BBC Report "Should access to online pornography be blocked?"

[youdeserve]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16670628

"22 January 2012 Last updated at 10:36 GMT Help
If you switch to a new provider for your internet access later this year, you will be forced to make a choice: do you want access to adult content or not?

If you are with one of the big four providers, you won't be able to get online until you answer. It's a fresh step taken to protect younger teenagers from hardcore material, which is sometimes seen by children who have barely started secondary school.

But the move is controversial, alarming firms which say they run lawful sites already restricted to adults - and those who fear for the free nature of the internet.

Nick Ravenscroft reports."

Oppinions? Is it just the normal well... "special approach to the worlds things" by british people or does this makes any sense?

[CurrentlySober]

I think this a GREAT step forward, and I will be one of the first to sign up and vocally support this !

[youdeserve]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

I think this a GREAT step forward, and I will be one of the first to sign up and vocally support this !

The 10 min report is covering more aspects of this theme, not just the choose of YES / NO on porn.

[youdeserve]

Btw this is a video follow up of it: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-15256993

[halfpint]

Its a good idea and they allready do this if you buy a dongle or a new mobile phone. You have to phone up and ask them to remove it. I had to do it. The only problem I did find is that it blocked mainstream sites like youtube and some game sites as well as all adult sites. But yep I think its a good idea and will support it

[youdeserve]

Originally Posted by halfpint

Its a good idea and they allready do this if you buy a dongle or a new mobile phone. You have to phone up and ask them to remove it. I had to do it. The only problem I did find is that it blocked mainstream sites like youtube and some game sites as well as all adult sites. But yep I think its a good idea and will support it

Sorry, but I need to mix some politicsm here.

Hungary is now being targeted that, for instance:

- Our media is censored, state controlled and the media is not free
- We are not a democracy
- We are controlled by the government closely
- We are not free in general and we have a dictatorship.

Whilst:

- Media is not controlled at all, on some stations open speaking about how bad is the government goes on 24/7
- I can do whatever I want, anywhere I want, nobody will bother
- I can go wherever I want, nobody blocks me doing this

And this includes that I have free access to anything on the internet, data protection laws are in fact weakend this jan 1. so the ISPs no longer keeping any data about anybody regarding surfing behaviours and so.

So... why the UK is not attacked by these EU politics about freedom and stuff? Just used my logic ... if we are attacked for bogus stuff, whiches are not exists then why the UK is not attacked for things that exists?

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by youdeserve

Sorry, but I need to mix some politicsm here.

Hungary is now being targeted that, for instance:

- Our media is censored, state controlled and the media is not free
- We are not a democracy
- We are controlled by the government closely
- We are not free in general and we have a dictatorship.

Whilst:

- Media is not controlled at all, on some stations open speaking about how bad is the government goes on 24/7
- I can do whatever I want, anywhere I want, nobody will bother
- I can go wherever I want, nobody blocks me doing this

And this includes that I have free access to anything on the internet, data protection laws are in fact weakend this jan 1. so the ISPs no longer keeping any data about anybody regarding surfing behaviours and so.

So... why the UK is not attacked by these EU politics about freedom and stuff? Just used my logic ... if we are attacked for bogus stuff, whiches are not exists then why the UK is not attacked for things that exists?

They are not restricting your freedom they are giving you the choice if you want to veiw porn you simply get it unblocked it takes a few minutes. It took me one phone call and the lock was off in a matter of minutes.

Its a good idea for dumb parents who dont know how to block porn sites from kids

[youdeserve]

Originally Posted by halfpint

They are not restricting your freedom they are giving you the choice if you want to veiw porn you simply get it unblocked it takes a few minutes. It took me one phone call and the lock was off in a matter of minutes.

Its a good idea for dumb parents who dont know how to block porn sites from kids

Still, the restriction exists in any form, whilst here - no restriction at all. Still we are attacked and not the UK, where default is the restriction and you need to make steps to remove it. I believe it should work the other way round, however I accept the fact that parents, especially there are dumb enough to not knowing about how stuff works on the interWebs so might be a good idea to have it blocked by default

[CurrentlySober]

Originally Posted by youdeserve

The 10 min report is covering more aspects of this theme, not just the choose of YES / NO on porn.

I agree with restrictions 100% !

I have children - I dont want tem watching filth !

Adults with credit cards however are a different matter.. After all, muy children (despite their pocket money) cant pay ! Think about it!!!

[youdeserve]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

I agree with restrictions 100% !

I have children - I dont want tem watching filth !

Adults with credit cards however are a different matter.. After all, muy children (despite their pocket money) cant pay ! Think about it!!!

I always think that there are reality shows in the tv, and in these programs are always the dumbest, most low lifed scumbags featured. Youngsters take them as role models for obvious reasons. What if I have children (I don't) - and I ban him/her watching it? Next day he/she will be abandonded by others and excluded from social life in school / kindergarten as he/she wont be able to speak about the latest throw up or party happened in the show...

Same with porn I believe; it is obviously a bad thing for them. Their soul is not prepared for most of the stuff which is available porn related on the net - honestly, some stuff even not for my disguse, and I experienced a lot in the last 3-4 months. BUT - as the report pointed out that some teenagers are starting their sex life in a way inapropriate way - this ban only works if everybody and everything is banned, as sex life has two sides, two humans (at least). So if one has not clue about what is going to happen when the other part is just about do stuff he (or she maybe...) saw in the internet and thinks that this is normal as breathing air, there will be confusion and maybe a bigger harm done.

Hope that my point is clear in that, sorry if my english is bad or anything to express my thoughts

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

I agree with restrictions 100% !

I have children - I dont want tem watching filth !

Adults with credit cards however are a different matter.. After all, muy children (despite their pocket money) cant pay ! Think about it!!!

With so many free sites and porn tube sites you dont even need a credit card to view porn so even if a child hasent got access to a credit card it dosent stop them from viewing it.

[CurrentlySober]

Originally Posted by halfpint

With so many free sites and porn tube sites you dont even need a credit card to view porn so even if a child hasent got access to a credit card it dosent stop them from viewing it.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by youdeserve

I always think that there are reality shows in the tv, and in these programs are always the dumbest, most low lifed scumbags featured. Youngsters take them as role models for obvious reasons. What if I have children (I don't) - and I ban him/her watching it? Next day he/she will be abandonded by others and excluded from social life in school / kindergarten as he/she wont be able to speak about the latest throw up or party happened in the show...

Same with porn I believe; it is obviously a bad thing for them. Their soul is not prepared for most of the stuff which is available porn related on the net - honestly, some stuff even not for my disguse, and I experienced a lot in the last 3-4 months. BUT - as the report pointed out that some teenagers are starting their sex life in a way inapropriate way - this ban only works if everybody and everything is banned, as sex life has two sides, two humans (at least). So if one has not clue about what is going to happen when the other part is just about do stuff he (or she maybe...) saw in the internet and thinks that this is normal as breathing air, there will be confusion and maybe a bigger harm done.

Hope that my point is clear in that, sorry if my english is bad or anything to express my thoughts

Well they do have sex education at school and yes a lot they do pick up from their mates, but to have a kid watching had core porn on the internet is a big no no and they have plenty of time as they become an adult to explore and find out more about sex whether that be online or from their friends.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

[Dirty Dane]

Blocked by default is bad. Giving a free choice is good.

[rowan]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

I agree with restrictions 100% !

I have children - I dont want tem watching filth !

Adults with credit cards however are a different matter.. After all, muy children (despite their pocket money) cant pay ! Think about it!!!

The problem is that it's difficult to define "adult content"

Difficult for a human, even more difficult for a computer program.

There are going to be a ton of false positives (sites that shouldn't be blocked) and probably a fair few false negatives (adult sites that SHOULD be blocked)

The best way to protect your kids from the big bad internet is to supervise them.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by rowan

The problem is that it's difficult to define "adult content"

Difficult for a human, even more difficult for a computer program.

There are going to be a ton of false positives (sites that shouldn't be blocked) and probably a fair few false negatives (adult sites that SHOULD be blocked)

The best way to protect your kids from the big bad internet is to supervise them.

Yep that is one problem when I purchased a dongle it wouldent even let me go onto my own mafia game site or youtube, but I still agree its a good idea and you only have to say yes you want to view adult content or ring them.

[rowan]

Originally Posted by halfpint

Yep that is one problem when I purchased a dongle it wouldent even let me go onto my own mafia game site or youtube, but I still agree its a good idea and you only have to say yes you want to view adult content or ring them.

Too many people will rely on the govt (or whoever is doing the filtering) to get it right.

We just went through this shit in Australia, and the "oh my god, won't SOMEONE please think of the children?" mentality is sickening. You cannot use flawed technical "solutions" to replace education and supervision of your kids.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by rowan

Too many people will rely on the govt (or whoever is doing the filtering) to get it right.

We just went through this shit in Australia, and the "oh my god, won't SOMEONE please think of the children?" mentality is sickening. You cannot use flawed technical "solutions" to replace education and supervision of your kids.

I really dont see the problem here. You still have a choice whether you want to view porn or not. It took me a whole of maybe 5 minutes at the most to get the lock off.

[rowan]

Originally Posted by halfpint

I really dont see the problem here. You still have a choice whether you want to view porn or not. It took me a whole of maybe 5 minutes at the most to get the lock off.

I don't know about the UK solution, but the proposed AU solution only blocked HTTP, and a specific manually edited list of sites. That's a bit like letting your kid out to play in the yard unsupervised when the fence has fallen down, and all that's left is a gate standing by itself. It is a flawed solution that many people will rely on too heavily.

[alextokyo]

Lots of teenage boys will be shitting their pants over this, but then again most will easily find a way around it. When I was a teeanger I was the go-to-guy for anything technical, like setting up the VCR or tuning in the TV.

I remember getting my first computer then convincing my mom to sign up for a free month trial of AOL dial-up. One snag: credit card required. Well, being about 14 I had to convince my mom to use her card. We sat down at the computer together and went through the signup process together. I knew there was porn on the Internet. I can only imagine the excuses I would've come up with if we would've been asked "would you like to block adult content?"

Needless to say, when my parents went out a few hours later, I was spraying cum all over the place. Then I spent the next few weeks shitting myself, because I thought that the itemized phone bill might show all the sites I'd been visiting. For the next few weeks I rushed home from school hoping to intercept the bill before my parents got home.

... and I've been whacking it online ever since.

[Fletch XXX]

1984 was not written about America... We must fight the tyranny

[Splum]

its too late the governments and corporations are taking over the internet, we are all fucked

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by halfpint

With so many free sites and porn tube sites you dont even need a credit card to view porn so even if a child hasent got access to a credit card it dosent stop them from viewing it.

Exactly. This is a great development. Hopefully they will be able to filter better, but it's still a great way to give people the choice.

Originally Posted by rowan

The best way to protect your kids from the big bad internet is to supervise them.

I'll chain my kid to her bed so I can supervise her that closely.

I assume you're single and old. So no experience of bringing up a child or memory of what you got up to as a child. Here's something from a Father.

Eva and I were watching a comedy on the TV, our daughter was showering. When she came down two girls were kissing, it was a dare and part of the episode. Our 9 year old daughter blurted out "They're Gay". which surprised us as we had no idea she knew what it meant. So when she returned from school and before Eva got in, Dad had a little chat with her.

Seems she knew more than we thought. Girls or boys that kiss each other are "in love with each other". She understands the sex act. Not fully but knows what the bits are for. Knew about sleeping, what Mums and Dads do. Where did she learn all this. At school, not in a lesson, from talking to her friends and reading a book one of them has. She got the book for Xmas and has had a further chat with Dad and will come back when she needs to know more. Which is very unlikely.

Eva has already told her about puberty and periods and how her body will change. But not the person to openly discuss sex with her. We now all joke about it and when the dog starts bonking one of his stuffed toys, it's a joke and we all understand it.

You can't wrap children in cotton wool. Have you seen a Lady Gaga concert or video?

Prepare them for the world.

But let them see what some of us produce? NO FUCKING WAY!!! If I can possibly stop it. This also gives the parents of your kids friends the same choice.

[youdeserve]

All well said.

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Exactly. This is a great development. Hopefully they will be able to filter better, but it's still a great way to give people the choice.



I'll chain my kid to her bed so I can supervise her that closely.

I assume you're single and old. So no experience of bringing up a child or memory of what you got up to as a child. Here's something from a Father.

Eva and I were watching a comedy on the TV, our daughter was showering. When she came down two girls were kissing, it was a dare and part of the episode. Our 9 year old daughter blurted out "They're Gay". which surprised us as we had no idea she knew what it meant. So when she returned from school and before Eva got in, Dad had a little chat with her.

Seems she knew more than we thought. Girls or boys that kiss each other are "in love with each other". She understands the sex act. Not fully but knows what the bits are for. Knew about sleeping, what Mums and Dads do. Where did she learn all this. At school, not in a lesson, from talking to her friends and reading a book one of them has. She got the book for Xmas and has had a further chat with Dad and will come back when she needs to know more. Which is very unlikely.

Eva has already told her about puberty and periods and how her body will change. But not the person to openly discuss sex with her. We now all joke about it and when the dog starts bonking one of his stuffed toys, it's a joke and we all understand it.

You can't wrap children in cotton wool. Have you seen a Lady Gaga concert or video?

Prepare them for the world.

But let them see what some of us produce? NO FUCKING WAY!!! If I can possibly stop it. This also gives the parents of your kids friends the same choice.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

Blocked by default is bad. Giving a free choice is good.

Agreed.

You should have the 'choice' to block it if you like. But it should not be blocked by default.

[DamianJ]

Mobile sales are massive over here, so it doesn't seem to be damaging the biz in anyway at all. Stops freeloaders and kids.

[rowan]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I assume you're single and old. So no experience of bringing up a child or memory of what you got up to as a child.

You're wrong there.

I'm all for protecting my kids from the big bad internet, but you seem to be missing the point that the METHOD of blocking is flawed; it is still possible for sites to slip through the cracks. Censorship will lessen the chance of your kids stumbling onto something accidentally, but it's not an ironclad solution to ensure they'll never see adult content.

That's why I am advocating education (tell your kids, in an appropriate way for their age, that they may find something bad on the internet, and encourage them to tell you if they do) and basic parental supervision. The internet isn't a babysitter.

[Best-In-BC]

How can you guys not see this as pure BS

[Best-In-BC]

edited! wqrqwr

[Best-In-BC]

Originally Posted by rowan

see adult content.

That's why I am advocating education (tell your kids, in an appropriate way for their age, that they may find something bad on the internet, and encourage them to tell you if they do) and basic parental supervision. The internet isn't a babysitter.

Exactly, but do parents not already have this option, why does it at all have to be done this way ?

[raymor]

When a site is blocked, does it say so clearly and unambigously, including some wording that indicates how to turn off the block?

If not, so that many less technically saavy people don't know that the reason they can't get to a site is because someone decided it's not appropriate for kids, that's bad.

If the message you get doesn't make it clear that you can turn it on and off, it's interesting that the majority of webmasters seem to support blocking their own sites, but were radically opposed to blocking sites dedicated to theft.

[Best-In-BC]

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

Blocked by default is bad. Giving a free choice is good.

Bingo Bango, Anyone supporting needs to think about what this actually means

[bronco67]

I would welcome anything that allows parents to keep their children innocent for as long as possible.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by raymor

When a site is blocked, does it say so clearly and unambigously, including some wording that indicates how to turn off the block?

If not, so that many less technically saavy people don't know that the reason they can't get to a site is because someone decided it's not appropriate for kids, that's bad.

If the message you get doesn't make it clear that you can turn it on and off, it's interesting that the majority of webmasters seem to support blocking their own sites, but were radically opposed to blocking sites dedicated to theft.

With mine it said I could not view the site and to ring a number to get the lock taken off. Then they just veryfi that you are the person who purchased the dongle from the shop to make sure you are over 18 by asking you the card number, DOB, postcode ect you purchased it with. This was with a dongle but I guess they will ask the question whether you want to view adult sites or not when you sign to the ISP.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by Best-In-BC

Bingo Bango, Anyone supporting needs to think about what this actually means

It does not mean squat they have been doing it for years over here in the UK with mobile phones

[ottopottomouse]

Originally Posted by raymor

When a site is blocked, does it say so clearly and unambigously, including some wording that indicates how to turn off the block?

On my phone it redirects to the networks Adult Content Filter page telling you to contact customer services if you want to remove the block.

Currently the filters block so many ordinary sites that a lot of people end up removing it with no intention of looking at porn anyway.

[u-Bob]

Originally Posted by rowan

Too many people will rely on the govt (or whoever is doing the filtering) to get it right.

We just went through this shit in Australia, and the "oh my god, won't SOMEONE please think of the children?" mentality is sickening. You cannot use flawed technical "solutions" to replace education and supervision of your kids.

[u-Bob]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

But let them see what some of us produce? NO FUCKING WAY!!! If I can possibly stop it. This also gives the parents of your kids friends the same choice.

Those parents have had the ability to filter their internet connection for almost as long the web existed. There's a myriad of filtering programs out there they can install on their computers. A lot of browsers have come with filtering capabilities for years now....

I'm sure if those parents are really worried about porn, they have taken the time and made the effort to filter their internet connection (either by installing software themselves or asking a tech save friend/neighbor/technician to do it for them) instead of waiting 15 years for the government to come up with a solution.

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

I agree with restrictions 100% !

I have children - I dont want tem watching filth !

Adults with credit cards however are a different matter.. After all, muy children (despite their pocket money) cant pay ! Think about it!!!

i can only assume you aren't raising your kids. at least from your totally unstable persona here, i hope not. kids will find access to what they want one way or other. of course you don't want to give them easy access to porn but why should the rest of society have to deal with it because some parents are too lazy to do anything?

[travs]

it shouldn't be blocked by default

[CurrentlySober]

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

i can only assume you aren't raising your kids. at least from your totally unstable persona here, i hope not.

Dont worry, I was just trolling... FYI my boy is a grown man now with a baby daughter, and a son on the way

I'm 'Grandad' these days

[DWB]

I think people should be given a choice when they sign up for service. Do you want porn blocked or not. Then parents can decide what is best for their family.

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by halfpint

It does not mean squat they have been doing it for years over here in the UK with mobile phones

Yup, i couldn't even get on GFY with my fone. A quick fone call though soon changed that though...

[Fabien]

I don't know what to think about it.

Of course we don't want children to watch porn, hell it takes 2 secs to see some !
But blocking stuff and trying to manage internet is something that scares the hell out of me !

[youdeserve]

I'm actually satisfied with all the inputs I'm getting in this thread; exactly the stuff I wanted to get in return by starting this. "This thread delivers" - REALLY IS

[blackmonsters]

I support it if it can only be unblocked by a credit card.

Think about it.

Freeloaders would be fucked!

[youdeserve]

Originally Posted by blackmonsters

I support it if it can only be unblocked by a credit card.

Think about it.

Freeloaders would be fucked!

Good point

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by rowan

You're wrong there.

I'm all for protecting my kids from the big bad internet, but you seem to be missing the point that the METHOD of blocking is flawed; it is still possible for sites to slip through the cracks. Censorship will lessen the chance of your kids stumbling onto something accidentally, but it's not an ironclad solution to ensure they'll never see adult content.

That's why I am advocating education (tell your kids, in an appropriate way for their age, that they may find something bad on the internet, and encourage them to tell you if they do) and basic parental supervision. The internet isn't a babysitter.

All protection methods are flawed. Doesn't mean you don't do your best.

Education + filtering.

Originally Posted by u-Bob

Those parents have had the ability to filter their internet connection for almost as long the web existed. There's a myriad of filtering programs out there they can install on their computers. A lot of browsers have come with filtering capabilities for years now....

I'm sure if those parents are really worried about porn, they have taken the time and made the effort to filter their internet connection (either by installing software themselves or asking a tech save friend/neighbor/technician to do it for them) instead of waiting 15 years for the government to come up with a solution.

Education + filtering + plus filtering programs.

Originally Posted by DWB

I think people should be given a choice when they sign up for service. Do you want porn blocked or not. Then parents can decide what is best for their family.

And that's precisely what's happening here. I think a few here are scared Mum might say no to porn and this will stop Dad buying a membership. If it allows the kids to slip over it, at their house or a friends house because Mum and Dad are not savvy, Then who cares, not those who scream it's censorship.

Children need protecting from what some in this thread publish. And it should not be left to chance, educate them they might see something bad or relying on friends parents having the filtering programs.

It's simple, do you strap a seat belt around your child because its the law or it's the best thing to do or both? Both covers more angles.

[Eyeball]

It's not all about the kids. My grandmother should be able to search online for tan tights in the comfort of her wing backed chair without having to see nylon cumshots.

Not everyone is sitting at their computer with their dick in their hand and needs access to adult. If they want it on they will make the call or tick the box.