Barry, not everything the govt says is a lie...but when you reveal the truth of what they are doing you go to prison for "treason". That should kinda be a hint that maybe we the public don't know shit about what they are really doing

And I agree that empty threats are dangerous. Our Pres. had no business threatening another country to begin with.

But to now say that we have to go in and KILL people in Syria because Obama made a dumb move by threatening to do it in the first place is not cool at all.

I think if you or I were Syrian citizens we would be just as unhappy about our families being killed by U.S. bombing as we would be about getting gassed by the Syrian Govt.

Two wrongs do NOT make a right.

As I said before, it's NOT "okay" to use chemical weapons.
But I'm pretty sure that the CWC was about the use of those weapons in WAR. They were concerned with the safety of their own troops.

And there is international law that says one country can not attack another one without provocation. In other words...our military is supposed to be DEFENDING our country.

Not out attacking other countries base on theories of "preliminary strikes". Look at what that got us in Iraq.

On one hand you are saying the govt. lied it's ass off to invade Iraq and made up stories of WMD's.
Then you turn around and say that since a guy you like is now in office...it's all good to do the same thing all over again.

I just don't think it is. And to see my Democrat friends and the scumbag politicians in Washington D.C. suddenly become War Hawks is just an amazing and disturbing thing.

And it just goes to show that nothing really matters except power.

John Kerry calling for us to bomb another country that did not attack us is just pure politics. Deep down inside he is still that guy who wanted to abolish war and testified about the atrocities in Vietnam by our military.

But politics has him selling out and following the party line.

And watching Nancy Pelosi come out of the White House meeting the other day all bloodthirsty and ready to start killing people with Cruise Missiles was one of the most bizarre things I've ever witnessed.

And to see them all trying to justify it by comparing it to Chamberlain appeasing Hitler is a fucking joke.

Hitler was invading and occupying half of Europe at the time (you know, sort of like what WE did in Iraq and Afghanistan) and had a giant military machine that was threatening all of Europe.

Syria? They are definitely not even CLOSE to the military that Hitler had.
Hitler would have destroyed this civil war bullshit in a couple of hours. The Syrian military can't seem to stop it at all...much less invade other countries.

And will they suddenly have the ability to pull their troops away from barely being able to hold off the "rebels" and hit the borders and start firing all of their chemical weapons at Israel and Turkey and Iraq now?

I don't know. And neither does Obama.

And how about instead of assuming shit, we wait until somebody actually DOES it before we start another Iraq-style preemptive strike?

Our country JUST did that over the last decade and it was a huge mistake.

Hell, we are still fighting in Afghanistan. We should have never invaded them either.
Their "crime" was that the leader of the Taliban (you know, the ones we helped get into power by arming them against the Russians) refused to "cooperate" and hand over Bin Laden.

So the U.S. govt. invaded the whole goddamned country.
And yeah, it "felt" right at the moment.

But now looking back (with 20/20 hindsight) I see that it was a fucking dumbass thing to do and has ended up killing tens of thousands of civilians and as of Oct. 2012 had killed 2,012 U.S. troops (that number is higher now).

Really? 12 years and all these dead people plus hundreds of billions of dollars. The whole thing could have been taken care of by The Navy Seals from the very beginning.

And now we want to do it again?

How about we just skip the mass deaths, creating new hate filled enemies of the people there...and just send in the Seal team to take out Pres. Assad now?

I'll tell you why...because our fucking politicians love to play at war. But the fear of their own sorry asses getting assassinated in retaliation keeps them from taking out Assad himself.

So more innocent people are going to die because Obama made a dumbass comment about a redline and now has to prove how tough he is politically?

Come on man. We can't go in there and murder people with bombs to teach Assad a lesson about murdering people with gas.

It makes ZERO sense.

You make it sound like this practice is in the distant past :1orglaugh:winkwink:

All very well said, Robbie. As others have pointed out though, the 'President' is just a frontman. A bought and paid for lackey.

All this partisan 'Obama is terrible', 'Bush was terrible', 'Demublicans suck' fighting, chatter, drivel is exactly what "they" want: Focus on the frontmen, and Pay No Attention To The Men Behind The Curtain.

Divide and rule.
Follow the money.

This would not have happened under Reagan, no country wanted to fuck with him!

Reagan was just another corrupt politician as well. Was he better at "leading"? I think so...but in the end, just another politician with his own cronies and agendas.

NONE of them are worth a damn.

Thank you. Saved me some keystrokes.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=2HvuUSRhpXE

Thanks for pointing this stuff out. Yes America is the world's bully. The abuse of power is off the hook.

Things America leads the world in?.
1. the number of people incarcerated in prison. 24% of all the world's prisoners. This in spite of having only 4% of the world's population. Obscene.
2. America's military budget is more than the next 16 countries combined. Obscene. Perhaps if USA didn't meddle in everyone else's affairs then this wouldn't be necessary.

Any common foreigner can get a taste of US oppressive power by going through US customs where you have no rights and answering a question like "have you ever smoked a joint?" honestly can get you banned for life. I know plenty of people who have had their rather expensive holiday and business plans unceremoniously ruined by customs for the silliest little things. People are actually staying away from US in droves because of US customs and taking their tourist dollars elsewhere.

There is something really fucked up with the American psyche where litigation is a sport and everyone is out to control everyone else.

America?. The land of the free!? huh? Wait. Off the top of my head I'm not thinking of too many less free countries in the world.

Oh, and what is with every American's love affair with their military? If I hear one more American trip over themselves to be the first to thank a soldier I'm going to barf. I know that opinion is going to be unpopular but I only see them as contributing to the madness.

Fuck yeah! Robocop!!

Bully or mandated world police?
If mandated world police then USA must take action.
If bully then ok, USA step back and the free world must consider how they can deal with Syria knowing people fighting for basic human rights are gassed to death.
How is this different then any human looking to have basic human rights?
All people are born equal and have basic human rights, that is my opinion and any person believing any different is a wasted life. Yes then you did NOTHING other than making your short stay on earth comfortable.
I DO NOT believe the USA should be fighting this cause but instead WE ALL should.
Look at slavery or even earlier in history and you will know that it is worth fighting for the freedom of every humans on earth. Borders mean NOTHING, the world is one.
I have no compassion for Obama, but just ask you look at the present situation with an unbiased opinion.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh Al Qaeda AKA the "rebels" are fighting for basic human rights? Is that why they are eating hearts and executing young boys and raping and slaughtering christians and even non by the tens of thousands? These are the people we would be (we really have been all along) and are now supporting.

I think TPTP have shown their cards on this one and it's blowing up in their face. There's a just a few like yourself that have yet to see it.

I see IT very clearly but perhaps you have elected to only see what you want to believe.

If you see the "rebels" as some sort of freedom fighters you are blinded by stupidity. If you think this is about chemical weapons you are blinded by stupidity. Especialy considering the "rebels" were found to have used them multiple times in Syria already and there's no word of that now. In addition to the fact the US has used white phosphorus, depleted uranium, agent orange, and who knows what else in recent years so who are we to preach?

the one with the missiles and the air fighters

Speaking of which the supposed chemical weapon was apparently fired from outside of Syria.. Most likely the Mediterranean. Why would Assad fire from outside his country? There's also good speculation he had no idea it was even happening. As in if it was his army he found out about it afterwards.

Robbie never fails to disappoint.

Agent Orange can't be equated with sarin. Sarin is used to kill people, a horrible death. Agent Orange was a chemical defoliant used against the Viet Cong who were clever enough to hide their weapons and themselves under the cover of thick jungle vegetation. Agent Orange was dropped not to kill people but to give the American soldiers the ability to see their enemy. There's no doubt that the chemical caused many on both sides of the war and civilians terrible health problems but it is not in any way equivalent to using sarin gas to deliberately kill your enemy.

Can't wait until the US becomes a weak isolationist country at the behest of its citizenry, who will shortly thereafter begin their crying about being jobless, higher taxes, less entitlements - your standard of living has much to do with the very shit you're crying about.

no, but you can compare its toxicity to dioxin
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2,3,7,8...odibenzodioxin
dl50 (rat, oral) 20 μg/kg

sarin:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin
dl50 (rat, oral) 0,55 mg·kg-1 (= 550 μg/kg)

dioxin is even more toxic than sarin

(source french wikipedia)

Agent Orange still wasn't developed or used to kill people.

why doesn't the west attack north korea where mothers are forced to drown their own babies?

totally agree with you robbie, i think the people have had enough. The British vote proves that.

And yet it DID Mutt. And once the U.S. saw what it was doing...they started pumping out MORE of it. They literally were killing 2 birds with one stone.

I don't want to argue this with you.

But I will tell you this much...what do you think the U.S. govt. would call it if another country sent planes and dumped Agent Orange all across the U.S.? Even ONE time (not every day like we did)?

It would be an "Act Of TERROR" and definitely called chemical warfare by our govt. if it was done to us.

And if Agent Orange was falling from the sky on you and your family...would you tell your kids "Don't worry, it's not chemical warfare...it's just plant killer. They didn't intend it to hurt you"?

Of course not.

That is an understatement. TODAY they still have birth defects in Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos because of it.

Dow Chemical knew in 1965 that dioxin was harmful to humans, and kept it quiet. The US government knew this was going to cause health problems, and use it anyway. But Dow is the real cock sucker when it comes to Agent Orange. They knew more than everyone else how harmful it was, and kept a lid on much of it.

If given the choice to die somewhat quickly by sarin or get cancer and fuck up generations of my family for decades to come, I'm going out as quickly as possible and choose sarin, as horrible as it would be. :Oh crap

Just go to google. Type in "vietnam agent orange"
Then hit the "images" tag

Then explain how Agent Orange wasn't chemical warfare.

Brother, I've seen that shit with my own eyes in Vietnam and Cambodia. It is horrific what is still happening. And that is just chemical. You should see what is happening still with land mines. Fuck man. Just horrible shit, kids and people blowing limbs off and dying EVERY DAY, STILL after all these years. Various NGO groups are there trying to clean it up but they lack funding. Go figure.

The Vietnamese tell a different story about the "American War" that differs a little from the "Vietnam War" story we have all been fed. And their war museums have some of the most horrific images of US troops doing beyond human things to the Vietnamese people. I literally walked out of one museum in tears and my head hung in shame.

Then as you travel the countryside and see hideously deformed kids begging, or sitting outside of a shack incapable of doing anything other than shitting on themselves, mostly all third generation Agent Orange victims... to say it is heart wrenching would be an understatement.

Check out the birth defects and cancer rates in Iraq now due to the weapons used on them. It's Vietnam all over but worse. :(

Novel "1984" + Book of Revelation = Now

Of course, the fact that Obama has bombed Lybia, Somalia, Yemen, and continues to bomb Pakistan and Afghanistan isn't HIS fault.....


:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh



.:winkwink:

It's like we have become desensitized to killing people world-wide.

We hear a quick mention of it on the news (maybe) in between 24/7 coverage of shit like the George Zimmerman trial or Casey Anthony trial and it doesn't really register what the United States is doing to people.

We are getting a media blitz from The President Of The United States Of America today. And he will be trying everything he can to explain why it's a good idea to kill Syrian's with our bombs and destroy their entire countries infrastructure to "punish" their leader.

"Punish". Like WE somehow have become their daddy and can give them a spanking.

Might does not equal right. And I think that when history takes a look at our govt. in the future it's going to look very, very bad.

The fact that people STILL buy into the Republicans v Democrats thing is beyond mind boggling to me....

http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczyn...war-with-syria

"During the presidential election last year Vice President Joe Biden attacked Mitt Romney for being ?ready to go to war? in Syria. He offered no specifics.

?He said it was a mistake to set an end date for our warriors in Afghanistan and bring them home. He implies by the speech that he?s ready to go to war in Syria and Iran,? Biden said Sept. 2, 2012 speaking in York, Pennsylvania.

?He wants to move from cooperation to confrontation with Putin?s Russia. And these guys say the president?s out of touch? Out of touch? Swiss bank account, untold millions in the Cayman Islands. Who?s out of touch, man??

Biden more clearly defined his own Syria position in his vice presidential debate with Rep. Paul Ryan. He was asked why the need to intervene in Syria was not the same as in Libya where it was justified to prevent further massacres. (At that the time the death toll in Syria was 30,000. It has now passed 100,000 deaths.)

?Different country. It?s a different country,? Biden said. ?It is five times as large geographically, it has one-fifth the population, that is Libya, one-fifth the population, five times as large geographically.It?s in a part of the world where they?re not going to see whatever would come from that war. It seep into a regional war.?

?You?re in a country that is heavily populated in the midst of the most dangerous area in the world. And, in fact, if in fact it blows up and the wrong people gain control, it?s going to have impact on the entire region causing potentially regional wars,? Biden added.

Biden said the Obama Administration was working with allies in the region to identify people to takeover in the ?when? Assad fell.

?We are working hand and glove with the Turks, with the Jordanians, with the Saudis, and with all the people in the region attempting to identify the people who deserve the help so that when Assad goes ? and he ? there will be a legitimate government that follows on, not an Al Qaida-sponsored government that follows on.?



.:2 cents:

Yeah, chemical weapons are terrible. Assad should have just used white phosphorous instead, like the Israelis used on the people of the Gaza Strip...

http://d10ikykk3ztxb7.cloudfront.net...04/gaza-wp.jpg

Because that's not criminal, right?

so 110,000 people have died in Syria so far and because of another 1,400 we're going to kill a few thousand more - right?

what's truly fucking insane now is that the attack is now a fight for democratic party power. obama is now going to spend 2 days selling the attack to us just to simply try and save the dem party now. if congress does not authorize the use of force, obama is done, lame duck. dems lose.

that's fucked up when politics boils down to bombing and killing in another country to try and save the democrat president.

While I agree that there are no honest politicians anymore, or that there has ever been, Reagan didn't bow to foreign leaders.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=jocQgIBjPzc