Well, you know those there "pissing" galleries and "poopsex" galleries could incite some sickos to go out to public parks and picnic areas and piss/defecate in front of innocent people so....

Nope, we better ban them http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif


Jeez, good points Sykk. I would add that if we're always afraid of what "might" happen then there would BE no entertainment industry, except for a big purple dino named Barney. But then the suicide rate would skyrocket, so Barney's out too.

SykkBoy2..... this would be ME you are referring to and yes I am well aware that people have said this, yes...... and this is not ALL my kids watch, I just don't censor them as much as some people do. And as far as them being agressive with their playmates? Yeah ok, that's why my kids have all won congeniality awards and such. Have one on Home school and works full time, was even offered a management position becaus of her people skills........ she is 17, have another who is on the academic team and has wond many awards for his kindness to his classmates, he has also been nominated for the Gifted and Talented list...... he is 12......... and my youngest son? Well I just got a letter from his teacher telling me how well rounded and intelligent he is and how helpful he is with his classmates, and what a joy he is to have in her class. How many teachers you know call their students parents to tell them how WELL their kids are doing in school? This one is 7........ and my youngest, well she is not in school yet and she is a bit more abrasive, but she is the baby and only 3...... and watches ONLY Nickalodean........ I htink I spelled that wrong. LOL

Yeah I suppose you are right........ damn these violent movies are just absolutely RUINING my kids......... what was I thinking? Should I cut them off the news too? That's about the most violent thing on TV........ nahh....... I have nothing to worry about as far as the effect violent TV is having on my kids....... what I WOULD be concerned about is if they were experiencing this in my home, which they are not taught this, and it is not tolerated. As long as they are not hurting or disrespecting anyone, they are doing ok. If one of these things come up then we deal with it ASAP........ so no I am so NOT a believer in simply WATCHING violence also TEACHES violence, it is MY job to teach them right from wrong and I am doing this. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/wink.gif

Being a porn webmaster does not give us an open end ticket to be immoral and disrespectful of others and I think SOME people could benefit from this lesson. And you are right, this is a matter of opinions and I am strong about my opinions, always have been. BUT if it is MY site, I have the right to make such opinions.

As for Vampire galleries......... shit I have no problem with this, providing BOTH or all parties are consenting, to each his own. LOL

Tam

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[This message has been edited by Battuss (edited 09-29-2001).]

I'll have to agree with Tam on this one. I am 100% positive that kids develop aggressive tendancies from the example set by their parents. There are a few exceptions to everything in this world, but USUALLY kids tend to emulate and develop hangups directly from the behavior of their idiot parents.

I watched tons of violent shit on TV when I was a kid, even the most violent Bugs Bunny cartoons (all of which were censored back in the late 80,s right?), but my parents set a good example for me, and they helped me develop the presence of mind to THINK before I act, not just react and take out my aggressions on others. (Like some kids do/did).

I percieve Tam as a person who cares a great deal about her kids, one that sets a good example around them (and misbehaves like sin when she's NOT around them http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif ) I think a caring parent will have some good communication channels open to his or her kids at all times for all things, and watching tv violence isn't going to create a new wave of criminals, but stupid parents might.

Maybe we should ban stupid parents.

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CD, you bigmouth,
you started with your studies to proove everything you write, so post it or stop it.
You have made extensive researches and found no law or internet law governing fantasy content? Strange thing, I spend 5 minutes and found 3 laws against (Austria, Germany, Swiss) and one that allows fake kiddyporn (USA). Looks like you are nothing but a little liar with all your studies and researches.

"If we start stomping on every webmaster that has fantasy-only sites just because Heinz thinks it is bad, the what does that say about Heinz?"
I don't know what it says about me, but it says everything about webmasters posting this shit: if you post it, you promote it. There are no galleries saying: I post now pix, but it's not ok, so don't do it. If you post a gallery you say: That's the right thing, let's do it, happy masturbation.
Post a fake rape gallery or a fake kiddyporn gallery, most ppl will hit the back-button, but some will enjoy it, and they will understand your message that rape and kiddyporn are fine.

And because the master of researches seems to have a little problem how to use a search engine: Bonobos are apes, they are now considered to be the next relations to humans. And while chimpanzees solve their conflicts with violence and repression, bonobos solve their conflicts with sex, not only with heterosexual copulations but with heterosexual and homosexual masturbating too. That's the reason why the behaviour of bonobos is a standard argument in discussions about repressive sexual systems.

And Mika:
"As far as rape fantasy is concerned, IMO stories are ok, but not fake pics" - Give me a call when you are 18.

Heinz. No comment. Target your hatred somewhere else.

I like monkeys. Especially in black leather chaps. SPANK THAT MONKEY! http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif


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BITCH SLAPPIN' STUPID PEOPLE EVERYWHERE

Heinz, why do You think that fantasy rape in the internet actually has anything to do with real rape in life?

And have You ever seen FAKE child porn? Cause I dont get it - how can You fake 11 y.o. child having sex?

Is repeating yourself a sign of intelligence?

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Heinz, now you're just being a dipshit. Or maybe you're emulating a bonobos, I don't know.

Sadly, your conversation technique is sinking to a new low, and I've made my points 6 ways to next week, obviously with no effect where your concerned. You're now squirming and crying and attacking when you should be proving your theories. The reason for this is simple... you can't.

Get over it Heinz. If you're going to make such bold statements, be prepared to back them up next time.

Ummmm WHY fake something that is SO hurtful to the very gender that you expect sex from?

Arguing FOR this subject so as to cater to a handful of surfers that are already prone to this subject might very well BE encouraging them enough to commit the crime. So for a few doallrs to the pocket you are willing to even take a chance???

Argue the laws all you want. Its not illegal to shoot missiles at Mars either, but what might the results be if its done? We may never know those results. As far as faked CP? Seen it. The girls that look 15, that ARE 18 could very well encourage the peds to attack that 15 year old next door. But hey, thats not YOUR prob right? YOU just made some money, err used your legal right to show what the law said. Newsflash! I can't wait until the Feds get time to enforce the few laws they have that DO cover obscenity. Gone will be the so called fantasy murder-rape-beasty-severe bondage sites. More power to them! Insomuch as their dictating that a female isn't allowed to use a popbottle... well thats a lil more of an open subject that involves NO known laws that I am aware of. Tying IS a form of kidnap, animal IS a crime of nature (see necrophilia) murder-rape (even fantasy) IS femae degradation under US Fed laws. Want the laws? Look 'em up. Ignorance IS no excuse doncha know.

For you guys that think alot of women run around with that fantasy... I feel for you. Sorry that you were born with twisted brains or that maybe your Dad bounced you once too often. For others... I'll be the redhead in the back of the court cheering when the verdict comes down as GUILTY. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif

But get a clue... how many for how many females have responded in the negative here.

.

I hear ya. I just watched Terminator 2 and saw Arnold take over the CyberDyne building with all that heavy weaponry, and now I'm really motivated to go take over my first cybernetic research building. I've often thought of it... but seeing it, finally pushed me to a decision.



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BITCH SLAPPIN' STUPID PEOPLE EVERYWHERE

Originally posted by Gemini:
Ummmm WHY fake something that is SO hurtful to the very gender that you expect sex from?

For someone who seems pretty smart, this is a fairly ignorant question.

Arguing FOR this subject...

Hold on sister redhead. Where do you get the idea that anyone here is arguing FOR the concept of rape? I find the idea of rape to be utterly distasteful, as do I find the idea of killing someone in any way utterly distasteful. I also find those that use their own twist on arguments to further the cause of hindering free artistic expression to be just as distasteful, which you are now doing. When I run across a website or a movie that I find distasteful to me, I simply exercise my God-given right to not view it, and to go elsewhere. Weren't many of these points already made and dealt with on this thread? Not clearly enough for you I suppose.

so as to cater to a handful of surfers that are already prone to this subject might very well BE encouraging them enough to commit the crime.

Gee, again we should all be afraid of what "may very well be". Just as there are fantasy websites, so to are there scenes of rape & murder and violence on many many movies and TV shows. How far are you going to take this useless argument of yours?

So for a few doallrs to the pocket you are willing to even take a chance???

I don't see you shutting down your evil porn sites any time soon. They too may contribute to someone's delinquency, but life goes on, correct? Gem, you sound like the fantasy police here.

Argue the laws all you want. Its not illegal to shoot missiles at Mars either, but what might the results be if its done?

This type of analogy looks flashy on the surface, but anyone with a brain the size of a quarter-pounder with cheese will see through it as empty. Fact is, the laws are right now being stretched and twisted in ways you can't even imagine, all to suit the agenda of a FEW holier-than-thou moralists who actually want ALL of our sites off the internet. Please get a clue on this, I beg you. (wake the hell up)

We may never know those results. As far as faked CP? Seen it. The girls that look 15, that ARE 18 could very well encourage the peds to attack that 15 year old next door. But hey, thats not YOUR prob right?

Actually you're wrong here too. No, you're right about the faked CP and it's existance, but you're wrong about it not being my "prob." I've likely reported just as many CP sites as anyone here, for one thing. For another, if you were to make a movie containing sex with minors, and recruited 18 year-old girls and boys that looked younger to play the parts and depicted them in graphic sex scenes you'd likely get arrested anyway. All CP is illegal, and so is anything that implies CP including the hypothetical movie in this example.

BUT, including scenes of violence, rape or murder in a movie is not illegal if it's fantasy play-acting by consenting adults. If it wasn't legal, then you better go out and arrest Sharon Stone for her role in basic instinct, because that movie had it all baby. I've helped to amass a list a MILE long of movies that contain all that content and worse. All fantasy, all totally legal, yet my brother's movies containing similar f/x with NO sex are illegal? Now you know why we are suing on the grounds of selective prosecution for 10 million bucks.

I can't wait until the Feds get time to enforce the few laws they have that DO cover obscenity. Gone will be the so called fantasy murder-rape-beasty-severe bondage sites.

Believe what you want. The real facts are that the two precidents set in Canada covering this subject specifically say that movies (entertainment, websites too) that contain violence + sex in the EXTEME END OF THE SPECTRUM will almost always be in violation (illegal) but not always. That's from the Regina vs Butler decision. If you're talking about my brother's special f/x site, then this language doesn't apply, because there is no sex on that site, only simple nudity. The question then becomes Is simple nudity now considered to be extreme sex? Right there you are stretching a law to suit your own purpose and so are the cops.

The other precident is from R vs Sharpe, and it defines what is illegal as the law pertains to CP, and in this case simple nudity can in SOME cases be considered as sex, thus illegal. But again, only as it pertains to underage minors, <u>not</u> movies with consenting adults. Sorry, you're out of luck there too.

More power to them! Insomuch as their dictating that a female isn't allowed to use a popbottle... well thats a lil more of an open subject that involves NO known laws that I am aware of.

Yet there are people that want it banned and made illegal everywhere. Do you see how cheering on the proponents of censorship only shoots yourself in the foot in the long run?

Tying IS a form of kidnap

So you want all movies and sites where consenting adults are acting out these fantasies to be banned too? You should have been a cop Gem, you'd make a good one. What do you base the above statement on? If it's fantasy role-playing among consenting adults, what right do you have to go crapping on them? Who exactly do you think you are Gem? Why is it that YOUR opinion should be the right one here?


animal IS a crime of nature (see necrophilia)

What does bestiality (proper term, not "animal") have to do with necrophilia? Enlighten me officer Gem.
I agree however that bestiality should be illegal everywhere, because like CP it is not conducted by consenting adults.

murder-rape (even fantasy) IS femae degradation under US Fed laws.

Nope, not fantasy, sorry. For one thing, the FBI looked closely at my brother's site and deemed it to be legal under US law. For another thing, if your statement was true there would be thousands of movies of both big and small budgets pulled from circulation.

And, why is it only FEMALE degredation when there are also thousands of movies and sites that show scenes where men too are being shot, stabbed, impaled, tied up, tortured, degraded, and sodomized against their will etc etc etc but that get's not so much as a byline from you? Now why is that?

Want the laws? Look 'em up. Ignorance IS no excuse doncha know.

I have looked them up. I've been ready to present my defense to a real judge (not judge Gemini) for many months now. The holdup in our case is that the prosecution side is realizing slowly that they don't have the case they thought they did, so now they are negotiating with us to drop some of it. They have egg on their faces, and they have wasted taxpayer's money to the tune of a few million now, for nothing, and they've disrupted and crapped all over a lot of good people too. But that's no sweat off your back, right Gem?

For you guys that think alot of women run around with that fantasy... I feel for you.

Feel all you want. A good % of paying members at such sites ARE WOMEN, and not just any women either. From what I've seen in my limited travels through a few of these sites, many of the members are lawyers, doctors, politicians, retired cops, government officials, and many people in managerial positions. Surprise surprise how many people indulge their little private fantasies online and in the movie rental shops.

Sorry that you were born with twisted brains or that maybe your Dad bounced you once too often.

Yes, resort back to the smartass to drive your point forward, that'll win em over. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif
Good one Gem. I too am sorry, to see that such an intelligent woman as yourself is so utterly ignorant of what is right and wrong, so utterly blind to the fact that you are not only promoting censorship of free thought & expression but you are helping those that want to eventually wipe out our own part of the industry. (mainstream porn as it were). To me this makes no sense at all.

For others... I'll be the redhead in the back of the court cheering when the verdict comes down as GUILTY. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif

Yes, you've said this before luv. What will you be doing when the virdict is the opposite? I don't know about other cases, but we've all but won ours already, it's just a matter of getting through the process. Gem, you really should have been at some of the latest proceedings on this case. There is so much to this case that someone on the sidelines like you will never know Gem, and it's really sad that you have been so quick to condemn without all the facts. You of all people should know that in order to make an INFORMED decision about anything you need ALL the facts. Anything less is uncivilized, not to mention conjecture couched in ignorance.

Now, an intelligent person would come back here and admit that on some levels maybe they were wrong, and start finding out exactly what the real facts are before jumping to judgements. The question is, are you really intelligent, or are you merely pretending?

[This message has been edited by CDSmith (edited 09-30-2001).]

Sometimes Guys its good to "agree to disagree"
Like Tam, I am a Mom too. I think we "Moms" watch things a little closer than the normal person. My 3 year old mainly watches pbs. PBS is a non violent cartoon station, and learning channel. I never really thought about the actual violence that is in regular cartoons I grew up watching, until one day she was watching a cartoon with the chicken and a dog, In which the chicken spanked the dogs ass and hit him in the head with a hammer. She freaked out saying.. "Mommy, why that chicken hitting him". anyway,
If you ever notice on regular tv, the violence is there, you see rape, murder, psychos, ect ect. We were watching CNN last night and they showed a taliban woman getting executed, shot in the back of the head. You should of seen me explaing that one. I am real picky on my sites about the content I post. I dont like to post some one who is bound and penetrated at the same time. Anal sex scares me, because it is illegal in some states. Beastiality really freaks me out too. You see that on alot of sites also. I guess the bottom line is.. Its your site, you are responsible for what you post. Hopefully it is legal. Another thing that really bugs me is all this "Lolita" shit. I am constantly having sites like this trying to trade with me. I have banned two this week. oh and "Barely Legal" and "school girl" shhessh I am done now http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/smile.gif
Must be that full moon tonight...

Okay I know that this post is gonna get me in a lot of trouble ...but I just gotta add my 2 cents.

I was raped when I was 17.
But the really strange thing is that ever since it happened i actually do fantasise about being raped.
I Really get off on being scared out of my wits...it's not the rape that actually scares me - but whether or not I'm gonna get killed at the end of it.
Lately my big fantasy is being anally raped by a group of dirty wogs.

I know that sounds really sick and twisted and before anyone says anything YES! I have gone and seeked help - but apparently there is nothing wrong with me, and there are other women out there who feel the same way.

I'm not saying that rape is a good thing - by all means I think that those who commit it should be strung up by the balls.

But I just thought I would make the comment that some people do actually enjoy that sort of thing.

But then again some people wanna have sex with teddy bears ... so you tell me who's sick?

What is a group of dirty wogs?

Nice reply CD.

Heinz --

Here's one experts article on media violence and it's effects on kids: http://www.reason.com/sullum/012301.html

Dr. Neil Malamuth (we call him Malamouth) has been retained by the prosecution in our case to testify as to the "harm to society" angle, much like Gem and Heinz are insinuating here. Here is an article co-written by Dr. Malamuth that contradicts his own upcoming testimony:

Repeated Exposure to Violent and Nonviolent Pornography: Likelihood of Raping Ratings and Laboratory Aggression Against Women,
Neil M. Malamuth and Joseph Ceniti. In Aggressive Behavior, 12, 129-137. 1986.

"With respect to exposure effects, the results did not reveal that repeated exposure to violent or nonviolent pornography had any significant effect on laboratory aggression against women. These findings appear to be inconsistent with previous data showing that exposure to violent pornography may increase males' laboratory aggression toward women (e.g., Donnerstein, 1980a,b; 1984; Donnerstein and Berkowitz, 1981; Malamuth, 1978). The most apparent explanation for this discrepancy is that earlier investigations examined immediate effects (i.e., in same session that exposures were presented) whereas the present experiment tested for relatively long-term effects. It may be that exposure to violent pornography might have an immediate impact on aggressive behavior against women but this effect may dissipate quickly over time."

The asshole just contradicted himself. Here is the link to their entire study: http://www.apa.org/divisions/div46/MalamuthCeniti.html

I have many more such links to studies and official documents in our defense package. It take time to dig them out though. Now Hienz old boy, about your "Lier" comments....

Here's another example:
Sexuality on the Internet: From Sexual Exploration to Pathological Expression, Alvin Cooper, Coralie R. Scherer, Sylvain C. Boies, and Barry L. Gordon, American Psychological Association Journal, April 1999.

"In the media's portrayal-and therefore the public's perception-the sexual dimension of the Internet is likened to the sirens of mythology, an irresistible and corrupting force which lures "netizens" to the rocks. These are compelling images, but alas, like the sirens themselves, they are more fantasy than reality. Instead, this study found, and clinicians need to be aware, that most persons (92%) who go on-line for sexual pursuits do not spend excessive amounts of time at it and report very little interference in their lives."

Here's another one:
Sexually Explicit and Violent Media Material: research and policy implications, Compiled and written by Paul Wilson and Stephen Nugent. Trends & Issues in Criminal Justice No.9, Australian Institute of Criminology, December 1987

"A Joint Select committee of the Federal Parliament, under the chairmanship of Dr Richard Klugman, currently is considering the effects of video material upon Australian society. The Committee received a submission from the Australian Institute of Criminology reviewing the current status of international research on the impact of sexually explicit and violent behaviour.
The Institute submission contends that research presents some dilemmas for policy makers. On the one hand, there appears to be no sustainable research evidence of a causative link between media violence and violent criminal events. More particularly, a direct association between exposure to sexually violent media material and sexually aggressive behaviour has yet to be proven."

Want more? I got more. Anytime Heinz. Any fucking time.

1. CD - You're basicly right in all You say it's just the form which is very wrong. From my humble opinion when You speak with woman and speak about rape , be it just fantasy rape site, I dont think You should really stress anyone. I do understand that You are RIGHT and they are wrong but You're on the wrong foot here. Protecting the free speech and Your right or anyone's right to have ANY fantasy You have as long as it does no hurt anyone is correct but insulting anyone in any form because they dont understand is wrong. I myself cant blame anyone for not understanding that there's nothing bad in rape fantasy.

No offense though. Just my point of view.

2. Gem. You're making an obvious mistake here. Think about it this way - is there's really so much difference between rape fantasy and just the usuall porn? You tell us that You dont want to take chances that a sick man will look on those pics then go out on the street and rape anyone. Right? Well how do You take chances then that he wont do it just by being excited by normal porn?

In fact there are so many sick people out there that if I were You with Your view of life I'd never touch porn at all. Because porn gives SEXUAL EXCITEMENT being a huge natural stimulator thus how can You guarantee that various sick fucks like rapists , pedophiles (!) or simply unstable people will not suddenly burst in different crimes killing, kidnapping and raping everyone in sight just because they saw a nice teen girl in a cheerleader outfit sucking a black cock?!

Also You say You'd be the one sitting in the back of the court room cheering? Just like those witchcraft courts You had couple of hundred years ago I think...there were also a lot of people in the back of courts cheering.

Also You dont get how a female may like rape fantasy? Well. I dont get how MALES can like ... BDSM ...how they like SCAT ...but me being 22 years old I still cant get how they like MATURE niche at all... Who the fuck can be excited by 50 year old woman?!?

And of course I also dont understang GAYS at all. Fuck - they are disgusting to me.

Unfortunately it doesnt make them immoral or illegal.

The only real problem with rape fantasy is it's name. Remove it and suddenly You aint got no problem at all. Anyone of You.

3.Kit - I'll repeat. In my humble opinion fantasy rape like those pics or stories are very very different from real life rape. In fact I have a strong feeling that noone was ever raped from those who look through those sites and enjoy them and those who make it.

Just my point of view.

This one's for the censorship nuts:

Bottom line here is, you can rant and rave 'til the fuckin' sheep come home, but you're never going to be able to DICTATE what people THINK about. ("think" being an appropriate replacement for "fantasize") Whether you want it to be right or wrong, whether you pass a million laws about it or not.... you can never force someone to NOT think about whatever the hell they want to, short of killing that person.

Hence, I submit... if it can be thought of.... there will always be a demnd for it. And as long as there is a demand for it, there will be a supplier. Provided that supplier is not performing illegal acts, there is not a FUCKING thing you can do about it. It's business. I don't like Amway salesmen, but we don't ban them, do we? And you are going to argue that Amway salesmen are not comparable to fantasy rape pics, but they are. Those fuckers are scary.

So summing up here... I can't tell you what you can THINK about anymore than you can tell me what I must THINK about. And as long as someone is asking... someone will be providing. And it doesn't have a fucking thing to do with whether or not you like it, endorse it, agree with it, fight against it, cry over it, send sad emails about it to your whole family, or sleep on your fucking congressman's doorstep with a big yellow sign and a button on your hat. If it's illegal, they will be eventually busted and do time for it. If not.... leave them the fuck alone. And the next time you get up on a big fucking horse to go on a power trip, remember... I don't care how fuckin' great your Amway products are.

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BITCH SLAPPIN' STUPID PEOPLE EVERYWHERE

[This message has been edited by Amputate Your Head (edited 10-01-2001).]

Why don't they go ahead and ban Nabokov's Lolita or Kubrick's Clockwork Orange, too. Both classics...

Btw, still looking forward to my 18th birthday. Or was it already? Shit I dont remember, maybe I was too drunk.

Well, I live on the housing estate where Clockwork Orange was filmed. I go through the garages where they hung out almost every day (scary place).

You may not be aware but in the UK Kubrick self banned the film. There are varying reasons but one of them was his concern because people were copying the things they saw in the film.

It was only after his death that it was able to be shown in the UK. It was such a big deal that they rereleased it and showed it in the big cinemas.

Just a FYI.

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"The real facts are that the two precidents set in Canada covering this subject specifically "

I could care less about Canadian law... OMG they even think they can cause the US probs if we seal our borders. lol We have to work with OUR laws since we live here.

The FBI is not the court system and THEY do not decide which cases can be tried. They only try and work with the laws as each agent can interpret them.

Our law states 'implied' - same as fantasy under the few precedents set so far.

For Incognito... we were late in the witch trials. Europe had them all well before the US did. http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/wink.gif

I may not have worded my thoughts the best way on this and by no means am trying to be the 'Cop' here. But we DO need to draw a line someplace. Why not leave the things that bother half of the population on the wrong side of the line? Is it because you CAN do it? Power trip? Or is the real bottom line that you will make money.... Yet 90% of the ones saying its ok will rail at a tgp gallery with one banner and 50 hi rez pics on terra. What IS the difference? You either have ethics or you don't.

And trying to qualify the Internet as a staged production from a real movie company is 1) not precedented and 2) hah hah (simpsons kid laff)

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BITCH SLAPPIN' STUPID PEOPLE EVERYWHERE

thought you were going to go kick some unarmed goat herder tail? Oh thats right! You won't go unless a woman goes with you to show HER guts. Coward. How about we just nuke them? Is it starting to hurt slapping yourself so much?

------------------------


But I did think this thread was for us to post our thoughts on the subject... Not have other twisted minds ram their beliefs down our throats. I would take heed to the negativity of the female posts unless you truly ARE just doing it for the $$$. If thats the case then no one will reach thru.

And to your knowledge, did the level of violence, rapes and murders go up in society because of it?


Incognito -- I take a stronger "tone" with Gem because she has viciously attacked me out of the blue once before over a similar issue to do with my brother's website that shows short video clips from larget movies containing his brand of special f/x in murder scenes. He produces bullet hits, arrow impacts and stabbing scenes, all the effects are done on his computer with software, and he's one of only a handful of guys in the world that can do those f/x to the level of realism that he does. Gem and a few others hate it because in his films he uses only women. Women in combat with each other, women in scenes where they are being double-crossed by ex-husband, women (characters) that have become a liability to the mob thus they are "taken out" by a hit-man etc. etc. The script list is endless, but it's all fantasy. Gem and her crew only see it as violence against women though, so she seems to want to attack me at every opportunity when I speak up for the cause of anti-censorship.

I should also add in here that a few local cops that are members of an extremely fundamentalist church have taken it upon themselves to arrest my brother and me for obsenity last year, directly to do with his website. They found themselves a hired gun feminist lawyer from Toronto and they have blabbed a lot of untruths about us to the media, which a lot of people like Gem seem to buy into without fleshing out the real truth.

That is why I pull no punches where these issues are concerned. Fact is, if her and her cohorts were to meet me and find out what I'm really like, I'm sure they'd feel differently, but in her mind I'm already convicted. Wishful thinking. Another fact is that although I've watched a good deal of violence in my life in cartoons, books, tv and movies, if I were to see a real rape occuring I would kick the guy's ass from here to Minot North Dakota, and I would help the lady in any way possible. I'm saying this because I'm no different than you in that I don't like my character assassinated.

I hope that clears things up some.
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I could care less about Canadian law...

No, actually you could care less about the truth Gem. Face it, you've been a hardass bitch to me lately, because you don't want to face the truth or even acknowledge it.

And trying to qualify the Internet as a staged production from a real movie company is 1) not precedented

Sorry, but again you're wrong. The internet contains movie-trailer sites to the tune of thousands in numbers, and many small movie companies are now internet-based. You're just sqirming here, again struggling against the truth.

and 2) hah hah (simpsons kid laff)

Sadly, this is all I really expect from you anyway lately. Out comes the smartass when others disagree with you. (or challenge your opinion)

Not have other twisted minds ram their beliefs down our throats.

"Other" twisted minds? You mean you're admitting that your mind is twisted as well? Okay you surprised me on this one Gem. LOL

Again, people with opinions that are in phase varience to your own have "twisted" minds, right? I'm not ramming anything down anyone's throat Gem, I'm merely exercising MY right to voice MY opinion here too. My mind is anything but twisted, contrary to your opinion which seems rather narrow & closed-minded at the moment.

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[This message has been edited by CDSmith (edited 10-01-2001).]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by CDSmith:
And to your knowledge, did the level of violence, rapes and murders go up in society because of it?

Actually I wasn't even attempting to debate that with my reply. I was just pointing out to the previous poster that what he was using as a far fetched idea had already happened.

The difference between UK society from when Clockwork Orange first was released and today is so vast that you can't really do a proper study. When Clockwork came out it was truly shocking. Mostly do to the violence and rape for fun aspects. People did go out and try to emulate what they saw on the screeen. Not everyone of course but some did and that is why the creator took the decission. Which I think it relevant to this thread.

In todays world, when it was rerelease we are desenitised to violence on the screen to a large degree. There aren't huge expolsions in Clockwork so it was adults who went to see it..not the general movie going public.



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CDSmith:
Hm...point taken.

My idea is that FEMINISM is even worse than rape - cause it's so fucking stupid and as it always is with such shit someone just makes their bucks out of it by using dumb people.

As for the discussion I will continue to stress on the fact that sick people are sick people and no rape fantasy can motivate them or make normal people sick and for normal people internet fantasies, just as books in many ways and videos does not do any harm at all cause such is human nature.

*Muffles a scream because she can't believe she just read that*


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Hot tropical Babe,

"A group of dirty wogs" =

In Oz we call anyone who is from a medditerranean country (and sometimes the middle east) a wog.
However when people say 'wog' they are usually reffering to either Italians or Greeks.


I don't know how or why the tem 'dirty wog' came about - I'm not sure if it has a sexual meaning or if it just reffering to the hygeine of ethnics in general (however unjustified it may be).

I hope I haven't offended anyone with this comment - but most wogs don't seeem to care...i call my man (who is greek) a dirty wog all the time - he even calls himself and his mates dirty wogs so...

hope that clears it up for you

--- www.sexcontents.com - See lovely young girls getting fucked by dirty wogs

That cleared it up ,, Thanks

I'm feeling a bit woggish myself this evening. Just got my final check for excess money in my retirement fund (from my former job that I quit nearly 2 years ago), and I just sold a pile of content for a pile of moolah.

I think I'll sip some cold wine, have a hot shower to wash the dirty woggishness off, and then dream about being raped by a handful of you lovely webmistresses http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif (if that's okay, you know, a man having fantasies of being raped by 4 women) LOL
(I could play-act that I was unwilling)

ROFL!!!!!!!

Ahem....okay, sorry, more wine needed here.
hee heee

...can I be in on that???? :P

CD, why don't you change your sig? How about something like: "I have trouble with the canadian justice, and as soon as I hear something that could be censorship, I shut down my brain."

"If someone's prone to committing real rape or any real crime, other studies have shown .....". That is what I want to see. Show these studies, that came to the result that sick ppl calm down looking to fake rape pix. And you posted again studies that have absolutly nothing to do with this question. It has something to do with your problems with the canadian justice, but that's all. Non of your studies has anything to do with ppl with schizophrenia or psychosis or any other brain damage.

And that's why I call you low, CD. In the whole thread I can't find any post, that stated that violence or sex or both has negative impacts to mental sane ppl. But the whole time you are acting as if I would do so, and this with the additude of the last defender of the freedom. Low, CD, no arguments, only low style.
(When I have nothing better to do, I will post tomorrow why Donnersteins studies are bullshit)

AMP: You are a little bit confusing the last two days. After my posts about ppl with schizophrenia or another psychosis, you post about your own experiences. Do you feel concerned if I'm writing about sickos?

And at last a hint to ppl with problems to read a post: here is only one person talking about censorship for fantasys in our heads. The rest of the thread is about pictures or movies with simulated rape. And in on of my posts I wrote about drawings of kiddyporn, and in the next message I used the term "fake kiddyporn" for this. Do you think it should be allowed? In the USA it's allowed, in some other countries not. And you can go one step further: if you know how to handle photoshop or something similar, you can create pictures that have nothing to do with a real person, but that show kiddyporn.So you can have kiddyporn without a victim - should this be allowed?

I honestly never saw you as such a fucking whiner Heinz. I never made any such claim about studies of effects on people with mental dysfunctions. What is your whole point again exactly? That we should remove 1000's of sites from the net because of Heinz's fear that mentally disturbed people MIGHT be encouraged by them to do harm?

Your whole argument is completely inane buddy. Your new law according to Heinz would again have to extend to movies and other media such as TV. Why? Because psycotics may be watching "Hannibal" or "Silence of the Lambs" or Scream 1-3 or Friday the 13th 1-400 or WHATEVER. Hell, the Rocky series of movies is pretty violent, better yank them too! Duhh

And Heinz, up until now I've never seen you as the type that is quick to insult and attack when your opinion is challenged. Get over it, get over yourself and get on with your life.

Can you do that? Thanks pal http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif
Are we still friends? C'mon, gimme a kiss!! Okay a hug at LEAST http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif http://bbs.gofuckyourself.net/board/biggrin.gif
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The problem isnt with people having fantasies. People can sit and fantasize about rapin a fuckin dog for all I care. But when its placed on the net, or anywhere that others (and especially children) are able to see it, then it must be stopped. I dont care if its real or fake, if it is accessible by the public then it needs to be removed, that simple.

Than what the fuck You do porn for? Or do You think normal porn wont hurt children if they see it? Say in age of 12?

Now I am tired of this bullshit too.
It's as simple as that - SICK person is SICK person and OFFENSIVE materials dont make NORMAL people sick in no way.
That is why we have VIOLENCE AND SEX all over books, tv's and newspapers.

Unlike RAPE fantasies or anything by the way CP is not just offensive it is a crime already done because it has got REAL VICTIMS in it.
And that's it. What is so fucking difficult?

Better take your own sites down then, because by the same token I don't give a shit weather your site is real or fantasy either. If you have naked people on your site, then your site is harmful shit and needs to be destroyed, and the person that made it must be labelled as a sick fuck.

Where do you draw the fucking line boyo?
I recommend you take a mittful of Tylenols and bang your fucking head against a wall as hard as you can for an hour straight. Let me know if it knocks any sense into you.

You know, it bothers me that people come onto a thread this size, they don't read any of the fucking posts beyond the first few, then they shoot their all-knowing opinion out there and proclaim the way it ought to be. Meanwhile, people have already addressed your lame shit opinion 40 posts back, but you don't have the time to actually read what was said (yet you have the time to squawk your bullshite right?).

If you're going to puke your opinion out here, at least take the time to read the discussion. It's the human thing to do. Squawking your slanted misinformed opinion without all the facts is what a dumbass does. Ask yourself before you post..."am I a dumbass?"
If the answer is "yes", then maybe you best keep your fat mouth shut. Maybe. Otherwise take your chances and look like an idiot.

Remember the old saying Rivux.... "It is better to keep silent and be thought of as a fool, than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt"

Ponder that before you answer.

Why am I so pissed at your lame stupid remarks? Because it isn't up to me to babysit your brat kids, it's YOUR responsibilty as a parent to keep them safe. I have disclaimers and links to screening services on all my sites, do you? After that it is up to parents to watch the kids. It is up to the parents to keep their brats away from adult sites. To think any differently is to agree with A_ss_c_r_o_f_t. Do you WANT all adult sites removed? No? Then rethink your position.