It's an Illuminati poll. They'll TELL you who the winner is when they're ready.

You're not hearing me...Obama is trying to take credit for oil production being slightly up. He had NOTHING to do with it. HE brought it up and lied in the debate. Romney correctly pointed out that Obama is the enemy of the oil industry and has sought to stop them from drilling. It's up in SPITE of the federal govt.

Romney isn't distorting anything. He correctly pointed out Obama's policy and stated that when he is President he will open up those lands and drilling permits that Obama is blocking and bring up oil production to full capacity.
Which will create jobs AND increase the global market supply of oil.

There really is no defense for Obama being deceptive with his b.s. on that matter.

Obama has pretty much failed in all respects to the economy. That's why he really can't run on his record in that dept.
But he does have Romney by the balls on social issues. Romney can't defend himself there. And that is where Obama should be going for the throat.
On the economy...the Obama campaign and their surrogates are trying to re-write history. But people aren't stupid. They can see with their own eyes.

But on social issues...Obama can win the election. He just needs to focus there.
If he doesn't....all that Romney has to do is keep bringing up Obama's own lies from the 2008 election and all the big promises he made.

Gosh Robbie, I think you should just vote Romney. You pretty much have a love affair going on with him already based on your posts. They're practically all pro-Romney, very rare to hear pro-Johnson response from you in defense of Obama or Romney.

You're full of shit.

All my posts are simply arguing against the hysterical Obama supporters.

I'm just pointing out the truth. If that is "pro-Romney" then Obama is really a piece of shit.

And just to make it clear to you since you keep jabbing at me...I 100% agree with Romney on the economy. That's why I laugh at Dems trying to defend the utter failure of Obama on the economy.

I 100% DISAGREE with Romney on every social issue.

That's why I'm voting Johnson. Now do me a favor and stop pretending that you know that I think. Worry about what I'm presenting in my argument and discuss those points instead of trying to get personal with me. I know it's hard because Obama has no record that is defensible on the economy.

These seem mostly pro-Romney instead of something like, "hey Johnson wouldn't do this, he'd do this..." Why do you care so much about defending Romney, when he isn't even the guy you want? Or is he? ;)

These facts are misleading. Oil production on federal land is down 14% in the last year. That's cherry picking a single stat and making into something it isn't. Oil production on Federal land from 2004-2008 under Bush fell 17%. At the very same time, oil production on Federal land from 2009-2011 rose 11%.

So during Obama's tour of duty, oil production on federal land went up while under Bush it went down.

I am not a "hysterical Obama supporter". Given two choices, he is the better of the choice. Your other guy isn't even in the running.

Obama "ain't no JFK". But he's better than Romney.

So Obama sucks but not as bad as Bush? That ain't saying much. Romney is saying straight up that he will double permits for drilling and try to bring up oil production.

It's not that hard to understand.

And also..how is it "misleading" to point out that oil production on Federal lands is down under Obama? It is.
Bush isn't the issue here, Obama is. If Bush were running for president then his opponent could give him hell for the same thing.

My "other guy" is in the running. It's thinking like that that makes sure he can't win. By our very actions we are ensuring we either get a socially acceptable/ fiscally failure Obama OR a socially horrible/ fiscally sound Romney.

Johnson gives us REAL freedoms. Not Obamas half ass freedom or Romney no-freedom.
He wants to pull us out of Afghanistan TODAY...not in 2 years. No need for any more of our kids to die in that god forsaken piece of shit country for nothing.
He will stop the spending and get govt. off our backs, out of our bedrooms, and out of our private lives with their spying and searching us.

You want me to vote for the lesser of two evils.
I'm going to vote instead for what I believe in.

With you having admitted to being a "47 percenter" I understand why you don't get what Robbie is explaining to you.

I was a 47 percenter when I was nine months old because my daddy died a US Marine in Vietnam. Since then I've repaid my debt by serving four years as a US Marine myself. At the same time I'm pretty confident I've paid more taxes in the past ten years than you have.

So Romney is going to do... Raise oil production... Which is what Obama did?

Oil production on federal land under Obama's turn is up, not down.

That story reminds me of Romney, another American Hero!



https://youtube.com/watch?v=Tg_qbnjFAaI

No, he's not in the running. He doesn't even have an outside shot.

What fucking freedoms? Do you need to show your papers when you cross the county line? At the super market? Do the police search your house without a proper reason?

Bush rammed the Patriot Act down our throats and do you know what changed? Nothing. I still wake up, make porn sites, drive 300 miles to see my family, no one bothers me. I have a fucking arsenal of assault rifles in my house and my government doesn't seem to give a crap about 'em.

LOL. Freedoms. Yeah, Obama will take away our freedoms. Romeny too. Good one.

There are two kinds of people in this world, there are givers and there are takers. I would never consider somebody who served their country to be a 47 percenter or a taker. To me a taker is somebody who lives off the government dole or the fruits of somebody else's labor and never attempts to better themselves.
All I was trying to do was to push your buttons to figure out why you said that in the first place last week or a few weeks ago in another thread. If you still consider yourself a 47 percenter then so be it but why would you if you are not? And you clearly are not.

shut the fuck up and start learning chinese idiots

lol @ robbie talking about freedoms

if i wanted to be free I would go to fucking jakarta not that giant police state they call america

You cannot push my buttons. I am the most even keeled person you will ever meet.

My father died when I was nine months old and my family collected death benefits until I was eighteen. Clearly since then I've come a long way.

But all of us will be part of the 47%. Well, at least those of us who live till retirement age.

Yes, they both will not remove the Patriot Act, they will keep "Homeland Security" searching us at airports, police are allowed to search you most anywhere you are at.

I just don't think of that as "freedom". I guess a lot of people have just gotten used to it. I have not. It isn't the "normal" thing to me. Never will be.

Bush used the 9-11 terrorist attack as a way to scare us all into giving up our freedoms. The Patriot Act and getting searched by the TSA are totally against the founding principals of our country.
Yet here we are still getting searched, still having private emails being looked at, still having our phones tapped, the list goes on.

Romney is a war-mongering piece of shit who also will cater to the religious right. Obama is a war-mongering piece of shit who will cater to the left.
They will ALL make money for their cronies.

I believe that Libertarianism is as close to what this nation is SUPPOSED to be about as I've seen. Neither the Dems or Repubs represent what I think.
So I'm going to vote my conscience. I hope you do too.

:thumbsup:thumbsup:2 cents::pimp

fact is there are a lot of givers in what mitt was calling the 47%. he just generalized big time and assuming everyone who doesn't pay income taxes is a piece of crap but its a terrible generalization. there are all kinds of situations that a person might find themselves in at certain points in life that might have them fall into that category but that doesn't mean they haven't given so much at another.

Please explain to me how Obama will cater to the left, most of left isnt happy with him but he is all we got. He is a moderate at best that leans right.

Well said , its how the pundits get people all hopped up but you re right. What in someones life has changed.

Mit Wins, Penalty Obama for cluding with ref

I'd say...all the people who are on foodstamps that were not on foodstamps 4 years ago have had their lives changed.
I'd say that a percentage of our revenues being down from paysite sales is attributable in part to the shitty economy...which changed my life.
I'd say all the people who have joined the welfare ranks lives have been changed.
I'd say all the people who were lucky enough to get a job but it pays far less than their last one have had their lives changed.
My health insurance premium has gone UP through the roof over the last 3 years...that has changed.
Gas is priced so high that it is driving up the price of food and goods as well as killing normal people at the pump...that has certainly changed people's lives.

OR...we can just whistle in the dark and pretend nothing is wrong and blame it all on Bush from 4 years ago.

american's seem to expect an a lot of a president. would things be better if mccain got in? doubtful. will things improve if romney gets in? doubtful. will things get better if obama gets a second term? i doubt it. fact is no president can change what is going on in the world in regards to the economy. there are much larger things in play than US government policy.

I think it's more of how the President leads. Reagan is a good example.
So was Clinton starting in 1994 when he figured out what he was doing and started kicking ass.

Obama came in with a lot of us behind him. The whole world was cheering for him. His approval ratings were through the roof.
And most importantly he told us that YES..he could change things. And that YES it was all Bush's fault to begin with.

So I disagree that the President can't change things.

Obama himself claims that Bush changed it for the worse. And in 2008 he claimed he could change it for the better. And I believe he really COULD have in that first year in office when he had everything going his way.

But he didn't.

As for McCain, obviously since I voted for Obama in 2008 I didn't believe he would do a better job.

But looking back in retrospect at his "drill baby, drill" mantra...I'm thinking we might have already had a recovery instead of stagnation. But who knows?

McCain was another guy (like Obama) who was a legislator and not an executive. That's why Senators don't get to the presidency as often as governors do.

I'm going to vote for Gary Johnson...but more importantly I'm going to vote for the Libertarian ticket up and down the ballot. I feel that really can change things (especially on the local level)

i thought the illuminati didn't exist :2 cents:

But... They've always searched us before getting on an airplane. Ever since I can remember. And after 9/11, it's just common sense. I want them to search every last person who gets on that airplane. What you see as a violation of your freedoms is what I call protecting me from nut jobs.

The police can search you any place they want? Is that because of Obama? Bush? The Patriot Act? Or laws that have been in place for decades?

It all just depends on your outlook in life. Some people are afraid to have their cars or homes searched - Me, the local cops are welcome in my house any time. Fuck, two of my best friends are police officers.


We were being searched before getting on airplanes long before 9/11 and President Bush. This is just common sense here. You saw what happened on 9/11 and you damn well know they'll try again.

They do it every fucking time too. They say "Oh, so and so is gonna take away our rights" or "so and so is gonna take away our guns" and yet not a god damn fucking thing ever changes. At all.

And it's always fucking comical.

Oddly enough, both candidates are silent about our right to bear arms. Go figure.

On the oil thing, it's pretty clear that WHILE Obama HAS reduced and retracted fed. land grants for the VERY GOOD reasons he stated (shorthand: no more squatting), it's ALSO true that drilling is UP.

So it's just a game of spin that people do not appreciate who recognize it as such.

It's also true that we're not dying for more oil. If we were, we'd stop selling some of what we've got, wouldn't we? Hell yes. It's just ear candy for fools, I'm sorry but that's what that debate is about.

america has the right to invade your country and take your oil

That's exactly what it is - spin. And I hate it.

"Oil production is down on Federal land in 2011". Well might be true, but only for one year. If you look at his entire term oil production on federal land is up.

And again, I'm asking why Romney is saying this - One of the primary reasons drilling is down federal land is because of the Deepwater Horizon accident. Romney wants to increase drilling in the Gulf - WTF? - does he want another massive oil spill that will put tens of thousands of people out of work?

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure the Obama side spins shit too. Let's debate some of the stuff he's spinning.

I have NEVER been searched getting on an airplane until after 9-11

I remember flying to Colorado with my grandparents in 1974 on Braniff airlines. We walked on the tarmac, up a stairway onto the airplane with our luggage in our hands and people were smoking cigs on the plane.

As an adult I flew out of Miami many times in the 1980's...even out of the country down to Lima, Peru and back to Miami and was never searched.

In the 1990's I flew all over the country and over to St. Marten as well. When I got back from St. Marten the Atlanta airport DID search my luggage (I had the little sticker in it telling me so)

But no...they did NOT search you like a criminal the way they do now. I even had them pull me aside and take me to their little search room last year when I flew to New York from Vegas. I was wearing sweat pants and a t-shirt. They stuck their hands right down my sweat pants and felt all around my balls.

What were they looking for I wonder? A bomb?
Fuck no. It was just an excuse to search people for the failed War On Drugs.

From what you have written...you seem to have no problem with any of this & it's all good to let the govt. do these things.

I do not feel that way.

Do you THINK writing in CAPS sometimes helps PROVE your point?

Ugghhh it is PAINFUL reading YOUR posts.

That is not true.

I've watched things change dramatically in my lifetime.

Doesn't matter if it's a Republican or Dem in office.

When I was younger the police could NOT search your car. They couldn't search your person (unless you were under arrest).
But after a Supreme Court ruling...they now are like GOD.

I've watched the "war on drugs" take away more of our freedoms and put more people in prison than I can stomach.
I read Jimmy Carter talking about going to the annual governors meeting back when he was governor of Georgia. And at the time all the governors loved to brag how FEW people were in prison and how low their crime rates were.
He said he attended one a few years back as an honorary attendee....and was shocked because all the governors were now bragging about how MANY people they had in prison.

So yes...shit does change. And we DO lose our freedoms.

I'm kinda stunned that people just accept that and think it's "normal".

Then don't read them. You obviously disagree. So put your blinders on and ignore me.

This is not true, and it is an oversimplification. The cost of oil is determined partially by supply, but it is also driven by demand, speculation, politics and even sentiment (The belief that the price of oil will go up, itself drives up the price of oil). The belief that oil prices will drop itself drops the price of oil. Speculators then sell oil futures short, dropping the price even more.

Here's another way to prove it. In the past 4 years the US has been producing more and more of its own oil. It now produces more than it buys and in fact, even sells oil to other countries like China. The price of oil is still high despite so much more supply.

Because the global market supply is still not enough.
Supply and demand will always determine price. The U.S. doesn't even produce enough at current levels to satisfy it's own needs.

If folks can't even agree how supply and demand works in the global economy then I'm afraid that there is just no way to have any kind of intelligent discussion on this.

So I'm gonna go with your thoughts: Let's produce less oil and see what happens to the price. And I mean everybody produce less! Nothing will happen right?

Listen up everyone, Robbie is right.

Just last week Obama's storm troopers broke down my front door, illegally searched my house, took away my guns, and then hauled me off to prison for failure to have the correct "papers".

Robbie, I'm reading a book right now about a little known government official from Vichy France during WWII. Trust me when I tell you that you have no idea what freedoms you have.

Why do you keep babbling about Obama? I'm not. I'm talking about the freedoms that I have seen the federal govt. take from us during my lifetime.

Stop jerking off to your picture of Obama...I'm not talking about baby jesus Barrack. Is that all you think about is Obama? :1orglaugh
I'm talking about the govt. in general over my LIFETIME.

You, on the other hand are exaggerating and talking about Obama, stormtroopers, papers, and guns.

What the fuck is wrong with people these days? Don't any of you give a damn about the govt. spending 10.6 billion dollars a day, or about being searched, or about having your phone lines tapped, or any of the other shit the govt. does?
Fuck! I thought we the people were supposed to not trust career politicians and are supposed to be diligent about protecting our freedoms and privacy. Guess I was wrong.

Ouch, sorry man. Can I send anything? Soap? Candy?

people easily fall into an us vs them mentality. people want a 'side' to be on. unfortunately no matter what president is in charge, the freedomes we've lost won't be coming back without some kind of "revolution" which will most likely have to be violent.

I think we could start getting SOME of our freedoms back on a local level. But it won't be easy. Religious crazies and the "fun police" have made it very difficult.

For instance...I'm seeing all the local judges up for re-election around Vegas. And they are all bragging how we should vote for them because they are endorsed by all the law enforcement agencies.

Isn't that a little upside down? If you go to court...do you really want a judge who owes their election to the cops endorsing them to have your fate in their hands? lol

Seems to me that a judge who is endorsed by the cops is the LAST person I want to vote for as a judge. Not saying I want a "crooked" judge either. But at least someone with a semblance of fairness and not 100% on the side of the cops every time.

It's little things like that on a local level that I believe can make a difference in our lives.

Hell, Romney will take even more of our freedoms if he could. :(
And Obama just seems kinda indifferent to the whole thing.

Fine, great, awesome. Take Obama, Romney, Republicans, and Democrats out of it. And then tell me what freedoms you've lost?

I'm forty-four years old and I cannot think of one freedom that I've lost since I was a teenager. Can I own a firearm? Yep - same exact fucking one I was trained with while in the Marines Corps. Can I drive from state to state without having to show my papers? Can I work where I want to work? Can I go where I want to go? Yep yep yep.

Do you know how much contact I've had with the federal, state, county, and city governments this month? Zero. And the month before that? Zero. And the month before that? Zip. And so. I guess at some point I had to go to DMV and I also filled out a form to get a license for my assault rifle, but otherwise, nothing at all.

What freedoms have been taken away from us?

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...93219726_n.jpg

We can go back and forth on this forever. Republican policies account for nearly 70% of the country's current debt. The Romney/Ryan plan does nothing to reduce the debt, so this argument is totally meaningless.

What is more concerning to me is that the entities that fund the Romney team are generally doing so, so they can benefit from the breaks and policies they (and only they) will receive in return.

Billionaires like the Koche brothers for example, who wish to pollute our air and water without consequence are not "Good for America". As one move against this, Obama has proposed carbon taxes that they do not want to pay, so contributing tens of millions to the Republican party is worth it to them, in order to save hundreds of millions in additional costs, even though it is not better for regular people.

This is why many of the oil lobbyists want to eliminate the EPA entirely, a move the Romney/Ryan team seems to side with.

Sheldon Adelson is another prominent billionaire Republican contributor. He's scared of prosecution for illegally bribing officials to allow him to set up casinos in China. Should Obama be re-elected he may have to face the music, so the sky's the limit regarding his donations.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...#ixzz29Cc4oaBw

I can go on and on, but to be clear, Romney will not be doing ANYTHING for regular Americans - he will be paying back huge favors at the COST of regular Americans - monetarily and environmentally.

A concerted effort to destroy Obama was orchestrated by the Koche brothers and others, starting on his very first day in office.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1452899.html

Here is a lengthy documentary regarding how the fake grass-roots Tea Party group was started...

https://youtube.com/watch?v=oSAzYWmsiwI

A short semi-fictional account of this anti-American terrorist movement can be seen here, in a short HBO scene from a show called The Newsroom. It's a fictional show, but the scenario is accurate...

https://youtube.com/watch?v=yGAvwSp86hY

The Bush Administration was an unmitigated disaster. This is why the Republicans lost in 2008. They would have lost to a lampshade. This is why they have kept Bush away from the Romney campaign at all cost.

A few moderate Republicans wanted to work with Obama, but they were quickly weeded out, so only the radicals and obedient remain.

The idea was simple: Make sure Obama fails, so the GOP can regain power. That is exactly what they have done at every turn. They have filibustered everything the President has proposed.

They claim that Obama had a 2 year super-majority, but in reality, he only had a "super-majority" (over 60 votes) for approximately 24 days. After that, everything was filibustered.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...88823930_n.jpg

Obama presented Romney Care (a Republican idea), but it was rejected. He offered 3 to 1 spending cuts for revenue to help balance the budget, and it was rejected. He proposed the American Jobs Bill multiple times, but it would have helped to create jobs, so it was rejected, and again, I can go on and on.

I don't blame Obama. I don't think Obama is a great leader, but at least he has only had one position, and it has been to help the American middle class.

If Romney wins, based upon lies, based upon voter suppression, based upon blind contributions, and most disturbing of all - based upon an anti-American congress who cared more about getting their power back, than they did about the betterment of America, then a new political strategy will have succeeded.

Like a child taking a fucking tantrum to get his way, one party can get their way by blowing up the system - holding their breath and turning blue. This concept has frightening ramifications.

These people are not the solution - they are the problem...

https://youtube.com/watch?v=9nv3PK8t7RM

The truth is, a government in disarray is just what some of these assholes want, because then they can get away with anything, and by voting for Romney, you are just helping this madness come to fruition.

This is what a bully looks like...

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...22976419_n.jpg

And here's one of many wonderful endorsements for Romney, by a fellow Republican...

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...90125375_n.jpg

The economy is worse.
Employment is worse.
Gas is more expensive.
The debt is worse.
Foreign affairs are worse.

Shitcan the idiot, get some fresh blood in there.

This has to sting, right through the magic fucking underwear - Awesome!

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...92987282_n.jpg

hey you made a poll, arent you supposed to show the vote ? or you wait to next election in 2016 ??????????????

Not seen the debate, not read the thread, but I guess Obama won.

If Romney came across as anything other than an idiot, I'd be amazed.