He was a bad-ass. Got the name because he went on a revenge killing of Crow Indians. They had killed his wife and unborn child when he was away. He went on a rampage, not only scalping his victims, but cutting their livers out. It was presumed he ate them, but no confirmation that I am aware of.

WTF.....Ok......:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

with or without onions ?:helpme

One of my favorite movies :thumbsup

As for the wagons, I can just imagine the pioneers sitting around the campfire and one of them is telling the others about how some guy in the east was trying to put an engine on the wagon so you no longer need a horse and all the others saying it will never happen because you could only go so far on a tank of gas and then you'd have to find some more gas. Why do that when grass is everywhere for your horse :winkwink:

Well, considering the location, I am going out on a limb and suggest sans onions.

Not sure I have ever seen it. I probably should though.

And then they polluted the land with gas stations. And let's not even get into how we fucked up the southwest with train tracks and telegraph lines.

No wonder the Indians were pissed.

(But I get what you are saying)

0-60 doesn't mean a thing. Electric motors develop their peak torque at 0 RPM anyway, but they taper off once they get going. I'm more interested in what the 60-120 times are.

While this is a Hybrid it shows where the technology is headed and puts to rest any fear for the lack of performance and those that think electric cars in the future will be nothing more than disguised golf carts :winkwink:

:2 cents::2 cents:

I stopped driving completely while living in Miami for 3 years. Its easy NOT to drive..

Just like the first mobile phones.

a former german imperator once said that cars are just a fad sinces horses are perfectly fine for what they are needed for

EXACTLY!!

New technology is always very expensive for the first adopters ... as the technology creators try to recoup as much of their R&D as they can, as quickly as they can ... but it is not long before they must reduce their prices to make the technology viable for the masses, or fade into obscurity.

The same Tesla S Sedan that is $60 out of the gate in 2012, will probably settle somewhere in the $35-40 thousand range by 2015 ...

I suggest bolting a Honda generator on the roof. That way you can drive while recharging.

.

How did you get around? Bicycle, cab?

As I was gassing up the Charger earlier I thought back to this thread and realized that with one of these innovative cars I could not even pick up a passenger at the airport unless they had zero baggage. I doubt I could get my two carry-on pieces in the car and have a passenger as well.

If you live in Miami, NYC or San Francisco. Try surviving in LA or Valparaiso without one. :2 cents:

Right, mobile phone started off at what, 3 figures, compared to this that is 5 or 6. Oh yeah, phones come with a 2 year contract, how will they do that with electric cars?

Not sure if this is referring to the Model S, or the video embed (I didn't watch it), but for refrence the Model S has a heap of cargo space, more then pretty much any similar car on the market. The battery lays flat on the floor, so you have both a massive boot and the 'frunk'.


It's a car, of course it will always cost more. Are you saying people will stop buying cars because they can't get them down to the price of a mobile phone? A mobile phone isn't the target, a competitive price relative to gas cars is. Given the quality of the sedan it is already competitive with similar cars (Merc's, etc), however their next planned iteration is a $30k car, that is a 3~ years off though.

Contract is irrelevant, as stated above. You don't get 5 years free fuel with your current car either.

Haters gotta hate.

I don't drive. I stopped a long time ago - right after it stopped being fun.There is no fucking way I'd ever spend $60K on a car that can only go 300 miles (best case).

In Toronto it doesn't matter how far a car can go on a charge, it matters more how long it can idle in traffic. If it can't idle for four to six hours, its useless.

Besides, electric cars are the biggest joke of the last century. My pretty battery-powered car is so green! But the coal-fueled and nuclear powerplants that it relies on aren't.

Haters gotta hate? Sheesh.

Stop being logical.

Odin, where do the kids sit?

There is technically 7 seats in the car. However the two rear facing seats are only for children, and can be folded down for storage. See this video as a demo:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=fRzdvLLQiYY&hd=1 - watch from 4:50 on.

I do believe in this car/company, not purely because it is electric though. If you watch some of the detailed videos and reviews on it (for instance watch the full video of the beta release) you will understand just how well engineered this car is. It is quite possibly the best engineered car in the US on pretty much every front. Keep in mind the founder and CEO of Tesla is also the founder and CEO of SpaceX, the company that will be docking with the ISS in a couple months and soon take over cargo and potentially human cargo for NASA. They are heavy on engineering talent, and very engineering focused, and it shows in their product.

[QUOTE=Caligari;18660026]wrong. not every 10 years. solar panels on average have a lifespan of 20-25 years.

You have batteries that last 20-25 years?!?! patent that shit! That's what puerile forever about solar power - the batteries cost more than the panels, and pollute more. As far as solar panels, the manufacturers of solar panels claim that they retain 90% of their capacity for ten years, 80% for fifteen years, and 60% for twenty years. So only if a) you believe the manufacturer isn't being the least bit optimistic and b) you're happy with getting held of the tasted output could you ever get 20 years out of photovoltaics.

You like solar. You wish everyone could use it. Great. The first step in getting solar used more is to have an understanding of how it can actually be used. I like Linux. I promote Linux. I don't go around saying that Linux is compatible with more games than Windows is because when people found out I was lying that would HURT the reputation of Linux. Same with solar. If you want to promote solar, be intellectually honest about it and promote it to people living in south Florida. Saying it's viable in New Hampshire hurts your cause, as does claiming that solar manufacturers are lying and their product lasts twice as long as they say it will, or claiming that a $25,000 solar system and three sets of fifteen batteries each is cheaper than paying your electric bill.


Look up how much arsenic, cadmium, and other toxic metals are released during the MANUFACTURING if the panel. You may be able to recycle the dead panel in 10-15 years, but that's too late because before you even take them out of the box you've already poisoned the planet during the manufacturing process. You might decide that you'd rather have arsenic pollution than carbon dioxide pollution and that's a perfectly logical decision. You can't intelligently make that decision as long as you pretend that recycling the panel afterwards will undo tbe release of toxins, though.

I'm a former member of Greenpeace. I'm all about protecting the environment. I just think that to ACTUALLY protect the environment we have to be honest with ourselves rather than being a fanboy, picking something our team likes and pretending it's perfect.

I spent six months studying the issue. I was a member of Greenpeace at the time. I read the studies in the university library. I started out wanting to demonstrate the crisis Greenpeace and others alerted me to. Getting the details, I found out that my Greenpeace magazine was telling the truth that there were tons of waste, and they were telling the truth that nuclear waste was very dangerous. I was disheartened to learn that the dangerous waste was NOT the kind that there was a lot of.

Back then I also repeated the Greenpeace line that in twenty years California would be underwater from global warming. That was in the early 90s. Apparently I was wrong because California is still here.

Mark, you would look great on Sainte-Cath's with this babe hehehehehe

Once again, any links to back up your claims (like the ones i have provided) would be appreciated.

It has nothing to do with Greenpeace or global warming etc. and everything to do with the facts which validate the grim reality of high level nuclear waste being generated in very large quantities every year and the lack of safe storage for this waste.
It's a ticking time bomb.

It also doesn't help when you have countries like Japan who get the bright idea to make a nuke plant in the ring of fire...
It's created a major disaster which has now spread beyond 100 miles from the site on land and thousands of miles in the ocean, and it will continue to do untold damage for many years to come.

So in conclusion, trying to promote nukes as "cleaner" than solar is ludicrous at best.
It has already been proven that the emissions/pollution from the manufacturing of solar panels is far less per output than fossil fuel production, and far better than nuclear power production on both a safety and environmental level.


.

koolaid must be tasty...would be easy to drink it i guess

who wants to spend a shitload on a car only to be limited to the distance you can travel? i don't know about you but i like to be able to jump in my car at moments notice and be able to go anywhere i want.

Bingo. When did driving become limited to "need?" That is no fun. Driving doesn't get interesting until you are 300 miles from home.

Okay, you're clearly not going to change your mind nor do you wish to learn anything. Solar is perfectly clean, because arsenic, cadmium, and lead aren't toxic at all. It's nuclear, not coal, that spews millions of tons of pollutants into the air every day. Everybody should just move to south Floruda, where every day is sunny and they don't need any electricity at night. Happy now?


Give me a shout if you ever grow out of your fanboy stage and want to look at the positives and negatives of things.

And where does all this magic electricity come from? Nuclear? Oil? Gas? Coal? But hey out of sight out of mind right?

That car looks so sweet...

https://youtube.com/watch?v=F0vycQ06a04

Whilst it is understandable if you like to road trips that this car isn't from you yet, it still does not take away from the potential of the car. Your one point seems to be that the range is not sufficient enough, so let me dispel why this isn't such an impossible deal in the relatively short term.

The first point that needs to be made is that you do NOT need an electric charger at every single gas station. You can not refill your gas at home, and thus there needs to be a gas station in every village, town, etc. Usually multiple to handle the load. This is what a lot of people completely neglect to take in to account. 90% of the time individuals will charge at home, at night, in off-peak times. This requires no upgrade to the grid (since off-peak power usage is so low), and the existing grid can support over 100 million electric cars charging off peak. As you do with your mobile phone you will simply plugin your electric car at night and wake up to a fully charged car every morning.

With this said, and as users adapt to this model (and technology morphs to make sure you never forget to charge at night - think wireless charging, mobile phone notifications, etc) it becomes a non-issue on a car of 300 mile range to drive around anywhere within the city for the day more or less.

Now, as you like to road-trip. Lets talk about CURRENT technology. Tesla's DC fast-charging network (which is being rolled out next year) can add 100 miles range in 20 minutes. So an hour to add 300 miles. Grab yourself something to eat, stretch your legs, watch a TV show/movie in or out of your car (Tesla has a 17 inch screen in the console) and you are ready to roll. If you only need an extra 100 miles to get to your hotel, it will require even less then this. Keep in mind this is current technology, and it will only get better.

Now for the kicker. There are 46,000 miles of highway in the US. Tesla plans to start with distances of nearly 300 miles between charging stations along highways, and move down. With a charging station at every 200 miles, along every highway in the US, that is a total of ONLY 200 charging stations to cover the entire US. Hardly an impossible task.

There is a lot of work to be done, and naysayers like yourself don't help, but as the thread started stated the days gasoline cars are numbered. For everyone a Tesla does not make sense today, for many it does. In as little as 5-10 years (with the reduction in price of battery tech at CURRENT pace), the build out of fast charging infrastructure, and the numerous benefits of electric (cheaper to run, cleaner, quieter, less maintenance, more room, etc) it will be common sense. The original gasoline cars didn't get on the road without work or issues either. This technology is the future, and the near future at that.