50 Shitty Boats!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5242/...eed79bab_o.jpg

1. I don't get this. If a site converts then who cares if it's ccbill, epoch or another biller-based affiliate program. How can Epoch-sites be irrelevant??? It's about what converts and not how many sites are in a biller-based affiliate-program! Could it be that you actually trying to say that your amount of traffic is irrelevant and that it is a "reaching minimum pay out" problem? What else would make epoch-sites irrelevant? Epoch is Top Notch; constantely improving and now paying webmaster via paxum!

2. I don't work offline jobs. I'm doing this fulltime. 80 hours per week! I'm not getting rich here. But, I can make a humble living out of it with only 6000 daily visitors to my site and are able to invest slowly in shooting new content for two new sites (which is fucking expensive.) So... that means that I am growing instead of declining and having to look out for a offline job!

3. Good for you:thumbsup

4. Ok that's nice... but if ccbill is not the problem and conversions are 10 times worse then last month, then what could be the problem? I'm selling 20% more then last month so no way that it can be explained with people not paying for porn anymore.

These are the posted numbers of september of one of my affiliates:

Affiliate programs

Bondage Bank nats 1:234
Struggle 4 Bucks epoch 1:475
Kind Cash epoch 1:1297
Queen Snake epoch 1:1656
Fetish Wealth nats 1:4388
NBB Cash ccbill 1:3602
DDF Cash nats 1:2690
Fuck You Cash nats 1:1725
Kinkster Cash nats 1:3595
Kinky Dollars nats 1:14091

Epoch and Nats-sites in the top 5! Where are the ccbill-sites?

Good luck to you anyway!

Another one of my affiliates:

Struggle4Bucks - 1:732

Captured Snapshots - 1:1053

Kinkster Cash - 1:1192

Bondage Bob - 1:2050

Kinky Dollars - 1:2051

MasterA Cash - 1:2175

Bound By Bhowani - 1:2246

Dungeon Bank - doesn't pay anymore, not recommended for promotion

Again... where are the ccbill-sites?

September was hurting after August sales but Oct is making up for it. And Sept. drop was minimal. We may not be in the big boys club but thats why our numbers might be more usefull.



Paully

Struggle4bucks got it figured out. Work hard. Then work harder.

Sorry, my apologies, global media must be wrong and you are right...

Public staff weren't paid for two weeks. Therefore less money.

3rd Quarter 2013: $355,000 in profit.

October 2013: $150,000 .. .Forecasting $400k for Q4.

All in 2013: $1.4m is on track.

Mainstream IT sales. Its what's up....

A little bit better than last month

how do you mean who cares? I do, as tons of affiliates. If I have 40 blogs network , I want to collect money as fast as possible. this means I don't want to spread revenue on dozen sponsors (nats, mpa 3 ,etc..) and always have some "virtual" money. this was biggest mistake and once I've dropped most of sponsors that are taking care about payments on their own, revenue became stable. So me, and many affiliates are going to choose to promote sites that will send them money as fast as possible. As far as I see, epoch have only 4...yeah four, femdom sites to promote. On my personal list of sponsors, I have more then 150 sites from ccbill suitable for my blogs. Since logic is to diversify and offer variety of sites, only logical conclusion is to choose ccbill if I want to see my money fast. Otherwise, every sponsor have own payment rules, methods...fuck that,maybe bigger affiliates can handle that shit but I can't . I am also promoting Verotel but they are fucked up and now most of sites dropped them and I need to go through my network and delete those sites and I am also promoting Inet cash sites because there is plenty of femdom sponsors.

Also, I don't want to give any special exposure to any sponsor because often ,sponsors or sites go down. And then what? I need to take down complete sites filled with their content? Also, I saw so many times that sites are converting good in the beginning and then suddenly stop once they are available all over.

Sure, conversions were much better when I was running pay sites compared to affiliate stats, but by using Nifty Stats I can compare any period during last 7 years (from time when I stepped up in this business) and there were bad periods but somehow at the end, conversions are more or less, the same.

If guy above from blue pixels profits confirmed what I've said for this month and together with other webmasters (affiliates and site owners) that means that something is wrong here and it is not about CC company. I won't tell what people I am talking about since I don't have authorization to give info about their business.

In this moment I am at 1:10021 which is total disaster and started being like that from the beginning of this month (few days before, I think).There is no chance that people decided to lost interest in niche precisely on october 2013 so I am trying here to hear opinions what is going on.

October 2012 - 1:1195
October 2011 - 1:1092
October 2010 - 1:995
October 2009 - 1:1138
October 2008 - 1:1411
October 2007 - 1:1439

Yes I know that I can get better conversions from my traffic if I redirect to specific sites ( I have precise list of sites converting 1:400 and other converting 1:2200 but I've explained how I am maintaining stability through diversification through years ). Now, going 1:10k is crazy and fucked up shit completely.

Little slow this week but Oct. started out like a house of fire.

Federal workers who usually jack off at their desks were home in front of their big, strong, fat, short-haired DC wives and didn't want to get their pasty feminine asses beat, and federal contractors, the only ones with money, actually did get laid off for a few weeks and couldn't buy.

I guess you know who your markets are now.

same as september, below average though.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

I like Struggle4Buck's work ethic and overall attitude - work harder, work smarter, but never ever stop working - because it is my own. :) But also we must remember we're comparing apples and oranges here.

Niche sites (kink, BDSM, etc) have a very differant audience than "mainstream" porn does. Max Hardcore has a name (brand) and following so Paully's numbers look about right. Beaner just started his own merch account setup so initial results are fantastic but time, chargebacks, fickle banks and other issues may (and I hope not) cause him trouble in the future. Mr. Deitz sees Programs from ALL niches and has a wider perspective. I run my own highly unique paysite network, not really comparable to other people's businesses.....

So what does all that mean? It means "sales are up" for one person/business does NOT mean "sales are up" for someone else who's promoting something completely differant.

Conclusion: threads like this are, ultimately, useless.

Carry on. :D

Programs put the shavers on for extra xmas monies.

That is out of this world numbers. I read them last night and blew me away. Those numbers are 40K per month numbers. Are you sure when you checked stats you didn't include your rebills also?

Everyone can increase their sales. That is no lie... not just the design, look, strategy of a site... but also the final billing solution. I am not new to this... have been collecting money (and living off of websites) since 2010. I offer a free trials that converts to paying on mainstream... I do know what it takes to make, or break, the process.

Just an FYI... You might want to remove the link to your affiliate program in your sig, then. You still have a CCBill program, yet when you enter your CCBill referral code, it goes to a non-CCBill join page. Good way to piss off affiliates. (Unless I'm seeing it wrong. If so, my apologies.)

Yes, you are off.

We could make it much more clear but has not been our focus. All affiliates are now paid through No Limits. CCbill is simply the affiliate signup process. We sweep that information and send directly into sliiing admin and we never look back.

We should reprogram so affiliates can signup without ever seeing a ccbill signup form... that is in the works.

Yeah, more clear is a good thing. I went to see about signing up for your program because we have cuckold traffic, and noticed it was a CCBill program (which I like). So, I checked your CCBill referral code tour for traffic leaks, etc., and noticed it didn't even go to a CCBill join page.

No mention of Sliiing, No Limits (whatever that is), or anything else EXCEPT CCBill on your affiliate page.

I'll check back in a few weeks to see if it's all straightened out.

u guys are beating a dead horse. porn is dead. its done. cams / dating will still do okay but analog porn videos are finished

give it up and concentrate your efforts on mainstream

LOL, exactly what I said, but your way is funnier :thumbsup

This month was actually was good at the beginning, but, last few days are horrible.
We get 15% of sells, WTF.

That's new sales and we are definitely not doing 40K a month but we will. Again not sure exactly how they calculate retention as I don't see it that high. I think maybe they figure new sales for the month over all recurring sales in their retention formula which is misleading to me or I just don't know.

We had lots more new sales better than 1:100 but after adding multi-month joins we saw that drop a bit and gladly so.

interesting reading

been reading this since 2006

Paully no offence, but can you please post your stats screenshots?
thx

Sure, 268 new sales/206 rebills as of today. Gonna need to block out some shit but Ill put up my stats as of today when I get a minute.

Here are those numbers, and they are just my experience. 340 new sales in 21 days extrapolates to 486 new sales. Rebills need to be average of 2 more months... so when everything caps out you are at 486 + 972 = 1458 sales per month.

$30 a pop... that's $43,740 per month. I understand multi-months etc. are in the mix, it is just general averages. Each new join, on average, is great to try and get $90.

These ratios you are talking are much better then previous... what changed to get such a dramatic increase in conversions? Because really, nobody is seeing those conversion ratios. Do you have 1,000 people a day searching for *Max Hardcore*?

2300 or so uniques a day give or take. You do understand we have a trial join for 3.95? Maybe half(A little better)roll over to a full join but that fluctuates. We also charge 24.95 a month recurring. Also I said 340 new sales a month. Just over ten a day. As of today we have 268 new sales and 206 rebills for the month.

We also didn't charge as much in the beginning and we offered huge discounts for early signups when we were still getting things going. Anyways we aren't doing 43k a month. That's for damn sure.

Nothing changed and I aint bullshitting. The new sales did drop off after I added multi-month options. But thats good. I would rather have a customer pay 3,6 or 12 months in advance every time.

Ahh... misread then your first page post. Either way, those conversions are killer. I'm not sure how many months you are in now but the only numbers that don't look sexy are the rebills, and that just may be because you are still growing them.

It is something I have noticed. 2008/2009 rebills were much better with 3rd parties, up to last month they really seemed to suck. 1:1 ratio type thing.

No rebills when people pay for 3,6 or 12 months at a time.

We started billing almost a year ago exactly. Were growing and growing.

Maybe we'll hit that 40k a month by this time next year.

Yeah but Max Hardcore is a huuuuge brand. We've (I mean all of us, here on GFY) determined that it is 45 and older who pay, and they all cut their teeth on Max. He could just be sitting on a goldmine.

Definitely. We are getting the younger crowd as well but no doubt he has a well known name. We hit the ground running when we started last October and still have a long ways to go.

We will be adding some other sites to the mix and give surfers no reason to go elsewhere.

Here you go Mr. Deiz


http://i41.tinypic.com/mikxdx.jpg

Had to block out a few things but those the numbers from about 5 minutes ago.

Paully

What is making you refund trials? 4 refunds and they were all trials... how is that?

Numbers in general are my strong point, your recurring numbers are low, figure that out, and you will increase your bottom line.

Like I said though, cheers on the new sales, good job. I know you study those numbers, and obviously are not shy about sharing them. You know what I'm doing, and doing it for 1) to show that those rebills can be much higher and 2) more new sales in general.

I offer the $9.95 trial right now, it has rebilled at 63% since the 3rd. But what is more interesting is monthly subscriptions are higher then the trials.

Take a look at my pre-join form, notice only 2 options and price is NOT listed. Everything is recurring, always for me. I will never put a non-recurring option ever on an online join form. Proven HUGE in my other operations. What you do not have control over is your actual join form, which is the downfall, in my opinion, of the industry wide setup.

We prefer transparency. Thats why we kicking ass. I have people throwing down 200 dollars for a 1 year join. Not gonna get a monthly rebill from that. BTW you are making a huge mistake by only taking recurring IMO. If your product is good they'll be back.

We also have sms/phone billing/eudebit/ideal Whichever way they would like to pay.

In all probably 8 different ways to take payment.

As far as refunds go. If someone was hoping for euro content and aren't happy no problem. Refund. If it looks shady and the scrub didnt catch it we refund. Thats why I only have a couple chargebacks a month if that. Last month was 0 chargebacks.

My findings suggest otherwise on recurring model. You aren't offering a monthly plan... only trial then all multi month plans that don't recur. I think 1 year recurring is too far out to recur honestly... 6 month max.

But your rebills are telling me you are not optimizing. Not saying you are wrong, or whatever, I am saying my numbers tell a different story. And yes, I'm still testing adult results.

Honestly, I would do what I recommended and then put a *donate* or *tribute* fund to Max. In the description put... "I did hard time for you fuckers, for freedom of speech and expression", donate $100, $200 or $500. Then you can capitalize on your one time sales :)

The trial either rolls over to monthly recurring or they cancel. Basic trial model.

Since I added multi month 1 time only billing our overall sales went up 35% or more and continue to grow.

Were not asking for handouts. If they want to donate they can buy a membership for the pervert of their choice or just not use it. I dunno man. My model works and believe me when I say I looked at everybody's sales models and did what made sense for our end users.

From start to finish they know what they are gonna get. No bullshit. No tricks or gimmicks.

We go after pirates and continue to update and eventually gonna throw another site into it. Then another and another.

^^ my statement above, while recurring is always the model I would like to re-iterate, again, if you can't control your join forms and the way they are displayed, the recurring model will not work to it's full potential. So if you are using zombaio, you will never be able to fully control the process.

Hint: Todays charge is: USD $3.95 for 3 days period. Membership renews automatically at USD $24.95 after 3 days unless cancelled, then at USD $24.95 every 30 days until cancelled.

... is a sales killer. It should say... in big, bold and beautiful artwork:

3 DAY TRIAL TO MAX-HARDCORE.com!

CHARGE FOR TRIAL: $3.95

Enjoy 3 full day's* of Max Hardcore's yada yada videos.

Below form:

*Terms: Trials become standard monthly memberships after 3 days if not cancelled at $29.95 per month. Please see our terms and conditions here.

We like it simple. I cant stand that fine print/hope they dont see this shit here stuff.

And they don't see the join form again once they sign up. It needs to be spelled out. Clear as day. Maybe another reason we have low refunds and chargebacks.

And by the way my join form says it in 50 different languages.

Gonna end the discussion here because we have different ways of doing things Beaner.

LOL... you are selling something. For a price... it is simply artwork showing what you are selling and for what price. The terms of anything are spelled out... this is basic stuff man.

Do not try and convince me that your shit rocks the world and everything on your site is gold. If it was... you would have rebills 6 times higher then your new sales... guess what... you don't.

We are done... I think you inherently have a lack of understanding of business in general. And it shows on your site. Max has a good brand... a figure in the industry. He should have someone who cares for his bottom line.

Do not ever try and insult me for a different brand of *ethics*. Artwork, online, is HUGE to the bottom line. I am trying to tell you that *artwork* is also huge on the join form, whether you want to believe it or not. Nobody is hiding shit, it is presenting the form in a classy manner. But I do not think you will ever *get* it.

Good bye my friend :thumbsup

You think artwork on the join page is what keeps members on a site month after month?

I could see your argument for new sales from some flashy join page but how the fuck does that translate into rebills?

We sell porn over here not some gimmick and I dont remember insulting you but I will tell you this, If you think you blowing smoke up everyone's ass over some billing alternative that your affiliated with after one month of processing is impressive. Then youre a fucking idiot.

I will tell you this... and this is inherently wrong with every third party biller:

Todays charge is: USD $3.95 for 3 days period. Membership renews automatically at USD $24.95 after 3 days unless cancelled, then at USD $24.95 every 30 days until cancelled.

It instills uneasiness with potential members. Hardcore is absolutely the exception in something below 1:200 conversions, period.

It is his name, his legend, and people knowing him from past that is giving you those conversions.

When you do get signups, people read that price description and think to themselves "What the fuck is going on? Are they going to bang my card for another five sites or something? I need to cancel this shit RIGHT away!"

That is what I think. Nobody in the entire industry displays pricing structure like adult does. And every third party does it.

So yes... I think that *scary* wording makes people cancel right away. It is not just you (3rd parties) telling potential member the terms... it is telling them in an unsettling way.

It, quite simply put, scares them. Couple that with all the cross banging shit... and you have the results you do :thumbsup

Believe me, don't, I don't care. I ran an adult site in 2008 to 2010 and rebills were right around 2 months for every join... average. What do you think changed? And you posted your results straight up... you have less rebills then new joins.

Again though... we are done. You have a thick skull and you pissed me off... yes, you did insinuate you have better moral ethics then me and you can kindly go fuck yourself.

Ever heard the saying 'A dick in the hand is worth 2 in the bush'?

Let me give the first 3 rules of business buddy:

1) Get the money
2) Get the money
3) Get the money

I checked out your join page with my Portuguese Geo Proxy and your page translated to 'Beaner is an idiot'. I dunno? My join page looked the same??

Maybe my users are smarter than you though. They sign up and either cancel or don't since thats what the fucking join page says up front. Not in some *You will be re-billed at 29.95 a month billshit.

May was when I added multi month non-recurring joins. Maybe its working. What do you think Mr Math?

[IMG]http://i42.tinypic.com/10yovup.jpg[/IMG]

Money is always in rebills. The first step is to not scare customer. Second is to try and create something of value.

You will never reach 40k per month because you are behind the wheel.

I never make text smaller... i say straight up this is recurring and cancel. Every single contact us linkvis a direct email to me.

At 12 months, you should be at almost 1000 joins per month (with rebills). Im not sure why max is in bed with you but you are losing a lot of money sucking dick with your current setup.

Did i mention that you cant close a window on the site when it pops up? Really, that is really necessary?

What window? We have no popups? Talking about the Apache password dialogue? Try clicking cancel or enter your password like the box says.

Maybe you are a math genius but you need to brush up on your reading skills. Check Google for a night school around your neighborhood.

You just saw it and you can't understand. It's OK man. Hang in there.

Your gonna shake the industry up I know it once you can read.

Viva la Revolucion Beaner!

THE NEVER ENDING POPUP
Paully, like I said (should I not call you by name for fear you may be thinking I'm calling myself Paully?) the box doesn't close!! People don't hit the cancel... they hit the fucking X... you can't fix that?

Your join process is terrible. I mean really bad. Which is why, you posting those stats, I was blown away. Imagine what they could do if properly done??

You are representing a brand that has a lot of history in adult... I renig my statement of 40K/month... should be making 100K/month!

AND HERE IT IS... IT WILL NOT CLOSE, IT CONTINUES TO POPUP... AT LEAST 3 OR 4 TIMES

http://www.judoporn.com/images/hardcorepicture.jpg

3 times. Your blown away because your wrong. Now are you Sara Swirls webmaster?

Anyone who goes to your site will say the same thing... WTF. 3 times... it may be 6 times, I don't know really... I checked your site months ago and it still does the same thing... stupid is what it is. It tells me you are a groundhog on your stats, providing nothing, to little, on the advancement of that site.

I'm sorry mostly for the guy relying on you to make money...

Yes, your popup is horrible, irritating, confusing, and just looks like an error. And there is not a chance in hell that is why your conversion are what they are... you are trying to grow a program in which an adult figure is behind.

Just let Max read these comments, make his decision for himself. It is obvious to me you don't have the first understanding of online business.

I am being a dick because for several reasons... and #1 it is because you insinuated that you have more morals above and beyond mine. That was the straw that broke the camels back... just so you know. Have MAX hit me up if he wants to both 1) stay under the radar and 2) make a shitload more money