OK, who wants the Roulette System? - Page 5 - GoFuckYourself.com

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 08:01 PM

On a side note... having never played roulette in a casino... do they limit the number of numbers you can place a bet on at once?

studio · 01-17-2005, 08:13 PM

Pipeline Q,

I think you are understanding the system... and yes, you always have 4 $1.00 chips bet, one on each side... I never tried to use the wins of the 17 to 1 bets to be able to lower the amount you need to bet in the middle...????

studio · 01-17-2005, 08:14 PM

No, you can bet on them all if you want... LOL but that would be a loss for sure...

Pipeline Q · 01-17-2005, 08:17 PM

Wait a minute... When you say corner bets, what exactly are those bets? Actual numbers, or...?

Because I was betting on actual numbers to test it. Like 1, 2, 3 and 4 being the side bets and 5 the main bet that increases. Is that right?

aico · 01-17-2005, 08:18 PM

Actually, the very best way to win at roulette is to find a veteran "dealer" and tip him well. It's a little known secret that they can make it land on whatever # they want by how hard and when they toss the ball. I've seen it with my own two eyes. If you tip em well, they'll send some wins your way. Because if you make money they make money.

Pipeline Q · 01-17-2005, 08:21 PM

Well I don't know about that, but I suppose they could with expierence get it to a specific side of the wheel. Thus doubling your chances.

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by studio

No, you can bet on them all if you want... LOL but that would be a loss for sure...

Ok... so why not just bet 20 numbers on the board and double down upon losing, revert to orginal bet on winning... if I didn't make any errors in my calc, you should come out with a win.

Check it out http://agentcash.com/gfy/scripts/roulette.htm plug in 20 (instead of the default 5) for number of picks and run it. Someone please tell me I've made an error somewhere, before I take a trip to Laughlin

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 08:42 PM

Nevermind, found my error, I was calulating the max bet as a single number max instead of table max.

studio · 01-17-2005, 09:11 PM

Pipeline Q,

Here is a pic of how the bets are placed...

the straight up bet pays 35 to 1

the other 4 pay 17 to 1

woj · 01-17-2005, 09:16 PM

For those of you that still think this system works:
http://www.wizardofodds.com/gambling...g-systems.html

studio · 01-17-2005, 09:17 PM

AgentCash,

What the heck is this?
http://agentcash.com/gfy/scripts/roulette.htm

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by studio

AgentCash,

What the heck is this?
http://agentcash.com/gfy/scripts/roulette.htm

It's a double-down system, I wrote it to get a handle on the datasets involved. It's mighty slow since it's run in the browser, I just implemented in perl because I can't believe the numbers I'm seeing... If anyone wants to test my system on their own here is how it works. Bet on 20 numbers with $1 if you lose double down on all numbers. If you hit table max bet the max you can on 20 numbers (ie: table max of $100, bet $5 on each number) until you win. Then once you win revert to $1 bets on the 20 numbers.

Now someone prove to me this isn't profitable over a large number of iterations, cause I can't see my mistake. I've run 2 million iterations and the profits get up to the millions.

studio · 01-17-2005, 09:37 PM

This is a great tool... Don't remember who posted it... It proves my point...

http://www.gravicor.com/scratch/asystem.html

You just need to understand the bets to place.

Just use the first 2 coulms... This tool gives you 3000 random numbers... although he should have put in 0 & 00 into the mix...

woj · 01-17-2005, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AgentCash

It's a double-down system, I wrote it to get a handle on the datasets involved. It's mighty slow since it's run in the browser, I just implemented in perl because I can't believe the numbers I'm seeing... If anyone wants to test my system on their own here is how it works. Bet on 20 numbers with $1 if you lose double down on all numbers. If you hit table max bet the max you can on 20 numbers (ie: table max of $100, bet $5 on each number) until you win. Then once you win revert to $1 bets on the 20 numbers.

Now someone prove to me this isn't profitable over a large number of iterations, cause I can't see my mistake. I've run 2 million iterations and the profits get up to the millions.

http://www.wizardofodds.com/gambling...g-systems.html
This explains fairly well, why doubling system doesn't work.....

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

http://www.wizardofodds.com/gambling...g-systems.html
This explains fairly well, why doubling system doesn't work.....

Yes that's all well and good, but when you bet on 20 numbers you reduce the probability of having to double down enough times to take a loss. All I'm asking is for someone else here to do the math I outlined above. Run a few hundred thousand or few million iterations and see for yourself, when you bet on 10-20 numbers each spin you come out ahead...

woj · 01-17-2005, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AgentCash

Yes that's all well and good, but when you bet on 20 numbers you reduce the probability of having to double down enough times to take a loss. All I'm asking is for someone else here to do the math I outlined above. Run a few hundred thousand or few million iterations and see for yourself, when you bet on 10-20 numbers each spin you come out ahead...

I don't know how your system works, but isn't betting on 20 numbers about the same as just betting on red for example?

studio · 01-17-2005, 09:51 PM

AgentCash,

Think about it... your betting $20.00 lets say 1.00 on every number 1 to 20 They spin the wheel it lands on 36 You lose $20.00 now you bet $40.00 - $2.00 on each number 1 to 20 they spine the wheel it lands on 22 You lose 40.00 bringing your loss to 60.00 now you bet $80.00 $4.00 on each number 1 to 20 they spin the wheel... it lands on 15 you win! or do you? on your winning spin you win 4 at 35 to 1 thats $140.00 you have lost $136.00 total and you have the 4.00 left on the board. You you would be even... LOL

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 09:59 PM

Yeah, but on average you will win a little better than 50% of the time.

studio · 01-17-2005, 10:04 PM

This is to funny... I laid it out for you all... those who don't think it will work are not understanding...

Houdini · 01-17-2005, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevsh

Unfortunately, roulette tables are not random number generators and so there is literally no way of calculating what will happen. Mathmeticians will say different and that, for example, the odds of hitting black 10 times in a row are 1 in 1000 (or whatever it is). But then drag their ass into a casino and watch as it happens a few times a night.

A random generator is not trying to calculate anything, it's just a simulator. There's no other way to test this other than go to a casino and try it out. However, the ball landing on a number is as random as picking a number out of a hat. So a random generator will work to test this. Of course anything can happen since it's random, hence you can hit black 10 times in a row.

AgentCash · 01-17-2005, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by studio

This is to funny... I laid it out for you all... those who don't think it will work are not understanding...

Not saying your system wouldn't work, I was pointing out that betting on 20 numbers places the odds of you hitting at a bit better than 50%. With odds of 35:1 that means it works out over time to:

Start with $1000
Lose $980
Lose $940
Win $1080
Win $1115
Win $1150
Lose $1130
Lose $1090
Win $1230
Win $1265
Lose $1245
Lose $1205

Over time it adds up to profit. Just not sure I'd have the patience to sit there betting 20 numbers for very long. I'd love to hear from anyone that has run my numbers independently, I'm so damn tired I feel I must be making a mistake somewhere.

studio · 01-17-2005, 10:51 PM

Good Night All...

We'll see if the grave yard shift will get it... LOL

dudus · 01-17-2005, 11:22 PM

Bud - it just can't work. If it works why the heck don't u live in Vegas, hit a different casino every second day - make a $1500 a time. $200k a year return in Vegas is not gonna get u noticed.

??

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 05:08 AM

Interesting thread.
Been trying it out now for 20 mins and won 300 dollars so far.

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 05:12 AM

Still i dont believe it will work in the long run.

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 05:15 AM

437 profit....

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 05:22 AM

576

Amazing...honestly...

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 05:26 AM

649

.....

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 05:40 AM

783

Nifty.

dudus · 01-18-2005, 05:57 AM

It's total and utter crap ! Just run the odds...

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudus

It's total and utter crap ! Just run the odds...

The thing is you will reach the point where your number simply wont hit and thats when you will lose all your money.

dudus · 01-18-2005, 06:09 AM

Studio - I've never seen you use the propabilities in your expanation... Without the odds / yields this is all meaningless.

Here's the deal.

Probability on a single bet is 2.6% and on a double is 5.3%. Therefore the expected yield on a $1 single bet is $0.91 (0.026 x $35) and on a $1 double bet is $0.90 (0.053 x $17). Thus the expected return is less than your stake.

Packaging the bets together has absolutely NO merit as it cannot change these odds. I could work out the odds / returns for each 5 bet package but it is totally irrelevant, betting 5 times won't change the odds.

Thus the system boils down to the doubling up on the single bet. This has indentical problems with typical doubling up (the only difference is you have a lower stake and double up more often). The system also contains classic gambler's voodoo "Don't chase the board..." - it doensn't matter if you move your number as each spin is totally independent to the last (otherwise the wheel or ball would have to have a memory).

Any system must be able to provide a bet in which the expected value is greater than the stake - this system doesn't. To my knowledge the only game which can do this is blackjack, but the amount of work involved is so phenomenal that casino's in truth aren't too worried about it.

dudus · 01-18-2005, 06:14 AM

Quote:

The thing is you will reach the point where your number simply wont hit and thats when you will lose all your money.

Yep - you hit the problem with doubling up.

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 06:24 AM

Ok i hit the point where my number isnt coming up anymore...im back at 0, my next bet will be a loss.

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 06:27 AM

Well since i just keep on doubling im losing money real quick now...

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 06:37 AM

Ok back at 1600

I was almost 1000 down though.

I can see Studio's point and i agree its a pretty nice setup but still there is no guaranteed winning....

mardigras · 01-18-2005, 06:59 AM

This would guarantee me to lose a LOT of money. I have anti-luck at the casinos. Last time I went I put 4 rolls of quarters in slot machines without so much as winning a single quarter back. 3 people however won nice amounts on machines I just left, one woman on her first spin. Then again, I went to Bingo every week for over a year and never won a single time while everyone at my table did, some sometimes twice in one night.

When I go to casinos now it's for the buffet. If I'm going to throw money away I'd rather just walk outside and throw it on the sidewalk. At least that way it would have a chance of ending up with someone who needs it

e-god · 01-18-2005, 07:08 AM

casino games suck, unless you master the game

see sig

DEA - banned for life · 01-18-2005, 07:16 AM

anyone give it a try yet?

studio · 01-18-2005, 07:16 AM

kevinale,

Could you hit me up on ICQ 251860879

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEA

anyone give it a try yet?

Try reading the thread.

Twe Russ · 01-18-2005, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Platinum Rinaldo

Roulette is for losers... poker is the best game

i agreed poker is better but this is a game against the house and not
against a friend or someone at the table. two different kind of games

studio · 01-18-2005, 08:04 AM

Think if I could get Kevinale, to alter his number generator to use the proper bet sequence and amounts... it would be much more clear to everyone and prove my point...

If someone knows him or has his ICQ let me know it or have him contact me please

dudus · 01-18-2005, 08:09 AM

no need to run simulations - simulations are only necessary for complex situations where the probabilities are unknown.

In this case the probabilities are known and certain...

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 08:16 AM

So Studio, if you are so sure of yourself why arent you in Vegas now to become a millionaire?

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franck

So Studio, if you are so sure of yourself why arent you in Vegas now to become a millionaire?

Cough cough

studio · 01-18-2005, 09:17 AM

There are many reasons... Business, Family, the casino's would just change the table limits...

AgentCash · 01-18-2005, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudus

no need to run simulations - simulations are only necessary for complex situations where the probabilities are unknown.

In this case the probabilities are known and certain...

Mind running the probabilities for my scenario?
$1 starting bet, $100 table maximum bet, 38 numbers to bet on, 35:1 payout.
Bet on 20 numbers. If you lose double down. If you lose enough times to reach table maximum, bet table maximum until you win ($5 per number). Once you win revert to the $1 bets.

Dirty F · 01-18-2005, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by studio

There are many reasons... Business, Family, the casino's would just change the table limits...

Ahhhh i see.

*cough* bullshit *cough*

pinkhat · 01-18-2005, 09:36 AM

The best odds on a routette system is 1 bet straight-up on 1 number.

If you split that decreases payouts ( 17 + 17 < 35 )
If you bet on more than one number you're throwing money away. The ball can only land on 1 number at a time...

01-17-2005, 08:13 PM	#202
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	Pipeline Q, I think you are understanding the system... and yes, you always have 4 $1.00 chips bet, one on each side... I never tried to use the wins of the 17 to 1 bets to be able to lower the amount you need to bet in the middle...???? __________________

01-17-2005, 08:14 PM	#203
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	No, you can bet on them all if you want... LOL but that would be a loss for sure... __________________

01-17-2005, 09:11 PM	#209
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	Pipeline Q, Here is a pic of how the bets are placed... the straight up bet pays 35 to 1 the other 4 pay 17 to 1 __________________

01-17-2005, 09:16 PM	#210
woj <&(©¿©)&> Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 47,882	For those of you that still think this system works: http://www.wizardofodds.com/gambling...g-systems.html __________________ Custom Software Development, email: woj#at#wojfun#.#com to discuss details or skype: wojl2000 or gchat: wojfun or telegram: wojl2000 Affiliate program tools: Hosted Galleries Manager Banner Manager Video Manager Wordpress Affiliate Plugin Pic/Movie of the Day Fansign Generator Zip Manager

01-17-2005, 09:17 PM	#211
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	AgentCash, What the heck is this? http://agentcash.com/gfy/scripts/roulette.htm __________________

01-17-2005, 08:01 PM	#201
AgentCash Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 720	On a side note... having never played roulette in a casino... do they limit the number of numbers you can place a bet on at once?

01-17-2005, 08:17 PM	#204
Pipeline Q Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,891	Wait a minute... When you say corner bets, what exactly are those bets? Actual numbers, or...? Because I was betting on actual numbers to test it. Like 1, 2, 3 and 4 being the side bets and 5 the main bet that increases. Is that right?

01-17-2005, 08:18 PM	#205
aico Moo Moo Cow Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Washington State Posts: 14,748	Actually, the very best way to win at roulette is to find a veteran "dealer" and tip him well. It's a little known secret that they can make it land on whatever # they want by how hard and when they toss the ball. I've seen it with my own two eyes. If you tip em well, they'll send some wins your way. Because if you make money they make money.

01-17-2005, 08:21 PM	#206
Pipeline Q Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,891	Well I don't know about that, but I suppose they could with expierence get it to a specific side of the wheel. Thus doubling your chances.

01-17-2005, 08:42 PM	#208
AgentCash Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 720	Nevermind, found my error, I was calulating the max bet as a single number max instead of table max.

01-17-2005, 09:37 PM	#213
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	This is a great tool... Don't remember who posted it... It proves my point... http://www.gravicor.com/scratch/asystem.html You just need to understand the bets to place. Just use the first 2 coulms... This tool gives you 3000 random numbers... although he should have put in 0 & 00 into the mix... __________________

01-17-2005, 09:51 PM	#217
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	AgentCash, Think about it... your betting $20.00 lets say 1.00 on every number 1 to 20 They spin the wheel it lands on 36 You lose $20.00 now you bet $40.00 - $2.00 on each number 1 to 20 they spine the wheel it lands on 22 You lose 40.00 bringing your loss to 60.00 now you bet $80.00 $4.00 on each number 1 to 20 they spin the wheel... it lands on 15 you win! or do you? on your winning spin you win 4 at 35 to 1 thats $140.00 you have lost $136.00 total and you have the 4.00 left on the board. You you would be even... LOL __________________

01-17-2005, 09:59 PM	#218
AgentCash Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 720	Yeah, but on average you will win a little better than 50% of the time.

01-17-2005, 10:04 PM	#219
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	This is to funny... I laid it out for you all... those who don't think it will work are not understanding... __________________

01-17-2005, 10:51 PM	#222
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	Good Night All... We'll see if the grave yard shift will get it... LOL __________________

01-17-2005, 11:22 PM	#223
dudus Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: UK Posts: 175	Bud - it just can't work. If it works why the heck don't u live in Vegas, hit a different casino every second day - make a $1500 a time. $200k a year return in Vegas is not gonna get u noticed. ??

01-18-2005, 05:08 AM	#224
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	Interesting thread. Been trying it out now for 20 mins and won 300 dollars so far.

01-18-2005, 05:12 AM	#225
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	Still i dont believe it will work in the long run.

01-18-2005, 05:15 AM	#226
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	437 profit....

01-18-2005, 05:22 AM	#227
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	576 Amazing...honestly...

01-18-2005, 05:26 AM	#228
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	649 .....

01-18-2005, 05:40 AM	#229
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	783 Nifty.

01-18-2005, 05:57 AM	#230
dudus Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: UK Posts: 175	It's total and utter crap ! Just run the odds...

01-18-2005, 06:09 AM	#232
dudus Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: UK Posts: 175	Studio - I've never seen you use the propabilities in your expanation... Without the odds / yields this is all meaningless. Here's the deal. Probability on a single bet is 2.6% and on a double is 5.3%. Therefore the expected yield on a $1 single bet is $0.91 (0.026 x $35) and on a $1 double bet is $0.90 (0.053 x $17). Thus the expected return is less than your stake. Packaging the bets together has absolutely NO merit as it cannot change these odds. I could work out the odds / returns for each 5 bet package but it is totally irrelevant, betting 5 times won't change the odds. Thus the system boils down to the doubling up on the single bet. This has indentical problems with typical doubling up (the only difference is you have a lower stake and double up more often). The system also contains classic gambler's voodoo "Don't chase the board..." - it doensn't matter if you move your number as each spin is totally independent to the last (otherwise the wheel or ball would have to have a memory). Any system must be able to provide a bet in which the expected value is greater than the stake - this system doesn't. To my knowledge the only game which can do this is blackjack, but the amount of work involved is so phenomenal that casino's in truth aren't too worried about it.

01-18-2005, 06:24 AM	#234
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	Ok i hit the point where my number isnt coming up anymore...im back at 0, my next bet will be a loss.

01-18-2005, 06:27 AM	#235
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	Well since i just keep on doubling im losing money real quick now...

01-18-2005, 06:37 AM	#236
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	Ok back at 1600 I was almost 1000 down though. I can see Studio's point and i agree its a pretty nice setup but still there is no guaranteed winning....

01-18-2005, 06:59 AM	#237
mardigras Bon temps! Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: down yonder Posts: 14,194	This would guarantee me to lose a LOT of money. I have anti-luck at the casinos. Last time I went I put 4 rolls of quarters in slot machines without so much as winning a single quarter back. 3 people however won nice amounts on machines I just left, one woman on her first spin. Then again, I went to Bingo every week for over a year and never won a single time while everyone at my table did, some sometimes twice in one night. When I go to casinos now it's for the buffet. If I'm going to throw money away I'd rather just walk outside and throw it on the sidewalk. At least that way it would have a chance of ending up with someone who needs it __________________ .

01-18-2005, 07:08 AM	#238
e-god Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: BabeLand Posts: 1,736	casino games suck, unless you master the game see sig __________________

01-18-2005, 07:16 AM	#239
DEA - banned for life V.I.P. Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: InYour Head Posts: 7,886	anyone give it a try yet?

01-18-2005, 07:16 AM	#240
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	kevinale, Could you hit me up on ICQ 251860879 __________________

01-18-2005, 08:04 AM	#243
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	Think if I could get Kevinale, to alter his number generator to use the proper bet sequence and amounts... it would be much more clear to everyone and prove my point... If someone knows him or has his ICQ let me know it or have him contact me please __________________

01-18-2005, 08:09 AM	#244
dudus Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: UK Posts: 175	no need to run simulations - simulations are only necessary for complex situations where the probabilities are unknown. In this case the probabilities are known and certain...

01-18-2005, 08:16 AM	#245
Dirty F Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 59,204	So Studio, if you are so sure of yourself why arent you in Vegas now to become a millionaire?

01-18-2005, 09:17 AM	#247
studio Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Oshkosh, WI ICQ #251860879 Posts: 1,095	There are many reasons... Business, Family, the casino's would just change the table limits... __________________