50 WW3 Maniacs

51 Surrendering EU army guys. :Graucho :1orglaugh

It really depends on who is attacking who. If anyone attacks us they would lose. All of us are just looking for a reason to shoot our guns. Having some foreign country come over here on boats and planes dropping from parachutes would be like a gift certificate to the gun range for every American.

bullshit, tell that to arabs, not here

Israel is a small country with increased military numbers for their population and that's all. Greece military expenses if you include the secret budget match the Israel's one and we have 1mil more manpower. Army is obligatory here too. Now look a small comparison between Israel, Germany and UK which are way bigger countries.

ISRAEL

males age 15-49: 1,562,716
note: both sexes are liable for military service (2003 est.)
Military expenditures - dollar figure:
$8.97 billion (FY02)


now look at UK

Military manpower - availability:
males age 15-49: 14,877,666 (2003 est.)

Military expenditures - dollar figure:
$31.7 billion (2002)

GERMANY

Military manpower - availability:
males age 15-49: 20,509,838 (2003 est.)

Military expenditures - dollar figure:
$38.8 billion (2002)


War is not a Rambo episode. Having higher military skillz as you say and if that's in reality valid won't match such differences.

If you placed the two armies ready on a battleground, all other things being equal, the European army should win. That is one of the reasons why some EU countries, notably France and Germany, are not wholly enthusiastic about NATO and the special influence the US has in that organisation.

But in a (non-nuclear war) presumably ranging back and forth between the US and Europe, the US would have an advantage. Few European countries have forces that are intended to fight (far) outside their own territories, whereas the US military is planned largely on the assumption that it will be fighting overseas. Going up against Europe, the US would be handicapped in that many of its jump-off points are in Europe, but still it should be better placed to attack Europe than vice versa.

Of course if the conflict moved from bombing to invasion, then a lot would depend on the reaction of the population. That's largely an unknown as Americans haven't fought at home since the Civil War and few Europeans of combat age have personal experience of war either. I tend towards believing Europeans would bear up better, but really, who knows...

UK and France both have armies that are deployed all over the world.

the sure thing with EU is that their leaders would never agree on which tactic to follow :1orglaugh

sad to admit the USA would win easily

the USA spends $350 billion a year on defence, compared to $35 billion in the UK, and $350 billion is what the next 10 big military powers spend in total

it's all about the money

and carriers:
the USA has 7 carrier battle groups, each with 100+ combat aircraft... the UK has 3 tiny aircraft carriers and I think France just has 1

but we are all great friends and do alot of business together :)

A look at Bowling For Columbine should give a good indication of what to expect should there ever be an invasion. A look at Boyz In Da Hood should also be required for any potential invaders.

Rappers would be a secret weapon.

you guys are all fucked up in the head, if there would be a war, no one will win it because the whole population will fight against the invaders....that will happen if the EU goes into the US and vice versa...

The US spend alot yes, but combine all European countries and you'll see that the figure will not be so far behind the US.
As for the carriers, they would be sunk pretty fast on both sides, so I doubt it would matter.

I think alot of the modern weponry would be useless pretty fast since I'm sure both the US and Europe would destroy every military satellite pretty fast.

True.

However, the EU can easily match US defense spending due to the budget of the EU countries being alot larger than the US budget.

Right.

The EU is not a small group of Arab nations with army technology dating from the 19th century.

Israel definitely has an advanced army but its way too small to be a serious threat.

eh... dont forget the eh, eh, great czech army...

http://1.im.cz/n/photo/00/86/21vjcvu-topsirka.jpg

they still dont have any air-fighters..

If Israel tried anything hostile against a major worldpower, the Mediterranean Sea would become 20770 sq km larger.

wtf? where are you from? all eastern euro former commie countries actually dont havy any army that would be able to fight anywhere on this planet.. the dont have enought money to build a powerfull army at this time. maybe in africa they can fight, somewhere.. :BangBang:

See, this is the edge that EU / US have over China. China doesn't have too many satellites up. Not as much as the EU and US at least.

Whoever can get the first nuke airborne

But soon they will have about 10 million elite hackers who can take over our sats at will.


I'm not kidding. If anyone thought the russian hackers were bad just wait a few years and see what happens.

Military spenditure for the EU is in the range $200 - $250 Billion, US is about $300 - $350 Billion and China about $50 - 100 Billion.

I hope it won't get that far!

I don't think that figure is relevant. The dollar is an imaginary value. What you would pay to build a tank in China is a whole lot less than what you would pay to build a tank in the USA, but the end product is similar

All that is important is the final total of manpower and equipment.
China is not far behind us in tech, and outnumbers us 3 to 1.
We cannot let some idiot president piss these people off. :warning

I've been been trying to find a good source of info detailing how much of what they've got compared to us .. this is the most comprehensive inventory I've found: (but unoffical) http://www.sinodefence.com/

In general, I think most Americans severely underestimate foriegn powers. To our peril.
We do need the EU, and we must make sure China sides with us instead of the (inevitable) United Islamic Nations.

I don't think the relevant measure is $$$ spent but FIERCENESS and HEART of the troops.

That's what we said about the former USSR, until they became the first "supposedly backward" country to launch a satallite in sapce(sputnik). By then, we were playing catch up (we eventually did and surpass them).

As CamChick had pointed out, China had been sending more and more satallite into orbit. As for scientific personel, they're catching up.

As for worrying about our current prez irritating China. Don't worry, the Bushes have closer relationship with China than any other powerful political families to date.

one word.

nuke.

I can tell you one thing. USD$50 Billion can buy a lot more in China than it can in the U.S. -- So long as you're chinese :-)

:1orglaugh

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh

what a fucking stupid thread. :warning

Besides aborigines, who have australians conquered?

I could say the same about your life.

DA BEARS!

Australians have conquered nobody and this is a good thing. I want to live in peace with our neighbours.

By the way genius, it was the English the conquered (murdered)the aborigines. Australia wasn't a nation before 1901.

What a childish comeback. You don't even fucking know me. Grow up, kid.

China is not a Naval power...thus cannot project its military forces.

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh

one might ask, who has the british empire conquered besides aborigines?

Australian parasites. Not exactly known as a major power.

Are you are fucking retard?

Do ya think it could have something to do with population, shitstain?

The question did not specify where the fighting would take place. If US history repeats itself, we would more likely be invading them over some fake drama. And we'd get beaten back hard.

They do have a large defensive navy (plus a lot of nuclear subs), just not the floating cities / aircraft carriers we routinely use. Those are only necessary if you're planning to invade other countires. :winkwink:

IMO no nuclear power will ever wage a fullscale war with another nuclear power, unless by accident. :uhoh But it should still be made known that we do not have unchallenged powers to go wherever we want. Our last few 'wars' have been misleading in that regard.

well france woulnt be a factor in it thats for sure

Nice insult there troll.. but yeah anyway .. Australia has a minor population, hence less tax to draw on for spending on defence..

You seem to know allot about Military stuff for a chick :thumbsup

Here's world military spending

http://www.cdi.org/budget/2004/world...y-spending.cfm

China is also pushing Europe to lift the Arms embargo so they can buy more high tech weapons and tech transfers. Imagine what will happen if they got a copy of the Euro Fighter and started mass producing.
http://www.contumacy.org/bbs/index.p...mes;read=26893
http://www.euobserver.com/index.phtml?sid=13&aid=14196

They also got their first batch of SU30MKK from Russia.
http://www.kanwa.com/edaily.htm

China more than doubling budgeted military spending this year
http://www.spacewar.com/2004/040423060406.hm15bwqn.html
China's official defense budget in 2004 is more than 25 billion dollars.

But when off-budget funding for foreign weapons system imports is included, total defense-related expenditures this year should soar to between 50 and 70 billion dollars, said Richard Lawless, the deputy undersecretary of defence.




Of course they will never do this cause they don't want to look hostile. They just want to make money



:)

Your right, China will only invade Taiwan.


China Eyes Ukrainian Slava-Class Cruiser

Ukrainian Defense Minster Oleksandr Olinyk announced March 2 that the Slava-class cruiser Ukraina will be offered for sale on the international market. He said China most likely will be the buyer of the warship, which, despite lengthy construction delays, is 96 percent complete.

China is in the midst of procuring large, multipurpose surface combatants from Russia, such as the Sovremenny-class destroyers, while also building new units of the Lanzhou- and Guangzhou-class destroyers in order to improve the sea service?s air defense, surface strike and antisubmarine warfare capabilities. The Slava-class cruiser, however, adds the new dimension of long-range surface-strike capability with 16 P-500 Bazalt surface-to-surface missiles with a range of 297 nautical miles.

This capability would give the Chinese Navy a standoff capability against large air-capable combatants such as aircraft carriers, amphibious ships and other large surface combatants.

If China accepts the cruiser as is, it likely will transfer the vessel to China for completion and outfitting, since it will be able to finish the work at significantly less cost than if completed in the Ukraine. Current estimated value of the Ukraina is $500 million.

http://www.navyleague.org/sea_power/may_04_50.php

They are also building their own stealth ships.

http://www.cjdby.com/UploadFile/200442519182915814.jpg

http://www.cjdby.com/UploadFile/20044251919744298.jpg

http://www.cjdby.com/UploadFile/200442519211743819.jpg

You sure about that? We will see this summer. :Graucho

God this thread is so utterly useless.

Here's a few more without any stupid tugboats in the way.

http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard...171_harbor.jpg
http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard...ds/Type054.jpg
http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard...ka-28_helo.jpg

None of you patriotic and argueing idiots realize that a conflict of such dimensions would mean the end of it all. Why do you think the Cold War never escalated? Because people were afraid of just that. And the scale was much smaller than in this hypothetic scenario.

Get your head out of your ass, and get back to work, for fuck's sake.

With the advanced weaponry of the US...we could do pre-assaults before ground troops were activated, which would more like take a high number of enemy troops out...not to mention that "if" this war took place, rest assured the draft would be reinstated. FYI...prior to WWII, US standing army was roughly 180,000 troops...and within 1 year of the draft, the new figure was 7.2 million. So technology and #'s are on our side if this stayed a conventional war. Just my :2 cents:

:1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Europe that'd be easy :thumbsup