What does it take to get webmaster to leave a PPS program for %? - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

bigdog · 09-23-2003, 07:19 PM

i think that most revhsare programs have to start paying more then 50/50 and 60/40.They are getting exit traffic,emails, and upsells in the members area.Also when someone tries to cancel their membership you offer them a lower monthly price to get some to stick around

swami · 09-23-2003, 07:22 PM

Mr fiction said

Quote:

With the justice department and credit card companies getting ready to tag team the adult industry, many smart people are looking to get their money up front.

The way things are going at the moment i am looking for a sponsor who will pay me in advance

EscortBiz · 09-23-2003, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction
With the justice department and credit card companies getting ready to tag team the adult industry, many smart people are looking to get their money up front.

I don't care how much you trust someone or how long they have been around, if A-s-h-c-r-f-t knocks on your sponsor's door, you're going to wish you had done PPS.

Is anyone going to get paid rebills by this company:
http://www.girlspooping.com/

yup exactly the reason to make sure when you promote a PPS program that they dont pay you PS because they defraud the surfer, because guess what you will get locked up even if you are an affiliate, they made it very clear at that penispill trial that they will enforce the rules related to porn and such using the RICO act, good luck

besterman · 09-23-2003, 07:28 PM

I cannot say enough about revshare, it is absolutely the best for those who are serious about building a long term business. It's the next closest thing to having your own paysite and the extremely powerful magic of royalty based income. Work once and get paid many times over. If the site is fantastic and the company financially stable, your long term wealth is very much secured, and if not, well, choosing that sponsor is the most important decision...

SteveLightspeed · 09-23-2003, 07:28 PM

This is my 1000th post, so I'll try to make it an intelligent one.

There are good reasons to send to a pps sponsor, and good reasons to send to a revshare sponsor. To those who say "all that matters is the size of your check at the end of the day" I'd offer up these points:

a) Is your sponsor paying you fairly for your traffic? Maybe you got a big check, but maybe you should have got an even bigger check.

b) Does your sponsor offer good sales tools? Free Content? Hosted Galleries? Pic of the Day? other sales tools?

c) Does your sponsor have good support? What if you have problems? Can you reach someone who cares about you?

d) What if your sponsor gets fucked by a shitty billing company, would they pay you anyway, or stick you with the loss?

e) Does your sponsor actively look for ways to make you more money, or do they only look for ways to make themselves more money?

f) Does your sponsor give a flying fuck about the surfer's experience? or just the sale?

g) Does your sponsor have sites that are appealing, or do they just try to copy the latest craze?

There is a lot more to think about than how much you get paid, and how soon you get your check.

Try calling your sponsor on the phone. How many of them will return your call?

There, 1000 down! Hope my advice doesn't fall on deaf ears.

Steve Lightspeed

EscortBiz · 09-23-2003, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lightspeed
This is my 1000th post, so I'll try to make it an intelligent one.

There are good reasons to send to a pps sponsor, and good reasons to send to a revshare sponsor. To those who say "all that matters is the size of your check at the end of the day" I'd offer up these points:

a) Is your sponsor paying you fairly for your traffic? Maybe you got a big check, but maybe you should have got an even bigger check.

b) Does your sponsor offer good sales tools? Free Content? Hosted Galleries? Pic of the Day? other sales tools?

c) Does your sponsor have good support? What if you have problems? Can you reach someone who cares about you?

d) What if your sponsor gets fucked by a shitty billing company, would they pay you anyway, or stick you with the loss?

e) Does your sponsor actively look for ways to make you more money, or do they only look for ways to make themselves more money?

f) Does your sponsor give a flying fuck about the surfer's experience? or just the sale?

g) Does your sponsor have sites that are appealing, or do they just try to copy the latest craze?

There is a lot more to think about than how much you get paid, and how soon you get your check.

Try calling your sponsor on the phone. How many of them will return your call?

There, 1000 down! Hope my advice doesn't fall on deaf ears.

Steve Lightspeed

very well put and congrats on the 1000

09-23-2003, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lightspeed
This is my 1000th post, so I'll try to make it an intelligent one.

There are good reasons to send to a pps sponsor, and good reasons to send to a revshare sponsor. To those who say "all that matters is the size of your check at the end of the day" I'd offer up these points:

a) Is your sponsor paying you fairly for your traffic? Maybe you got a big check, but maybe you should have got an even bigger check.

b) Does your sponsor offer good sales tools? Free Content? Hosted Galleries? Pic of the Day? other sales tools?

c) Does your sponsor have good support? What if you have problems? Can you reach someone who cares about you?

d) What if your sponsor gets fucked by a shitty billing company, would they pay you anyway, or stick you with the loss?

e) Does your sponsor actively look for ways to make you more money, or do they only look for ways to make themselves more money?

f) Does your sponsor give a flying fuck about the surfer's experience? or just the sale?

g) Does your sponsor have sites that are appealing, or do they just try to copy the latest craze?

There is a lot more to think about than how much you get paid, and how soon you get your check.

Try calling your sponsor on the phone. How many of them will return your call?

There, 1000 down! Hope my advice doesn't fall on deaf ears.

Steve Lightspeed

very well put.

09-23-2003, 07:43 PM

I personally prefer to promote sites that have character. Sites from smaller programs that are appealing, that don't have the same old pattern to them, sites that are backed by people that care about the webmaster and his traffic.

Most PS programs seem to release only the same old crap with no character whatsoever. That's why I personally prefer partnerships. I can check out the site's member areas beforehand (which large program will give a fuck to show you the memberarea anyway) and make myself a good picture on whether the surfer will retain or not. % rocks. Still have year old signups recurring for me, and it made me tons more money than a PS ever would.

BlackCrayon · 09-23-2003, 07:44 PM

without reading all the replies, i'll say what most probably said -rentention -

i recently tried out a revshare program for a few days, i sold 24 trials, only 4 converted to monthlys. quite a waste in my opinion. revshare is a risk, it could end up paying off more or you could end up losing. also the risk of the site closing and losing all rebills or the processing company. im not put off revshare sites but i don't think i would use them exclusively.

Stud Money · 09-23-2003, 07:44 PM

Having a revshare program ourselves this may come as a shock to some however, as a general rul eof thumb and this is somehting that we have always stood by as a company...

Webmasters shouldnt leave PPS for recurring programs at all.

Instead they should use them as a compliment to the PPS sponsors sites that they currently utilize.

As has already been mentioned webmasters tend to use PPS sponsors to get a quick no fuss cash flow and building up your recurring incomes can take several months.

However, by offering recurring programs in addition to per signup sponsors on exit consoles once the surfer has left their site which promote PPS sponsor this gives the webmaster a way to build up long term recurring incomes during those times when PPS programs just dont seem to work.

We have all seen posts on the boards complaining about almost every major per signup sponsor and that sales 'are down' for certain pay periods well, by utilizing recurring income programs in addition to PPS affiliate programs even when PPS sales are low the webmasters can still be making money from the recurring program signup that they got X amount of months ago.

Many recurring programs seem to tell webmasters the only way they will make money is by using those types of programs exclusively this is simply not the case.

We already offer our surfers alternatives in the sites they can join why not offer our businesses an additional way to make long term, recurring incomes whilst at the same time still promoting the base of sites that you know do convert for you presently, once the periods where PPS sales drop, you will be glad of the additional recurring incomes you generate.

09-23-2003, 07:46 PM

Not to mention the fact that I sleep well at night because I know that my % sponsor ain't scrubbing my check at night.

slapass · 09-23-2003, 09:13 PM

i have a couple of programs if they offered PPS i would not switch and one of those sites is Steve Lightspeeds. BUT I know of a dozen revshares that if they had PPS i would push them again.
Nothing sucks like getting 5 trials and zero converting. Send a a couple k of traffic for $12.47 or whatever the trial split works out to.

Donnie Gangsta · 09-23-2003, 09:32 PM

My opinion:

Revshare:

1) Only good if you can do at least 30-50 sales per day.

This industry is all about #'s. The most annoying thing is when affiliates bitch because they don't have any sign ups when they sent 2000 clicks. They don't realize that in the next 1000, they could get 5 joins, to balance out their ratio. If you can pull that many sales, and assuming the sponsor stays up, even with a shit site, revshare would be better after 6 months.

2) Only do revshare if you trust the sponsor

I honestly would not recommend revshare in the current climate. I would actually recommend doing per sign up and saving every dime until it's clear what will happen with the billing companies. It is not good to lose your revshare money, obviously

Per Sign Up:

1) Do this if you have lower amounts of traffic

Since as I stated above, this is all about averages, the sponsor's entire affiliate portfolio might convert at 30% and make an average of $50+ per sign up, but this does not mean your little 5-10 daily sales will.

2) Do this with the current climate

Just the exact opposite of what I said above... gravy train might be stopping soon, so it's probably best to save all of your money.

e2raygun · 09-23-2003, 09:34 PM

socalcash

any plans to add any more sites to your portfolio? How about an ebony site? some nice hot socal ebony babes... and/or some kind of anal site? socal anal babes...

also, how about just pushing your program a little more. I'm sure there alot of guys who dont know about socal cash...

Sharky · 09-23-2003, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Equinox
Not to mention the fact that I sleep well at night because I know that my % sponsor ain't scrubbing my check at night.

how well would you sleep if the % sponsors processor fell of the face of the earth? all the recurrings you live from will be gone.

sending to PPS doesn't give you recurring.. but it does give you money up front and piece of mind that you can change links to another sponsor with little or no hiccup in income!

Mutt · 09-23-2003, 09:39 PM

huh? why would you encourage Socalcash to push their program harder to webmasters? i'm sure the guys who are making bank with the program secretly hope nobody else starts promoting them .......... and they're right, who wants to compete with 2,000 other webmasters actively promoting a site?

e2raygun · 09-23-2003, 09:43 PM

Mutt,

you have a point....

He asked how to get more webmasters, I just gave a suggestion.. but your 100% right. we need to keep it on the down low

chowda · 09-23-2003, 09:45 PM

i think we can solve this by saying its a matter of caring.

if its a revshare program, YOU have as much to gain as the program. since ur both aiming to increase retention...

with a pps. i dont give a fuck what they do in the backend. i get my money. im happy. if they have cross sales and shit like that, let them figure it out how to squeeze more money from them. my job is finished.

09-23-2003, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sharky

how well would you sleep if the % sponsors processor fell of the face of the earth? all the recurrings you live from will be gone.

sending to PPS doesn't give you recurring.. but it does give you money up front and piece of mind that you can change links to another sponsor with little or no hiccup in income!

This doesn't make any sense. If my recurring sponsor fell off the face of the earth, I'd have to change links. I would also have to change links if a PPS sponsor crapped out on me. And the new signups that I generate daily would just not go towards retaining members but to PPS programs. The flexibility is there, no matter what. It would just hurt that the recurring income would break off.

09-23-2003, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by chowda

with a pps. i dont give a fuck what they do in the backend. i get my money. im happy. if they have cross sales and shit like that, let them figure it out how to squeeze more money from them. my job is finished.

See, this is exactly a common thought process in this business: Fuck the surfer, I did. Why care about what the sponsor does with its members inside the member area. I don't give a fuck if their email addresses are being sold in optin lists, I don't give a fuck what crap they will offer the surfer to cross sell to, and I even care less if the member area really offers what I told the surfer about... fuck the surfer, I did! At least I will get my $35 bucks a pop, and the rest... I don't give a fuck. Maybe the surfer will be so frustrated with what he spend $30 bucks on, that he'll never sign up for a paysite again. As you said, your job is finished when the surfer enters his CC numbers in the signup form.

I prefer earning the surfer's trust. Being a webmaster, I want to tell the surfer what is being offered for his buck, and I want him to be satisfied with what he paid for. I even want him to come back and buy more from me. Surely PPS programs live off retention as well, however, I just don't trust them as much as I do % programs. From own observation I have the feeling that % programs simply offer *better* paysites.

Just my thoughts at late hour.

SleazyDream · 09-23-2003, 10:05 PM

lol - this of course depends on your defination of big boys in this industry.

aff and lars do percentage. they're bigger than most that say they are big boys.

chowda · 09-23-2003, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Equinox

See, this is exactly a common thought process in this business: Fuck the surfer, I did. Why care about what the sponsor does with its members inside the member area. I don't give a fuck if their email addresses are being sold in optin lists, I don't give a fuck what crap they will offer the surfer to cross sell to, and I even care less if the member area really offers what I told the surfer about... fuck the surfer, I did! At least I will get my $35 bucks a pop, and the rest... I don't give a fuck. Maybe the surfer will be so frustrated with what he spend $30 bucks on, that he'll never sign up for a paysite again. As you said, your job is finished when the surfer enters his CC numbers in the signup form.

I prefer earning the surfer's trust. Being a webmaster, I want to tell the surfer what is being offered for his buck, and I want him to be satisfied with what he paid for. I even want him to come back and buy more from me. Surely PPS programs live off retention as well, however, I just don't trust them as much as I do % programs. From own observation I have the feeling that % programs simply offer *better* paysites.

Just my thoughts at late hour.

well, if i had a personal site where ppl come in and i promote crappy pps. then yes, i know i would be fucking surfers and they wouldnt come again. But if i have a freesite/gallery/fpa on SE floating around then my job is to sell whatever they might be interested in. It boogles my mind how ppl can give me 35-40bux for every trial sale but thats not my concern. thats program owners like adult.com (who knows what to do) concern.

Donny · 09-23-2003, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mike AI
but eventually going PPS is the only way to make it to the big leagues.

I disagree 1,000 percent. I know you've been around a long time and are well established and respected, but that statement is dead wrong.

Let me give 3 examples, all of sites that are bigger than most will EVER be:

KarupsPC
ATK (Amateur and Teen Kingdom)
Offworld Media Group (Twinks.com, AuntJudys.com)

These guys do NOT offer pay per sign up. And ATK is currently not even taking new affiliates. All former affiliates are strictly on revshare.

sexyavs · 09-23-2003, 10:23 PM

If people think that because someone is paying revshare it makes them honest or that it tracks all signups..they are a retard.. everyone can be shaved...

I wouldnt use a partnership for all the rice in china..when this 1% hits, I wouldnt want to be relying on someone else unless they are going to publicly open up their stats which would be dumb on their part..but otherwise I want no part of it..

If partnerships would pay me more etc..then do me a favor.. PAY ME LESS..and just pay me per signup!

Chris

m0rph3us · 09-23-2003, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DonovanPhillips

I disagree 1,000 percent. I know you've been around a long time and are well established and respected, but that statement is dead wrong.

Let me give 3 examples, all of sites that are bigger than most will EVER be:

KarupsPC
ATK (Amateur and Teen Kingdom)
Offworld Media Group (Twinks.com, AuntJudys.com)

These guys do NOT offer pay per sign up. And ATK is currently not even taking new affiliates. All former affiliates are strictly on revshare.

big members area != large revenue

FUCKuPAYme · 09-23-2003, 10:45 PM

Its all a numbers game. companies in it for the long haul have lots of money so they pay per trial.

rev programs are for the small to mid companies who can't afford to take risks. on PPS your dealing with large volume lower profits.

this year you will see alot of companies go out of business so why risk on rev. share when you can get paid up front on a trial.

if anything the pps model will get stronger

FUCKuPAYme · 09-23-2003, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by swami
Mr fiction said

The way things are going at the moment i am looking for a sponsor who will pay me in advance

Talk to pornkings.com they sometimes pay in advance cause they know how well they convert.

Yanks_Todd · 09-23-2003, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FUCKuPAYme
Its all a numbers game. companies in it for the long haul have lots of money so they pay per trial.

rev programs are for the small to mid companies who can't afford to take risks. on PPS your dealing with large volume lower profits.

this year you will see alot of companies go out of business so why risk on rev. share when you can get paid up front on a trial.

if anything the pps model will get stronger

But there will always be big money in finding the small quality rev share who will be big.

FUCKuPAYme · 09-23-2003, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DonovanPhillips

I disagree 1,000 percent. I know you've been around a long time and are well established and respected, but that statement is dead wrong.

Let me give 3 examples, all of sites that are bigger than most will EVER be:

KarupsPC
ATK (Amateur and Teen Kingdom)
Offworld Media Group (Twinks.com, AuntJudys.com)

These guys do NOT offer pay per sign up. And ATK is currently not even taking new affiliates. All former affiliates are strictly on revshare.

how do you know they are really doing well?

maybe they can't afford to pay webmasters up front they might not have the resources involved.
It takes alot to run a webmaster program with all the fraud etc.

I only trust programs right now with deep pockets paying per trial not even per sign up

FUCKuPAYme · 09-23-2003, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Yanks_Todd

But there will always be big money in finding the small quality rev share who will be big.

you keep believing that

I plan on getting paid and you won't hear me bitching about not getting paid or not converting. I stick to the guys who understand the business and not all the BS talked about on the boards.

Mutt · 09-23-2003, 11:07 PM

Both ATK and Karups do fabulously well. Could they do better if they offered per signup? Dunno. I think they are doing so well that they just don't want to deal with the headaches and liabilities that PPS brings, they don't even push their revshare programs hard and ATK is picky as to whom they will even allow to send them traffic on a revshare basis. Mel Brooks said it best 'It's good to be the king!'

Those two brand names are so strong that thousands and thousands of signups find their way to those sites all on their own.

More and more people are waking up to the fact that exclusive content is the way to go long term - guarantee you that no program spends as much on exclusive content as ATK, not even Bangbros who run several exclusive content sites across two programs.

Mutt · 09-23-2003, 11:09 PM

hmmmmmmmm....... actually doing rough calculation, Bangbros/Ox/Nasty together would spend about the equivalent of ATK on fresh content.

KCat · 09-24-2003, 12:22 AM

From an affiliate standpoint, I prefer per signup. My job is to deliver the surfer & get him to sign up. It's the sponsor's job to retain him, not mine.

Matt_WildCash · 09-24-2003, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by swami
There is too many variables with recurring.I got stung by Largecash doing %
I was only getting 1out of 10 renewing their trial and whenever I complained they just said it was an aberration.After 6 weeks of screaming it turns out the credit card wasn't automatically rebilling .
Fuck me fuckn drunk!
I get 700 signups amonth and I would seriously like to do % but I havent found anyone i trust enough.

Simple fact, DON'T do Percentages with big boy programs, they SUCK ass at recurring. I mean they charge $39.95 +cross sells and you can be sure the recurring sucks ass with that. Tell the truth I have no idea how these big boys keep paying out $35 per signup cause there recurring is just plain scary. I think they make a lot on mass emailing there current members with offers to there other sites. + I'm 100% sure some are shaving a certain percentage to stop themselfs losing money.

50/50 $20-30 program kick ass when done professionally and properly, the recurring with unique members areas and A LOT of members content and daily updates. We added daily updates to our members video area a new big ass 25 minute clip in 4 formats ever day and our recurring is now rocking

ControlThy · 09-24-2003, 02:46 AM

I am about to launch a program paying per signup for mature traffic, but no where near 40 USD per signup. The reason for this is that there will be no exit consoles and no crossbilling. (and third party statistics.)

I hope people will give it a chance

ControlThy · 09-24-2003, 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by FUCKuPAYme

I only trust programs right now with deep pockets paying per trial not even per sign up

So, if some program opens tomorrow paying 40 USD per trial you will go straight to them? Without even asking yourself how they can afford it, since they are new?

It is not like you can check if the people behind a program have good financial backing unless they have been around long. (like Adult.com, CECash, HiRise, etc.)

scooby doo as scooby does · 09-24-2003, 04:46 AM

I basically run my own sites, but I have a fair few 'serious' traffic generating sites (forums, reviews etc.). So way back I decided to push other peoples pay sites (bit of variety wouldn't hurt ?

). I started with the glamourous PPS. So much up front! Bit down the line I decided to try a couple of revshare programs. After 6 months or so of that, now it's all revshare. Not a PPS in sight. Not saying revshare is for everyone, but it knocks spots of PPS for me. I'm still getting paid for signups I generated over a year ago. Thats over $200 for one signup and still increasing. No PPS can compete with that.

Yes - it takes (way) longer to get the cash, yes - you need to watch who the processor is. yes - you have to be way, way, way more picky with the sites you promote. But no point in having experience in this biz if you don't use it

slavdogg · 09-24-2003, 05:33 AM

Revshares are for newbies

PPS is for real webmasters that know #s

jayeff · 09-24-2003, 05:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by FUCKuPAYme
how do you know they are really doing well?

From personal experience I know that two of those three perform brilliantly, leaving every PPS program in the shade. I would add score-cash to that list as well.

Unrelated to your post, but to avoid posting twice, I will also add that it seems to be a popular idea that revshare programs are automatically honest. At the very least that is naive. In fact if I wanted really cheap signups that I could play the same tricks on that some PPS sponsors are guilty of, what better way than revshare?

The payment method doesn't affect site quality or program honesty. Those are entirely down to the business practises of individual program operators.

09-24-2003, 05:47 AM

good thread

09-24-2003, 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by slavdogg
Revshares are for newbies

PPS is for real webmasters that know #s

Bullshit. Your preformance as a webmasters is measured as amount of signups per traffic. How the money rolls in is personal preference.

slapass · 09-24-2003, 06:01 AM

I think it is funny that revshare has 2 arguments:

1) PPS has to fuck the surfer to pay that kind of money.

2) in the long run you make more with revshare.

I doubt nastydollars is having rebill problems on their shit.

gin · 09-24-2003, 06:04 AM

certainly not only 60% revshare, expecially when you are cross selling to 2 other sites at 39.95$ which rebills before the main site does. so the affiliate get's a trial sign up. they get slammed with 2 cross sales at 80$ before they are charged for their membership which they only get 60% rev share. next month they will probably not have as much money on their credit card because they most likely didn't know they had those cross sales checked. so they will get rebilled for 1 or 2 of the cross sales and the main site which the affiliate get's the sale for will be denied because they don't have enough money on their credit card. paid trials should convert 50 - 80% depending on niche. but then they will be ass raped by the charge backs because of your cross sales, 60% rev share with 2 cross sales which are worth 4 times the value of the original sale is more like 20% rev share to the webmaster

Darren · 09-24-2003, 06:29 AM

Well I will offer $50 per a signup to anyone can do over 10 signups a day with me.

On these sites.

www.raremoviesite.com
www.mens-network.com
www.volumepills.com
www.prosolutionpills.com

No shaving, no cross sales, u get paid on exit popups etc.

Bex · 09-24-2003, 06:46 AM

I agree that partnership for the most part is better on a higher volume of sales. And yes a recurring income base does take a while to build up. And money up front is awfully nice. Recurring may be better in the long run, but you have bills to pay today.
So why not utilize both?
Do your PPS take your upfront money and build your recurring at the same time ... once your recurring is built up you will have 2 very nice rev streams.

Carrie · 09-24-2003, 06:56 AM

Breaking away from the PPS/Revshare argument and getting back to the question at hand... and these answers aren't just for revshare sponsors, they're for any sponsor.

I don't need free hosting. I'm in this for the long haul, I know there are costs to running a business - I have my own domains and my own servers. Offering free hosting invites questionable webmasters, IMO.
I don't need free hosted galleries.
I don't need free hosted free sites.
I don't need gallery generators, or free site generators. I know the business takes work to make money and I'm willing to do that.

What I need/want is:
- a user/pass to go in to your site(s) and look around, maybe take some screencaps. The better I can truthfully get excited about what's inside, the better I can sell it. Even if the password only works for an hour - hell I only need 15 minutes to see if your member's area will retain.

- content; preferably of the girls that are on the tour. Don't watermark it, don't resize it to 450max pixels (I can't use it unless it's 550 or 600 on the long side), and at least 15 *softcore* pics. Sure, the 40-pic sets for webmasters to use sound nice, but if 35 of them are insertion then I can't use them. The surfer's going to get off before he even gets to your tour.
By watermarking I mean putting a URL on there - I don't care if your logo is on the pics, but putting a full URL on the pics is a fucking insult - could you attempt to steal my traffic any more blatantly? Why not just put a little picture of a razor next to the URL also to add insult to injury?

- an option to send to a clean tour, whether it is an alternate URL or a variable on the URL that signals no pops, so that I can send PPC traffic etc straight to your tour.

- FPAs that are coded correctly. It truly sucks to have to go through an FPA and fix broken tables, bad coding, and screwed up (or conveniently forgotten) affiliate links.

- Decent odd-sized banners that don't look like my 5-yr old made them.

- Clean site logos available for us to use would be *truly* helpful, to save us the time of screen-capping your tour and then having to mask out the girl/text/images that are intruding onto the site logo.

- Referral URLs or traffic tracking via URL varialbes in the stats area. Let me know which traffic is performing best.

I have one sponsor that will allow me to send him URLs of content sets for his site that I've seen, he'll buy them and put them in his member's area and then make them available for my use in promoting his site. We both get something out of it and I can be assured the surfer will find that girl in the site.

If you don't offer free content, then at least be willing to tell me where you bought yours so that I can go grab a set to use in promotion. And I'm talking a set or two, not a $500 CD. I'm NOT going to spend $500 just to promote your site.

If you've got a microniche that you understand but I might not, then take the time to post some URLs where I can research the niche OR write up a small article telling me how best to sell it (ie: for BBW it's better to play up how fun-loving and happy she is rather than capitalizing on what a huge disgusting pig she is etc).

I really like the talk of "signup OR %age, whichever is more" that has popped up in this thread. I'd like to see a full list of sponsors that offer that.

scoreman · 09-24-2003, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by FUCKuPAYme

how do you know they are really doing well?

maybe they can't afford to pay webmasters up front they might not have the resources involved.
It takes alot to run a webmaster program with all the fraud etc.

nicchick · 09-28-2003, 01:13 AM

I ran a gallery about 18 months ago and got a grand total of 2 sign-ups at $14.97 each. However both the guys who signed up have stayed with it and now, a year and a half later, I've made over 500 bucks from them.
I think you have to do both types and really diversify when it comes to promoting sponsors. It doesn't happen as often as you might think, but people do go bad in this business and people get stiffed.

Rorschach · 09-28-2003, 02:53 AM

What Carrie said... It constantly pisses me off that in a sense my payouts are being affected by the cost of the sponsor's webmaster promotions and all that newbie "free" stuff.

bigdog · 09-28-2003, 08:52 AM

well i have signed up for a couple partnership programs and they are loseing lots of money but not doing some things the top sponsors are doing.

1) They don't email their members at all.That is just plain stupid
2) No upsells in the members area .Offer them a big penise site or dating site
3) Offer the surfers a lower monthly membership price when they try to cancel the membership or offer more sites for the same price
4) Even when the surfer cancels add their user name and password to your own free avs site with only your sites inside.So later on maybe you can sell them again.This is like haveing a tgp where everyone has used their credit card before to buy porn
5) How about some exit consoles

09-23-2003, 07:19 PM	#51
bigdog Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,964	i think that most revhsare programs have to start paying more then 50/50 and 60/40.They are getting exit traffic,emails, and upsells in the members area.Also when someone tries to cancel their membership you offer them a lower monthly price to get some to stick around Last edited by bigdog; 09-23-2003 at 07:23 PM..

09-23-2003, 07:28 PM	#55
SteveLightspeed Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Lightspeedworld Posts: 7,940	This is my 1000th post, so I'll try to make it an intelligent one. There are good reasons to send to a pps sponsor, and good reasons to send to a revshare sponsor. To those who say "all that matters is the size of your check at the end of the day" I'd offer up these points: a) Is your sponsor paying you fairly for your traffic? Maybe you got a big check, but maybe you should have got an even bigger check. b) Does your sponsor offer good sales tools? Free Content? Hosted Galleries? Pic of the Day? other sales tools? c) Does your sponsor have good support? What if you have problems? Can you reach someone who cares about you? d) What if your sponsor gets fucked by a shitty billing company, would they pay you anyway, or stick you with the loss? e) Does your sponsor actively look for ways to make you more money, or do they only look for ways to make themselves more money? f) Does your sponsor give a flying fuck about the surfer's experience? or just the sale? g) Does your sponsor have sites that are appealing, or do they just try to copy the latest craze? There is a lot more to think about than how much you get paid, and how soon you get your check. Try calling your sponsor on the phone. How many of them will return your call? There, 1000 down! Hope my advice doesn't fall on deaf ears. Steve Lightspeed __________________ Abra-cadabra! Last edited by SteveLightspeed; 09-23-2003 at 07:32 PM..

09-23-2003, 07:44 PM	#59
BlackCrayon Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Ottawa Posts: 19,631	without reading all the replies, i'll say what most probably said -rentention - i recently tried out a revshare program for a few days, i sold 24 trials, only 4 converted to monthlys. quite a waste in my opinion. revshare is a risk, it could end up paying off more or you could end up losing. also the risk of the site closing and losing all rebills or the processing company. im not put off revshare sites but i don't think i would use them exclusively. __________________ you don't know you're wearing a leash if you sit by the peg all day..

09-23-2003, 09:34 PM	#64
e2raygun Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: usa Posts: 62	socalcash any plans to add any more sites to your portfolio? How about an ebony site? some nice hot socal ebony babes... and/or some kind of anal site? socal anal babes... also, how about just pushing your program a little more. I'm sure there alot of guys who dont know about socal cash... __________________ Submit Your Sites to http://bigtimebookmarks.com

09-23-2003, 09:39 PM	#66
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	huh? why would you encourage Socalcash to push their program harder to webmasters? i'm sure the guys who are making bank with the program secretly hope nobody else starts promoting them .......... and they're right, who wants to compete with 2,000 other webmasters actively promoting a site? __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

09-23-2003, 07:28 PM	#54
besterman Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 623	I cannot say enough about revshare, it is absolutely the best for those who are serious about building a long term business. It's the next closest thing to having your own paysite and the extremely powerful magic of royalty based income. Work once and get paid many times over. If the site is fantastic and the company financially stable, your long term wealth is very much secured, and if not, well, choosing that sponsor is the most important decision...

09-23-2003, 07:43 PM	#58
X37375787 Guest Posts: n/a	I personally prefer to promote sites that have character. Sites from smaller programs that are appealing, that don't have the same old pattern to them, sites that are backed by people that care about the webmaster and his traffic. Most PS programs seem to release only the same old crap with no character whatsoever. That's why I personally prefer partnerships. I can check out the site's member areas beforehand (which large program will give a fuck to show you the memberarea anyway) and make myself a good picture on whether the surfer will retain or not. % rocks. Still have year old signups recurring for me, and it made me tons more money than a PS ever would.

09-23-2003, 07:44 PM	#60
Stud Money So Fucking Banned Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Somewhere between my monitor and my chair Posts: 3,214	Having a revshare program ourselves this may come as a shock to some however, as a general rul eof thumb and this is somehting that we have always stood by as a company... Webmasters shouldnt leave PPS for recurring programs at all. Instead they should use them as a compliment to the PPS sponsors sites that they currently utilize. As has already been mentioned webmasters tend to use PPS sponsors to get a quick no fuss cash flow and building up your recurring incomes can take several months. However, by offering recurring programs in addition to per signup sponsors on exit consoles once the surfer has left their site which promote PPS sponsor this gives the webmaster a way to build up long term recurring incomes during those times when PPS programs just dont seem to work. We have all seen posts on the boards complaining about almost every major per signup sponsor and that sales 'are down' for certain pay periods well, by utilizing recurring income programs in addition to PPS affiliate programs even when PPS sales are low the webmasters can still be making money from the recurring program signup that they got X amount of months ago. Many recurring programs seem to tell webmasters the only way they will make money is by using those types of programs exclusively this is simply not the case. We already offer our surfers alternatives in the sites they can join why not offer our businesses an additional way to make long term, recurring incomes whilst at the same time still promoting the base of sites that you know do convert for you presently, once the periods where PPS sales drop, you will be glad of the additional recurring incomes you generate.

09-23-2003, 07:46 PM	#61
X37375787 Guest Posts: n/a	Not to mention the fact that I sleep well at night because I know that my % sponsor ain't scrubbing my check at night.

09-23-2003, 09:13 PM	#62
slapass Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 14,622	i have a couple of programs if they offered PPS i would not switch and one of those sites is Steve Lightspeeds. BUT I know of a dozen revshares that if they had PPS i would push them again. Nothing sucks like getting 5 trials and zero converting. Send a a couple k of traffic for $12.47 or whatever the trial split works out to.

09-23-2003, 09:32 PM	#63
Donnie Gangsta Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 1,104	My opinion: Revshare: 1) Only good if you can do at least 30-50 sales per day. This industry is all about #'s. The most annoying thing is when affiliates bitch because they don't have any sign ups when they sent 2000 clicks. They don't realize that in the next 1000, they could get 5 joins, to balance out their ratio. If you can pull that many sales, and assuming the sponsor stays up, even with a shit site, revshare would be better after 6 months. 2) Only do revshare if you trust the sponsor I honestly would not recommend revshare in the current climate. I would actually recommend doing per sign up and saving every dime until it's clear what will happen with the billing companies. It is not good to lose your revshare money, obviously Per Sign Up: 1) Do this if you have lower amounts of traffic Since as I stated above, this is all about averages, the sponsor's entire affiliate portfolio might convert at 30% and make an average of $50+ per sign up, but this does not mean your little 5-10 daily sales will. 2) Do this with the current climate Just the exact opposite of what I said above... gravy train might be stopping soon, so it's probably best to save all of your money.

09-23-2003, 09:43 PM	#67
e2raygun Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: usa Posts: 62	Mutt, you have a point.... He asked how to get more webmasters, I just gave a suggestion.. but your 100% right. we need to keep it on the down low __________________ Submit Your Sites to http://bigtimebookmarks.com

09-23-2003, 09:45 PM	#68
chowda Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Gooch city Posts: 9,527	i think we can solve this by saying its a matter of caring. if its a revshare program, YOU have as much to gain as the program. since ur both aiming to increase retention... with a pps. i dont give a fuck what they do in the backend. i get my money. im happy. if they have cross sales and shit like that, let them figure it out how to squeeze more money from them. my job is finished. __________________ Someone finds you... 2007 PS: Nationalnet is the best host I've ever had. And i tried alot of them.

09-23-2003, 10:05 PM	#71
SleazyDream I'm here for SPORT Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phone # (401) 285-0696 Posts: 41,470	lol - this of course depends on your defination of big boys in this industry. aff and lars do percentage. they're bigger than most that say they are big boys. __________________ This dog, is dog, a dog, good dog, way dog, to dog, keep dog, an dog, idiot dog, busy dog, for dog, 20 dog, seconds dog! Now read without the word dog.

09-23-2003, 10:23 PM	#74
sexyavs Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 615	If people think that because someone is paying revshare it makes them honest or that it tracks all signups..they are a retard.. everyone can be shaved... I wouldnt use a partnership for all the rice in china..when this 1% hits, I wouldnt want to be relying on someone else unless they are going to publicly open up their stats which would be dumb on their part..but otherwise I want no part of it.. If partnerships would pay me more etc..then do me a favor.. PAY ME LESS..and just pay me per signup! Chris __________________ <br> <a href="http://www.sexypassport.com/webmaster/webmaster.php?siteid=752359">Join the Highest Paying FREE AVS. </a><br> <a href="http://nakedpass.com/webmaster/webmaster.php">Naked Pass New FREE Avs Also Pays $20.00 Per FREE Signup!! </a><br> Have you checked out <a href="http://makefuckingmoney.com">Make Fucking Money!</a> Get Paid on FREE Memberships!

09-23-2003, 10:45 PM	#76
FUCKuPAYme Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: LA Posts: 1,023	Its all a numbers game. companies in it for the long haul have lots of money so they pay per trial. rev programs are for the small to mid companies who can't afford to take risks. on PPS your dealing with large volume lower profits. this year you will see alot of companies go out of business so why risk on rev. share when you can get paid up front on a trial. if anything the pps model will get stronger __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

09-23-2003, 11:07 PM	#81
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	Both ATK and Karups do fabulously well. Could they do better if they offered per signup? Dunno. I think they are doing so well that they just don't want to deal with the headaches and liabilities that PPS brings, they don't even push their revshare programs hard and ATK is picky as to whom they will even allow to send them traffic on a revshare basis. Mel Brooks said it best 'It's good to be the king!' Those two brand names are so strong that thousands and thousands of signups find their way to those sites all on their own. More and more people are waking up to the fact that exclusive content is the way to go long term - guarantee you that no program spends as much on exclusive content as ATK, not even Bangbros who run several exclusive content sites across two programs. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

09-23-2003, 11:09 PM	#82
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	hmmmmmmmm....... actually doing rough calculation, Bangbros/Ox/Nasty together would spend about the equivalent of ATK on fresh content. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

09-24-2003, 12:22 AM	#83
KCat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: PNW Posts: 2,204	From an affiliate standpoint, I prefer per signup. My job is to deliver the surfer & get him to sign up. It's the sponsor's job to retain him, not mine. __________________ ~ 300+ FHGs, 100,000 pics to use plus a rockin' Video of the Day download! ~

09-24-2003, 02:46 AM	#85
ControlThy Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,909	I am about to launch a program paying per signup for mature traffic, but no where near 40 USD per signup. The reason for this is that there will be no exit consoles and no crossbilling. (and third party statistics.) I hope people will give it a chance __________________ Promote our unique Voyeur and Fetish sites!

09-24-2003, 04:46 AM	#87
scooby doo as scooby does Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: A deep dark place. Posts: 314	I basically run my own sites, but I have a fair few 'serious' traffic generating sites (forums, reviews etc.). So way back I decided to push other peoples pay sites (bit of variety wouldn't hurt ? ). I started with the glamourous PPS. So much up front! Bit down the line I decided to try a couple of revshare programs. After 6 months or so of that, now it's all revshare. Not a PPS in sight. Not saying revshare is for everyone, but it knocks spots of PPS for me. I'm still getting paid for signups I generated over a year ago. Thats over $200 for one signup and still increasing. No PPS can compete with that. Yes - it takes (way) longer to get the cash, yes - you need to watch who the processor is. yes - you have to be way, way, way more picky with the sites you promote. But no point in having experience in this biz if you don't use it __________________ In 1904, Charles Newman-Berry connected two abacus's together using specially enhanced GrapeVine thus inventing the first Internet connection. NEWMAN-BERRY CASH Paying webmaster since 1904

09-24-2003, 05:33 AM	#88
slavdogg Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 3,570	Revshares are for newbies PPS is for real webmasters that know #s

09-24-2003, 05:47 AM	#90
X37375787 Guest Posts: n/a	good thread

09-24-2003, 06:01 AM	#92
slapass Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 14,622	I think it is funny that revshare has 2 arguments: 1) PPS has to fuck the surfer to pay that kind of money. 2) in the long run you make more with revshare. I doubt nastydollars is having rebill problems on their shit.

09-24-2003, 06:04 AM	#93
gin Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 672	certainly not only 60% revshare, expecially when you are cross selling to 2 other sites at 39.95$ which rebills before the main site does. so the affiliate get's a trial sign up. they get slammed with 2 cross sales at 80$ before they are charged for their membership which they only get 60% rev share. next month they will probably not have as much money on their credit card because they most likely didn't know they had those cross sales checked. so they will get rebilled for 1 or 2 of the cross sales and the main site which the affiliate get's the sale for will be denied because they don't have enough money on their credit card. paid trials should convert 50 - 80% depending on niche. but then they will be ass raped by the charge backs because of your cross sales, 60% rev share with 2 cross sales which are worth 4 times the value of the original sale is more like 20% rev share to the webmaster

09-24-2003, 06:29 AM	#94
Darren Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,994	Well I will offer $50 per a signup to anyone can do over 10 signups a day with me. On these sites. www.raremoviesite.com www.mens-network.com www.volumepills.com www.prosolutionpills.com No shaving, no cross sales, u get paid on exit popups etc. __________________ Penis enlargement / male enhancement pills - earn up to $229.48 per signup ICQ: 46335817

09-24-2003, 06:46 AM	#95
Bex Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 2,382	I agree that partnership for the most part is better on a higher volume of sales. And yes a recurring income base does take a while to build up. And money up front is awfully nice. Recurring may be better in the long run, but you have bills to pay today. So why not utilize both? Do your PPS take your upfront money and build your recurring at the same time ... once your recurring is built up you will have 2 very nice rev streams. __________________ www.NicheWealth.com

09-24-2003, 06:56 AM	#96
Carrie Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Virgin - nee Posts: 3,162	Breaking away from the PPS/Revshare argument and getting back to the question at hand... and these answers aren't just for revshare sponsors, they're for any sponsor. I don't need free hosting. I'm in this for the long haul, I know there are costs to running a business - I have my own domains and my own servers. Offering free hosting invites questionable webmasters, IMO. I don't need free hosted galleries. I don't need free hosted free sites. I don't need gallery generators, or free site generators. I know the business takes work to make money and I'm willing to do that. What I need/want is: - a user/pass to go in to your site(s) and look around, maybe take some screencaps. The better I can truthfully get excited about what's inside, the better I can sell it. Even if the password only works for an hour - hell I only need 15 minutes to see if your member's area will retain. - content; preferably of the girls that are on the tour. Don't watermark it, don't resize it to 450max pixels (I can't use it unless it's 550 or 600 on the long side), and at least 15 softcore pics. Sure, the 40-pic sets for webmasters to use sound nice, but if 35 of them are insertion then I can't use them. The surfer's going to get off before he even gets to your tour. By watermarking I mean putting a URL on there - I don't care if your logo is on the pics, but putting a full URL on the pics is a fucking insult - could you attempt to steal my traffic any more blatantly? Why not just put a little picture of a razor next to the URL also to add insult to injury? - an option to send to a clean tour, whether it is an alternate URL or a variable on the URL that signals no pops, so that I can send PPC traffic etc straight to your tour. - FPAs that are coded correctly. It truly sucks to have to go through an FPA and fix broken tables, bad coding, and screwed up (or conveniently forgotten) affiliate links. - Decent odd-sized banners that don't look like my 5-yr old made them. - Clean site logos available for us to use would be truly helpful, to save us the time of screen-capping your tour and then having to mask out the girl/text/images that are intruding onto the site logo. - Referral URLs or traffic tracking via URL varialbes in the stats area. Let me know which traffic is performing best. I have one sponsor that will allow me to send him URLs of content sets for his site that I've seen, he'll buy them and put them in his member's area and then make them available for my use in promoting his site. We both get something out of it and I can be assured the surfer will find that girl in the site. If you don't offer free content, then at least be willing to tell me where you bought yours so that I can go grab a set to use in promotion. And I'm talking a set or two, not a $500 CD. I'm NOT going to spend $500 just to promote your site. If you've got a microniche that you understand but I might not, then take the time to post some URLs where I can research the niche OR write up a small article telling me how best to sell it (ie: for BBW it's better to play up how fun-loving and happy she is rather than capitalizing on what a huge disgusting pig she is etc). I really like the talk of "signup OR %age, whichever is more" that has popped up in this thread. I'd like to see a full list of sponsors that offer that.

09-28-2003, 01:13 AM	#98
nicchick Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 316	I ran a gallery about 18 months ago and got a grand total of 2 sign-ups at $14.97 each. However both the guys who signed up have stayed with it and now, a year and a half later, I've made over 500 bucks from them. I think you have to do both types and really diversify when it comes to promoting sponsors. It doesn't happen as often as you might think, but people do go bad in this business and people get stiffed.

09-28-2003, 02:53 AM	#99
Rorschach So Fucking Banned Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 5,579	What Carrie said... It constantly pisses me off that in a sense my payouts are being affected by the cost of the sponsor's webmaster promotions and all that newbie "free" stuff.

09-28-2003, 08:52 AM	#100
bigdog Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,964	well i have signed up for a couple partnership programs and they are loseing lots of money but not doing some things the top sponsors are doing. 1) They don't email their members at all.That is just plain stupid 2) No upsells in the members area .Offer them a big penise site or dating site 3) Offer the surfers a lower monthly membership price when they try to cancel the membership or offer more sites for the same price 4) Even when the surfer cancels add their user name and password to your own free avs site with only your sites inside.So later on maybe you can sell them again.This is like haveing a tgp where everyone has used their credit card before to buy porn 5) How about some exit consoles Last edited by bigdog; 09-28-2003 at 08:55 AM..