Microsoft, Real Networks may be pulled into Acacia fight - GoFuckYourself.com

Mr.Fiction · 11-18-2003, 01:33 AM

He is also investigating whether the colleges already license streaming software through companies like Microsoft or RealNetworks. Depending on what their contracts say, those companies might have some responsibility for helping to defend the university from a lawsuit. Officials at Apple and Microsoft say they know nothing about Acacia's letters.

But Mr. Rawlins says, "When we go back and look at the contracts and the threads through them, we could have a lot of interesting people on our side."

http://homepages.law.asu.edu/~dkarja...CHE11-7-03.htm

Acacia has stepped into a trap and it's time to take this fight public. No one cares about porn companies, but everyone cares about schools.

This is where the IMPA people need a public relations company. Now that the schools are getting letters, it is time for a full scale media attack on Acacia.

Imagine the backlash the government would hear if Acacia was exposed for driving up tuitions and putting schools out of business or hurting the education system in the United States.

Now is the time for a public relations war with Acacia. They have overplayed their hand.

If the public hears enough about this, they will get angry.

It's also a good way to preview your case to potential jury members before the cases go to court.

The public (jury members) need to know before the porn cases go to court that Acacia is trying to hurt the U.S. educational system. Make sure that jurors understand this is not about porn, it's about the exploitation of a bad patent.

The IMPA needs a PR firm badly.

eroswebmaster · 11-18-2003, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction
.

The IMPA needs a PR firm badly.

I thought Sexeducation held that position ;)

But seriously thx for the post was very enlightening.

perfectodollars-gabrio · 11-18-2003, 03:13 AM

very nice, indeed.

xanx · 11-18-2003, 03:16 AM

i agree 100% with you

BRISK · 11-18-2003, 04:51 AM

SR · 11-18-2003, 04:56 AM

A very stupid move of them to go after schools.

Gemini · 11-18-2003, 05:11 AM

It seems like even with the knowledge about the colleges... the local news people are afraid to wade in to this one.

Isn't there a hearing this week?!

LiveDose · 11-18-2003, 05:19 AM

Wow, truly a bunch of stupid fuckers running acacia. I feel much better about this situation.

Mail order law degrees perhaps?

Space Puppy · 11-18-2003, 05:21 AM

i am personally surprised that the media havent covered this in a light other than 'porn' it does have far reaching consequences whether 'we' win or lose across the web and the 'real world'.

basschick · 11-18-2003, 08:01 AM

you know what's puzzled me? it seems to me that the question of the acacia patents are a matter between acacia and real, and acacia and microsoft. here's why i think that.

i talked to someone at the legal department of real. he said that to the best of real's knowledge, acacia does not own the patent to their technology.

if that's true, i can't owe them any money for using real technology, and if real is exempt, their entire patent fails as real is streaming media.

Mr.Fiction · 11-18-2003, 10:02 AM

Officials at Apple and Microsoft say they know nothing about Acacia's letters.

That line from the article has to be bullshit. I'm sure that someone has contacted both Real and Microsoft about this issue by now.

crockett · 11-18-2003, 10:09 AM

I was suprised when I heard Acacia was going after schools... I figured that to be a really dumb move, specially early on.. I figured it would come back to bite them.. as with Adult no one will stand up for us, but everyone will fight for schools.

Sly_RJ · 11-18-2003, 10:12 AM

If I remember correctly, Microsoft recently stated that they would go to bat for their customers in cases like this. I wonder if that's retroactive?

Oh SNAP!

FightThisPatent · 11-18-2003, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by basschick
i talked to someone at the legal department of real. he said that to the best of real's knowledge, acacia does not own the patent to their technology.

To put Acacia's patent claims in simple terms, they claim:

1) There is source content
2) Content is converted to digital form
3) Digitized content is compressed
4) Stored on a server
5) Distributed via network
6) Playback via PC

Companies that make A/V servers like Microsoft, Real, and Apple
have software that covers steps 2-6

The software itself does not cause the infringement.

When the webmaster combines content with the software, the missing piece is added to create the "process" that the Acacia patent describes.

Content Producers are the ones that take content and digitize/compress.

Webmasters purchase the content and put on their servers, and use either HTTP (apache) web server or a streaming server to distribute

So the webmaster is infringing because they have assembled all the pieces together that the Acacia patent describes.

The major snag to this patent is that this process was in effect well before 1990....so the patent is not novel.

So Acacia can't target them for the software, but they could target them for completing the process by including content!

WindowsMedia.com -owned by Microsoft, has content
iTunes.com -Apple...also infringes on SightSound patent
Rhapsody - Real...also infringes on SightSound patent

The big three are aware of Acacia...

Fight the Process!

Pleasurepays · 11-18-2003, 10:29 AM

I dont think it was a stupid move to go after Colleges and Universities per se... they could have went after a ton of small schools who offer distance learning that would not fight and could not afford to fight... but they sent a legal threat to Stanford of all places, which is so far beyond bizarre and ignorant.

Hmm....

1) Stanford Law.
2) The Internet as we know it, started at Stanford.
3) Many professors at Stanford were originally involved in DARPA Net
4) Many students from Stanford created the technology that even today, drives the Internet.
5) Many fortune 500 tech companies like Cisco, Sun Microsystems, Lucent, Netscape etc started at Stanford.

that would have been the last place i would have tried to fuck with if i was Acacia.... but oh well, thats what they get for being a greedy bulk mailer running an extortion racket and pump and dump scheme.

Hooper · 11-18-2003, 11:54 AM

m$, real & apple can all be held liable for contribory infringement.

After all, they sell the product to you, they include example media, and give you detailed instructions on how to use the software.

Not saying that acacia has a valid patent, but if it WAS valid..

Lets put it this way. ms & apple & real are really doing the equivalent of selling you a gun, giving you instructions on how to kill people, and encouraging you to do so.

Then as seperate products they also sell you bullet making kits. I'd say they are as liable as it gets.

FightThisPatent · 11-18-2003, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hooper
Lets put it this way. ms & apple & real are really doing the equivalent of selling you a gun, giving you instructions on how to kill people, and encouraging you to do so.

Then as seperate products they also sell you bullet making kits. I'd say they are as liable as it gets.

True, but who would you rather hold up with that gun, a mom and pop convenience store or Wells Fargo bank that can afford full complement of security features?

This is why i believe the big players are not directly being targeted.

Fight the Hollow-Point!

FightThisPatent · 11-18-2003, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pleasurepays
5) Many fortune 500 tech companies like Cisco, Sun

My list goes to 6... it's one better than 5 for when you think you have listed enough points, but need that extra line to give your point that extra punch.

Fight the Spinal-Tap-References!

ravener · 11-18-2003, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crockett
I was suprised when I heard Acacia was going after schools... I figured that to be a really dumb move, specially early on.. I figured it would come back to bite them.. as with Adult no one will stand up for us, but everyone will fight for schools.

Let's just hope that the schools aren't offered a sweetheart deal and settle!

JDog · 11-18-2003, 03:09 PM

If MS and Real step into this lawsuit, Acacia is fucked! Hopefully some good news come's outta this!

jDoG

JSA Matt · 11-18-2003, 03:22 PM

Quote:

College lawyers are scrambling to figure out how to respond to Acacia, and in the meantime they're saying little. It's possible that they will find a silver bullet that will shoot down Acacia's claims.

Quote:

one college lawyer, who asked not to be named, said that Acacia's demand would significantly hurt colleges, and that they wouldn't rush to sign the licensing deal. "I think our folding is highly unlikely," the lawyer said.

Scootermuze · 11-18-2003, 04:25 PM

Standford would probably make this a class project for a few law students..

If law students can free a man on death row as a class project, they can certainly fight Acacia and win..

basschick · 11-18-2003, 04:37 PM

my point was that if we can put it in real's backyard to deal with, it will take porn out of the equation. i buy feeds done in real, real says that they don't think acacia owns the patent to their streaming. if i believe real, why would i pay acacia? real isn't exactly a fly by night company.

now, acacia is a small patent company and real is enormous and invented their own technology. a judge or jury will listen to them where they may not listen to us.

richard · 11-18-2003, 06:25 PM

Just curious:

What happens in the USA if "the" court case with HomeGrown/IMPA goes in favour of Acacia and they make everyone pay... then in X months/years, they have another case with some one like Microsoft.... and Microsoft wins...

Can you sue the government for judging in favour of Acacia in one case, and in favour of someone like Microsoft in another?

Rich · 11-18-2003, 06:43 PM

Why would anyone think the media is going to start reporting on Acacia? It's a simple patent case, the IMPA should be using it's money to beat the invalid patent in court, not setting up a "PR firm" to try to get some meaningless TV about something no one besides us cares about. Some people are making this out to be the biggest business scam in history, shit like this goes down all the time in business. This is not some big scandal like some people make it out to be.

Someone mentioned sending Acacia packets to the Microsoft and Real legal departments, now that's a great fucking idea.

Krome · 11-18-2003, 07:18 PM

Quote:

They say that Acacia's licensing demand, backed by the threat of lawsuits, would add a huge new expense to colleges' technology programs, which are already running under tight budgets. And officials say that such costs could force colleges to stop adding new media features to course sites, which could hamper innovation in higher education.

Acacia just lost any public support they may have wanted.

Quote:

Acacia did not send letters to Apple, Microsoft, or RealNetworks, companies that have built businesses on developing and licensing online-media programs, for simple business reasons, Mr. Berman says.

Translation "Microsoft, Apple and Real would arse fuck us repeatidily so we are hitting the small guys who we can scare into giving us a % of their turnover.

11-18-2003, 01:33 AM	#1
Mr.Fiction Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Free Speech Land Posts: 9,484	Microsoft, Real Networks may be pulled into Acacia fight He is also investigating whether the colleges already license streaming software through companies like Microsoft or RealNetworks. Depending on what their contracts say, those companies might have some responsibility for helping to defend the university from a lawsuit. Officials at Apple and Microsoft say they know nothing about Acacia's letters. But Mr. Rawlins says, "When we go back and look at the contracts and the threads through them, we could have a lot of interesting people on our side." http://homepages.law.asu.edu/~dkarja...CHE11-7-03.htm Acacia has stepped into a trap and it's time to take this fight public. No one cares about porn companies, but everyone cares about schools. This is where the IMPA people need a public relations company. Now that the schools are getting letters, it is time for a full scale media attack on Acacia. Imagine the backlash the government would hear if Acacia was exposed for driving up tuitions and putting schools out of business or hurting the education system in the United States. Now is the time for a public relations war with Acacia. They have overplayed their hand. If the public hears enough about this, they will get angry. It's also a good way to preview your case to potential jury members before the cases go to court. The public (jury members) need to know before the porn cases go to court that Acacia is trying to hurt the U.S. educational system. Make sure that jurors understand this is not about porn, it's about the exploitation of a bad patent. The IMPA needs a PR firm badly.

11-18-2003, 04:51 AM	#5
BRISK Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,240	__________________ I post on GFY so that when people ask me what I do, I can tell them that I work with the mentally retarded.

11-18-2003, 05:11 AM	#7
Gemini Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: o-HI-o Posts: 7,183	It seems like even with the knowledge about the colleges... the local news people are afraid to wade in to this one. Isn't there a hearing this week?! __________________ <center><a target="_blank" href="http://dev.datedollars.com/index.php?s=signup&aid=535&cfg=aac"><img border="0" src="http://216.130.172.224/gfy/gsig.gif" width="490" height="100"></a><br><a href="http://dev.datedollars.com/index.php?s=signup&aid=535&cfg=aac" target="_blank"><b><font face="Arial"><font color="#FF99FF"> Buy me away from Slavedriver Smokey!<br>It's May Sig Sweeps!<font></b></center>

11-18-2003, 05:19 AM	#8
LiveDose Show Yer Tits! Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Somewhere Out there... Posts: 25,792	Wow, truly a bunch of stupid fuckers running acacia. I feel much better about this situation. Mail order law degrees perhaps? __________________ Scammer Alert: acer19 acer [email protected] [email protected] Money stolen using PayPal

11-18-2003, 08:01 AM	#10
basschick Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: el lay, ca usa Posts: 2,540	you know what's puzzled me? it seems to me that the question of the acacia patents are a matter between acacia and real, and acacia and microsoft. here's why i think that. i talked to someone at the legal department of real. he said that to the best of real's knowledge, acacia does not own the patent to their technology. if that's true, i can't owe them any money for using real technology, and if real is exempt, their entire patent fails as real is streaming media. __________________ Got Gay and For Women Traffic?

11-18-2003, 03:13 AM	#3
perfectodollars-gabrio Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: www.perfectodollars.com Posts: 3,811	very nice, indeed.

11-18-2003, 03:16 AM	#4
xanx Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 3,711	i agree 100% with you

11-18-2003, 04:56 AM	#6
SR Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,239	A very stupid move of them to go after schools.

11-18-2003, 05:21 AM	#9
Space Puppy So Fucking Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 817	i am personally surprised that the media havent covered this in a light other than 'porn' it does have far reaching consequences whether 'we' win or lose across the web and the 'real world'.

11-18-2003, 10:02 AM	#11
Mr.Fiction Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Free Speech Land Posts: 9,484	Officials at Apple and Microsoft say they know nothing about Acacia's letters. That line from the article has to be bullshit. I'm sure that someone has contacted both Real and Microsoft about this issue by now.

11-18-2003, 10:09 AM	#12
crockett in a van by the river Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 76,806	I was suprised when I heard Acacia was going after schools... I figured that to be a really dumb move, specially early on.. I figured it would come back to bite them.. as with Adult no one will stand up for us, but everyone will fight for schools. __________________ In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.

11-18-2003, 10:12 AM	#13
Sly_RJ Live Hard - Die Hard Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Ready to leave... Posts: 17,042	If I remember correctly, Microsoft recently stated that they would go to bat for their customers in cases like this. I wonder if that's retroactive? Oh SNAP! __________________ PHAT SERVERS - Quality dedicated hosting at a quality price! sly AT phatservers DOT com - 147479144

11-18-2003, 10:29 AM	#15
Pleasurepays BANNED - SUPPORTING TUBES Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I live in a pile of boogers Posts: 11,913	I dont think it was a stupid move to go after Colleges and Universities per se... they could have went after a ton of small schools who offer distance learning that would not fight and could not afford to fight... but they sent a legal threat to Stanford of all places, which is so far beyond bizarre and ignorant. Hmm.... 1) Stanford Law. 2) The Internet as we know it, started at Stanford. 3) Many professors at Stanford were originally involved in DARPA Net 4) Many students from Stanford created the technology that even today, drives the Internet. 5) Many fortune 500 tech companies like Cisco, Sun Microsystems, Lucent, Netscape etc started at Stanford. that would have been the last place i would have tried to fuck with if i was Acacia.... but oh well, thats what they get for being a greedy bulk mailer running an extortion racket and pump and dump scheme.

11-18-2003, 11:54 AM	#16
Hooper Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: A Free America Posts: 2,210	m$, real & apple can all be held liable for contribory infringement. After all, they sell the product to you, they include example media, and give you detailed instructions on how to use the software. Not saying that acacia has a valid patent, but if it WAS valid.. Lets put it this way. ms & apple & real are really doing the equivalent of selling you a gun, giving you instructions on how to kill people, and encouraging you to do so. Then as seperate products they also sell you bullet making kits. I'd say they are as liable as it gets. __________________ <a href="http://www.adultplatinum.com/"><img src="http://www.adult.com/wmbanners/10dcash-468x60.gif"></a>

11-18-2003, 03:09 PM	#20
JDog Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Canby, OR Posts: 7,453	If MS and Real step into this lawsuit, Acacia is fucked! Hopefully some good news come's outta this! jDoG __________________ NSCash now powering ReelProfits.com ALSO FEATURING: NSCash.com :: SoloDollars.com :: ReelProfits.com :: BiminiBucks.com :: VOD PROGRAMS COMING SOON: Greedy Bucks :: Vengeance Cash NOW OFFERING OVER 60 SITES CONTACT :: JAMES SMITH :: CHIEF TECHNOLOGY OFFICER :: ICQ (711385133)

11-18-2003, 04:25 PM	#22
Scootermuze Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 4,513	Standford would probably make this a class project for a few law students.. If law students can free a man on death row as a class project, they can certainly fight Acacia and win..

11-18-2003, 04:37 PM	#23
basschick Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: el lay, ca usa Posts: 2,540	my point was that if we can put it in real's backyard to deal with, it will take porn out of the equation. i buy feeds done in real, real says that they don't think acacia owns the patent to their streaming. if i believe real, why would i pay acacia? real isn't exactly a fly by night company. now, acacia is a small patent company and real is enormous and invented their own technology. a judge or jury will listen to them where they may not listen to us. __________________ Got Gay and For Women Traffic?

11-18-2003, 06:25 PM	#24
richard Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: UK Posts: 543	Just curious: What happens in the USA if "the" court case with HomeGrown/IMPA goes in favour of Acacia and they make everyone pay... then in X months/years, they have another case with some one like Microsoft.... and Microsoft wins... Can you sue the government for judging in favour of Acacia in one case, and in favour of someone like Microsoft in another? __________________

11-18-2003, 06:43 PM	#25
Rich So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 11,486	Why would anyone think the media is going to start reporting on Acacia? It's a simple patent case, the IMPA should be using it's money to beat the invalid patent in court, not setting up a "PR firm" to try to get some meaningless TV about something no one besides us cares about. Some people are making this out to be the biggest business scam in history, shit like this goes down all the time in business. This is not some big scandal like some people make it out to be. Someone mentioned sending Acacia packets to the Microsoft and Real legal departments, now that's a great fucking idea.