Acacia's current "status". Is this good or bad for us? - GoFuckYourself.com

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 03:53 PM

From http://www.technologymarketing.com/m...ent_id=1899661

Ryan initially targeted three markets: Internet radio, online adult entertainment and on-demand hotel movies. All three of these markets share a similar characteristic?the lack of a dominant player who might be tempted to fight Acacia's claims. By selecting fragmented markets rather than going after big players like MSN or AOL, Acacia hoped to avoid getting embroiled in a debilitating legal battle. "My approach is to get some deals done and get some goodwill," says Rob Berman, Acacia's senior vp of business development. "I don't want to end up in the bowels of legal hell."

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 03:54 PM

Continued..

Going after the adult firms was a spectacular miscalculation, according to Greg Piccionelli, an Internet attorney with Los Angeles-based Brull, Piccionelli, Sarno & Vradenburgh, who often represents adult entertainment firms on first amendment issues. "Many of these Internet firms have ties to the larger adult entertainment business, which generates as much as $40 billion each year, more than the entire professional sports industry," he explains. The larger adult firms banded into a coalition and refused to pay. Acacia then initiated patent infringement litigation in the U.S. District Court of the Central District of California against 39 adult entertainment companies.

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 03:55 PM

Continued:
The coalition responded by retaining the services of Fish & Richardson, which handles more patent litigation than any other U.S. law firm. "Our clients feel very strongly that they do not infringe these patents and that these patents are completely invalid, based upon preliminary reviews of the prosecution history of the patent, the technology of the clients, and the prior art that was not disclosed at the patent office," says attorney Juanita Brooks. The case is now making its way slowly through the courts, squelching Ryan's hope for some easy cash and a quick PR victory. So much for marketing momentum.

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 03:56 PM

Continued:

For Ryan the situation is clearly frustrating. "These companies will end up spending more on litigation than if they just paid the fees," he fumes. Attorney Dorman is equally dismissive of the adult entertainment firms. "These companies are so used to people challenging their business on first amendment grounds that they constantly feel victimized," he says. "They're not sophisticated enough to realize that this patent action is just standard procedure in mainstream businesses."

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 03:57 PM

and finally..

The question now is whether Acacia can afford to fight a drawn-out battle. The company has some $40 million in cash, but its burn rate (without the extra expense of litigation) is around $4 million to $5 million a year. Patent lawsuits can cost anywhere from $1 million to $3 million to litigate, and if every industry proves as scrappy as the adult entertainment folks, Acacia could find its war chest shrinking before it can make good on its claims. Indeed, there's no sign that the on-demand hotel movie companies, for example, intend to comply with Acacia's demands. (Both LodgeNet and On Command declined to comment for this story.)

Meanwhile, Acacia's Media Technology group has almost no income. While Acacia noted in its most recent quarterly report that it had entered into 18 license agreements for its streaming media technology, that amount wasn't enough to stem a $1.5 million quarterly loss. It's a poor performance for a company that's already in trouble. License revenues for the v-chip fell from around $10 million a quarter in 2001 to a measly $43,000 a quarter in 2002.

To make matters worse, the licensing deals that Acacia has struck for its streaming media patent are apparently too small to produce much revenue. One of the eight adult entertainment deals that Acacia is touting won the company only a one-time $500 payment, according to Farrell Timlake, president of adult site Homegrownvideo.com. But the real indicator that Acacia's strategy is stalled is the company's moribund stock (Nasdaq: ACTG), which has been hovering at under $1.50 a share, cumulatively less than Acacia's cash on hand. The strategy isn't flying with investors.

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 04:02 PM

I forgot to add who wrote this article:

Geoffrey James (www.geoffreyjames.com) is a frequent TM contributor and the author of numerous books.

I was actually fairly encouraged by what I read. Granted the article is like 3 months old..so don't zap me if all of this has been posted before. Just thought it would be good material for folks who didn't know any of this before now.

Any input?

KRL · 10-27-2003, 04:12 PM

These monkeys in Newport Beach are going to get buried in their own hype and bullshit at the rate they're going.

They thought they could shank the adult industry and get away with it.

papa56 · 10-27-2003, 04:54 PM

Wow..Thanks for posting that...very encouraging.

Tuga · 10-27-2003, 05:04 PM

Nice reading, but why so many posts?

BRISK · 10-27-2003, 05:10 PM

Right now the worst scenario for Acacia is happening. Webmasters aren't settling, their case against Holio got thrown out of court, and it looks more and more likely that they will have to take court action against every single patent infringer just to get their money.

The one single thing Acacia does NOT want to do is take legal action against all these thousands of webmasters just to get their money. Acacia knows they won't make any money that way because legal action costs big money (even if they win).

For Acacia, legal action = bad

I predict in January that Acacia might take legal action against 10 medium size adult companies in an attempt to scare the rest of the industry into paying again, but they really really don't want to have to do that.

rooster · 10-27-2003, 05:18 PM

its definitely bad for acacia. Their stock plumeted even after hyping the signings of hustler, vivid.

Now the confidence in that stock is shaky at best.

And acacia still has to fight their battle against impai, and probably a handful of other legal cases against them will emerge.

And very small amounts of revenue coming in.

Its a no win situation, why the fuckers even attempted this stupid scheme is beyond me.

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tuga
Nice reading, but why so many posts?

Attention span on here seems to be limited to one paragraph max per post!

Mr.Fiction · 10-27-2003, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rooster
its definitely bad for acacia. Their stock plumeted even after hyping the signings of hustler, vivid.

Now the confidence in that stock is shaky at best.

And acacia still has to fight their battle against impai, and probably a handful of other legal cases against them will emerge.

And very small amounts of revenue coming in.

Its a no win situation, why the fuckers even attempted this stupid scheme is beyond me.

It will be funny if they start suing companies that make less than a few $100k per year. Even if they win, they are going to spend more on lawsuits than they will get back.

For each stupid lawsuit they file, they could actually lose money even if they win.

jimmyf · 10-27-2003, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction

It will be funny if they start suing companies that make less than a few $100k per year. Even if they win, they are going to spend more on lawsuits than they will get back.

For each stupid lawsuit they file, they could actually lose money even if they win.

Now that would be funny as hell.

sm00ty · 10-27-2003, 06:10 PM

coming soon - bermangetsbanged.com featuring streaming videos

Theo · 10-27-2003, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Centurion

Meanwhile, Acacia's Media Technology group has almost no income.

The ones buying ACTG should read this a couple of times. ACTG will turn profitable only after having a gazillion licenses and without spending big amounts for legal battles. Shares are not only EXPECTATIONS, but financial numbers as well. ACTG went up due to expectations....now expectations are gone. Tell me....what is left?

Mr.Fiction · 10-27-2003, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel

Tell me....what is left?

"the bowels of legal hell"

Theo · 10-27-2003, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BRISK

I predict in January that Acacia might take legal action against 10 medium size adult companies in an attempt to scare the rest of the industry into paying again, but they really really don't want to have to do that.

probably and the best thing to avoid any bad scenario from now on is to inform the rest webmasters what options they have.

DO NOT SETTLE.

icedemon · 10-27-2003, 06:45 PM

I don't see why Acacia doesn't just plain quit while they are ahead and go after some other group. Going after colleges is another bad move by them. I'm starting to wonder how much brains the guys at Acacia actually have.

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by icedemon
I don't see why Acacia doesn't just plain quit while they are ahead and go after some other group. Going after colleges is another bad move by them. I'm starting to wonder how much brains the guys at Acacia actually have.

Because at the beginning of their push, they got several businesses to settle, or who simply did not even show up for court.

If you read the threads on Acacia here (yeah..there are a zillion of them), there truly are a lot of scared webmasters. And this is what Acacia is betting on. The psychology of fear taking deep root which will induce settlement.

AND YES...seek LEGAL advice. Don't want to get my butt burned because I forgot to say I'm not a legal scholar..this is just my opinion.

Fucking politically correct folks!

Oedipus · 10-27-2003, 07:48 PM

Acacia wants $1500 up front from webmasters netting $1 to $50,000 in revenue from promoting or selling streaming video content. THEY'LL SPEND WELL IN EXCESS OF $1500 ON EACH LAWSUIT PURSUING EACH WEBMASTER IN THAT CATEGORY WHO DOESN'T SIGN THEIR LICENSE AGREEMENT.

WAR OF ATTRITION.

The Other Steve · 10-27-2003, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sm00ty
coming soon - bermangetsbanged.com featuring streaming videos

Has anyone bought the domain yet?

Perhaps bermangetsbuttbanged.com might be a more appropriate choice.

Big Fish 47 · 10-27-2003, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction
It will be funny if they start suing companies that make less than a few $100k per year. Even if they win, they are going to spend more on lawsuits than they will get back.

What's even funnier... is that they want me to pay $1500

I think that's what I made last year

doober · 10-27-2003, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Big Fish 47

What's even funnier... is that they want me to pay $1500

I think that's what I made last year

all your commissions are belong to acacia

Mr.Fiction · 10-27-2003, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oedipus

WAR OF ATTRITION.

basschick · 10-27-2003, 09:46 PM

that was a very interesting read. thanks!

neewwman · 10-27-2003, 09:48 PM

Fuck those fucking fuckers.

Flow · 10-27-2003, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oedipus
Acacia wants $1500 up front from webmasters netting $1 to $50,000 in revenue from promoting or selling streaming video content. THEY'LL SPEND WELL IN EXCESS OF $1500 ON EACH LAWSUIT PURSUING EACH WEBMASTER IN THAT CATEGORY WHO DOESN'T SIGN THEIR LICENSE AGREEMENT.

WAR OF ATTRITION.

The one thing that all of you who think like this is forgetting is that if they take you to court and win a patent infringment case against you, they can counter-sue you for up to three times the cost of their court case. If you don't believe me, do some research on patent ingringment lawsuits.

Flow

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Flow

The one thing that all of you who think like this is forgetting is that if they take you to court and win a patent infringment case against you, they can counter-sue you for up to three times the cost of their court case. If you don't believe me, do some research on patent ingringment lawsuits.

Flow

1)And if your assets don't even come close to the figure they are suing you for..what the fuck do they think they are going to get? YOUR SOUL?
2)You make it sound like it's SO SIMPLE to sue someone. Besides the "just cause", don't forget how friggin expensive suits & court time is! Do they really want to spend 2 mil to get $5000.00 out of someone's total estate???

NO!! But posts like yours is exactly what they do hope for. Try and scare the fucking shit out of someone by throwing around "counter-sue you for up to three times the cost of their court case." Give me a break!!

P.S. A counter-suit is when someone ELSE has sued the party that is counter suing!

Flow · 10-27-2003, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Centurion

1)And if your assets don't even come close to the figure they are suing you for..what the fuck do they think they are going to get? YOUR SOUL?
2)You make it sound like it's SO SIMPLE to sue someone. Besides the "just cause", don't forget how friggin expensive suits & court time is! Do they really want to spend 2 mil to get $5000.00 out of someone's total estate???

NO!! But posts like yours is exactly what they do hope for. Try and scare the fucking shit out of someone by throwing around "counter-sue you for up to three times the cost of their court case." Give me a break!!

P.S. A counter-suit is when someone ELSE has sued the party that is counter suing!

And I quote from the US Code.....

"Remedies for ingringement of an issued patent include injunctions, damages, and attorney's fees" 35 U.S.C 281-287

"In the event of willful ingringement of a patent, a court may award treble damaegs (i.e. increase the damages up to three times the amount found or accessed)" 35 U.S.C. 284

To answer your other questions....

1) When you are sued and you lose, the court can cease all of your assets (i.e. cars, boats, houses, etc) to cover your debt) they can also put you on a monthly payment plan so that you will eventually pay for it, even if it takes you 30 years to do so.

2) They more than likely don't want to spend millions to get their patent paid for as has been pointed out before. They are very much so counting on fear to settle the majority of their cases.

Now for the huge BUT.... we cannot continue to assume that they won't. How many webmasters would settle with ASAP them if they took somebody to court who literally owned them a couple of thousands of dollars and used them as an example.? Not saying it is going to happen, but think about it.

When people make statements like

"Acacia wants $1500 up front from webmasters netting $1 to $50,000 in revenue from promoting or selling streaming video content. THEY'LL SPEND WELL IN EXCESS OF $1500 ON EACH LAWSUIT PURSUING EACH WEBMASTER IN THAT CATEGORY WHO DOESN'T SIGN THEIR LICENSE AGREEMENT.

WAR OF ATTRITION."

They are greatly misinforming other webmasters and could very likely get themselves and many others in a lot of trouble. Somebody has to research this stuff and keep people in check.

Flow

JDog · 10-27-2003, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL
These monkeys in Newport Beach are going to get buried in their own hype and bullshit at the rate they're going.

They thought they could shank the adult industry and get away with it.

I live a couple blocks away, I could go bury them in shit! Or atleast their building!

jDoG

Centurion · 10-27-2003, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Flow

And I quote from the US Code.....

To answer your other questions....

1) When you are sued and you lose, the court can cease all of your assets

put you on a monthly payment plan so that you will eventually pay for it, even if it takes you 30 years to do so.

When people make statements like

WAR OF ATTRITION."

They are greatly misinforming other webmasters and could very likely get themselves and many others in a lot of trouble. Somebody has to research this stuff and keep people in check.

Flow

From the top: Thanks for the quote from the U.S. Code but I didn't need it. Yeah, I SAID they could take ALL of your assets, but my point was if you are someone (and alas, I think a great deal of webmasters fit this) who really doesn't have that much in assets to lose, then Acacia sure ain't going to spend the money on you to get back little or nothing. Put them on a monthly plan paying $5.00 a freakin month then. Juries have found people guilty and awarded the prosecution $1.00 (yeah..I know that this is a patent trial..not a criminal trial).

Those that have assets to lose HAVE attornies and will use them if necessary.

The bottom line is that Acacia is NOT some giant octopus that can literally afford to take 100's of adult webmasters to court let alone afford to COLLECT from 100's of webmasters. Even there own people are admitting that they didn't expect to run into such strong opposition as they have.

Stay informed, when in doubt do consult an attorney. I and others have said that from day one. But also don't go to bed at night thinking there is some huge boogey man named Acacia that is about to kick you out of your apt and make you sleep on the street because you use video streaming on the internet.

Oedipus · 10-27-2003, 11:05 PM

I could write the check for treble damages.

Oedipus · 10-27-2003, 11:07 PM

Obtaining a judgment against a party is one thing ... collecting the judgment is whole different ballgame.

Flow · 10-27-2003, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Centurion

From the top: Thanks for the quote from the U.S. Code but I didn't need it. Yeah, I SAID they could take ALL of your assets, but my point was if you are someone (and alas, I think a great deal of webmasters fit this) who really doesn't have that much in assets to lose, then Acacia sure ain't going to spend the money on you to get back little or nothing. Put them on a monthly plan paying $5.00 a freakin month then. Juries have found people guilty and awarded the prosecution $1.00 (yeah..I know that this is a patent trial..not a criminal trial).

Those that have assets to lose HAVE attornies and will use them if necessary.

The bottom line is that Acacia is NOT some giant octopus that can literally afford to take 100's of adult webmasters to court let alone afford to COLLECT from 100's of webmasters. Even there own people are admitting that they didn't expect to run into such strong opposition as they have.

Stay informed, when in doubt do consult an attorney. I and others have said that from day one. But also don't go to bed at night thinking there is some huge boogey man named Acacia that is about to kick you out of your apt and make you sleep on the street because you use video streaming on the internet.

I agree 100%

Mr.Fiction · 10-27-2003, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oedipus
Obtaining a judgment against a party is one thing ... collecting the judgment is whole different ballgame.

Centurion · 10-28-2003, 12:49 AM

After tonight, if there's truly any justice in the world, the ONLY person that Acacia will successfully sue and collect from would be GAG On more commonly known as Grogan!

10-27-2003, 03:53 PM	#1
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	Acacia's current "status". Is this good or bad for us? From http://www.technologymarketing.com/m...ent_id=1899661 Ryan initially targeted three markets: Internet radio, online adult entertainment and on-demand hotel movies. All three of these markets share a similar characteristic?the lack of a dominant player who might be tempted to fight Acacia's claims. By selecting fragmented markets rather than going after big players like MSN or AOL, Acacia hoped to avoid getting embroiled in a debilitating legal battle. "My approach is to get some deals done and get some goodwill," says Rob Berman, Acacia's senior vp of business development. "I don't want to end up in the bowels of legal hell."

10-27-2003, 04:12 PM	#7
KRL Entrepreneur Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 31,429	These monkeys in Newport Beach are going to get buried in their own hype and bullshit at the rate they're going. They thought they could shank the adult industry and get away with it. __________________ If you would like to develop your domains, you can lease inexpensive foreign labor from the leaders in the field at iWebmasters.com TO LOWER YOUR COSTS AND INCREASE YOUR PRODUCTION! * * * * * * * * * * * * Domains Adult News KRL's Newsletter Biz Tips Just Listed Domains

10-27-2003, 05:04 PM	#9
Tuga Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Portugal Posts: 7,678	Nice reading, but why so many posts? __________________ Go Fuck Yourself! ICQ 101411627

10-27-2003, 05:10 PM	#10
BRISK Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,240	Right now the worst scenario for Acacia is happening. Webmasters aren't settling, their case against Holio got thrown out of court, and it looks more and more likely that they will have to take court action against every single patent infringer just to get their money. The one single thing Acacia does NOT want to do is take legal action against all these thousands of webmasters just to get their money. Acacia knows they won't make any money that way because legal action costs big money (even if they win). For Acacia, legal action = bad I predict in January that Acacia might take legal action against 10 medium size adult companies in an attempt to scare the rest of the industry into paying again, but they really really don't want to have to do that. __________________ I post on GFY so that when people ask me what I do, I can tell them that I work with the mentally retarded.

10-27-2003, 06:45 PM	#19
icedemon Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Lutz, FL Posts: 1,022	I don't see why Acacia doesn't just plain quit while they are ahead and go after some other group. Going after colleges is another bad move by them. I'm starting to wonder how much brains the guys at Acacia actually have. __________________ Clips4Sale.com

10-27-2003, 03:54 PM	#2
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	Continued.. Going after the adult firms was a spectacular miscalculation, according to Greg Piccionelli, an Internet attorney with Los Angeles-based Brull, Piccionelli, Sarno & Vradenburgh, who often represents adult entertainment firms on first amendment issues. "Many of these Internet firms have ties to the larger adult entertainment business, which generates as much as $40 billion each year, more than the entire professional sports industry," he explains. The larger adult firms banded into a coalition and refused to pay. Acacia then initiated patent infringement litigation in the U.S. District Court of the Central District of California against 39 adult entertainment companies.

10-27-2003, 03:55 PM	#3
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	Continued: The coalition responded by retaining the services of Fish & Richardson, which handles more patent litigation than any other U.S. law firm. "Our clients feel very strongly that they do not infringe these patents and that these patents are completely invalid, based upon preliminary reviews of the prosecution history of the patent, the technology of the clients, and the prior art that was not disclosed at the patent office," says attorney Juanita Brooks. The case is now making its way slowly through the courts, squelching Ryan's hope for some easy cash and a quick PR victory. So much for marketing momentum.

10-27-2003, 03:56 PM	#4
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	Continued: For Ryan the situation is clearly frustrating. "These companies will end up spending more on litigation than if they just paid the fees," he fumes. Attorney Dorman is equally dismissive of the adult entertainment firms. "These companies are so used to people challenging their business on first amendment grounds that they constantly feel victimized," he says. "They're not sophisticated enough to realize that this patent action is just standard procedure in mainstream businesses."

10-27-2003, 03:57 PM	#5
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	and finally.. The question now is whether Acacia can afford to fight a drawn-out battle. The company has some $40 million in cash, but its burn rate (without the extra expense of litigation) is around $4 million to $5 million a year. Patent lawsuits can cost anywhere from $1 million to $3 million to litigate, and if every industry proves as scrappy as the adult entertainment folks, Acacia could find its war chest shrinking before it can make good on its claims. Indeed, there's no sign that the on-demand hotel movie companies, for example, intend to comply with Acacia's demands. (Both LodgeNet and On Command declined to comment for this story.) Meanwhile, Acacia's Media Technology group has almost no income. While Acacia noted in its most recent quarterly report that it had entered into 18 license agreements for its streaming media technology, that amount wasn't enough to stem a $1.5 million quarterly loss. It's a poor performance for a company that's already in trouble. License revenues for the v-chip fell from around $10 million a quarter in 2001 to a measly $43,000 a quarter in 2002. To make matters worse, the licensing deals that Acacia has struck for its streaming media patent are apparently too small to produce much revenue. One of the eight adult entertainment deals that Acacia is touting won the company only a one-time $500 payment, according to Farrell Timlake, president of adult site Homegrownvideo.com. But the real indicator that Acacia's strategy is stalled is the company's moribund stock (Nasdaq: ACTG), which has been hovering at under $1.50 a share, cumulatively less than Acacia's cash on hand. The strategy isn't flying with investors.

10-27-2003, 04:02 PM	#6
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	I forgot to add who wrote this article: Geoffrey James (www.geoffreyjames.com) is a frequent TM contributor and the author of numerous books. I was actually fairly encouraged by what I read. Granted the article is like 3 months old..so don't zap me if all of this has been posted before. Just thought it would be good material for folks who didn't know any of this before now. Any input?

10-27-2003, 04:54 PM	#8
papa56 Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 155	Wow..Thanks for posting that...very encouraging.

10-27-2003, 05:18 PM	#11
rooster Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,384	its definitely bad for acacia. Their stock plumeted even after hyping the signings of hustler, vivid. Now the confidence in that stock is shaky at best. And acacia still has to fight their battle against impai, and probably a handful of other legal cases against them will emerge. And very small amounts of revenue coming in. Its a no win situation, why the fuckers even attempted this stupid scheme is beyond me.

10-27-2003, 06:10 PM	#15
sm00ty Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 146	coming soon - bermangetsbanged.com featuring streaming videos

10-27-2003, 07:48 PM	#21
Oedipus Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 190	Acacia wants $1500 up front from webmasters netting $1 to $50,000 in revenue from promoting or selling streaming video content. THEY'LL SPEND WELL IN EXCESS OF $1500 ON EACH LAWSUIT PURSUING EACH WEBMASTER IN THAT CATEGORY WHO DOESN'T SIGN THEIR LICENSE AGREEMENT. WAR OF ATTRITION.

10-27-2003, 09:46 PM	#26
basschick Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: el lay, ca usa Posts: 2,540	that was a very interesting read. thanks! __________________ Got Gay and For Women Traffic?

10-27-2003, 09:48 PM	#27
neewwman Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA Posts: 1,737	Fuck those fucking fuckers. __________________ Porn Wealth Everything the newbie adult webmaster needs to know. Buy it, or sell it through our 50% affiliate program!

10-27-2003, 11:05 PM	#33
Oedipus Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 190	I could write the check for treble damages.

10-27-2003, 11:07 PM	#34
Oedipus Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 190	Obtaining a judgment against a party is one thing ... collecting the judgment is whole different ballgame.

10-28-2003, 12:49 AM	#37
Centurion Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: SeATtle Posts: 6,033	After tonight, if there's truly any justice in the world, the ONLY person that Acacia will successfully sue and collect from would be GAG On more commonly known as Grogan!