The shotgun effect works in advertising and you advertise were the traffic is :2 cents:

I am media neutral -- where the ROMI is: the volume branding and conversions will always win out.

If I could buy ads on Facebook for what they are worth -- (remember ROMI?) I would. Facebook is losing our ad revenue by excluding ''adult'' they have bigger fish to fry and it is to their benefit to exclude us. So, when they are finished at Facebook where do they go to Fap?

To a freemuim operation like a tube or some freemium cam site where my ads would not be accepted.

.05%( or a lot less?) head for a paysite or a PPV cam site. How the hell do you think they got there?

Facebook lets me create semi adult pages and market them via paid post boosts etc. Facebook surfers, of all surfers, are most immune to ads. Facebook adapts, by paid boosting of posts. Been like this for a few years now. Adult needs to adapt.

Analyze your surfing experience while on FB with an ad blocker on, that's the key. Very simple. Tumblr, same thing.

Then their ads are worth what they are because they are not seen. If you can make money with Facebook ads use them.

That's why the shotgun method works on a large scale. You also cannot link direct to a porn site from a Facebook ad -- or Twitter.

I need 200K new visitors inbound a day! Not a few hundred -- I have 6,000 ''mouths to feed.'' Unless I hold their little hands, and lead the way, the models won't/don't know how to use their (or their screen-name's) social media accounts to make money. If a model generates her own conversion she gets an additional 20% on all of that customers purchases for every/all model(s) he chooses to spend on -- the money is there! But you have to take the initiative.

The models and studios depend on the website's customers and the site's advertising budget. You would think for an extra 20% they would get organised .. but its easier to split-cam and scrape their privates from several sites.:2 cents:

Not meant personally ''Blade'' but talk is cheap. If someone had an advertising disruptive innovation on paper or in alpha -- there are joint-venture or VC monies available. But most traffic ideas are just copycat and trading dollars (market capture or transfer of market). Innovation and not imitation.

I'm glad you said "nothing personal" I don't want to give you that impression either. From what I remember of anyones posts, I remember yours ringing true often. That's a great impression to make :thumbsup

You know your business, and you're making money, so something right is being done, I'm sure it could be improved too. I've just been forced by an outside entity recently to question the industry, what I want, what my place is, what it needs, what it could be, what I have to offer. I came up with an idea outside adult that I can implement, but first I'm testing it in adult. It's been 6 weeks of 12-14 hour days, and I have a few more hard weeks ahead. I talked to a biller and they are very excited. I hired a programmer I trust, and they are very excited ( not just because they got paid :), I hope ). I wont be able, and have no interest in, doing it all myself, so I'm working at reaching out and being a littl e more trusting ( not my strong point )

Based on your last post there are things you deal with that I didn't consider. I'm just seeing an alternative coming up that breaks some of the constraints that I perceive many people in your position have, and that people in my position have. The future is an exciting place and I love that so many people are trying to find solutions to problems here and not just accepting what they are dealt :thumbsup

Online's port answer to adapt or die. Piss off more surfers.

How do you feel about Muslims? ISIS has done a lot to brand them. Extreme but showa how people link their thinking.

It's another step on the road of pissing off the customers.

What you're not addressing is the possible upside. Ad blockers become so successful, Tubes are no longer profitable. Because webcams, penis pills and dating sites, can't subsidise them to get their 20,000,000 visitors a day. They will have advertise elsewhere. Or pay more for advertising.

We have become a tiny industry because of the emphasis on giving away porn in pursuit to place ads. Even a banner on an FHG is an "ad".

But they converted an average of 1-300 on clicks. And every time they gave away more porn to get more traffic. The ratio got worse every time.

A smart move would be sites giving them away for free. Think of the consequences.

The pre recorded porn business with it's models, studios and sites. Need to not have their product given away on sites that sell ads.

You're arguing for your side of the business, ruining the other side. Which is fine. You'll not get sympathy from those who rely on prerecorded porn sales.

ISIS doesn't brand muslims, it brands itself and very successfully. It has got big amount of recruits and money. Anyways, I am not in the target audience, you neither (I think). There are target audiences in branding, you know.

I don't know about this tube issue, I work in mainstream. Porn is just a sideshow for me. There are much bigger things in stake in here than some tubes. I don't even agree that the amount of free porn has increased because of the pursuit to place more ads. Tubes use free porn and they monetize it with whatever way that is most profitable. In this case it is probably ads. I don't know is this very good English translation, but tube is business model and ads monetizing (earning) model. The tube business model still exists without ads.

About ISIS branding.

"Islamic State?s social media and video efforts have stepped up, part of a region-wide effort to sign up youths to fight take up the black flag. RFE/RL reports"

Isis launches Russian-language propaganda channel | World news | The Guardian

I never let my customers have copies of the content -- case closed. Lock the fuckin' door! And I am not looking for sympathy -- pass the crying towel ... I am looking for customers were they are NOW not 10 years ago.

We advertise where the traffic is. If every tube-enemy of yours was closed I would advertise were the traffic is.

Don't take it ''personal.'' You can have your ''agenda'' but when you need 200M visitors a day (98.00+% of bulk ads bounce) so 182,000 of the 200,000 tube site users are crap -- they are just buying FREE today -- you are not losing anything but your sanity -- those surfers would not buy a paysite's content anyway.

I don't have an agenda -- you go where the traffic is. Where else can I get the 18,000 visitors a day? Tell me I AM LISTENING (chirp-chirp). Move the traffic and I will buy it there NO PROBLEM.

The best traffic, and I pay a lot for it, is from adwords followed by the ad networks' non-tube offerings. Tubes are 1:50,000 new conversions or worse -- so 49,000 were useless POS anyway.

If the ad target's ad blocker didn't hide the ad and I paid for the click? -- that was the subject of this thread -- STICK TO IT. So, if you want to complain about the $2,000 you spent last month and how the ad-blocker affected you by all means go ahead and bitch you have paid and have the right to bitch ... You can't, you are not an active player anymore, for lots of reasons, including your bad health (happens to us all at some point Paul).

So, spare me the crying towel over tubes and the pay-sites demise. It was the perfect storm and IMHO: Bailing water with a leaky bucket will not keep the Porn-ship afloat forever. Hate the message if you want but that is the reality.

Someone start a pornflix platform that is not early VOD bullshit -- like $5.99/mo unlimited and get traffic that is qualified and sell ads -- even a 'hulu' like service free and subscription model with ads. I would love to buy some ad referral from visitors with payment options -- not 98.00+% deadbeat bounces. A new innovation in traffic generation is welcome. Again and again: If the traffic is there that benefits us we will buy it.

My competitors are not concerned when they buy ads to their websites in adwords using our trademark names. We could litigate like ... isn't that trademark theft?

http://cdn.okccdn.com/php/load_okc_i...551445599.jpeg

:2 cents:

Well put!!! :thumbsup

We can't stop the tubes or the "tube model", please Paul - you're (STILL!) talking in circles about this. It's amazing. Please move on :pimp

I had to install Ad Block Pro on this Chrome install.

Why? Because of all the news sites auto starting the fuckin' videos and blasting my face off!


If you want your ads seen you have to proactive about how you serve them :2 cents:

GFY is "collateral damage" the ads are filtered out because of the way they are served. It also loads a lot faster because there is no multiple DNS lookups required:

I often have this issue with our coders and developers -- they don't consider all the ramifications of their actions and take the easiest path for their coding and API control needs :2 cents:

It is super easy to circumvent those ad-blockers actually, so the results we see so far are very positive. As long as the ads presented to the ad-blocked user is relevant and of very high quality, they will click it :thumbsup

It was just an example of how Branding can present a negative image.

Ad sales supporting porn tubes has damaged pre recorded porn. I wonder if the Tube business can survive in it's present form, time will tell.

For businesses reliant on sites that survive via ad sales, which is a huge chunk of business. If it harms their profit margins, ads disappear. People will need to adapt. Thinking about ways to get around ad blockers is pointless, the ad blockers will up their game.

If ad blockers become a factor that effects the profit margins, people will need to change their game. Maybe a text link like Adwords, maybe blogs will rise again, it's all part of evolving and staying ahead of the game.

Barry will advertise where the traffic is, in a form that can't be blocked.

Being in business means constantly evolving and adapting. Trying to block ad blockers, is a retro step.

You still think "porn minded". Let's assume that you have reputable media, not just some mfa shit that you have thrown across internet. It is not about evolving or staying ahead; it is about monetizing (as we talk about monetizing). I don't really see any difference if you succeed in it by blocking ad blockers, throwing in affiliate links, selling subscriptions, asking donations, or whatever.

The evolving and staying ahead part is how you develop the media you posses. That is how non-mfa thinking goes. And when you have that reputable media, you are not just; "Let's give up, how about throwing 100 mfa blogs instead?" If blocking ad blockers saves the day, I see nothing wrong in it.

explain again please, how you are "in business" please? Oh wait....

Your mind is black and white Paul, just because one step is taken in one area does not mean everything else has gone stale - but I can see how you weren't able to "evolve and staying ahead" with that mentality of yours. No offence but you are still raging against tubes at every twist and turn you can :Oh crap

We are debating how to do something about ad-blocked surfers, not if it's a step back on the evolutionary ladder on the publisher business on the internet - that's a very different debate. Fact is, many people start using ad-blockers either because of annoying ads that blast sound at them or because they come pre-installed. Not because they hate all ads. Kinda like you not liking one ad and swapping the channel on the TV when it comes on, doesn't equal you swapping the channel every time an ad comes on...

I know you want the world to be super simple and one sided, but it's not.

So just in case you totally missed the point (again) Paul, let em re-iterate that this thread is NOT about:

1. If the ad-driven website a viable business method.
2. If tubes are hurting the industry.
3. If tubes are a thing of the future or the past.
4. If tubes are to blame for less content being produced or more content being produced.
5. If it is smart, to show clips longer than 2-3 minutes on tubes.
6. If it's okay for tubes to even show ads.

We ARE on the other hand, talking about:

A. How to monetize the between 20-40% of surfers that land on your website that blocks most if not all ads.
B. How to best circumvent those ad-blockers in a way that will piss off the surfer least.... leading to:
C. How to best monetize the ad-zones for ad-blocked traffic

To everyone else:

I'll probably have some numbers ready by next week btw, comparing ad-blocked traffic with regular traffic in terms of CTR and sales. It's not representative for all traffic world wide, but it's a fun experiment in any case :pimp

You can use Adblock Redirect from PlugRush. Only ad network that lets you monetize users with adblock installed!

True :thumbsup:thumbsup

Not to Toot our own horn or anything, but we are the only ad platform out there that I know of in adult that offers an ad block work around solution. We provide real content which is actually leads to advertising in place of your normal ads when our ad blocker detection script detects an ad blocking system.
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The war rages on:
Yahoo Mail Blocks Users Who Run Ad Blockers - Fortune

An A/B test prevented people from accessing email on their Yahoo Mail accounts because they were using ad blocking software.

Some people who logged into their Yahoo Mail accounts last week were greeted with an ultimatum: ?Please disable Ad Blocker to continue using Yahoo Mail.? These users were unable to access their email accounts until they turned off their ad blockers or found a workaround for the problem.

The message is not a new policy, but was part of a trial, a Yahoo spokesman told Engadget over the weekend. A ?small number? of Yahoo Mail users were prevented from accessing their email accounts because Yahoo detected they had an ad blocker installed on their computer. The message was most likely a result from an A/B test, a technique in which technology companies push changes to a small number of people to gauge user reaction before deploying them widely.

Affected users complained about the test on the Adblock Plus forums. Yahoo?s mail service is the eighth most-used email client, behind Google GOOG 1.90% Gmail, Microsoft MSFT 3.16% Outlook, and the built-in mail clients on iPhone and Android. After news of Yahoo?s trial spread online, several Yahoo Mail users publicly declared on social media they planned to cease using Yahoo?s email service.

The trial is part of a growing trend: Websites that rely on advertising revenue are increasingly locking out users if they choose to use an ad blocker. Yahoo YHOO 1.66% joins The Washington Post and Hulu as part of the growing list of websites that block users with ad blockers. Others, including NFL team sites, The Guardian, and The Atlantic also detect ad blockers, but instead merely ask visitors to donate the site or turn their ad blockers off.

Although only 16% of web users in the United States block ads according to one estimate, the topic remains a source of anxiety for businesses and individuals who make money on the web. Using a blocker on ad-supported websites has been compared to eating at a restaurant without paying. Fortune?s Mathew Ingram has argued that while using an ad blocker might be a ?rational response? to invasive online ads, it?s also a ?scorched-earth approach? that puts publishers at risk.

Most ad-blockers are installed on desktop computers, so as more people began to use mobile browsers it looked like ad-blocker use might fall off. But earlier this year mobile Safari, the default browser on the iPhone, gained the ability to install third-party ad-blockers, a feature Apple APPL 0.00% calls ?content blocking.? One study expects the online ad-industry could lose $1 billion per year due to mobile ad-blocking.

Yahoo?s primary revenue stream is advertising, which means that it is among the companies with the most to lose when its users opt for ad-blocking software. That?s one of the reasons why Yahoo decided to trial blocking ad blockers, and one reason it may still go ahead and implement its new change more widely, despite complaints.

has anyone tried loading ads after page loads using javascript ? does that works ?

Analyse is the key like always.

• How many sites where not ?mobile? ready long time. We had our first ones out about 7 years ago and never regret it.
• How many sites where not ready to work with big sizes of screens in the past?
• How many sites did not have a android app?
• How many sites show ?ads? that is not even close to what the user is looking for or want to see.
• How many sites are showing something complete different of what the user expected.

Was this not always the case in ?our? industry ? and now we have Adblockers ?

Just check your lost views/clicks if the visitor has a adblocker. Maybe he installed it because one of you ?colleague? has a shitty site full of banner to get clicks or views.

Develop or use solutions makes the different, that include a user with adblocker.

Make the different on your sites is easy, Visitor has installed a adblocker use a fallback ;

Show related banner or product where he is looking for, his search "Chat with a Latina with big boobs and hairy pussy", don?t show a blond girl with small boobs. This is already a win-win situation for both the advertiser and you as a site owner. Doing this you can reduce your banners to have the same income.

or Your visitor likes to Get a Bigger, Harder & Healthier Penis, what about that this Latina girl with big boobs know this and do your upselling of this penis enlargement pills.

Just use the ?new? solutions they are there in the Market. Here some nice products to use or test

Antiblock.org - Anti Adblock Script
Demo
It ask the user Please disable your ad blocker!. Track how many do this.

or use our free adserver that include all options to control your banners and get more sales.

The next step of performance network

Ad-server that you can use for free including bypass for adblockers and include most adnetworks as templates. Analyse all your traffic and start to filter it. It just give more income and with all the features more sales.

As example of one adzone :

From the 590.361 views there are 47.971 views that where bypassed (8.13%) with other banners. On mobile devices the numbers are different 188.249 views and we bypassed 10.168 views (5.4%)

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It shows that develop or use solutions just work. You like to have a demo just contact me on Skype envivomedia