CDSmith, Metaman and all the federalists who denigrate Quebec..

[NoCarrier]

Like Robert Bourassa, Ex-Liberal (Not an evil separatist) and Prime Minister of Quebec in 1990 declared before the signature of the Meech Lake Accord (Newfoundland and Manitoba refused to sign the day after and killed the accord)

«Le Canada anglais doit comprendre de façon très claire que, quoi qu'on dise et quoi qu'on fasse, le Québec est, aujourd'hui et pour toujours, une société distincte, libre et capable d'assumer son destin et son développement.»

Translation :

"The english canadians must clearly understand, that no matter what they say or what they do, Quebec will always be a distinct society, free and capable of assuming it's own destiny and development"

No matter what you are going to say or think, even about economy. We are are different, not better, and we are going to assume our own destiny.

We now know that the Liberals clearly violated our election laws during the last referendum.

"The Liberal party said it wanted to promote federalism, but in reality the Liberals tried to buy the soul of Quebecers," Duceppe said in English. "It's not a Quebec scandal, it's a Liberal scandal created in Ottawa."

[Mike Okitch]

Oh boy. That risk to be one long thread.

[NetRodent]

Quebecers are only seperate and distinct from the rest of Canada in one way. While the rest of Canada is busy talking about how its "different" than the US, Quebec is busy talking about how its "different" than Canada.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by Mike Okitch

Oh boy. That risk to be one long thread.

I don't think so. I made my point. The "commandites" to *SAVE CANADA* from Jean Chretien and the Liberals was extremely childish from the start anyway. They thought that drowning us with canadian flags, the evil separatists would suddenly become federalists.

- "Oh Look.. Another canadian flag! WOOHOO!!! I'm loving that country more and more.. "

Instead of trying to deal with our differences, the Liberals stole our money and conscience. I'm sorry. But this is the point of no return.

[Phoenix]

im glad that the people who live in the province of Quebec have such a strong community sense.

i will drop what im doing and join the CDN army if they ever try to leave though.

I'm half french, but i'll vote to sanction the assination of all the leaders of the separatist movement...sounds ridiculous right? well so does the idea of a bunch of people separating from canada...if you want to leave Canada..then hop on the bus..we will give you a free ride to the ocean..you can swim back to France.


who stands to gain most from a separation? wonder why they want to leave?

[Mike Okitch]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

I don't think so. I made my point. The "commandites" to *SAVE CANADA* from Jean Chretien and the Liberals was extremely childish from the start anyway. They thought that drowning us with canadian flags, the evil separatists would suddenly become federalists.

- "Oh Look.. Another canadian flag! WOOHOO!!! I'm loving that country more and more.. "

Instead of trying to deal with our differences, the Liberals stole our money and conscience. I'm sorry. But this is the point of no return.

I agree with you NoCarrier. Look, I was born and raised in Quebec. I actually moved out weeks before the 95 referendum. I'm a federalist born of separatist parents (you can imagine all the debates I've gone through with them).

So while I agree that Chretien has been an asshole with the "scandale des commandites", I believe that Quebec is and should remain part of Canada.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

who stands to gain most from a separation? wonder why they want to leave?

The federal always want to gain power and decide what to do with our programs. And we want to be able to actually decide what we want to do with our money.

The federal government is getting richer and richer while the provinces are getting poorer and the federal government is denying the fiscal imbalance.

Here in Quebec we are losing 50 million dollars a week. And those numbers are not coming from an evil separatist. But from all the parties in Quebec.

Who stands to gain most from a separation? Both of us.

Now about killing people or sending them to another country because you don't give a fuck. I'd like to know where you tattoed your swastika.

[Paraskass]

Vive Le Quebec Libre Et Le Dollar Americain Fort!

[CDSmith]

First of all, I'm not "denigrating Quebec".... so try to keep your shit straight. In fact I'm not denigrating anyone. I AM however, challenging your arguments, and along with several others here and as in most forums where this discussion takes place, we have countered and shot holes in every one of your points.

Enough already.

There will be no 3rd fucking referendum. You people have caused enough aggravation and strife in Canada over the last 40 years to last several centuries. If you want to form your own territory then go find an unclaimed island or something and quit harping on incesantly.

You are parroting your parents, and probably their parents. Find something more productive to bitch about.

[CDSmith]

And the last time the terms "federalists" and "separatists" was being used in N. America was during and in the time leading up to the U.S. civil war.

Keep it up. If given the opportunity I would vote to send troops into Quebec and have this bullshit settled once and for all.

Good thing it won't come to that, because there will be no separation. :D

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

There will be no 3rd fucking referendum.

I understand why you want to deny it, it's much more easier that way.

Originally Posted by CDSmith

You are parroting your parents, and probably their parents. Find something more productive to bitch about.

My parents and grandparents would vote Liberal even if the candidate was a freaking dog. Now stop talking like you know everything about my family, me and our political convictions.

[DaLord]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

If you want to form your own territory then go find an unclaimed island

As long as they don't try to invade Skt. Hans. That island belongs to us in Denmark

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Good thing it won't come to that, because there will be no separation. :D

Sure. Because the last time, it was by 50 000 votes. And with the "NO" party violating the referendum law. I'm glad to know you are so confident it will never happen again and that we will be stupid enough to forget how the "NO" won last time.

[WarChild]

I'm pretty sick of my tax dollars paying for Quebec. Let them seperate, good fucking riddance.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by WarChild

I'm pretty sick of my tax dollars paying for Quebec. Let them seperate, good fucking riddance.

For the love of God.. VOTE TO KICK US OUT!! It will be much easier that way. Thanks guys!

[CDSmith]

No means no.

You seem to have zero regard for the some 3 million inhabitants of Quebec who do not support you and who do not want to separate.

No, sorry. Canada will very likely play hardball with you rather than give up approximately 1/8th of it's land mass.

[WarChild]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

For the love of God.. VOTE TO KICK US OUT!! It will be much easier that way. Thanks guys!

Much easier, eh? Who will make up the economic short fall Quebec has been stuck in?

After transfer payments, every person in BC, for instance, ends up paying in to the Federal Goverment. On the flip side, Quebec draws money out.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

You seem to have zero regard for the some 3 million inhabitants of Quebec who do not support you and who do not want to separate.

Ohhh trust me. It will be much more less than 3 millon quebeckers next time voting NO. The children of the "101" law now vote for us.

[CDSmith]

Carrier, your time would be better spent developing your business rather than on all this bloc-head separatist BS. You know, bring more US dollars into your province. (like I'm doing for mine)

[LadyMischief]

Personally, I don't give a fuck what Quebec does. I love Quebecois, so I'm far from prejudiced. I'm just tired of them taking 80% of I pay (and my province along with almost all the other provinces) in taxes for whatever reason. Quebec can do whatever the fuck it wants, as long as it pays for it itself. The other provinces have fed it the majority of their profits for years (ask any Albertan or Ontarian), and if it wants to leave so damn bad, or whatever the hell it wants, just stop costing us more money.

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

Ohhh trust me. It will be much more less than 3 millon quebeckers next time voting NO. The children of the "101" law now vote for us.

You know, I honestly never saw you as this much of an idiot before this.

You just don't fucking get it do you?

I have family back there and friends and know tons of people, NONE of whom want to separate. The natives who hold title on most of the territory of Quebec do NOT want to separate. What size new country did you have in mind? La Ronde? Okay, the fuckhead separatists can have La Ronde, happy now?

[baddog]

this is some funny stuff. . . . carry on

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by WarChild

Much easier, eh? Who will make up the economic short fall Quebec has been stuck in?

After transfer payments, every person in BC, for instance, ends up paying in to the Federal Goverment. On the flip side, Quebec draws money out.

Quebec's GDP per person = 27 900$

Which is better than Germany or Italy and Japan has the same.

Once we are a sovereign nation our financial problems will be solved once we are out of the federation because of the fiscal imbalance. (We are losing more than 50 million dollars a WEEK, that's more than 2 billion dollars a year).

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

You know, I honestly never saw you as this much of an idiot before this.

You just don't fucking get it do you?

I have family back there and friends and know tons of people, NONE of whom want to separate. The natives who hold title on most of the territory of Quebec do NOT want to separate. What size new country did you have in mind? La Ronde? Okay, the fuckhead separatists can have La Ronde, happy now?

Are you talking about the CREE nation? They actually said to the federal government that they should actually listen and care like the PQ when we made a deal with them.

Now, they already have their own fucking territory. It's not like it's going to affect our economy. It's not like we are going to INVADE their territory. Did CANADA invade their own territory? If that's your only "argument", it's pretty sad.

I'm sure telling me I was an idiot solved your frustration, but you need to calm down, go take a walk.. Get some fresh air bro, you need it.

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by LadyMischief

I love Quebecois, so I'm far from prejudiced. I'm just tired of them taking 80% of I pay (and my province along with almost all the other provinces) in taxes for whatever reason.

Actually, I love the province of Quebec too. Was there in '76 for the Olympics, travelled north of Montreal into the Laurentians to visit an uncle, then south towards the US border to stay with an aunt and uncle and visit with a multitude of cousins, met literally tons of people from those areas. I would love to go back and spend more time, we were only there for two months.

I only have a problem with anti-Canadian separatist assholes. That's all. A good half the population of Quebec seems to have a similar problem with them too, so it's all good.

Funny how when you ask them what about all the people in the province who don't want to separate they have no answer, they go all quiet, like they plan to kick 3 million people out if they gain sovereinty.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

I only have a problem with anti-Canadian separatist assholes. That's all. A good half the population of Quebec seems to have a similar problem with them too, so it's all good.

I'm not ANTI-CANADIAN. I respect the canadians, I respect their differences. I just don't believe in federalism. I think you are mixing up things.

I'm not going to tell you that you're a FUCKING IDIOT because you don't have the same political convictions.

Let me remind you that 60% of the french quebeckers voted YES. And that 95% of ethnic people voted "NO". With thousands of them who didn't even know how to say "BONJOUR" when they voted in 95, thanks to the Liberals who accelerated their "CANADIAN" citizenship process.

[WarChild]

I had the pleasure of going to Montreal several years ago during the Jazz Festival to meet with several MGP owners. I thought the city was beautiful and had a really good time. Our host, a native of Quebec kept warning us not to talk badly about seperatists in public because it might spark violence. We pretty much ignored him and still had no problems.

The only person who acted like a dink was a waiter in what was the old Forum. He was all smiley and happy when he got to the table. When we politely told him we did not speak French very well, his attitude quickly changed. He was rude and the service was terrible. This guy literally dropped the plates on the table from several inches up, returned only one time to pick up the plates and even then told us to basically clear the table ourselves and hand the dishes to him. In the end I waited to pay the bill personally and made a big deal about getting all my change back. When I had all the change I gave him a shiney new penny and a "fuck you" smile. He mumbled something as I was walking away I didn't hear. Funnily enough this tiny little Dutch guy who was with us jumped out of his seat in the booth (which he was already vacating) and stood eyeballs to chest with this waiter announcing in badly broken English "FUCK YOU FRENCHY". I turned to see the end of this and for some reason it just stands out as one of the funniest things I've ever had the pleasure to see.

Other than this one guy, everybody else in Quebec was loads of fun.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by WarChild

I had the pleasure of going to Montreal several years ago during the Jazz Festival to meet with several MGP owners. I thought the city was beautiful and had a really good time. Our host, a native of Quebec kept warning us not to talk badly about seperatists in public because it might spark violence. We pretty much ignored him and still had no problems.

The only person who acted like a dink was a waiter in what was the old Forum. He was all smiley and happy when he got to the table. When we politely told him we did not speak French very well, his attitude quickly changed. He was rude and the service was terrible. This guy literally dropped the plates on the table from several inches up, returned only one time to pick up the plates and even then told us to basically clear the table ourselves and hand the dishes to him. In the end I waited to pay the bill personally and made a big deal about getting all my change back. When I had all the change I gave him a shiney new penny and a "fuck you" smile. He mumbled something as I was walking away I didn't hear. Funnily enough this tiny little Dutch guy who was with us jumped out of his seat in the booth (which he was already vacating) and stood eyeballs to chest with this waiter announcing in badly broken English "FUCK YOU FRENCHY". I turned to see the end of this and for some reason it just stands out as one of the funniest things I've ever had the pleasure to see.

Other than this one guy, everybody else in Quebec was loads of fun.

There will always be assholes, everywhere. Not just in Quebec. That waiter was indeed a fucking asshole as a can see. I don't even understand why you have to use that example since you said that everyone else in Quebec was loads of fun.

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

Are you talking about the CREE nation? They actually said to the federal government that they should actually listen and care like the PQ when we made a deal with them.

Now, they already have their own fucking territory. It's not like it's going to affect our economy. It's not like we are going to INVADE their territory. Did CANADA invade their own territory? If that's your only "argument", it's pretty sad.

I'm sure telling me I was an idiot solved your frustration, but you need to calm down, go take a walk.. Get some fresh air bro, you need it.

I along with several others have made several solid points of argument in the other thread, many of which are still hanging there unanswered by your side.

Aside from all that, what is it you actually think you're going to accomplish with this thread? All you're doing is rampling on with the same old arguments and bitchings and whinings 'bro'... is it beneficial to you in some unseen way? You certainly aren't changing any minds here.

[CDSmith]

If you are a separatist, you are by definition anti-Canadian.

[WarChild]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

There will always be assholes, everywhere. Not just in Quebec. That waiter was indeed a fucking asshole as a can see. I don't even understand why you have to use that example since you said that everyone else in Quebec was loads of fun.

I wasn't using it as an example, it was just a funny story that came to mind. I guess you sort of had to be there. The Dutch guy was probably 5'4 and the French Waiter 6'4. Events like this can happen anywhere, I'm sure. It just so happened that it took place while I was in Montreal.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

You certainly aren't changing any minds here.

I'm not trying to change your mind. Not matter what you say or think, it will never change anything. I respect your opinion. I just wanted to share my opinion and wanted to see what you had to say. I didn't put your name for nothing in the title. Now for calling me a FUCKING IDIOT because you didn't agree, well, it was up to you. I don't think it was very productive. But that's my opinion.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by WarChild

I wasn't using it as an example, it was just a funny story that came to mind.

If you say so..

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

If you are a separatist, you are by definition anti-Canadian.

No, I am anti-federalism the way it is right now if you guys approved the Lake Meech Accord, It would be different. I was a liberal until 1992. Then I became convinced that the only way would be Sovereignty-Association.

[LadyMischief]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

Quebec's GDP per person = 27 900$

Which is better than Germany or Italy and Japan has the same.

Once we are a sovereign nation our financial problems will be solved once we are out of the federation because of the fiscal imbalance. (We are losing more than 50 million dollars a WEEK, that's more than 2 billion dollars a year).

Last I heard, a country has to have assets to be able to support it's own currency... But I was led to believe that Quebec wants to continue using the Canadian dollar if they seperate. How the hell does that work?

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

I'm not trying to change your mind. Not matter what you say or think, it will never change anything. I respect your opinion. I just wanted to share my opinion and wanted to see what you had to say. I didn't put your name for nothing in the title. Now for calling me a FUCKING IDIOT because you didn't agree, well, it was up to you. I don't think it was very productive. But that's my opinion.

See? Here you go getting things twisted again. I didn't call you a fucking idiot, what I said was that I didn't see you as this much of an idiot before this. Why? Because I made reference to all the people in Quebec who do NOT agree with you, and you basically came back with some lame comment about their kids you think you've managed to brainwash and seemed to be laughing arrogantly over it, instead of addressing my point.

And I don't see this as you just wanting to express your opinion. In the title of this thread you say I was "denigrating Quebec", which I am not and have not done. I like the province, loved all the time I've spent there and would love to go back. Again, you got things wrong. Try keeping things in line with the truth and then I won't have to point them out.

[CDSmith]

Carrier, did you watch the short speeches by Martin and Harper earlier?

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

See? Here you go getting things twisted again. I didn't call you a fucking idiot, what I said was that I didn't see you as this much of an idiot before this. Why? Because I made reference to all the people in Quebec who do NOT agree with you, and you basically came back with some lame comment about their kids you think you've managed to brainwash and seemed to be laughing arrogantly over it, instead of addressing my point.

It's called democracy, if the next referendum wins, the only place where they would ACTUALLY want to stay in Canada is the West Island of Montreal. I won't shed a tear, trust me. They are already isolated and don't give a fuck about us.

And about the children of the "101" law, I didn't laugh about it, we didn't brainwash them. They can decide for themselves. There's something you don't see to understand about democracy.

Sure, you will never deny that the Liberals violated a 100000 times our referendum law, if that's how you see democracy, I'm glad we don't share the same opinions.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Carrier, did you watch the short speeches by Martin and Harper earlier?

Yes, the speech by Martin was pathetic (Nothing new here). And Harper was an electoral speech. Harper would do a better job. I hope he's the next prime minister.

[CDSmith]

It just strikes me as obvious and funny that when there is the slightest little rift in the Canadian Gov't, the Quebec separatists start getting all uppity almost immediately, like a cloud of mosquitos being disturbed by an unwary hiker.

Anyway, it looks as though the PM is asking Canadians to wait until the final outcome of the Gomery (Spanish?) inquisition, and then work on calling an election then. Sound, actully. That's what I support at this point.

Harper on the other hand, is eager and smells blood in the water. He wants to press forward with an election this spring, regardless of what many Canadians may think or want.

Personally what I think is that we just had an election, enough already. I can certainly wait until next year at least to go through all that bullshit again, and of course this time out the separatists will of course be more rabid than ever. It's obvious they see this scandal as their next opportune moment. So transparent it's pathetic.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

It just strikes me as obvious and funny that when there is the slightest little rift in the Canadian Gov't, the Quebec separatists start getting all uppity almost immediately, like a cloud of mosquitos being disturbed by an unwary hiker.

Anyway, it looks as though the PM is asking Canadians to wait until the final outcome of the Gomery (Spanish?) inquisition, and then work on calling an election then. Sound, actully. That's what I support at this point.

Harper on the other hand, is eager and smells blood in the water. He wants to press forward with an election this spring, regardless of what many Canadians may think or want.

Personally what I think is that we just had an election, enough already. I can certainly wait until next year at least to go through all that bullshit again, and of course this time out the separatists will of course be more rabid than ever. It's obvious they see this scandal as their next opportune moment. So transparent it's pathetic.

Call me a fool, but I hope Harper is the next prime minister and that the conservatives actually want to give something similar to Quebec like the Meech Accord. If that's the case, I would give my full support to this idea.

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

If you are a separatist, you are by definition anti-Canadian.

LOL ... Back to the:

" You are either with US or With the terrorists ..."


English Canada should join the USA ( count on Harper to try to do so )...

By the way, I can be pro separation and not be " anti-Canadian" .... just " pro-Canadian without the Quebec in it"...

Probably very hard to figure....

Hummmm I like the color Yellow, so I am an anti-blue color ....

CDSmith, you are just a political racist: simply put for you ...

Still don't know why you want to keep Quebec IN Canada ....

[Mike Okitch]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

Yes, the speech by Martin was pathetic (Nothing new here). And Harper was an electoral speech. Harper would do a better job. I hope he's the next prime minister.

No offense NoCarrier, but I hope that the doofus Harper is never wins any election.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by directfiesta

CDSmith, you are just a political racist: simply put for you ...

Still don't know why you want to keep Quebec IN Canada ....

I didn't see it that way.. I guess you are right.

[CDSmith]

And what if there is a "next referendum" and your side were to lose again. What then?

Let me answer that for you. You will grumble about it for a few years, regroup for a few more years, then start plotting and laying the groundwork for a FOURTH referendum in or around the 8 to 10 year mark.

Tell me, if you win, does Canada get to have another chance at a referendum 8 or 10 years after that? :D

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

And what if there is a "next referendum" and your side were to lose again. What then?

Let me answer that for you. You will grumble about it for a few years, regroup for a few more years, then start plotting and laying the groundwork for a FOURTH referendum in or around the 8 to 10 year mark.

Tell me, if you win, does Canada get to have another chance at a referendum 8 or 10 years after that? :D

There will be another one, and it will win. There is no "if" and "what". The "Charest" Liberals in Quebec are doomed and the PQ will win the next election (Maybe with the ADQ as opposition).

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by directfiesta

LOL ... Back to the:

" You are either with US or With the terrorists ..."


English Canada should join the USA ( count on Harper to try to do so )...

By the way, I can be pro separation and not be " anti-Canadian" .... just " pro-Canadian without the Quebec in it"...

Probably very hard to figure....

Hummmm I like the color Yellow, so I am an anti-blue color ....

CDSmith, you are just a political racist: simply put for you ...

Still don't know why you want to keep Quebec IN Canada ....

Fiesta boy, I can honestly say I wouldn't hire you to crack peanuts for me.

Political racist? How quaint, what a cute little made up buzzword you have there. It makes no sense whatsoever, like your whole point of view, so it fits you.

And, you don't know why I won't agree with the separatists because you lack the ability to comprehend my posts for some reason. I have stated my reasons for my point of view in several of my posts on these threads today, yet here you are still scratching your empty little separatist head and wondering things.

Keep on wondering then. If you guys think your bullshit isn't going to cause damage to this country you're hugely mistaken.

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by LadyMischief

Last I heard, a country has to have assets to be able to support it's own currency... But I was led to believe that Quebec wants to continue using the Canadian dollar if they seperate. How the hell does that work?

So basically, if we want to be a sovereign nation and keep the same currency, you are going to say no ? Then we will have to sell all our canadian dollars. Good luck with what's left of the canadian currency value.

[CDSmith]

Originally Posted by NoCarrier

There will be another one, and it will win. There is no "if" and "what". The "Charest" Liberals in Quebec are doomed and the PQ will win the next election (Maybe with the ADQ as opposition).

And.....? I asked you a fucking question, what are you, as ADD-affected as Fiesta? Fuck.

If you win this mythical next referendum, does Canada get to cry for years until yet another referendum is granted? If not, why is it only your side that gets to have 2, 3 or 4 referendums?

Do you not see how one might compare separatists in Quebec to small children?

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by CDSmith

Tell me, if you win, does Canada get to have another chance at a referendum 8 or 10 years after that? :D

You should learn to shut your big mouth ....

The answer is Yes ...

Don't believe it ??? Think about the de-merging of Montreal ....

If people are not happy in 10 years AND Canada wants to have Quebec back in a confederation ( which we are not part of now ), so it will be. Just like election....

Why don't we have just a last election and that's it: no more for ever.... NPD, you lost, Stop whining, BlocQuebecois, you lost, stop whining, Kiberals, you lost, stop whining ....

Nice system, CDSmith