How will 2257 Affect public Domain Content? - GoFuckYourself.com

TaDoW · 06-07-2005, 06:00 PM

Up until this point, it has been perfectly legal to shoot and publish photos and movies of nude women if they are nude in public (i.e.: they have no expectation of privacy). While I'm not exactly sure how it affects the legality if .. say.. a 16 year old girl is flashing her titties at mardi gras, But let's assume for a second that you're shooting footage of girls flashing inside a BAR, where people have to be 21+ to get in ... still public domain, reasonable care exercised to assure only women of legal age are being filmed/shot ...

How will the new 2257 affect our ability to use/view/distribute this content? I suppose this could be yet another way to take it to court as a 1st amendment violation ...

Discuss.

Damian_Maxcash · 06-07-2005, 06:02 PM

Id guess that a very grey area just got a few shades darker.....

After Shock Media · 06-07-2005, 06:02 PM

technicality, but you are miss using the words public domain, it still would default copyright to the photographer. I know aside from the point.

As for your post, meer nudity is not covered by 2257 in my opinion which is debated.

TaDoW · 06-07-2005, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

As for your post, meer nudity is not covered by 2257 in my opinion which is debated.

I think that's even more of a problem ... "nudity" isn't defined anywhere in this pile of crap :-(

fusionx · 06-07-2005, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by damian2001

Id guess that a very grey area just got a few shades darker.....

Pics of titty flashing, say > 90% of the Girls Gone Wild kind of stuff, are not covered under 2257..

(2) ''sexually explicit conduct'' means actual or simulated -
(A) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital,
oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between
persons of the same or opposite sex;
(B) bestiality;
(C) masturbation;
(D) sadistic or masochistic abuse

After Shock Media · 06-07-2005, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaDoW

I think that's even more of a problem ... "nudity" isn't defined anywhere in this pile of crap :-(

Well some people say (e) in 2256 is exempt, and others are saying they left out 2256 and reffernce to (e) in the new 2257.
If the revised 2257 are just revisons and admendments to the current 2257 and the bulk of the original text remains with the clarifications/admendments added in then the refference to 2256 (e) should remain.

studio · 06-07-2005, 06:16 PM

By, the letter of the law... Even If the girl flashing in public was 16 if it's not sexually explicit by definition it would be legal... I make this statement based on the fact that publications such National Geo. and publications for like the Nudests, or the new parents that take some snap shots of their bady girl getting a bath could all go to jail.. Correct me if I'm wrong...

BV · 06-07-2005, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

Well some people say (e) in 2256 is exempt, and others are saying they left out 2256 and reffernce to (e) in the new 2257.
If the revised 2257 are just revisons and admendments to the current 2257 and the bulk of the original text remains with the clarifications/admendments added in then the refference to 2256 (e) should remain.

problem is there is no e in the current 2256,

2nd paragraph of 2256 now only has a & b, under "a" there are roman numerals I thru V and these are the old a thru e.

After Shock Media · 06-07-2005, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

problem is there is no e in the current 2256,

2nd paragraph of 2256 now only has a & b, under "a" there are roman numerals I thru V and these are the old a thru e.

You know I have not checked to see if 2256 was revised at all, where do you see a revised 2256? Link please.

BV · 06-07-2005, 06:28 PM

this (taken from 2257) might come into play also:

(iii) Any activity, other than those activities identified in
paragraphs (c) (1) and (2) of this section, that does not involve the hiring, contracting for, managing, or otherwise arranging for the participation of the depicted performers;

fusionx · 06-07-2005, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

You know I have not checked to see if 2256 was revised at all, where do you see a revised 2256? Link please.

I can't find any reference to a revised 2256 (after January 7, 2003). I'd love to see a published 2256 with "2nd paragraph of 2256 now only has a & b, under "a" there are roman numerals I thru V and these are the old a thru e."

Not saying BV is wrong - just want to see it.

After Shock Media · 06-07-2005, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fusionx

I can't find any reference to a revised 2256 (after January 7, 2003). I'd love to see a published 2256 with "2nd paragraph of 2256 now only has a & b, under "a" there are roman numerals I thru V and these are the old a thru e."

Not saying BV is wrong - just want to see it.

Neither can I.

fusionx · 06-07-2005, 06:33 PM

Found it:

http://my.execpc.com/~xxxlaw/18%20USC%202256_text.html

Not verified..

BV · 06-07-2005, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

You know I have not checked to see if 2256 was revised at all, where do you see a revised 2256? Link please.

my lawyer has one and the only place i can find it on line is here: http://my.execpc.com/~xxxlaw/18%20USC%202256_text.html

for some reason all the other places on line show the old one: like here: http://uscode.house.gov/uscode-cgi/f...20%20%20%20%20

Section 2256, which includes the definitions for Chapter 110, dealing with the sexual exploitation of children, was amended by Congress, and the definition of sexually explicit conduct is no longer broken down into subparts A -E. The definition was broken down to provide different meanings when the image is computer generated (part B) as opposed to an image of a live person (part A). This breakdown was in response to a U.S. Supreme Court case which struck the computer image portion of the statute as unconstitutionally overbroad. The remainder of the statute remians in force and enforceable.

After Shock Media · 06-07-2005, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

my lawyer has one and the only place i can find it on line is here: http://my.execpc.com/~xxxlaw/18%20USC%202256_text.html

for some reason all the other places on line show the old one: like here: http://uscode.house.gov/uscode-cgi/f...20%20%20%20%20

http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...6----000-.html

BV · 06-07-2005, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...6----000-.html

that's the old one, i wish it wasn't, but it is

After Shock Media · 06-07-2005, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

that's the old one, i wish it wasn't, but it is

If it was actually changed we should be able to see it on a .gov site no? and not some lawyers site only?

fusionx · 06-07-2005, 06:41 PM

Now, where is the revised 2257 that refers to this new definition?

(B), "sexually explicit conduct" means actual or simulated--

(i) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex;
(ii) bestiality;
(iii) masturbation;
(iv) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or
(v) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person;
(B) For purposes of subsection 8(B) of this section, "sexually explicit conduct" means--
(i) graphic sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral- genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex, or lascivious simulated sexual intercourse where the genitals, breast, or pubic area of any person is exhibited;
(ii) graphic or lascivious simulated;
(I) bestiality;
(II) masturbation; or
(III) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or
(iii) graphic or simulated lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person;

BV · 06-07-2005, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fusionx

Now, where is the revised 2257 that refers to this new definition?

(;

no where!

It seems that Congress never changed section 2257 to conform with the changes it made to 2256. The new regulation, 28 CFR Section 75.1 "definitions" does not deal with any definition sexually explicit material. We are left to rely on Sections 2256 and 2257.

BV · 06-07-2005, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by After Shock Media

If it was actually changed we should be able to see it on a .gov site no? and not some lawyers site only?

you would think so,

I do know that our lawyer had a copy of the new one also, so I can only asume at this point that there is a new one

fusionx · 06-07-2005, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BV

you would think so,

I do know that our lawyer had a copy of the new one also, so I can only asume at this point that there is a new one

Can you see if he has a reference to any new (not published at the GPO) 2257 docs? I'm really trying to keep up with all of this. I'll check with our lawyer as well.

06-07-2005, 06:00 PM	#1
TaDoW Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Where It Rains Posts: 3,875	How will 2257 Affect public Domain Content? Up until this point, it has been perfectly legal to shoot and publish photos and movies of nude women if they are nude in public (i.e.: they have no expectation of privacy). While I'm not exactly sure how it affects the legality if .. say.. a 16 year old girl is flashing her titties at mardi gras, But let's assume for a second that you're shooting footage of girls flashing inside a BAR, where people have to be 21+ to get in ... still public domain, reasonable care exercised to assure only women of legal age are being filmed/shot ... How will the new 2257 affect our ability to use/view/distribute this content? I suppose this could be yet another way to take it to court as a 1st amendment violation ... Discuss. __________________ -TaDoW I've Upped My Standards, Up Yours!

06-07-2005, 06:02 PM	#3
After Shock Media It's coming look busy Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn". Posts: 35,299	technicality, but you are miss using the words public domain, it still would default copyright to the photographer. I know aside from the point. As for your post, meer nudity is not covered by 2257 in my opinion which is debated. __________________ [email protected] ICQ:135982156 AIM: Aftershockmed1a MSN: [email protected]

06-07-2005, 06:16 PM	#7
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	By, the letter of the law... Even If the girl flashing in public was 16 if it's not sexually explicit by definition it would be legal... I make this statement based on the fact that publications such National Geo. and publications for like the Nudests, or the new parents that take some snap shots of their bady girl getting a bath could all go to jail.. Correct me if I'm wrong... __________________

06-07-2005, 06:02 PM	#2
Damian_Maxcash So Fucking Banned Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: MaxCash.com Posts: 12,745	Id guess that a very grey area just got a few shades darker.....

06-07-2005, 06:28 PM	#10
BV wtf Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Bikini State, FL USA Posts: 10,914	this (taken from 2257) might come into play also: (iii) Any activity, other than those activities identified in paragraphs (c) (1) and (2) of this section, that does not involve the hiring, contracting for, managing, or otherwise arranging for the participation of the depicted performers;

06-07-2005, 06:33 PM	#13
fusionx Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Olongapo City, Philippines Posts: 4,618	Found it: http://my.execpc.com/~xxxlaw/18%20USC%202256_text.html Not verified..

06-07-2005, 06:41 PM	#18
fusionx Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Olongapo City, Philippines Posts: 4,618	Now, where is the revised 2257 that refers to this new definition? (B), "sexually explicit conduct" means actual or simulated-- (i) sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral-genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex; (ii) bestiality; (iii) masturbation; (iv) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or (v) lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person; (B) For purposes of subsection 8(B) of this section, "sexually explicit conduct" means-- (i) graphic sexual intercourse, including genital-genital, oral- genital, anal-genital, or oral-anal, whether between persons of the same or opposite sex, or lascivious simulated sexual intercourse where the genitals, breast, or pubic area of any person is exhibited; (ii) graphic or lascivious simulated; (I) bestiality; (II) masturbation; or (III) sadistic or masochistic abuse; or (iii) graphic or simulated lascivious exhibition of the genitals or pubic area of any person;