Offering newsgroup photos in my members area...

[Jade]

Hi,

I just got this email offering a newsgroup service for my members area. What are your thoughts on this?

"You've done a great job with i-Blowjob.com, and I appreciate you to taking the time to reply.

I think the following opportunity would help you attract and retain additional members at your website, and I've included details below. Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions after reviewing the information.

We've been a Usenet newsgroup provider since 1992, and we developed a web-based version of our service that would let you provide erotic newsgroup access through i-Blowjob.com without using your servers, storage or bandwidth.

This is not a static image archive or porn feed, but a super message board! 20,000 newsgroup services worldwide, exchanging 8 million new postings a day, consisting of erotic discussions, photos and videos.
All of which, would give your customers another reason to stay at your website.

Your site users would have instant web access to that community, and we would operate and support the service for you transparently... so that it would look like any other member feature at your site.

The service costs as little as $75/month, takes 15 minutes to bring online, and does not present any problems with 2257 compliance.

I'd be happy to step someone through a live demo to show how the service works & how it would benefit your business. The demo takes 5 minutes, and we could do that by phone or ICQ."

[mortenb]

what about the image and video rights? newsgroups are usually filled with copyrighted pics that some surfer uploaded and didn't pay for..

[Jade]

Yeah, I also don't see how that can be 2257 compliant??

[Harmon]

Originally Posted by Jade

Yeah, I also don't see how that can be 2257 compliant??

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[mortenb]

huh??? since when does using includes to show stolen content make it legal?

[Harmon]

Originally Posted by mortenb

huh??? since when does using includes to show stolen content make it legal?

I was running with the 2257 argument... that could go on forever... stolen content? It's a newsgroup...

[Damian_Maxcash]

Hosting NGs isnt illegal.... It falls under the ISP cat.

"You cant be responible" - The same way AOL etc can offer them.

[mortenb]

Originally Posted by Harmon

I was running with the 2257 argument... that could go on forever... stolen content? It's a newsgroup...

yearh.. stolen content.. downloaded content.. whatever you want to call it.. someone downloaded it and is distributing it without paying for the rights to do so.. it might be a very common thing, but that doesn't make it legal.. it's the same thing the Hollywood people are pissed about..

[mortenb]

Originally Posted by damian2001

Hosting NGs isnt illegal.... It falls under the ISP cat.

"You cant be responible" - The same way AOL etc can offer them.

Sure.. the ISP's can't be held responsible.. but someone who actively pays to use the not legal content in the newsgroups at their website are walking on very thin ice..

[abadfish]

And a lot of newsgroup content is spam, so you would be advertising other sites using stolen content and you wouldn't get credit for the sales. (if any)

[Harmon]

Originally Posted by mortenb

yearh.. stolen content.. downloaded content.. whatever you want to call it.. someone downloaded it and is distributing it without paying for the rights to do so.. it might be a very common thing, but that doesn't make it legal.. it's the same thing the Hollywood people are pissed about..

YAY!5678

[Hinc]

Hmmm well, i agree it´s hard to see how copyright and 2257 violations could be avoided.

On the other hand, i´ve never heard of newsfeeds being targeted for such offenses...but then, they probably have/will be.

...and i wonder if its wise to show your members how much free stuff they can have from their ISP if they figure out how to set it up (or if isp doesnt carry, what they can easily find at 10 bucks a month)

[Master at Work]

Beware, lots of child porn on newsgroups, including mainstream groups.

[Damian_Maxcash]

Originally Posted by mortenb

yearh.. stolen content.. downloaded content.. whatever you want to call it.. someone downloaded it and is distributing it without paying for the rights to do so.. it might be a very common thing, but that doesn't make it legal.. it's the same thing the Hollywood people are pissed about..

Every major ISP in the world offers NG access.... Im pretty sure they have looked into this.

Google is even trying to wipe out NGs with its own service. Stolen content and all.

Sometimes people have a real problem seeing the difference between "Should be illegal" and "Is illegal"

[Master at Work]

Originally Posted by damian2001

Google is even trying to wipe out NGs with its own service. Stolen content and all.

Google does not offer binary newsgroups.

[Damian_Maxcash]

Originally Posted by Master at Work

Google does not offer binary newsgroups.

Thats right, they have all the other NGs... They have "Google groups" that offer binaries for the good stuff.

Hence my comment.

[mortenb]

Originally Posted by damian2001

Every major ISP in the world offers NG access.... Im pretty sure they have looked into this.

Google is even trying to wipe out NGs with its own service. Stolen content and all.

Sometimes people have a real problem seeing the difference between "Should be illegal" and "Is illegal"

sure.. the ISP's offer access and can't be held responsible for what their users do with the access, but someone trying to exploit the pics and movies monetarily is not the same thing.. (yes, you can argue that the ISP's are making money on it but that is not the same thing and not my point and I probably wouldn't be able to explain what I mean much better since my english is not that good and it is late) and they would probably be easy targets for a lawsuit.. but since none of us are copyright lawyers Jade should probably talk to one..

[Radik]

Your stealing plain and simple, and worse your charging for it.

[mardigras]

Originally Posted by Jade

The service costs as little as $75/month, takes 15 minutes to bring online, and does not present any problems with 2257 compliance.

This would be quite a bargain. I could get a friend to join blowjobjade.com and download all of your content and upload it to a newsgroup, then provide it to my surfers. I could let surfers post on a messageboard what other sites they would like to have access to, then do the same to all of them... hopefully not a lot of other webmasters would think of this ingenious plan

[jimmyf]

Originally Posted by Hinc

...and i wonder if its wise to show your members how much free stuff they can have from their ISP if they figure out how to set it up (or if isp doesnt carry, what they can easily find at 10 bucks a month)

This is correct... A lot of the big newgroup guy even have Hollywood movies..

20,000 newsgroups is a small guy the bigger guys have well over 100,000

[KCat]

I've had an Easynews account for years & the porn groups carry mostly watermarked videos, so you're definitely looking at a traffic leak. I think you'd be better off including some free sponsor content & at least get paid on the upsell.

There used to be a ton of iblowjob movies on the newsgroups (my boyfriend is a huge fan), but I haven't noticed any in a long time. Did you used to actively promote via newsgroups? Or try to cut down on members distributing the content?

[Machete_]

im not calling it a scam or anything, it's just not something I would ever put on my site because of the legal issue.

This is a conversation I had with a similar company:
.................................................. ..........................................
[00:50] Ebus_dk | GFY: im not talking about 2257, it more that the content you have on the site is licenced content, we both know that.. and since its posted illigal in newsgroups, you dont have the licens..
I think that makes it a legal problem for me to link to it
[00:51] XnXaXmXeX: Contrary to popular belief... a good portion of the content that appears within the newsgroups has been posted there intentionally by the copyright owner
[00:51] XnXaXmXeX: As you can imagine...

[00:51] XnXaXmXeX: Usenet sustain a worldwide audience of millions
[00:51] XnXaXmXeX: so it's a highly effective advertising vehicle for adult webmasters...
[00:52] XnXaXmXeX: Of course we must meet DMCA regulations...
[00:52] XnXaXmXeX: in the even that we are notified by a copyright owner that they do not want their content within a newsgroup
[00:53] XnXaXmXeX: we have 24 hours to review that complaint and remove the content...
[00:53] XnXaXmXeX: Usenet is actually more reponsible & responsive to those type of issues than other areas of the Internet
[00:53] XnXaXmXeX: FTP... peer-to-peer... email... etc
[00:54] Ebus_dk | GFY: your program is good - no doubt, But i cant risk it.
Lookat it this way. One of my partner is the guys from busty.pl - I see a LOT of their content right there on the site.. and i know for a FACT that those guys DONT like it being in the news groups...
It would put me in bad staning with a lot of my partners
[00:55] XnXaXmXeX: That's your call Kristoffer, and I completely understand... just keep in mind that what people say in public, and what they do privately to promote their business are two different things
[00:55] XnXaXmXeX: We work with a large number of adult entertainment companies...
[00:55] XnXaXmXeX: that actively use the newsgroups to promote their businesses...
[00:55] XnXaXmXeX: they understand that they can post their older content...
[00:55] XnXaXmXeX: which benefits the groups...
[00:56] XnXaXmXeX: ..and in return they reach a huge audience of potential customers for their sites...
[00:56] XnXaXmXeX: that don't mind the promotional message being delivered in that format...
[00:56] Ebus_dk | GFY: so do I :-)
But people that use the newgroups as promotion, tend to watermark the content so the surfers know where to look for the site.. and I dont se a lot of watermarks on those pictures
[00:57] XnXaXmXeX: I'm only speaking from my experiences, providing this type of service to commercial clients over the years...
[00:58] XnXaXmXeX: copyright violations take place in much larger quantities within other areas of the Internet
[00:58] XnXaXmXeX: Looking at that in total... Usenet represents a small fraction of that...
[00:58] Ebus_dk | GFY: I run a union of webmasters as well - we are dedicated to be 100% honest and progressive with legal issues..
With just ONE single ilegal picture in your system, and im pulling the plug on my own koncept
[00:59] Ebus_dk | GFY: what happens on the internet, and what lawa that are broken there have nothing to do about how others should do bussiness
[01:00] XnXaXmXeX: Usenet predates the Internet, and has been an active community long before the adult entertainment industry discovered the Web...
[01:00] XnXaXmXeX: We're not flying under the radar in any respect...
[01:00] XnXaXmXeX: ...and just about every major ISP provides access to the community...
[01:01] XnXaXmXeX: If we were the irresponsible, lawless community that some folks like to portray...
[01:01] XnXaXmXeX: it would have presented a problem many years ago, for both law enforcement agencies and these large commercial entities providing the service
[01:02] Ebus_dk | GFY: there is no point in discussing it any further - its not a program mu network or I would use.
But thank you for taking your time to present me with the software/script - its a good program, but just not for us
[01:02] XnXaXmXeX: not sure why we bothered with the demo...
[01:02] XnXaXmXeX: if you already had this preconceptions about the newsgroups
[01:02] Ebus_dk | GFY: because there was a potential :-)
[01:03] XnXaXmXeX: not really, but thanks for the opportunity Kristoffer, and best of luck with your sites.
[01:03] Ebus_dk | GFY: look - spare me the sales tricks ;-)
I have been in in sales for to long for that to work on me
.. Thanks again, and have a good day
Session Close (XnXaXmXeX): Fri Aug 12 01:04:08 2005


Session Start (300894038:XnXaXmXeX): Fri Aug 12 01:05:59 2005
[01:06] XnXaXmXeX: not a sales trick Kristoffer... you had no interest in Usenet for the reasons that you noted, and those views were obviously established well before we stepped through the demo... we could have simply saved each other the time, that's all I'm saying.
[01:06] XnXaXmXeX: No hard feelings
[01:06] XnXaXmXeX: and thanks again for the opportunity.
[01:06] XnXaXmXeX: got a run, have another demo
[01:07] Ebus_dk | GFY: no . trust me I se potentioal.. but I wanted to se how you handled the legal issues with the content.. Like I said we have look at those script ourself on our own server, so I know how it works
[01:07] Ebus_dk | GFY: se = saw :-)
Session Close (XnXaXmXeX): Fri Aug 12 01:07:50 2005

.................................................. ......

.. and it goes on for some 3-5 minutes. Again - im not calling them scammers - you deside for youself if it's something you want

[High Plains Drifter]

Originally Posted by damian2001

Thats right, they have all the other NGs... They have "Google groups" that offer binaries for the good stuff.

Hence my comment.

false

....

[Kevin2]

Originally Posted by damian2001

Hosting NGs isnt illegal.... It falls under the ISP cat.

"You cant be responible" - The same way AOL etc can offer them.

If thats the case then why does the news server that received the post remove my pics when I send a DMCA too them?