Opinions on AVS's - GoFuckYourself.com

lokiproductions · 02-14-2005, 04:11 AM

Anyone running sites on them?

Opinions good and bad most welcomed.

3AM eternal · 02-14-2005, 04:15 AM

lots of work. slow getting started. payoff is worth it though.

Project-Shadow · 02-14-2005, 04:24 AM

The original time investment is quite large, but yes it is worth it in the long run most definately.

It's just a case of deciding which one to choose.
[I.E One that provides content or one that doesnt]

I'm trying out AdultsAllowed [http://www.adultsallowed.com/wm/index.php/3987] at the moment, seems to be doing quite well. Converting at around 1:212.

baddog · 02-14-2005, 04:40 AM

I would suggest you read my tutorial on AVS found at Kblogger

David! · 02-14-2005, 04:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog

I would suggest you read my tutorial on AVS found at Kblogger

Great Info you have there, that is the only blog I have bookmarked

baddog · 02-14-2005, 04:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PussyMan

Great Info you have there, that is the only blog I have bookmarked

Thank you, but you might want to consider bookmarking the Adult SEO Blog also. It is loaded with great information on SEO/SEM.

Showman · 02-14-2005, 05:31 AM

Try SexKey...

groark · 02-14-2005, 05:34 AM

The linklist traffic is the best you can get, but you won't be able to make a lot only on that traffic. You have to make a good tour so people will sign up for that AVS system and get money that way..

xclusive · 02-14-2005, 05:58 AM

go for it you work and you will succede

jayeff · 02-14-2005, 06:26 AM

You really need to distinguish between the very different types of "AVS/AEN":

1. The "free" AVS - Sexkey, Freenetpass, etc - you provide only minimal content (or use sponsor content) and their promo rules are flexible, but one-time payout only.

2. The traditional "premium" AVS/AEN - Cyberage, Netverifier, etc - you provide slightly more content, tougher promo rules, good recurring income.

3. The modern (movie-based) AEN - AdultsAllowed, JansWebring, etc - they provide the content and hosting, recurring income, but no upsells and the traffic is never yours.

There are variations on these three main themes and each one is a very different business model, needs different approaches to selling etc.

The two big advantages of AVS sites were the upsells and free traffic (for ID's and upsells). The traffic has been so diluted by the number of sites in the longer running programs, Sexkey is the only one I know from which these days a site might still see (just) double digit traffic daily. Although the argument about the traffic being relatively high quality (because members already proved their willingness to pay for porn) is still valid, the internal traffic is so small (per site) that upsells have dwindled to a fraction of what they were.

All the long-running ones seem to have got stuck in a time warp. Their standards were barely relevant in 2000 and now they are hopelessly out of date, which makes even the "free" programs a harder sell than they were. There is no sign that any of these programs have any intention of bringing themselves up to date, rather they just seem to be riding out whatever is left of the market they once had.

As has already been said, you can still make money with them, but it is a longer, slower process with a lower ceiling. Depending on your traffic and aptitudes (design possibly plays a bigger part) the Movie AEN's can work better. Their main problem seems to be a limited content pool which means they all end up offering very similar, mostly fairly generic content. They took off very strongly when they first appeared and are still doing fairly well, but now there are close to a dozen such operations, sales per site seem to be slowing. There are also big differences in saleability of the various programs and while rebills are better than most paysites, they are not as good as the traditional premium AVS sites.

Of course, that is all only my own take, based on my own experiences. Yours may well be different...

GoodStuff · 02-14-2005, 07:29 AM

I don't think the old model of build a thousand of them and they will come works very well anymore. But if you're willing to make a quality site and promote it like a paysite, then an AVS system can be helpful as extra content and a third party processor.

I have a few sites that make a fair amount of money on a consistent basis, but am considering just paying CCBill the VISA fees and taking 87% of the revenue instead of 50% that I make with an AVS network. But in my case the sales come from my efforts, not the link lists.

E.Kant · 02-14-2005, 07:58 AM

I was considering the fact of using internal traffic in doing more couple of avs sites a day and submit them. one site doesnt bring you much internal traffic but I wonder how it is when you are doing a dozen daily ..

any got experience on that ?

JoeA · 02-14-2005, 08:15 AM

Jayeff is a long time, very experienced wm and his comments are so true.

AVS/AEN are not what they were 4-5 years ago, due mainly to Visa. You cannot rely on any of them for links list traffic at all, so if you don't have your own... Don't even get started.

GoodStuff · 02-14-2005, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E.Kant

I was considering the fact of using internal traffic in doing more couple of avs sites a day and submit them. one site doesnt bring you much internal traffic but I wonder how it is when you are doing a dozen daily ..

any got experience on that ?

AVS traffic while good, isn't as easy as it used to be based on the model of building a ton of sites. I think it would be more time effective to use google adword for similar quality traffic.

The biggest negative in this business model is that you end up with a bunch of crap sites for a little bit of traffic and then maybe the AVSs get shut down or quit (like Adult Check). Now you're stuck with a bunch of crap sites and have to start all over again. Whereas if you build a few quality sites and emphasize your time in building a significant traffic base of your own, then if the AVSs go bye bye, you can always switch to the paysite model with very little effort ($750 in VISA fees) and have a traffic base in place. Plus you aren't limited in members area upsale techniques anymore and get a higher return of revenues.

It just makes sense to plan for the future while building in the present.

jayeff · 02-14-2005, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E.Kant

I was considering the fact of using internal traffic in doing more couple of avs sites a day and submit them. one site doesnt bring you much internal traffic but I wonder how it is when you are doing a dozen daily ..

any got experience on that ?

Experience no: that was the kind of treadmill I never wanted to get on because I do enough boring, repetitive stuff in other areas. And it was obvious that it would weaken the AVS programs, so I was foolish enough to believe it wouldn't be allowed to run for long.

AVS operators would have you believe the single-site webmasters make the most money. Some may do well with that approach, but if you check out the new listings they are all dominated by a handful of webmasters who have been working that way for years. You have to assume it pays off for them.

lokiproductions · 02-15-2005, 01:43 AM

Thanks all for your generous advice.

Baddog, great resource, thanks for sharing!

Rui · 02-15-2005, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayeff

You really need to distinguish between the very different types of "AVS/AEN":

1. The "free" AVS - Sexkey, Freenetpass, etc - you provide only minimal content (or use sponsor content) and their promo rules are flexible, but one-time payout only.

2. The traditional "premium" AVS/AEN - Cyberage, Netverifier, etc - you provide slightly more content, tougher promo rules, good recurring income.

3. The modern (movie-based) AEN - AdultsAllowed, JansWebring, etc - they provide the content and hosting, recurring income, but no upsells and the traffic is never yours.

There are variations on these three main themes and each one is a very different business model, needs different approaches to selling etc.

The two big advantages of AVS sites were the upsells and free traffic (for ID's and upsells). The traffic has been so diluted by the number of sites in the longer running programs, Sexkey is the only one I know from which these days a site might still see (just) double digit traffic daily. Although the argument about the traffic being relatively high quality (because members already proved their willingness to pay for porn) is still valid, the internal traffic is so small (per site) that upsells have dwindled to a fraction of what they were.

All the long-running ones seem to have got stuck in a time warp. Their standards were barely relevant in 2000 and now they are hopelessly out of date, which makes even the "free" programs a harder sell than they were. There is no sign that any of these programs have any intention of bringing themselves up to date, rather they just seem to be riding out whatever is left of the market they once had.

As has already been said, you can still make money with them, but it is a longer, slower process with a lower ceiling. Depending on your traffic and aptitudes (design possibly plays a bigger part) the Movie AEN's can work better. Their main problem seems to be a limited content pool which means they all end up offering very similar, mostly fairly generic content. They took off very strongly when they first appeared and are still doing fairly well, but now there are close to a dozen such operations, sales per site seem to be slowing. There are also big differences in saleability of the various programs and while rebills are better than most paysites, they are not as good as the traditional premium AVS sites.

Of course, that is all only my own take, based on my own experiences. Yours may well be different...

Nice post, thanks for sharing

baddog · 04-21-2005, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jayeff

The two big advantages of AVS sites were the upsells and free traffic (for ID's and upsells). The traffic has been so diluted by the number of sites in the longer running programs, Sexkey is the only one I know from which these days a site might still see (just) double digit traffic daily. Although the argument about the traffic being relatively high quality (because members already proved their willingness to pay for porn) is still valid, the internal traffic is so small (per site) that upsells have dwindled to a fraction of what they were.

Yeah, thread is old, but felt I should respond to this.

I agree with most of what you said, and you have been around for a while, so I figure you have probably played with AVS. While you are accusing AVS systems of not thinking in today's environment, you aren't either.

The only difference is that now you have to provide your own traffic. No more relying on the AVS internal traffic, but if you make the signup, you are the one that is going to have the first few attempts at an upsell. You win both ways.

Back in the days of internal traffic you were making new sites every day so you could be on the top of the list. Today, just make one nice one, and promote it. That is the only difference.

Jim Neil · 04-29-2005, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog

Yeah, thread is old, but felt I should respond to this.

I agree with most of what you said, and you have been around for a while, so I figure you have probably played with AVS. While you are accusing AVS systems of not thinking in today's environment, you aren't either.

The only difference is that now you have to provide your own traffic. No more relying on the AVS internal traffic, but if you make the signup, you are the one that is going to have the first few attempts at an upsell. You win both ways.

Back in the days of internal traffic you were making new sites every day so you could be on the top of the list. Today, just make one nice one, and promote it. That is the only difference.

Indeed this thread is old but it continues to get alot of useful posts for people (myself) interested in starting an AVS.
Bump for good quality info.

02-14-2005, 04:11 AM	#1
lokiproductions Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 118	Opinions on AVS's Anyone running sites on them? Opinions good and bad most welcomed.

02-14-2005, 04:15 AM	#2
3AM eternal Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: a galaxy far far away Posts: 516	lots of work. slow getting started. payoff is worth it though. __________________

02-14-2005, 05:31 AM	#7
Showman Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: na Posts: 269	Try SexKey... __________________ *At Sedo.com you can sell your unused domain names and earn money through their paid domain parking program!*

02-14-2005, 05:58 AM	#9
xclusive Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 35,218	go for it you work and you will succede __________________ I support MediumPimpin.com / Shemp's Outlawtgp.com /

02-14-2005, 07:58 AM	#12
E.Kant Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Philosophy Center Posts: 1,577	I was considering the fact of using internal traffic in doing more couple of avs sites a day and submit them. one site doesnt bring you much internal traffic but I wonder how it is when you are doing a dozen daily .. any got experience on that ? __________________ FILL your TUBE SITE with thousands of videos within a few days! Content delivery with Tags, Description, Pornstar Name, and niche! For example: Start your Asian Porn Tube with 10,000 videos in only 10 days! Contact me: ICQ 461 531 88

02-14-2005, 04:24 AM	#3
Project-Shadow Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 7,340	The original time investment is quite large, but yes it is worth it in the long run most definately. It's just a case of deciding which one to choose. [I.E One that provides content or one that doesnt] I'm trying out AdultsAllowed [http://www.adultsallowed.com/wm/index.php/3987] at the moment, seems to be doing quite well. Converting at around 1:212.

02-14-2005, 04:40 AM	#4
baddog So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: the beach, SoCal Posts: 107,089	I would suggest you read my tutorial on AVS found at Kblogger

02-14-2005, 05:34 AM	#8
groark So Fucking Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 1,966	The linklist traffic is the best you can get, but you won't be able to make a lot only on that traffic. You have to make a good tour so people will sign up for that AVS system and get money that way..

02-14-2005, 06:26 AM	#10
jayeff Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 2,944	You really need to distinguish between the very different types of "AVS/AEN": 1. The "free" AVS - Sexkey, Freenetpass, etc - you provide only minimal content (or use sponsor content) and their promo rules are flexible, but one-time payout only. 2. The traditional "premium" AVS/AEN - Cyberage, Netverifier, etc - you provide slightly more content, tougher promo rules, good recurring income. 3. The modern (movie-based) AEN - AdultsAllowed, JansWebring, etc - they provide the content and hosting, recurring income, but no upsells and the traffic is never yours. There are variations on these three main themes and each one is a very different business model, needs different approaches to selling etc. The two big advantages of AVS sites were the upsells and free traffic (for ID's and upsells). The traffic has been so diluted by the number of sites in the longer running programs, Sexkey is the only one I know from which these days a site might still see (just) double digit traffic daily. Although the argument about the traffic being relatively high quality (because members already proved their willingness to pay for porn) is still valid, the internal traffic is so small (per site) that upsells have dwindled to a fraction of what they were. All the long-running ones seem to have got stuck in a time warp. Their standards were barely relevant in 2000 and now they are hopelessly out of date, which makes even the "free" programs a harder sell than they were. There is no sign that any of these programs have any intention of bringing themselves up to date, rather they just seem to be riding out whatever is left of the market they once had. As has already been said, you can still make money with them, but it is a longer, slower process with a lower ceiling. Depending on your traffic and aptitudes (design possibly plays a bigger part) the Movie AEN's can work better. Their main problem seems to be a limited content pool which means they all end up offering very similar, mostly fairly generic content. They took off very strongly when they first appeared and are still doing fairly well, but now there are close to a dozen such operations, sales per site seem to be slowing. There are also big differences in saleability of the various programs and while rebills are better than most paysites, they are not as good as the traditional premium AVS sites. Of course, that is all only my own take, based on my own experiences. Yours may well be different...

02-14-2005, 07:29 AM	#11
GoodStuff Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 511	I don't think the old model of build a thousand of them and they will come works very well anymore. But if you're willing to make a quality site and promote it like a paysite, then an AVS system can be helpful as extra content and a third party processor. I have a few sites that make a fair amount of money on a consistent basis, but am considering just paying CCBill the VISA fees and taking 87% of the revenue instead of 50% that I make with an AVS network. But in my case the sales come from my efforts, not the link lists.

02-14-2005, 08:15 AM	#13
JoeA Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: London Posts: 568	Jayeffs post say's it all... Jayeff is a long time, very experienced wm and his comments are so true. AVS/AEN are not what they were 4-5 years ago, due mainly to Visa. You cannot rely on any of them for links list traffic at all, so if you don't have your own... Don't even get started. __________________ www.saharagetsdirty.com/ www.ravishingindians.com/ www.anglo-indian-girls.com/

02-15-2005, 01:43 AM	#16
lokiproductions Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 118	Thanks all for your generous advice. Baddog, great resource, thanks for sharing!