ThunderBalls

In most states one has to prove self defense, not the other way around.

you're funny.

A bit naive but funny.

L-Pink

Martin's parents have already settled a million dollar claim against the homeowners association. Just an FYI .....

TheSquealer

You know who never complains about racial issues and never blames everything on race? EVERY fucking racial group apart from blacks.

Crazy how everyone is "racist" but only against one group. Weird right? It's almost as if they are busy just living their lives and not blaming every problem they have on another raciall group.

baddog

Bullshit, without the media you never would have known this shooting happened. Every opinion you have formed about this case is based on the media.

What law school did you attend? It is amazing, I have seen well over 50 pieces of evidence introduced and not one of them was the body. Maybe a few photos.

Intent, opportunity and motive are the three standard things that are proven.

ThunderBalls

A photo of a dead body is not evidence of a dead body?

What law school did you attend? *


*Sucking your cop boyfriends cock does NOT count as law school.

brassmonkey

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baddog

Do you think one photo from a cell phone is all the evidence it takes to convict someone of murder? How about 10?

Dumbass

xKingx

ThunderBalls

yea you're right, there is no body.

Cock breath.

brassmonkey

you mean murdered. what did he do wrong to be confronted by a guy with a gun? im wondering did he follow him from the store

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acrylix

Not sure what shit hole you crawled out from, but in this country we are innocent until proven guilty. That means the burden of proof is on the prosecution, NOT the defense. Get that through your thick skull you fucking moron.

Rochard

He was defending himself from what? Zimmerman followed the kid, stalked the kid, and then chased him when Martin fled. An armed man chased a kid who had done nothing wrong and killed.

You can't argue self defense. Zimmerman stared it, and his injuries were minor.

At what point in time did it become acceptable to have armed civilians chasing and killing innocent people?

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Trend

You're a clever guy and therefore you know what you are not so subtlety insinuating here. Do you understand how that does incredible harm to race relations and does nothing but fuel prejudices?

Follow this for me:

1. A hispanic male is accused of murder
2. He is acquitted in a court of law
3. A then legally innocent guy returns to his position
4. He is murdered in retaliation for his acquittal by blacks
5. Based on your coy remark in the other thread .. innocent whites are also killed by rioting blacks.

This disregards the law and fuels racial tensions. It's also so irrational that boggles the mind.

This is precisely why I don't believe we will ever see racial harmony.

TheSquealer

Uhm.... defending himself from getting punched, knocked to the ground, having a guy on top of him punching him repeatedly while beating his head into the pavement? All consistent with the injuries of each party and the eye witness account of the sole eye witness.

You are confusing the shooting with everything else. Pulling out a gun and shooting Martin doesn't have to be related to anything else other than exactly what was happening at the exact moment the gun was fired.

If you want perspective, listen to the 911 call. Its pretty clear Zimmerman was calmly doing his job and waiting for police and doing everything right, guiding police to the area etc etc etc.

And he didn't "stalk the kid" - he was keeping his eyes on him while police were en route.... AND guiding police to his location in the neighborhood. Again, all well documented in the 911 calls.... but who needs facts when you have headlines crafted to sell newspapers, twist facts and cause an emotional response from simpletons to increase readership and ad sales?

You are confused about "he started it" and what that means. All that really matters is what was happening at the moment the gun came out.

All evidence shows he acted in self defense. Even the wounds of each party and an eye witness account supports that.

There is a simple way to avoid someone getting killed in these situations. Don't punch the guy who is doing his job, then climb on top of him, start punching him and beating his head against the pavement.

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brassmonkey

you know how racist you sound? only "the blacks" think zimmerman is guilty! guess you closed your eyes plugged your ears and scrolled past Rochard's statement above yours guess what? he's not black!!

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tony286

He was told to stay in the car.also everyone scims over this guy had a history of being violent.

TheSquealer

No, he was not told to stay in the car.

Second, it wouldn't matter if he was told to stay in the car as its 100% irrelevant and carries no legal weight if he was.

Last, uhm... wait for it...
wait...

Why was Martin suspended from school for (one of the 3 times)....?

The investigator later saw Martin mark a door with "W.T.F." or "what the f--k," the report said. When the school cop searched Martin's backpack the next day looking for the graffiti marker, he reported he found women's jewelry and a screwdriver described as a "burglary tool," the report said.

According to the report, the 12 pieces of jewelry included silver wedding bands, earrings with diamonds and a watch. The investigator asked about the jewelry and "Martin replied it's not mine. A friend gave it to me," the report said.

Uh oh... almost seems like a ....

Burglar?

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Rochard

Trend

1. If you think white people would kill Zimmerman in response to his acquittal then you are delusional.

2. If you think white people will riot and murder in response to his acquittal you are delusional

My guess is you purposely misrepresented what I wrote because you realize how illogical your position is.

I never said that only "the blacks" think zimmerman is guilty.

brassmonkey

as far as i heard on 911 she said wait for the police they are on the way.

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tony286

I was on a neighborhood watch. Your job is to call police. The kid may have been a thief but he stole nothing and geo with a history of violence killed someone.

TheSquealer

I listened to the whole thing. I listened to it played in court.

I posted it here if you want clarity.

Clearly you didn't listen to the call or watch the video of the 911 operator being cross examined as they broke the entire call down... being that the 911 operator is a male not a "she".

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TheSquealer

He called police 46 times to report suspicious people and/or activity. He was calling police that night. He was guiding police to Martin. All well established facts.

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brassmonkey

dispatch: are you following him? zimmerman: yes dispatch: ok we don't need you to do that.

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brassmonkey

it should be open and shut case but this country they let people weasel around justice.

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TheSquealer

My sudden interest in this case is that as someone who never watches the news, is that I was completely stunned to hear soundbites of the prosecution calling witnesses that only hurt his case.

Then i started checking the facts and it seems no one even knows the facts or cares. Everyone has such a twisted version of what happened that its unreal. If you want to know what happened... all you have to do is listen to the 911 call and you hear a guy, calmly, professionally talking to 911 and guiding police to a guy who looks and is acting suspicious.

After following him to make sure he didn't hop a fence and disappear and evade police, Zimmerman claims Martin approached him (upset about being followed - but that doesn't make Zimmerman wrong for doing so - doesn't make Martin wrong for being upset),... what happened next and how Martin chose to deal with it is what defines the case. Martin approached him, punched him, knocked him to the ground and beat his head against he sidewalk as Zimmerman yelled for help. Zimmerman pulled out his gun and shot Martin. All of these facts are well supported with evidence and eye witness testimony.

Zimmerman will walk. There are no facts that support any other outcome.

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Rochard

TheSquealer

I know english is not your first language.. let me translate. "We do not need you to do that" is not an order to do something. Its the operating stating his preference. Furthermore, even if the operator gave him a command or order, its 100% irrelevant and carries zero weight.

Why was Zimmerman following him? He was guiding police - who were already dispatched to his location. Thats also quite clear in the 911 call.

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Rochard

TheSquealer

Too bad the law and evidence do not support your insane, lynch mob views. Otherwise, you could see two lives destroyed, instead of one so you feel better.

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Rochard

OneHungLo

That one group hates facts. Especially when they come to crime, rape, murder, IQ etc

brassmonkey

your full of shit just like zimmerman later let the police do their job! zimmerman sounded like he had pills or drinks or both. did you hear the weird shit he was saying?

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Trend

Just not worth it. They have an agenda & nothing you say .. no logic .. no facts will influence their minds.

TheSquealer

I would be happy to address facts as i've been doing. Declaring me to be "full of shit" does not change any of the facts of the case or the chain of events. As i've said, i've listened to the 911 call as it was played in court and with the 911 dispatcher being cross examined. Its pretty clear you didn't even make it that far being you thought the 911 dispatcher was a female.

But hey, don't let facts get in the way of your racism. Carry on.

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Rochard

baddog

Definitely debate captain material.

And you are basing these facts on . . . .?
Mind directing me to the time of the recording so we can hear what you are talking about?

Based on what?

blackmonsters

Well, it wasn't a black girl who just got a case to the supreme court claiming she didn't
get into college because of her race.




PS : You aren't stating facts, just your ignorant fucking opinion.

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brassmonkey

he followed and killed someone that was fleeing. listen to the 911 tape. what's crazy is he was killed where he was living.

read this baddog http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/...ains-zimmerman

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baddog

Page Not Found

and I will take court testimony over a newspaper article, especially considering how many reporters lost their jobs because of bullshit reporting.

brassmonkey

If George Zimmerman didn't break every rule in the book when it comes to Neighborhood Watch programs, he came close.

Zimmerman called Sanford police on Feb. 26, a rainy Sunday evening, to report a suspicious person inside his neighborhood near Seminole Towne Center.

We don't know everything that happened in the 13 minutes that passed between the time Zimmerman, 28, called police and a paramedic pronounced 17-year-old Trayvon Martin dead.

But this much isn't in dispute: Zimmerman was armed. He was alone. And while waiting for police, he somehow got into a fight with the person he thought suspicious.

All three of those actions are strongly discouraged by the National Sheriffs' Association, which oversees about 20,000 Neighborhood Watch programs.

There are practical reasons for those rules.

And this absolutely heart-wrenching one: A family of a teenager is now coping with a death that probably could have been avoided.

"There is no reason in the world to carry a gun for Neighborhood Watch," said Chris Tutko, a retired police chief who now directs Neighborhood Watch for the sheriffs' association. "It gets people more into trouble than out of it."

A manual published by the association for its "USAonWatch" program makes that very clear.

"It should be emphasized to members that they do not possess police powers and they shall not carry weapons or pursue vehicles," the manual states. "Members should never confront suspicious persons who could be armed and dangerous."

Zimmerman is reportedly the self-appointed leader for the group at his complex of town homes. A sign at the gated entrance warns it is surveilled by Neighborhood Watch, and says, "We report all suspicious persons and activities to the Sanford Police Department."

That's a prudent step for any neighborhood. In fact, Neighborhood Watches are popular in Central Florida. In Orlando alone, there are 905 block captains listed with Orlando police.

Some groups are highly organized and walk their neighborhoods in scheduled patrols. More often, though, neighbors just get acquainted with one another, exchange phone numbers and learn to report anything out of the ordinary that they notice as they move through life's predictable moments: taking out the garbage, walking the dog or getting the mail.

Even the basis for Zimmerman's initial phone call is questionable.

Here's why: The sheriffs' association manual lists the type of suspicious activity that should be reported to police. Among the examples: "Someone peering into car windows" and "broken doors or windows."

Nowhere does it list walking while black, which is all Trayvon appeared to be doing as he made his way back to the house of his dad's fiancée after a candy run to 7-Eleven. Trayvon was armed only with a package of Skittles in his pocket.

At least one neighbor told the Sentinel that young black men were suspected in recent neighborhood crimes. Yet nothing — so far, at least — suggests that Zimmerman had reason to think Trayvon was committing a crime.

We don't know exactly what happened next, but at some point the two fought. Zimmerman was bleeding by the time police arrived, and Trayvon was lying facedown dead in the grass.

Zimmerman told police the shooting happened in self-defense. The Seminole County state attorney is investigating whether the killing was justified.

It doesn't take much investigating, though, to see that if some basic, common-sense rules of Neighborhood Watch had been followed, it's likely none of this would have happened.


for some reason the filter is erasing the url if you want the article leave your email here
articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-14/news/os-trayvon-martin-beth-hahahahahaha-031512-20120314_1_orlando-police-block-captains-zimmerman

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baddog

I guess listening to admissible evidence is outside your skill set. You would rather believe hearsay.

Rochard

Great, so you have two people defending themselves - an armed man who stalked and then chased a teenager. The teen - Martin - was doing nothing wrong. A older, armed man stalked him, followed him, then physically fucking ran after him. It wasn't Zimmerman defending himself; It was Zimmerman who started it and the kid was defending himself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSquealer You are confusing the shooting with everything else. Pulling out a gun and shooting Martin doesn't have to be related to anything else other than exactly what was happening at the exact moment the gun was fired.

I'm not confusing the shooting with anything.

The kid had done nothing wrong, was followed and stalked by an older armed man so Martin did what any kid would do - he fled. He ran. And Zimmerman chased him. Take and the shooting out of this, and you have older armed man chasing a kid for no fucking reason.

He wasn't doing his job. He was running an errand, and saw Martin. He wasn't "on watch" or "on duty"; He was an armed civilian. He should have called the police and let them handle it. Instead, we have an armed civilian chasing down an innocent kid and killing him.

Zimmerman called 911 and followed him. Chances are Zimmerman had already been following him for a few minutes before calling 911. The kid notices a older man following him and fled.

The kid ran. Zimmerman said "He's running". Zimmerman was chasing him.

You said "who needs facts when we have the 911 call". Great - Zimmer called 911, followed the kid, and then chased him when he ran.

I'm not twisting facts at all. It's in the 911 call. He followed him, then he chased him, even though he was told by 911 not to.

You can argue he was acting in self defense all you want. He followed the kid, he chased the kid, and when he caught up to the kid he got his ass whopped. Martin was acting in self defense too. An older armed man was following him and when Martin ran, the older armed man chased him.

He wasn't doing his job. He was not a police officer. If anything, he only should have called police and then walked away - not chase an unarmed innocent kid and kill him for reason.

A teenager went to the store to buy skittles and was followed and chased by an older armed man who shot the teen dead. There is no two ways about it.

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baddog

Amazing how you are able to know all the facts without being there or bothering to listen to the trial. You are wasting your skills in adult.

brassmonkey

we're not in a fucking court

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/0...CALLY-INVOLVED

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brassmonkey

you cant teach a old dog new tricks

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Rochard

Why do you have to be childish and insulting?

An armed man chased a kid for no reason other than he looked suspicious. He chased him, ran after him, and when confronted he shot and killed him. I don't care who started the fist fight, I don't care who was winning, I don't care who got their ass whipped. Martin was acting in self defense when someone chased him for no reason. Zimmerman's life was never in danger; At the most he had a single cut and maybe a broken nose.

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Rochard

Imagine if you sent your kid to the store and he (she) was shot dead by someone for no fucking reason at all. One moment you kid is walking home form the store, the next minute they are being chased, and the next minute they are dead.

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baddog

And you base these "facts" on what?

Jel

way I see it (so hold on to your hats, because I'm obviously right), is the black kid was acting in self-defence initially, and had every right to kill, if necessary, an armed stranger.

It then turned, and the latino defendant bloke was in fear of *his* life, so then in turn shot the black dude in self-defence.

Both parties were genuinely acting in self-defence, at that time, as stipulated by their respective physiology.

A tricky one, but Judge Jel rules hispaniwhitey not guilty of murder. Completely guilty of being a fucking idiot waste of space who created an unnecessary event, but that, imo, isn't murder. Manslaughter (which I think is the equivalent of murder 2 in americaland?) in my book.

Court adjourned. I mean closed. Whatever the right terminology is.

brassmonkey

id be on deathrow

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crockett

Jewish people are so special they had to create their own special word for racism directed at them.

In the US blacks play the race card far too much and are usually far more racist themselves than the average white person.

Mean while it seems whites in Europe and playing the race card quite a lot these days.

Then you have the whole Latino thing in the US..

Blacks are certainly not the only ones.

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brassmonkey

doesnt mean 2 shits talking it out so im done

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Axeman

You sure like to state a lot of things as fact, when there is no evidence or witnesses to back up your beliefs. Using things like "ran after", "chased after" him.

He may have ran after him, but there is no evidence to support that. He may have started it, but again no evidence that it happened that way.

You act like you were right there in the thick of the action, and know exactly what happened! You better call the D.A soon, as this case is going to need you badly!

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Rochard

Jesus fucking Christ, the fucking 911 says it all.

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