Business Can the Industry Prevent ?the Death of Porn??

[LAJ]

I attended this seminar at the Qwebec Expo... it was interesting, and I did learn a few things. Take what you want out of this...


MONTREAL ? A seminar presented by a Canadian consultant explored an interesting, if familiar, question: Is porn dying, or can the adult industry stop the bleeding?

Edward Shorter PhD, president of Edward Shorter Associates in Toronto, took the latter position. As he noted before an audience of about 20 Qwebec Expo attendees, the reports of porn?s death have been greatly exaggerated. In fact, Shorter believes the adult industry is on the brink of a new revolution.

MORE: http://www.ynot.com/content/119973-c...eath-porn.html

[SongRider]

Its not dying... Its changing... It has been alive and well since the first titty was carved on a cave wall... It just grows and morphs every now and again...

[brassmonkey]

the spam side is dying

[Babaganoosh]

Porn isn't dying. There's really not much use for affiliates anymore though. If you're trying to build adult affiliate income, that boat left years ago.

[PAR]

Porn maybe long from dead; but lets think about this for a second...
Say we target audience "Y" with Niche "A", "B" or "C"
And we dump in $$$ into production on exclusive content with budgets from 15 years ago.

If it grabs an audience how long until you see it on the tubes/free sites? or full on tubes/free sites dedicated to it?

Reality is if you put your $ in just the content,.. does the niche really matter to the guy coping it and serving it up for free?

Maybe it's the billing, business models and marketing etc.. that need to be looked at.
Yes, content and new niches will matter to one degree or another.

Ask yourself.. How much would Facebook be worth if they charges even $1 a month to run ad free..? (Yes, some people would still have joined but $190 billion worth?)

I'm not saying free is 100% the answer, but what I am saying is that; IMO it will be the changes in monetization of the content that will "save us".. Not new niches to exploit and market...

That's like saying higher $ CGI will save the movie industry...

[Markul]

Originally Posted by SongRider

Its not dying... Its changing... It has been alive and well since the first titty was carved on a cave wall... It just grows and morphs every now and again...

This

[DVTimes]

Its got a quote from the master:

Retired porn producer-director Paul Markham agrees with Shorter ? to a point. In fact, a post he made in the YNOT.com forums was quoted in the slide show accompanying Shorter?s presentation.

[topnotch, standup guy]

Originally Posted by DVTimes

Its got a quote from the master:

The master

.

[Captain Kawaii]

We need to eviscerate the criminal elements from this business. The bangers, the thieves and have zero tolerance for them unlike we do now. Now we make them men of the year and promote their companies like they are pioneers or some bullshit.

Porn business needs to go through the changes the Italian mafia did some decades ago.

Keep laughing at Paul. Apparently Dr. Shorter isn't laughing. In Paul's long wind flow grains of truth. He talks a lot cause he's old. Its what we do.

We have so collectively fucked over our buying traffic no wonder they are not buying at the levels they used to and instead are making their own porn.

From the article:

?Women have a very different mindset about porn,? Markham wrote. ?They don?t need to see sex; they use their imagination. For many, that?s better than the reality.

Every woman I have ever known said the same thing. Her arousal came from her mind not some books, dvds or something.


?If [porn meant to appeal to the expanding women?s, BDSM and fetish markets] is shot, it has to be very well-done and on a budget that was possible 15 years ago. Producing something for women to jerk off to on today?s budgets is a non-starter.?

And that, Shorter indicated, is the biggest challenge the adult industry needs to overcome. There is no doubt new markets and rethinking approaches to old markets could prop up flagging porn revenues. The question, according to Shorter and some inside the industry, is whether adult entertainment producers are willing to divert a larger percentage of profits into increasing production values and developing new content themes. To do that, producers and distributors may have to tighten their belts in the short run in order to secure a reinvigorated industry over the long haul.

[RyuLion]

Originally Posted by SongRider

Its not dying... Its changing... It has been alive and well since the first titty was carved on a cave wall... It just grows and morphs every now and again...

[Captain Kawaii]

Originally Posted by LAJ

I attended this seminar at the Qwebec Expo... it was interesting, and I did learn a few things. Take what you want out of this...


MONTREAL ? A seminar presented by a Canadian consultant explored an interesting, if familiar, question: Is porn dying, or can the adult industry stop the bleeding?

Edward Shorter PhD, president of Edward Shorter Associates in Toronto, took the latter position. As he noted before an audience of about 20 Qwebec Expo attendees, the reports of porn?s death have been greatly exaggerated. In fact, Shorter believes the adult industry is on the brink of a new revolution.

MORE: http://www.ynot.com/content/119973-c...eath-porn.html

Great post, Jay. Thanks for the share. Only 20 showed up? No wonder this industry is FUCT.

[signupdamnit]

It's surreal to sit here for years and watch a kind of smart ass rep make wise cracks at affiliates and always talk about "adapt or die" and then to see him let go from his position because his company no longer has any business primarily because of tubes and piracy. There has been more than one like this and I bet he won't be the last. The same is true for many tube friendly affiliates and sponsors. It's a strange sight to see people who once bragged and liked to tell others "adapt or die, dinosaur" suddenly vanish themselves one day...

Regarding Paul Markham. I didn't always agree with him either but he was right a lot more often than many of you ass kissers. It's almost comical to sit here and see people still unwilling to admit the negative effect on the industry which these tubes have had overall. Talk about stubborn.

Don't get me wrong. I make money off of tubes now too and I have barely any skin in paysites anymore as an affiliate in 2014. So I really don't give a shit if you all want to reduce your EPC to $0.00001. Knock yourselves out. It's your money.

[Best-In-BC]

Its not die'ing . The quality of people promoting stuff has droped

[Paully]

It goes back to producing content, new content. How is that possible when we let people steel our content and exchange it for traffic adds.

Shady traffic companies could kill it today. If producers stood up and blacklisted every shitty ad company/affiliate then the pirate tubes would shrivel up.

More money in the content producers pocket the more content is being made, the further the industry will grow.

Content is king muthafuckas, not traffic.

[The Porn Nerd]

Short-term: traffic is King.
Long-term: content is King.

Problem: everyone wants NOW.

[Struggle4Bucks]

Originally Posted by PAR

IMO it will be the changes in monetization of the content that will "save us".. Not new niches to exploit and market...

Totally agree with this. It's ridicule to state that new niches will save the industry.

According to Shorter, Fifty Shades introduced millions of women and their partners to sexual dominance and submission, a type of play that once ?terrified? even the most libertine. After reading the novel, women felt empowered to take charge; men realized submitting to dominant women satisfied their fantasies, as well. Open discussion at dinner parties and in the media normalized what once was considered a perversion.

The fact that 50 shadeds of grey was a huge bestseller doesn't really say a lot about people and their sexuality. For the majority of women it was just a good read. Not a sexuality opener. You don't have to enjoy bdsm to enjoy 50 shades of grey. And to imply that women who enjoy 50 shades of grey also enjoy bdsm is the most stupid thing i have ever read. 9 out of 10 women i asked about 50 shades said that the appealing factor of 50shades was not the bdsm but the rich succesfull goodlooking selfmade man who blew this girl off her feet and the way he did that: totally focussed on her; introducing her to a worldly luxurious lifestyle; Grey was a hurt man in need. She opened him up and "cured" him. Bdsm is not a every womens desire... the idea that she can cure a man and the idea that he can't live without her is far more appealing to almost every women on earth.

The idea that after 50 shades every women on earth is now into bdsm is the most stupid thought of this century. Sexualities like these have very little to do with trends. Do you think you will start sucking cocks if it would become trendy or fashionable? No of course not... the urge lives within you or it doesn't. A book doesn't change a single fuck about that! Read again.... 50 shades was not about bdsm.

Can the adult entertainment industry take advantage of the unprecedented shift in public perspective? Shorter thinks so, but only if the industry addresses BDSM and fetishes in terms of women?s no-longer-hidden desires.

He suggested a few underserved markets in which porn producers might focus their attention:

??Pegging,? or women employing strap-on dildos to penetrate men, thereby turning the tables on the traditional male fantasy of anal sex.


?Forced sissifying with an emphasis on some men?s compulsion to reverse traditional roles.


?Forced male bisexuality, another role reversal that upends a perennially popular-among-men theme.


?Male chastity, which could be ?a huge future trend? considering a male chastity toy was included in the 2014 Emmy gift bags.

Yes these markets are underserved, but these niches are mostly MALE-fantasies... there will be a vey few girls into this.... but to say that women now massively desire these things and will massively join these type of sites, and thus open a new huge market, is an illussion just totally sucked out of someones ass.

[SmutHammer]

Originally Posted by Paully

It goes back to producing content, new content. How is that possible when we let people steel our content and exchange it for traffic adds.

Shady traffic companies could kill it today. If producers stood up and blacklisted every shitty ad company/affiliate then the pirate tubes would shrivel up.

More money in the content producers pocket the more content is being made, the further the industry will grow.

Content is king muthafuckas, not traffic.

Spot on

It really is to sad everyone is not willing to take a stand. Fuck, Even the tubes site owners would make more if they just started opening paysites instead or at least tried pushing them.

[theking]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

It's surreal to sit here for years and watch a kind of smart ass rep make wise cracks at affiliates and always talk about "adapt or die" and then to see him let go from his position because his company no longer has any business primarily because of tubes and piracy. There has been more than one like this and I bet he won't be the last. The same is true for many tube friendly affiliates and sponsors. It's a strange sight to see people who once bragged and liked to tell others "adapt or die, dinosaur" suddenly vanish themselves one day...

Regarding Paul Markham. I didn't always agree with him either but he was right a lot more often than many of you ass kissers. It's almost comical to sit here and see people still unwilling to admit the negative effect on the industry which these tubes have had overall. Talk about stubborn.

Don't get me wrong. I make money off of tubes now too and I have barely any skin in paysites anymore as an affiliate in 2014. So I really don't give a shit if you all want to reduce your EPC to $0.00001. Knock yourselves out. It's your money.

Paul Markham is uneducated and clueless about ninety plus percent of all subjects he has babbled on and on about.

[The Porn Nerd]

Women buying porn is perhaps 2% of the market.
Besides, women will make their MEN buy it FOR them anyway.

[sandman!]

[the Shemp]

porn isn't dead, but paying for porn is on life support ...

[AmeliaG]

Sounds like that speaker has really specific tastes he'd like to see catered to

[mopek1]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Regarding Paul Markham. I didn't always agree with him either but he was right a lot more often than many of you ass kissers.

I remember his arguments and agreed with much that he had to say. For some reason gfy made him the board clown and no matter what he said after that he was ridiculed. Nobody cared to see what was happening (tubes).

[Captain Kawaii]

Originally Posted by mopek1

I remember his arguments and agreed with much that he had to say. For some reason gfy made him the board clown and no matter what he said after that he was ridiculed. Nobody cared to see what was happening (tubes).

I hang out at LAJ's house sometimes. I plan to do it more often.
Parasites drove him off this board; Damian, tubes and ads. I wish we could eradicate all three.

[LAJ]

Originally Posted by Captain Kawaii

I hang out at LAJ's house sometimes. I plan to do it more often.
Parasites drove him off this board; Damian, tubes and ads. I wish we could eradicate all three.

I'm still here... nothing drove me away.

I just only hit the boards once or twice a day now. Business is goooood.

[LAJ]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Regarding Paul Markham. I didn't always agree with him either but he was right a lot more often than many of you ass kissers. It's almost comical to sit here and see people still unwilling to admit the negative effect on the industry which these tubes have had overall. Talk about stubborn.

Agreed about Paul. I like the guy and frankly he often brings something interesting to the table. And while he is wrong often enough on things... he's also been working in porn since the late 60s and deserves respect.

[Captain Kawaii]

Originally Posted by LAJ

I'm still here... nothing drove me away.

I just only hit the boards once or twice a day now. Business is goooood.

Sorry, man. I was talking about Paul.
You are omnipresent which is a good thing.

[PR_Glen]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Women buying porn is perhaps 2% of the market.
Besides, women will make their MEN buy it FOR them anyway.

You don't understand the market then.

[PR_Glen]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

It's surreal to sit here for years and watch a kind of smart ass rep make wise cracks at affiliates and always talk about "adapt or die" and then to see him let go from his position because his company no longer has any business primarily because of tubes and piracy. There has been more than one like this and I bet he won't be the last. The same is true for many tube friendly affiliates and sponsors. It's a strange sight to see people who once bragged and liked to tell others "adapt or die, dinosaur" suddenly vanish themselves one day...

Regarding Paul Markham. I didn't always agree with him either but he was right a lot more often than many of you ass kissers. It's almost comical to sit here and see people still unwilling to admit the negative effect on the industry which these tubes have had overall. Talk about stubborn.

Don't get me wrong. I make money off of tubes now too and I have barely any skin in paysites anymore as an affiliate in 2014. So I really don't give a shit if you all want to reduce your EPC to $0.00001. Knock yourselves out. It's your money.

what rep are you referring to here? Any I know and have worked with are still around and are doing well.

[topnotch, standup guy]

Originally Posted by mopek1

I remember his arguments and agreed with much that he had to say. For some reason gfy made him the board clown and no matter what he said after that he was ridiculed. Nobody cared to see what was happening (tubes).

I never had a real problem with Paul himself. Some of his posts were in fact spot on. Others not so much.

What I didn't like was how otherwise interesting threads would consistently and inevitably get overwhelmed and then ultimately drowned under the crushing weight of ceaseless back-and-forth bickering between Paul and Damian. Pages upon pages, upon pages, upon even more pages of it.

Admittedly it was probably the wrong nick that got banned as a result however.

[PiracyPitbull]

I didn't agree with everything that Paul said but Id rather have him on GFY than all those posters who parrot "adapt or die" and then you discover that its them and those like them that are one of the reasons that the industry is in the state its in.

[2MuchMark]

Porn will never die. As long as people get excited watching other people have sex porn will always have a market.

"Porn is dying" is a last breath cry by people and companies who are losing or have lost everything to content theft and copyright infringement, or by individuals and companies who now find it hard to compete in a crowded market.

It's important to make the tough decisions in business. Downsize when you have to. Look for new avenues of revenue and new companies to work with. Advertise carefully. Look for new talent. Protect your work, etc etc.

[xavi]

Originally Posted by SongRider

Its not dying... Its changing... It has been alive and well since the first titty was carved on a cave wall... It just grows and morphs every now and again...

true true

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by PR_Glen

You don't understand the market then.

LOL Wrong - my top sites are ALL 'female-friendly' and I have around 20% female Members. I was talking about your average, every day "porn" like Reality Kings, Brazzers, et al. Erotic, even softcore sites, sites with 'stories' always do well with women.

However: I still maintain that the amount of women buying porn, overall, is a tiny percentage. Are you saying more than 2% of women actually PAY for PORN? (Or do they say to their BFs/hubby: "I like that, buy that one"? I can't even get a chick to buy dinner. LOL)

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by PiracyPitbull

I didn't agree with everything that Paul said but Id rather have him on GFY than all those posters who parrot "adapt or die" and then you discover that its them and those like them that are one of the reasons that the industry is in the state its in.

Originally Posted by LAJ

Agreed about Paul. I like the guy and frankly he often brings something interesting to the table. ..... he's also been working in porn since the late 60s and deserves respect.

Same

[NaughtyRob]

Porn itself will never die. The business model just keep changing.

[KickAssJesse]

Change is good, mmkay - i agree with most, the porn biz model is changing; always changing for that matter.

[adultmobile]

unsure if cam is porn, is more a lonely guys psychological assistance, but that's definitely going ok (lots of private chats are clothed, that's why I don't think it is porn).

[DWB]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

It's surreal to sit here for years and watch a kind of smart ass rep make wise cracks at affiliates and always talk about "adapt or die" and then to see him let go from his position because his company no longer has any business primarily because of tubes and piracy.

Reps should stay out of any conversation that involves piracy or production. Most are douche bags anyway who swing from one vine to the next without any real in depth knowledge of the industry. You can already see how many have been let go, or are rapidly changing companies. When I see them posting as if there isn't a care in the world, I laugh to myself because I know it's only a matter of time before they are out of a job.

You do need to adapt or die, but for most reps, they are only a rep. That's it. Reps do not adapt, thus they ultimately will die. Those with skin in the game can adapt. They have to. Those working for a salary or commission, will always work for a salary or commission. Nothing wrong with that, but when someone else is writing your check, you may want to think twice before running your mouth on subjects you know nothing about.

Originally Posted by Paully

It goes back to producing content, new content. How is that possible when we let people steel our content and exchange it for traffic adds.

More money in the content producers pocket the more content is being made, the further the industry will grow.

Well over half of the producers I know are out of the business now. Affiliates too. Few companies can (or are willing to pay) amounts that make content production worth it.

Originally Posted by theking

Paul Markham is uneducated and clueless about ninety plus percent of all subjects he has babbled on and on about.

I'm curious, how many covers for Hustler did you shoot when you were actively in the biz?

Long winded and often misguided posts he may make, but Paul has probably forgotten more about the porn business than you (or many others) have ever known.

To all of the Paul haters, I only ask you post your resume next to his before trying to tear him down.

[miamicash]

I can't believe that the market is ending when sales are growing daily

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by miamicash

I can't believe that the market is ending when sales are growing daily

Good to hear congrats

Nice sites too