Let's talk about a philosophical subject here... - GoFuckYourself.com

09-20-2004, 01:42 PM

What is "Truth"?

discuss...

try to make this as serious as possible, as I will be taking it quite seriously myself

OzMan · 09-20-2004, 01:43 PM

liar

09-20-2004, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by OzMan
liar

well so much for the "serious" part

Serge Litehead · 09-20-2004, 01:45 PM

thruth usually butnaked ugly...

how deep you want to dig in to it?

09-20-2004, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by holograph
thruth usually butnaked ugly...

how deep you want to dig in to it?

as deep as you wish

Doctor Dre · 09-20-2004, 02:12 PM

Truth is your version of reality that addapt the most to the current situation ... how you see things :P

There is different truth for everybody

09-20-2004, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Doctor Dre
Truth is your version of reality that addapt the most to the current situation ... how you see things :P

There is different truth for everybody

then how can you possibly call it truth?

isin't truth supposed to be "ABSOLUTE" ? how can perception and opinion be truth?

polish_aristocrat · 09-20-2004, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
as deep as you wish

Said Juicy to MrIzzz

abyss_al · 09-20-2004, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
then how can you possibly call it truth?

isin't truth supposed to be "ABSOLUTE" ? how can perception and opinion be truth?

how can it be 'absolute' when its in the eyes of the beholder.... truth noadays is both opinionated and what makes you feel right.... IMO using religion to tell it is sad

Phoenix · 09-20-2004, 02:23 PM

what is truth?

hmm..this is some deep stuff

a truth is something that denotes the validity between a proposition and what it represents

i quote J.L. Austin here

"to assert that a proposition p is true is to maintain that "p corresponds to the facts""

block · 09-20-2004, 02:25 PM

Truth is an interpretation of an reality... so some crazy guy could be telling the truth, but it could be completely wrong

09-20-2004, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by abyss_al
how can it be 'absolute' when its in the eyes of the beholder.... truth noadays is both opinionated and what makes you feel right.... IMO using religion to tell it is sad

incorrect

truth is NOT in the eye of the beholder
that's why there is difference between the words "truth" and "opinion"

truth is absolute

many of us may not know what the truth is. but the "truth is out there"

jade_dragon · 09-20-2004, 02:29 PM

Truth is the masses ideals of what is and what is not right or correct based upon its laws explaining the world around us. Truth is subject to change based upon new facts or information given or taken away from society.

09-20-2004, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jade_dragon
Truth is the masses ideals of what is and what is not right or correct based upon its laws explaining the world around us. Truth is subject to change based upon new facts or information given or taken away from society.

that can't be!

TRUTH is 100%, that's why its called truth

truth is the thing that is ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN, NEVER TO CHANGE with time!

if I am wrong, plz tell me the word that describes what I am saying

abyss_al · 09-20-2004, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
incorrect

truth is NOT in the eye of the beholder
that's why there is difference between the words "truth" and "opinion"

truth is absolute

many of us may not know what the truth is. but the "truth is out there"

not necessarily.... telling something to someone... only person who trully knows its true or not is the person telling it... so in many cases it is in the eye of the beholder

09-20-2004, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by abyss_al
not necessarily.... telling something to someone... only person who trully knows its true or not is the person telling it... so in many cases it is in the eye of the beholder

that's why it's not "truth", but "opinion" or "what they believe to be the truth"

abyss_al · 09-20-2004, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
that's why it's not "truth", but "opinion" or "what they believe to be the truth"

so if its what they believe its truth..then its truth.... if you believe a persons opinion about something is right then its truth, whether he lied or not... theres no way to judge otherwise

alexg · 09-20-2004, 02:35 PM

truth is facts as they happen from an objective point of view.

09-20-2004, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by abyss_al
so if its what they believe its truth..then its truth.... if you believe a persons opinion about something is right then its truth, whether he lied or not... theres no way to judge otherwise

in that case, would you agree with me that it's "their belief of the truth" and NOT "truth" itself?

how can there be many truths? it doesn't work that way

Ironhorse · 09-20-2004, 02:36 PM

What? Nothing about shoes yet? WTF..

vas · 09-20-2004, 02:39 PM

truth ( P ) Pronunciation Key (trth)
n. pl. truths (trthz, trths)
1. Conformity to fact or actuality.
2. A statement proven to be or accepted as true.
3. Sincerity; integrity.
4. Fidelity to an original or standard.

Reality; actuality.
often Truth That which is considered to be the supreme reality and to have the ultimate meaning and value of existence.

according to webster anyway ;p

abyss_al · 09-20-2004, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
in that case, would you agree with me that it's "their belief of the truth" and NOT "truth" itself?

how can there be many truths? it doesn't work that way

thats all that counts.... its what you believe and makes you happy...not the opinion of someone else telling you your truth is not 'the truth'..... yes, there are million variations to truth

maxdaname · 09-20-2004, 02:41 PM

There's no such thing as the truth!

Everything that comes out of your mouth always has a lie in it!

psili · 09-20-2004, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vas
truth ( P ) Pronunciation Key (trth)
n. pl. truths (trthz, trths)
1. Conformity to fact or actuality.
2. A statement proven to be or accepted as true.
3. Sincerity; integrity.
4. Fidelity to an original or standard.

Reality; actuality.
often Truth That which is considered to be the supreme reality and to have the ultimate meaning and value of existence.

according to webster anyway ;p

Number 2 -- Like the rest of "life", "reality", etc, "Truth" is merely something that a group agrees upon. That's why there are so many versions of "Truth" because not all groups have reached the same agreement.

Tala · 09-20-2004, 02:43 PM

YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!

(sorry)

09-20-2004, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by psili
Number 2 -- Like the rest of "life", "reality", etc, "Truth" is merely something that a group agrees upon. That's why there are so many versions of "Truth" because not all groups have reached the same agreement.

Reality; actuality.
often Truth That which is considered to be the supreme reality and to have the ultimate meaning and value of existence.

the SUPREME reality

how can there be different kinds of supreme, eternal reality?

psili · 09-20-2004, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
Reality; actuality.
often Truth That which is considered to be the supreme reality and to have the ultimate meaning and value of existence.

the SUPREME reality

how can there be different kinds of supreme, eternal reality?

If you can get every single human on the planet to agree to a Supreme reality, then you will have it. Until then, there is only group opinion. -- My statement is only an opinion, however and essentially means nothing.

Basic_man · 09-20-2004, 02:52 PM

When you don't cheat on your wife :D

09-20-2004, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by psili
If you can get every single human on the planet to agree to a Supreme reality, then you will have it. Until then, there is only group opinion.

no, back in the day ppl thought the earth was flat

everybody thought so

but was that the TRUTH?!?

the ULTIMATE TRUTH?
the ETERNAL TRUTH?

that would never be questionned or challeneged?

THAT is truth... the supreme reality of things

everything else is just human perception, human opinion, what each human BELIEVES to be the truth, but it NOT the truth itself!

there is a line between TRUTH and what ppl believe to be the truth...

I am talking about ULTIMATE truth here

psili · 09-20-2004, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
no, back in the day ppl thought the earth was flat

everybody thought so

but was that the TRUTH?!?

the ULTIMATE TRUTH?
the ETERNAL TRUTH?

that would never be questionned or challeneged?

THAT is truth... the supreme reality of things

everything else is just human perception, human opinion, what each human BELIEVES to be the truth, but it NOT the truth itself!

there is a line between TRUTH and what ppl believe to be the truth...

I am talking about ULTIMATE truth here

You'd think there must have been some doubt to that "Truth" if someone was going to test it validity. If there was doubt to that "truth", then is it "absolute"?

ParasiteTV · 09-20-2004, 02:56 PM

Interesting question.

I will have to say that there cannot be truth as in absolute.

Years ago it was 'true' that the world was flat.

I think that truth is a common collective, untill the knowledge of that common collective changes.

edit: oops, the guy above me said it first, heh.

09-20-2004, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by psili
You'd think there must have been some doubt to that "Truth" if someone was going to test it validity. If there was doubt to that "truth", then is it "absolute"?

of course not

that's why I say, truth is a very hard thing to grasp

the truth could be out there, but NONE of us could know it

take the matrix for example... the TRUTH was that that wasn't the real world ppl were living in, only an illusion...

but the truth was out there, nobody knew it

as for my opinion, I believe the ONLY thing to be true (that we know of) are math and numbers, no matter what you do, no matter how hard you try, you can never challenge numbers, for they are eternal

psili · 09-20-2004, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
of course not

that's why I say, truth is a very hard thing to grasp

the truth could be out there, but NONE of us could know it

take the matrix for example... the TRUTH was that that wasn't the real world ppl were living in, only an illusion...

but the truth was out there, nobody knew it

as for my opinion, I believe the ONLY thing to be true (that we know of) are math and numbers, no matter what you do, no matter how hard you try, you can never challenge numbers, for they are eternal

Great point. I think you nailed it on the head when you said we can't grasp the truth.

In regard to numbers, we were taught that 2 + 2 = 4. Granted, I'm not going to refute that, because I agree with it. Is that to say some tribe in the bumb-fuck Amazon who hold True that 2 + 2 = red are wrong ? Do they not have Truth in that only because we agree they are wrong?

psili · 09-20-2004, 03:05 PM

Anyway, I gotta bail. I totally see your point in that there must be an absolute truth out there. What that is, I don't know.

abyss_al · 09-20-2004, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
of course not

that's why I say, truth is a very hard thing to grasp

the truth could be out there, but NONE of us could know it

take the matrix for example... the TRUTH was that that wasn't the real world ppl were living in, only an illusion...

but the truth was out there, nobody knew it

as for my opinion, I believe the ONLY thing to be true (that we know of) are math and numbers, no matter what you do, no matter how hard you try, you can never challenge numbers, for they are eternal

its the only language in which this world communicates in without problem

09-20-2004, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by psili
Great point. I think you nailed it on the head when you said we can't grasp the truth.

In regard to numbers, we were taught that 2 + 2 = 4. Granted, I'm not going to refute that, because I agree with it. Is that to say some tribe in the bumb-fuck Amazon who hold True that 2 + 2 = red are wrong ? Do they not have Truth in that only because we agree they are wrong?

but " 2 + 2 = RED " is no longer reffering to "only number" but to "human perception" (the color red), all of human perception CANNOT be trusted and is therefore question to opinion!

I may be wrong when I say that the only true thing in the world is math (that is, of course, my OPINION and not the truth about the world

)

and maybe there IS no absolutely truth in this world? maybe ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING, including numbers, are CONSTANTLY CHANGING, NEVER to be eternal, therefore never question to "ultimate truth"

As a great philosopher once said "The only thing we truly know is that we do not know anything"

psili · 09-20-2004, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf

As a great philosopher once said "The only thing we truly know is that we do not know anything"

Probably the best words in the thread so far.

Ironhorse · 09-20-2004, 03:07 PM

Here's the real truth. There is no such thing. Truth is based on perspective.

09-20-2004, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by psili
Anyway, I gotta bail. I totally see your point in that there must be an absolute truth out there. What that is, I don't know.

there may or may not be an absolute truth...

personally, I find the comfort of truth in mathematics, and pure mathematics... NOT science (because science is based on observations which may be fraudulent to human beings)

I just believe that the "truth" should be reffered to absolute truth and not the "truth in each of us" because there IS a "truth in each of us", and that is what we call opinion

very nice discussing with you, I'll continue this with Al for now

jade_dragon · 09-20-2004, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
that can't be!

TRUTH is 100%, that's why its called truth

truth is the thing that is ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN, NEVER TO CHANGE with time!

if I am wrong, plz tell me the word that describes what I am saying

Yes and no......

Wrong for truth only exists within the minds of those who will listen to what others they feel have a valid way of looking at something. Truth like time only exists as a way man lables something. The word you are looking for is PROVEN FACT and even that one can change with new information. People's idea of truth can not be validated by life as there is always someone or something that will challange an ideal and there always is the .0000000001 chance a TRUTH could be changed into misinformed or wrong. So there may be truths as most people think but that can never truly be guaged philosophically by people within this world as we will die never having proved or disproved because "time" marches on. Good paradox you have brought to the boards. There is not "TRUTHFUL" answer to your question as anything can be questioned and possibly disproved here or in the future with more info.

09-20-2004, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ironhorse
Here's the real truth. There is no such thing. Truth is based on perspective.

that's where it is my opinion that you are wrong. Although there may not BE an ultimate truth, truth CANNOT be based on perspective, as perspective is RELEVANT to each human being, varying from 1 human to another, from 1 animal to another, from 1 (spirit?) to another... how can that be called truth?

09-20-2004, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jade_dragon
Yes and no......

Wrong for truth only exists within the minds of those who will listen to what others they feel have a valid way of looking at something. Truth like time only exists as a way man lables something. The word you are looking for is PROVEN FACT and even that one can change with new information. People's idea of truth can not be validated by life as there is always someone or something that will challange an ideal and there always is the .0000000001 chance a TRUTH could be changed into misinformed or wrong. So there may be truths as most people think but that can never truly be guaged philosophically by people within this world as we will die never having proved or disproved because "time" marches on. Good paradox you have brought to the boards. There is not "TRUTHFUL" answer to your question as anything can be questioned and possibly disproved here or in the future with more info.

very nice response, I enjoyed reading it...

but that's why I say, anything can be questionned, and we may NOT have ANY IDEA WHAT SO EVER what the truth really is, but don't you think that there is an ultimate truth somewhere? That is never to be questionned and such?

(I am not religious, but let's say GOD existed...)
I don't believe in God, you may not believe in God, but let's say GOD DOES exist and is the truth behind it all, then what will our "definition" of truth be? would it not be god? or will you keep on saying that truth is between each of us?

I don't believe in god, but god DOES EXIST (let's say), me saying that god doesn't exist (and I believe it), is that truth? I highly doubt it, because the ABSOLUTE ETERNAL FACT is that god does exist and no matter what anybody says, that is the way it is

this was just an example of course, but I believe it describes pretty well what I meant

galleryseek · 09-20-2004, 03:16 PM

Allow me to put an end to this.

There is no such thing as true and genuine truth as long as we do not know the TRUTH, reasoning, and/or basis of our existance. As long as there is speculation about our origins and how everything was created, there is not a single absolute truth in the world.

Basic fundamental math, is not absolute truth. 1+1=2 is not absolute.

And because we do not know the basis of our origins, the only "truth" we can have are merely assumptions based on a collective understanding and comprehension of the world we live in.

MakeMeGrrrrowl · 09-20-2004, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf

truth is the thing that is ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN, NEVER TO CHANGE with time!

if I am wrong, plz tell me the word that describes what I am saying

The truth can change with time. The truth is, I am alive today, but that might not be the truth tomorrow.

09-20-2004, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by galleryseek
Allow me to put an end to this.

There is no such thing as true and genuine truth as long as we do not know the TRUTH, reasoning, and/or basis of our existance. As long as there is speculation about our origins and how everything was created, there is not a single absolute truth in the world.

Basic fundamental math, is not absolute truth. 1+1=2 is not absolute.

And because we do not know the basis of our origins, the only "truth" we can have are merely assumptions based on a collective understanding and comprehension of the world we live in.

so you are saying there is NO SUCH THING as truth? that there is nothing "behind the scenes" that is absolute and eternal?

I would respect that opinion, since the only thing seperating you and me are mathematics

but I just don't like the idea that "truth is relative"

09-20-2004, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MakeMeGrrrrowl
The truth can change with time. The truth is, I am alive today, but that might not be the truth tomorrow.

how do you know you are ALIVE?

what if it is an ongowing dream soon to be put to an end?

abyss_al · 09-20-2004, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
how do you know you are ALIVE?

what if it is an ongowing dream soon to be put to an end?

ahh...you just remionded me of a great movie you have to see... give me a few..let me remember the name

galleryseek · 09-20-2004, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bdjuf
so you are saying there is NO SUCH THING as truth? that there is nothing "behind the scenes" that is absolute and eternal?

I would respect that opinion, since the only thing seperating you and me are mathematics

but I just don't like the idea that "truth is relative"

Yes I'm saying as of now, there is no such thing as truth (or proven fact) until we have discovered the key to our existance (Whether this be a god or not, it does not matter).

Once we have discovered that key, then there will be truth. There is an absolute truth out there, we just don't know it yet, and we can only speculate until that time occurs, if it ever does.

09-20-2004, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by abyss_al
ahh...you just remionded me of a great movie you have to see... give me a few..let me remember the name

The Truman Show?

09-20-2004, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by galleryseek
Yes I'm saying as of now, there is no such thing as truth (or proven fact) until we have discovered the key to our existance (Whether this be a god or not, it does not matter).

Once we have discovered that key, then there will be truth. There is an absolute truth out there, we just don't know it yet, and we can only speculate until that time occurs, if it ever does.

so in your opinion, there is no truth without it being discovered?
there is no truth that exists wether we like it or not?

why will it be truth after discovery, and not before? since it was "present" throughout both phases?

09-20-2004, 01:42 PM	#1
buddyjuf Guest Posts: n/a	Let's talk about a philosophical subject here... What is "Truth"? discuss... try to make this as serious as possible, as I will be taking it quite seriously myself

09-20-2004, 01:45 PM	#4
Serge Litehead Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Behind the scenes Posts: 5,190	thruth usually butnaked ugly... how deep you want to dig in to it? __________________ SilverCrocodile.com Adult web design since '05

09-20-2004, 02:23 PM	#10
Phoenix BACON BACON BACON Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Poems everybody, the laddie fancies himself a poet Posts: 35,470	what is truth? hmm..this is some deep stuff a truth is something that denotes the validity between a proposition and what it represents i quote J.L. Austin here "to assert that a proposition p is true is to maintain that "p corresponds to the facts"" __________________ Skype Phoenixskype1 Telegram PhoenixBrad https://quantads.io Last edited by Phoenix; 09-20-2004 at 02:24 PM..

09-20-2004, 02:25 PM	#11
block Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Winnipeg, Canada - cough check sig cough Posts: 1,258	Truth is an interpretation of an reality... so some crazy guy could be telling the truth, but it could be completely wrong __________________ ICQ - 19961769

09-20-2004, 02:29 PM	#13
jade_dragon Confirmed User Join Date: May 2004 Location: NEW ORLEANS/Baton Rouge BABY! Posts: 1,737	Truth is the masses ideals of what is and what is not right or correct based upon its laws explaining the world around us. Truth is subject to change based upon new facts or information given or taken away from society. __________________ even ADULTS need TOYS icq: 3 6 3 2 6 6 6 7 \| aim: conglomorateman open for business, affiliates and friendships

09-20-2004, 01:43 PM	#2
OzMan Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Los Begas Posts: 9,162	liar

09-20-2004, 02:35 PM	#18
alexg IL4L.com Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Israel - ICQ: 162136565 Posts: 11,287	truth is facts as they happen from an objective point of view. __________________ Find fuck buddies in your area!

09-20-2004, 02:36 PM	#20
Ironhorse Pixel Pusher Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 7,094	What? Nothing about shoes yet? WTF.. __________________ [email protected]

09-20-2004, 02:39 PM	#21
vas Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Toronto Posts: 562	truth ( P ) Pronunciation Key (trth) n. pl. truths (trthz, trths) 1. Conformity to fact or actuality. 2. A statement proven to be or accepted as true. 3. Sincerity; integrity. 4. Fidelity to an original or standard. Reality; actuality. often Truth That which is considered to be the supreme reality and to have the ultimate meaning and value of existence. according to webster anyway ;p

09-20-2004, 02:41 PM	#23
maxdaname Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 5,193	There's no such thing as the truth! Everything that comes out of your mouth always has a lie in it!

09-20-2004, 02:43 PM	#25
Tala Fucked if I know Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Do you have a flag? Posts: 23,368	YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!! (sorry) __________________ ICQ: 11120676 \| Google: mindcrime \| Skype: suitemindcrime\|E-Mail: mindcrime AT gmail.com\|PR girl with great writing skills for hire!!!! Contact me to work for YOU!\|TECHIEMEDIA? 24/7 support from some of the best techs in the biz. Tell Jim that I sent you.

09-20-2004, 02:52 PM	#28
Basic_man Programming King Pin Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Montreal Posts: 27,360	When you don't cheat on your wife :D __________________ UUGallery Builder - automated photo/video gallery plugin for Wordpress! Stop looking! Checkout Naked Hosting, online since 1999 !

09-20-2004, 02:56 PM	#31
ParasiteTV Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Montreal Posts: 1,067	Interesting question. I will have to say that there cannot be truth as in absolute. Years ago it was 'true' that the world was flat. I think that truth is a common collective, untill the knowledge of that common collective changes. edit: oops, the guy above me said it first, heh. __________________

09-20-2004, 03:05 PM	#34
psili Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Loveland, CO Posts: 5,526	Anyway, I gotta bail. I totally see your point in that there must be an absolute truth out there. What that is, I don't know. __________________ Your post count means nothing.

09-20-2004, 03:07 PM	#38
Ironhorse Pixel Pusher Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 7,094	Here's the real truth. There is no such thing. Truth is based on perspective. __________________ [email protected]

09-20-2004, 03:16 PM	#43
galleryseek Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 8,234	Allow me to put an end to this. There is no such thing as true and genuine truth as long as we do not know the TRUTH, reasoning, and/or basis of our existance. As long as there is speculation about our origins and how everything was created, there is not a single absolute truth in the world. Basic fundamental math, is not absolute truth. 1+1=2 is not absolute. And because we do not know the basis of our origins, the only "truth" we can have are merely assumptions based on a collective understanding and comprehension of the world we live in.