desirable domains were released. Now he seems to be
> calling for ICANN to be pressurised into decisions on the basis of a
> financial hold he seems to think the Registrars have over ICANN.
>
> ICANN's selection of NewTLDs has attracted real concerns; ICANN's
> evaluation of the NewTLDs has appeared amateurish and unaccountable;
> ICANN's policy on further NewTLDs has seemed arbitrary; its
> restrictions on who can apply in the next round of gTLDs seems
> arbitrary and unreasonable.
>
> How can we rely on ICANN to make decisions in the interests of the
> broader public if it is dependent for money on registrars like Mr
> Hendeles who see that dependency as a negotiating weapon for putting
> private profit first. ICANN is supposed to be Not-For-Profit and its
> decisions must reflect that.
>
> Mr Hendeles : go and sell hot-dogs! Leave internet governance alone!
>
> And ICANN: no-one will trust you as long as you have this dependent
> symbiotic relationship with Registries and Registrars.
>
> * * *
>
> Yrs,
>
> Richard H

[sextoyking]

Good article and write up Bob!!!

You always say it like it is man

[TheDoc]

Really, why is .xxx soooo bad?

Is it because you "think" they will force the adult industry to move to .xxx (which is impossible).. So if you had .xxx domains what would be the problem? Filters?

Rebranding? Of what? Everyone knows your .com not like everyone will type in .xxx just because they came out.


So what is the real issue(s)?


For the record I?m neutral on the issue. I don?t live in a world of fear and I sure don?t fear .xxx.

[Connor]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Really, why is .xxx soooo bad?

Is it because you "think" they will force the adult industry to move to .xxx (which is impossible).. So if you had .xxx domains what would be the problem? Filters?

Rebranding? Of what? Everyone knows your .com not like everyone will type in .xxx just because they came out.


So what is the real issue(s)?


For the record I?m neutral on the issue. I don?t live in a world of fear and I sure don?t fear .xxx.

Recognizing something will be harmful to your business has nothing to do with fear... it has everything to do with having the ability to make sound business decisions. The reasons against dot-xxx have been explained at great length in various chat board threads, articles and seminars. I doubt anyone wants to post them yet again for one more person, but if you do a little research I think you'll come down off the fence and oppose this thing as something that can do significant harm to your business. That's not being fearful, that's just being practical and smart.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Connor

Recognizing something will be harmful to your business has nothing to do with fear... it has everything to do with having the ability to make sound business decisions. The reasons against dot-xxx have been explained at great length in various chat board threads, articles and seminars. I doubt anyone wants to post them yet again for one more person, but if you do a little research I think you'll come down off the fence and oppose this thing as something that can do significant harm to your business. That's not being fearful, that's just being practical and smart.

I have read about .xxx, many times.. I have seen posts about it.

I have yet to see anything other than fear based possible "issues" that could come from this. Everyone seems more pissed that people in this industry are making money from .xxx rather than pointing out one single solid fact of why it's bad.

If something could harm my business and you have no proof, that is fear. The GOV isn't going to force us to move, the world isn't going to move, we aren't going to lose branding, we won't have to rebrand, it still won't protect children but it will offer some help... Again, sounds like people are pissed that others are making money from it rather than the real issues of why .xxx may or may not be bad.

[Connor]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

I have read about .xxx, many times.. I have seen posts about it.

I have yet to see anything other than fear based possible "issues" that could come from this. Everyone seems more pissed that people in this industry are making money from .xxx rather than pointing out one single solid fact of why it's bad.

If something could harm my business and you have no proof, that is fear. The GOV isn't going to force us to move, the world isn't going to move, we aren't going to lose branding, we won't have to rebrand, it still won't protect children but it will offer some help... Again, sounds like people are pissed that others are making money from it rather than the real issues of why .xxx may or may not be bad.

If that's the conclusion you've come to then you're probably reading the wrong things...

You seem to be suggesting that we should close our eyes to all the potential problems of dot-xxx unless it can be proven that they are guarunteed to come to pass. I don't know of anyone successful who does business that way. The smart way to do business is to look at all the potential outcomes of a deal... both pro and con... and make the best decision based on likely outcomes. Your position sounds a little like Hendeles' position... which is, "trust us." If you choose to do business that way, well, best of luck with that approach. Personally when I see a proposal with an incredible potential for harm and no potential for positives, I'm against it.

BTW, which company are you with?

[BV]

What happens when .sex domains become available?

[TheDoc]

I do look at the pros and cons of pretty much everything that I do. But to look at the cons you can't branch off into the unknown or you start to dwell on the negative. Dwelling on the negative is worse than ignoring the cons.

Also as I said you can?t branch off into the unknown, only the facts. A possible negative outcome will become the outcome if you dwell on it. I can agree with you and everyone else that overall .xxx has many negative possibilities with little to no benefits for our industry.

This is why I had asked for a more solid answer as to why .xxx is bad. Not theories of what could happen.

2257 started off as a huge negative force of energy, no possible way to comply, the industry was over.. Months later, we are still here, most people can comply, and things are being changed. I know this is different but it?s an example.. Just because .xxx comes out doesn?t mean the industry is over, doesn?t mean anything will happen.

[tradermcduck]

Originally Posted by BV

What happens when .sex domains become available?

From my point of view the best method to fight .XXX is to launch .SEX , .PORN , .ADULT etc.

[polish_aristocrat]

Originally Posted by tradermcduck

From my point of view the best method to fight .XXX is to launch .SEX , .PORN , .ADULT etc.

that doesnt make much sense

[Connor]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

I do look at the pros and cons of pretty much everything that I do. But to look at the cons you can't branch off into the unknown or you start to dwell on the negative. Dwelling on the negative is worse than ignoring the cons.

Also as I said you can?t branch off into the unknown, only the facts. A possible negative outcome will become the outcome if you dwell on it. I can agree with you and everyone else that overall .xxx has many negative possibilities with little to no benefits for our industry.

This is why I had asked for a more solid answer as to why .xxx is bad. Not theories of what could happen.

2257 started off as a huge negative force of energy, no possible way to comply, the industry was over.. Months later, we are still here, most people can comply, and things are being changed. I know this is different but it?s an example.. Just because .xxx comes out doesn?t mean the industry is over, doesn?t mean anything will happen.

Nobody said the industry is over... but I'm not sure why a bad proposal can't be called a bad proposal. The potential for serious harm to your business is not worth the potential benefit, if in fact there is any potential benefit. Period.

2257... you're right, apples and oranges. But keep in mind, that's still being fought out in court and there's no telling where that one will land.

Here is the key to all this, stright from your own keyboard:

"I can agree with you and everyone else that overall .xxx has many negative possibilities with little to no benefits for our industry."

That's the point exactly. But you can't ask for "proof" of what is likely to happen in the future... until it happens, there can be no proof. You're asking for the impossible here. But that doesn't mean you ignore the very likely possibilities when they directly affect your business. Sometimes it's better to head something off BEFORE it becomes a problem rather than thinking happy thoughts and hoping for the best. Until today, we were all told that this .XXX thing was a "done deal," and that Commerce couldn't intervene, etc, etc. The playing field looks a little different now.

If you want to protect the kids, use voluntary labels... they're free, and you can always remove them if they become a problem. You may not like hypotheticals, but how will you feel if Visa suddenly decides that all adult sites have to be on .XXX domain names to continue to accept Visa? Many industry attorneys have said this is a real possibility. Supporters of .XXX have talked about using Visa as a "carrot" to get sites over to dot-xxx domains. Is that okay with you? And how are you going to feel when any generic word .com domain names you have belong to someone else in the dot-xxx world, and Visa issues a new regulation forcing you to move or lose Visa processing? This is just one simple POSSIBLE scenario that any smart adult business person would have to consider when deciding whether or not to oppose dot-xxx. Is that POSSIBILITY worth any possible benefits of dot-xxx?

[FightThisPatent]

The best way to keep kids from seeing the bad stuff, is for them to use a filtered browser that allows them access to a "white list".

.KIDS is a great TLD to have..

disney.kids would be there, etc.

they could even charge $120/domain for .kids

but oh gee, no money in it for the registrars and registry...


Fight the .XXX !

[Cains]

Originally Posted by Connor

Nobody said the industry is over... but I'm not sure why a bad proposal can't be called a bad proposal. The potential for serious harm to your business is not worth the potential benefit, if in fact there is any potential benefit. Period.

2257... you're right, apples and oranges. But keep in mind, that's still being fought out in court and there's no telling where that one will land.

Here is the key to all this, stright from your own keyboard:

"I can agree with you and everyone else that overall .xxx has many negative possibilities with little to no benefits for our industry."

That's the point exactly. But you can't ask for "proof" of what is likely to happen in the future... until it happens, there can be no proof. You're asking for the impossible here. But that doesn't mean you ignore the very likely possibilities when they directly affect your business. Sometimes it's better to head something off BEFORE it becomes a problem rather than thinking happy thoughts and hoping for the best. Until today, we were all told that this .XXX thing was a "done deal," and that Commerce couldn't intervene, etc, etc. The playing field looks a little different now.

If you want to protect the kids, use voluntary labels... they're free, and you can always remove them if they become a problem. You may not like hypotheticals, but how will you feel if Visa suddenly decides that all adult sites have to be on .XXX domain names to continue to accept Visa? Many industry attorneys have said this is a real possibility. Supporters of .XXX have talked about using Visa as a "carrot" to get sites over to dot-xxx domains. Is that okay with you? And how are you going to feel when any generic word .com domain names you have belong to someone else in the dot-xxx world, and Visa issues a new regulation forcing you to move or lose Visa processing? This is just one simple POSSIBLE scenario that any smart adult business person would have to consider when deciding whether or not to oppose dot-xxx. Is that POSSIBILITY worth any possible benefits of dot-xxx?

You make a point about future possible action and point to the fact that there is no proof to the contrary, yet to suit your argument you use words such as "likely" and "real possibility"

VISA could stop processing adult sites now if they like, why don't they? why do they even need to tell adult sites to move to .xxx? where is the benefit for them?

[TheDoc]

When the VISA rules came out, the industry was over. No possible way to get under 1%, chargeback hell, people getting flagged, refunds under 2%.. This was it, the industry was going to change.. But years later, we find out the you can process of shore, live in the US, split up accounts, use safe processing to keep cb?s low, etc.. The industry didn?t even change much other than the shady fucks had to straighten up a bit.

Spam laws, same BS different day.. Ended up, if you have double opt in, white lists, low t no complaints, your ass is fine.. If you spam, you get nailed.. Simple.

Then, 2257.. Again, we are done as an industry, no possible way to comply, no possible way we can get records in order. But we did, and now we are getting some changes. Fact is, we still can comply, the works sucks, but it can be done.



.xxx, probably the bitch of them all. Stand a ?chance? that VISA could regulate us but chances are that it wont happen. VISA has been found to be a monopoly by the Supreme Court, they don?t want to take us on just as much as we don?t want to take them on. GOV?s could block .xxx, but who is going to force us to move? Every country, The UN? VISA rules? In every processing region?

Why fill peoples mind with total fear of a possible outcome. If you are against it and don?t want it to not happen then pull the industry together. Fight it, take it to court, how can we donate? Who is fighting? Is it a group of guys arguing on a board or in a conference room?

So how do we block it from happening? I?m tried of reading about how bad it is for us.. If we have grounds to fight it, then lets fight.



As a side note, Internet lawyers, can take a hike on this issue.. If we have to fight VISA because of .xxx we will need real lawyers experienced in dealing with VISA.. VISA has been sued, and lost. It can happen again.

[dready]

I just read that the Bush administration is against .XXX big time.

http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-5833764.html

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by dready

I just read that the Bush administration is against .XXX big time.

http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-5833764.html

Some people in GOV are for it though..

[AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE]

[Rinaldo]

MikecOCK
Can you contact me on ICq please... thanks

[jayeff]

Those who try to dismiss fears about .XXX as some sort of conspiracy nonsense either have their heads up their asses or are promoting their own agenda.

It really doesn't matter whether you think the potential risks are serious or negligible, this new TLD has absolutely nothing positive to offer anyone except registrars and domain sitters. Without anything to compensate for whatever risk there may be, nor for the additional costs involved, what possible reason can there be to support it?

But then I guess (to borrow from the original question) that "Adult Webmasters Are Stupid". Poor attendance at the Internext seminar reflects the struggle that MikeHawk and others are having to get anyone to talk about this issue at all, let alone to do anything about it. Let's face it, if most couldn't spare the time to deal with 2257 and the threat of 5 years in jail, what chance does this topic have?

[GatorB]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

The GOV isn't going to force us to move,

The same government that enacted these onerous new 2257 rules? The same government that prevents babies from boarding flights because their names show up on a terrorist watch list? The same government that LIED out WMDs so it could invade Iraq because as Bush said, "Saddam tried to kill my daddy"? The same government whose constituency is the religious right that are DEMANDING that Bush ban porn.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by jayeff

Those who try to dismiss fears about .XXX as some sort of conspiracy nonsense either have their heads up their asses or are promoting their own agenda.

It really doesn't matter whether you think the potential risks are serious or negligible, this new TLD has absolutely nothing positive to offer anyone except registrars and domain sitters. Without anything to compensate for whatever risk there may be, nor for the additional costs involved, what possible reason can there be to support it?

But then I guess (to borrow from the original question) that "Adult Webmasters Are Stupid". Poor attendance at the Internext seminar reflects the struggle that MikeHawk and others are having to get anyone to talk about this issue at all, let alone to do anything about it. Let's face it, if most couldn't spare the time to deal with 2257 and the threat of 5 years in jail, what chance does this topic have?

Nobody should dismiss the possible outcome, but we shouldn't push fear on the webmasters.. Educate and inform us how help to fight it has a more positive outcome than saying Adult Webmasters Are Stupid. Right now, the only thing being published is how much we should fear something that ?could? happen.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by GatorB

The same government that enacted these onerous new 2257 rules? The same government that prevents babies from boarding flights because their names show up on a terrorist watch list? The same government that LIED out WMDs so it could invade Iraq because as Bush said, "Saddam tried to kill my daddy"? The same government whose constituency is the religious right that are DEMANDING that Bush ban porn.

Our GOV hasn't ever been for porn, since the 60's this industry has had to put up with tons of shit related to porn. This isn't going to change with any president we ever get. We can only fight it when things come up that we don't agree with.

The 2257 laws have been part of law for years; the new regulations make things a bitch, even though we can comply. The rules are getting changed now; we are fighting for our rights. The regulations will still come out but they won't be as bad. So rather than thinking they attacked us, to put us in jail for 5 years, I would like to think they are to stupid to write a proper law and now it will be corrected.

They won't ever ban porn and no harm is being done regulating it. It's a business that needs regulation. Much like many other business have rules. Some rules suck, some don?t. It?s part of life and part of doing business.

[LauraLee]

Originally Posted by jayeff

Those who try to dismiss fears about .XXX as some sort of conspiracy nonsense either have their heads up their asses or are promoting their own agenda.

It really doesn't matter whether you think the potential risks are serious or negligible, this new TLD has absolutely nothing positive to offer anyone except registrars and domain sitters. Without anything to compensate for whatever risk there may be, nor for the additional costs involved, what possible reason can there be to support it?

But then I guess (to borrow from the original question) that "Adult Webmasters Are Stupid". Poor attendance at the Internext seminar reflects the struggle that MikeHawk and others are having to get anyone to talk about this issue at all, let alone to do anything about it. Let's face it, if most couldn't spare the time to deal with 2257 and the threat of 5 years in jail, what chance does this topic have?

bumperoo

[GatorB]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Our GOV hasn't ever been for porn, since the 60's this industry has had to put up with tons of shit related to porn. This isn't going to change with any president we ever get. We can only fight it when things come up that we don't agree with.

FACT: number of obsenity prosecutions brought by the DOJ under Clinton in his 8 years in office ZERO

[TheGoldenChild]

Originally Posted by GatorB

FACT: number of obsenity prosecutions brought by the DOJ under Clinton in his 8 years in office ZERO

That's because Clinton was getting blown-
W gets no pussy-

Christians don't like pussy.

Then again he also had Janet Reno as his AG
And we still don't know what she did for the country or if she is male or female

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by GatorB

FACT: number of obsenity prosecutions brought by the DOJ under Clinton in his 8 years in office ZERO

During Clinton we had 102 prosecutions and 87 convictions.

Number of prosecutions, convictions, criminal referrals, and U.S. Attorneys' declinations, with lead charges as violations of 18 USC 1460-1468 (Federal obscenity laws) FY 1993 through FY 2001

[TheDoc]

This industry is quick to jump and yell that something is wrong, scream and bitch. .xxx which have many things that could go wrong and has little positive outcome (unless nobody tried to force rules on us)..

With 2257 you have 25million + a year companies bitching about having to donate $8k to FSC. People trying to figure out how they can get a personal account and include the websites they own. ACACIA coming down on our business and people don?t donate, don?t care, and don?t think anything will happen to them. While one man, that I won?t name, stands up to fight and has a hell of a time getting support.. Remember, nobody was going to push people that settled and only push the people that are fighting, well that didn?t last long.

Now we have .xxx, just as fucked up and it will end with just as much BS. People will turn the blind eye and keep moving as if nothing is going on. We have one of the strongest industries in the world but it is made up of a bitches.

People in this business are going to make millions from .xxx yet people will not stop doing business with those companies..

If this is wrong, then someone needs to stand up, take control and fix the problem. Go get support from the biggest companies, online and offline. Sue, it?s the American way. Get donations, name people, get some real support.

Don?t bash people because they don?t ?seem? to care. They care; they just don?t know what they can do. And don?t bitch when you can?t get support from everyone, just move on and keep going. Your million dollar companies aren?t going to support you, they are too rich to care.

And no, I don?t support .xxx, not for the fact that we ?could? be forced to move on it, or VISA ?could? process only for .xxx, or any other negative outcome.. Straight up, that some lying rich fucks are going to make bank off of our industry and they could care less if something could happen.

[PhillipB]

I sat next to Mike and Bob during the .xxx panel (still wish they would have let me thrown the tomatoes I brought). I do want to commend Connor and Tom for handing the other side of the table their ass. Jason Hendeles couldn't have looked more uncomfortable.

The attendance at the .xxx seminar was appalling, but not due to hangovers, Mojitos, or the inviting pool bar; rather, it's because most people in this industry have adopted a "wait and see" approach to the issues that most affect them.

· Everyone heard about Acacia, but did not run to join the IMPAI until they got the nasty letters. And even after then Acacia signed up some big names in the business.

· Thousands of Webmasters flocked to become a part of the FSC after, and only after one of the lawyers involved came on the boards to say in so many words, "Join the FSC and you will be protected against 2257."

The Adult industry is a strange one in that it is made up almost entirely of entrepreneurs and one-man (or woman) shops. To maintain any sort of cohesion against our enemies is a difficult task. No one wants to spend the extra time and money when their competitors aren't and achieving the same outcome. "Why should everyone be active in the fight against issues facing the Adult industry, when a few people are already taking care of it for us?!?"

It's definitely frustrating to say the least. So to answer your question Bob, yes, ICM and IFFOR do think we're stupid. And they might not be so far off. If we cannot realize the threat this TLD poses, then they have every right to run us over. To them we're easy prey.

I've said this a hundred times before: Those that think .xxx was not created to become mandatory are completely misinformed. Or does ICM/IFFOR employ a full-time government lobbyist just for shits and giggles? And is that why a mandatory migration already has the backing of 3 very powerful senators?

Fear is what motivates people to stand up and fight. There is no downside if we stand up and take action. There is a TREMENDOUS downside if we don't.

The scariest part of this whole thing Connor, is the 4 or 5 large Adult companies that are helping ICM get this passed in exchange for a piece of the profit and the ability to function in a less competitive landscape created by the .xxx fallout. These companies seem to think that .xxx will anhilate their competitors, leaving an oligopoly to run the industry. The irony is, they forgot that the .xxx will also eliminate 99% of their traffic.

Again, are we that stupid??? Apparently so...

[Moniker Man]

Just for the record, Aly asked me to participate on the panel, not Jason or Stuart. We are and remain neutral on the extension and we stand to make far less money on this extension than any others that were newly introduced. As you know, there will only be 100K of these domains registered.....maybe in the first year instead of 750K - 2M as with other extensions. As you also may know, we are the only registrar that openly serves the adult domain community...the only one that exhibits at the adult shows and conferences, participates on panels, sponsors events, etc. We serve some of the largest adult clients because we understand that adult community treat their domains like assets and that is in line with the way we run our business. We also offer the very highest levels of security, privacy and customer service, which again are particularly important to this community.

Before deciding whether to even position ourselves to offer this extension, we asked almost every one of our adult clients what their opinion was before getting prepared. More than 96% of 220+ adult clients told us that we better offer the .xxx extension regardless of whether they approve/agree of it or not. They wanted to make sure that they did not have to go elsewhere to register the domains. They made it clear that they would be protecting their key brands and trademarks regardless of how they felt about it.

What everyone should be cautious of are those companies offering pre-registration for this extension when they are not authorized to do so. Taking money from those that think they will get the domains first by paying now or putting pre-reservations on .xxx names now...is considered fraudulent activity in my opinion. Only a few ICANN Accredited Registrars will be qualified to offer the trademark protection rights to the Adult Community and we have qualified to be one of them due to our clientele, reputation, and technical ability to offer this to our customers.

So when and if this extension ever comes to be....or any others for that matter, we are still here to help all of you protect your self.

Thanks,

[SeniorX]

"The biggest .xxx adversaries today will be the biggest registerers tomorrow."

Connor, YnotBOB, MikeHawk - you guys are so fake! So why don't you just list the reasons why .xxx will be so bad instead of making long speaches and articles dancing around the issue and saying the other party is of the devil?

You say the reasons have been posted countless of other times and you won't bother posting them again yet you make long posts, compared to which listing the facts against .xxx would be much easier, or not?

You guys are like the inquisitors, you point your finger at someone and everyone should believe you their evil!

Reading YnotBOB's article it sounds like he's already made up his mind that adult webmasters ARE stupid.

You don't like the .XXX - no problem, we the adult webmasters ain't gonna be processing our .xxx sites with Ynot Billing! Happy?