Not going to happen.

liberal movement?

um.. democrats already have the right to marry.

It's gay people who need these rights still.

wtf is going on in your mind...whoever thinks europe is irrelevant is a dumbfuck. Bush doesn't know shit regarding foreign politics
(well..daddy's little boy doesn't know shit in general) wich is truly sad.

The one man fighting terror (*ugh*) can't fight terror without allies my friend.

Time for Clark to get the country back on track

Your insults are getting old, I don't think anyone thinks they're funny besides you. Anyone? Is that or any of 12clicks little insults making anyone laugh besides him self? Get over yourself douchebag, I've owned you so many times I lost count.

You asked me yesterday to back up my words and I did, why can't you do that, ever? Do you or do you not support the New American Century agenda? Do you even understand it? Who's the teacher here? I love you pretend Republicans, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about but you sure do love to speak up about everything. :1orglaugh

well you have just made a total ass out of yourself cause i dont have children. i dont want them at this point in my life so you lose!

now go play cause this adult world you dont understand.

So you aren't against change, only the change of definitions?

In that case, etymology must really piss you off :1orglaugh

I figure it's just a combo of the American National Anthem, Rush Limbaugh's radio show, and the Fox News intro songs all day long up there. How else could anyone be so ignorant?

Get used to it, it's his favorite passtime.

Absolutely 100% on track.

I agree 100% with every word you said. Couldn't have said it better myself.

12clicks doesn't understand big words.

:1orglaugh

so i have been told but i gave the benefit of the doubt.....once.

get him the hell out...please!!! i have to register absentee so i can have my say...

Liberals has no problem with the Amendment XVI which did just that. Guess it was because that amendment supported their 'special' dogma.

I would vote Bush if I could vote.

wtf are you talking about, and what does it have to do with what everyone else is talking about? Why do so many americans discuss social issues as if they were defending their favorite sports team? I don't care what side said what when. I don't care if someone wants to stick a (D) or an (R) next to their name. That's just petty tribalism.

What I'm talking about is liberals are quick to scream equality... when it suits their purpose. I'm not discussing the issue as if I were defending my favorite sports team.

I made my point on page one... seems you missed it, so I'll repeat:

A secular state has no business recognizing or rewarding a religious institution. Gay marriage is not the answer. A true separation of church and state is. The 'state' has never had and continues to have no business rewarding or penalizing someone based on a decision of faith.

If any church wants to start 'marrying gays'... I could honestly not care less.


People that miss the point and whine about equality -- when it suits their purpose -- annoy me. Therefore... you annoy me.

Anything conservatives say you can pretty much bet the exact opposite is the case.

1. Republicans say they are for less government.

Under Bush Sr. the total govt workforce was above 12 million. With Clinton it was under 10 million. Now it is currently at 12.1 million.

2. Republicans say drug users are bad and should be locked up.

Two words....Bush and Rush.

3. Republicans preach family values.

Hello Newt.

4. Republicans say they are the 'moral party'.

I guess if you consider turning your back on the homeless, polluting the air and water for corporate profits, allowing millions to go without healthcare, invading countries on lies, and executing people with the IQ of a 10 year old moral.

But hey, they're doing it in the name of God, so its okay.

<img src="http://www.mindfully.org/Jonik/Jonik-Free-Iraq.GIF">

The reasons behind why Bush wants no gay marriage are what is really scary, bigoted and pitiful. In his warped, religious way of thinking he thinks that outlawing gay marriage, and not giving tax breaks to these persons will somehow convince them that what they are doing is wrong, and that they will go to hell if they don't change.

I mean, forr goodness sakes people, the man doesn't believe in evolution!!!!!!!!!! And we're really gonna give him another term? 12clicks...sometimes I really hope you're joking.

When did we lose our allies?
Did they suddenly pack up and leave last night? I think that would've been on the news, don't you?

Our allies in Iraq:
Britain
Australia
Japan
South Korea
the Philippines
Thailand
Italy
Spain
Poland
Denmark
Hungary
Bulgaria
Ukraine
Romania
the Netherlands
Norway
El Salvador
and 17 other countries

Where do you see, or how do you think, that we don't have allies?
News flash: France and Germany are NOT the only other two countries in the world. They just happen to be ones with back-door deals with Iraq that go against UN Sanctions that they don't want revealed (too bad - been done - oh well). They were profiting quite nicely from selling illegal weapons to Iraq against the sanctions and trading weapons/parts for oil.
While other countries were following the sanctions for a dozen years, these two countries were thumbing their nose at everyone else.

And now, again, they are thumbing their nose at everyone else.
Lucky for the Iraqis though, 35 countries thought that ending the killing was more important than protecting the secrecy of illegal deals... and now the Iraqis are free. The biggest weapon of mass destruction - Saddam Hussein himself - has been dug out of a hole and no longer threatens the Iraqi people.

So take your "one man without allies" rhetoric and stick *it* in a hole.

A few things first off many of those countries on your list, their help was bought.

Secondly I am from NY and one of the first things you learn is not to take the opinions of anybody from NJ seriously lol.

To me if Bush was a true Republican (once apon a time Republicans were the money guys) he would encourage gay marriage because it promotes monogamy which prevents the spread of aids and saves the tax payers money.

Also they keep saying Marriage is a sacred thing not to be made a farce by the gays. I don't think you need the gays for that Brittany did a pretty good job of that lol.

The vast majority of the people here did not support the war, and when one of our colonels falsely represented us as being "part of the alliance" in front of the international media, the entire country was severely pissed off. :2 cents:

(our official stance: we supported the war, but not militarily)

Based on that how come we arent going all the other countries , that kill and treat their people like shit?

Don't be a bitch 12clicks, every post I've seen from you hasn't had any facts. All its had is some whitty right wing remark followed by a :1orglaugh

Start using real points in arguments instead of shitty one liners.

Did I mention your a bitch? :321GFY

What the hell was with his state of the union speech? Is this guy asking to start World War III?

Most homosxual couples don't a shit about 'religious marriage'.
They want secular 'legal marriage'.

The concept of marriage was not invented by the christian church.
(contrary to what they want you to believe) It doesn't belong to them.
Take those blessings and stick them up your ass, closet case priests.

Committed gay couples want to be able to go into a court room
and get a judge to grant them equal treatment in the eyes of the law.

It's not about god.
(despite bigoted attempts to steer the debate in that direction)
It's about property, and taxes, and treatment.

You must mentally untangle the church definition and the state definition.

As long as the state is granting special rights to committed couples,
and calling it "marriage", then they must grant those rights to all couples,
regardless of their sexual preference.

They supported it because they where threatened and blackmailed or bought. Besides, those countries are doing it against the will of the majority of there population. 17 Other countries? Which ones? Out of 190 countries, you could only give me a list of no more than 20 countries?

It's Bush who's thumbing his nose at everyone else. Where are those illegal weapons btw? They must've sold him weapons worth a trillion otherwise it'd be a lot more profitable to support the invasion of Iraq.

Did I mention your grammar sucks - it should be *you're* a bitch, not *your* a bitch.

If you're going to insult people, make sure you're perfect yourself first!

If I was gay I'd stop paying my taxes. You don't consider me as an equal? Fuck off then. Why should they work hard and pay taxes like everyone else if they're not treated the same?

I hate it when people correct people about grammer. Grammer is for important things, not a post on a message board.

I'd would like to have you're babies because you're a big penis'.

Fear.

I only pointed out grammar to point out that you're not perfect yourself, not because its either important or not for a board. I personally couldn't care less whether or not your grammar is correct, what I could care less about is the attitude that you take towards others.

Obviously.

Wrong.
It does when the religious institution has ALREADY been "recognizing or rewarded" special secular state rights.

If marriage was just a religious thing between two people then yeah gays would have no right to alter it to suit their needs, but when marriage brings special secular rights like access to your partners superannuation, property etc then yes they deserve equality under law.

I couldn't give a flying fuck whether joe gaydar gets access to his "husbands" super or whatever. Those are the sorts of rights there should be NO arguing over.

so either let them get married or change the rules so there are absolutely no property/financial differences.. none.. nada.. zip.

if two atheists can get married I don't see what the problem is.

12 clicks does truly represent heterosexuality.
He is the product of two cousins.

So, you just basically have to remember he's kinda slow because of his heritage...which is VERY heterosexual!

Hallelujah brother! Sing the praise of unqualified love! :thumbsup

Why?

Because Finland likes making fun of the United States?
That's the only reason I can think of for you voting that way.

Dead on right my friend! :thumbsup

Take any impartial person on this issue and I have absolutely no doubt that they would find all the right winger's comments totally nonsensical or without merit. While those in favor of TRUE civil rights have made excellent points in this thread that have not been refuted with any intelligent debate and/or evidence.

Oh..the spelling police just landed a huge right hook with their witty comment totally offsetting the points made. :1orglaugh

He wasn't insulting 12 Clicks..he was STATING THE OBVIOUS!

oh look, another 3rd grader for [Leader] and crew to recruit.:1orglaugh

haha, sorry son but if we let you half assed liberals change the definition of marriage, I'm sure you'll change the definition of "job" to mean slavery and outlaw that too.:1orglaugh

I don't think there's many people fit to raise a family these days :2 cents:

The days of urban sprawl and leave it to beaver are over. Sheer overpopulation will tell you that. Life's only gonna get harder and more expensive. Even if a kid has 2 parents unless the dad's rich the mom's still gonna have to work.

Darwinism is gonna weed out the children who can't raise themselves.

Gore won.

Cheers,
Matt

Careful what you wish for... gaining total world power with an iron-clad fist takes time, ya know :winkwink:

Seriously though - because these other countries are involved in "talks" (everyone join with me in a big "PFFFT") and are at least making enough headway or concessions that no one has deemed this necessary. The current exception to this being North Korea, who is putting up pretty much the same front as Saddam but actually even worse. They're still talking though. (Hell they'll probably talk until they're blue in the face and the entire common populace has starved to death. Idiots.)

Oh please.

We're gonna threaten 34 countries. Right. Militarily we're strong enough to take on 34 different countries of varying sizes scattered all over the world all at the same time. And these countries know it too, so they just humbly bowed down to our omnipotent power. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

They were blackmailed. That's cute. No really, that's cute. We sent Jimmy Hoffa to each of these countries and made them offers they couldn't refuse. Cuz Jimmy's not dead, you know. He's just working undercover for the CIA. *rolls eyes*

They were bought. All of them? God, no wonder there is no money left in the US. All of the ATMs here are dry. The Federal Reserve has been completely emptied of gold and we're in a major crisis!!! Why haven't you heard about it? Why, because the American media is such a puppet of the administration, that's why!! All broadcasts that go out to the world are pre-screened, edited and corrected to say only what Ho Chi Bush says they should say! But thankfully, you know the truth now, because you read GFY. You are one of the enlightened, one of the few!!

Now go run and hide before the black helicopters come find you... they're tracing your every move on the internet and they've already intercepted this transmission. They can't allow the truth to get out, ya know.

You don't get out much, do you?

I'll be sure to tell my kids (2 at present, one on the way) that technically, we don't exist - a working dad and a mom staying home to raise the kids just doesn't fit the agenda therefore we must not be here.

Carrie:

DUH? Is that all? Just 34??

Add another batch that were bribed .. wake up for God's sake!

Threats come naturally for that piece of lying Texas trash which you seem to adore for some reason...

This was proven incorrect by multiple independent studies 3 years ago. Bush won no matter how you want to count those stupid chads. (God let's hope none of those things are involved in this election.)

Bush won. Period. Proven over and over again. Come join us in 2004. You'll find a lot of neat things have changed. Just wait until you see what Visa has done to the business - boy will you be surprised! And that whole 9/11 thing... phew you've got a lot of catching up to do.

I already addressed bribing, please scroll up.

Lying Texas trash. Hrrmm. Does that mean that all Texans are trash? Or just possibly that all Texans lie? Or maybe both - that all Texans lie *and* are trash?

It must have some connotation connected with Texans, otherwise you wouldn't have bothered to include that little fact. You'd have just said "lying trash".

So I'm curious here. When was it exactly that you developed this hatred towards Texans?

Carrie:

What crap are you talking now?

Did I say or even imply "all Texans are trash"? NO

Did I say "possibly" that all Texans lie? NO

Did I even refer to ANY other Texan that the lying trash in the Whitehouse? NO

Get a real life and grow up...

You remind me of how totally crazy with hate some republicans were about Clinton. It's kinda funny.