Parallels ? Video game industry and adult

[DoubleD]

Hey folks?
Recently, there was a quick little post about video games - ones to look out for, and while the majority of the folks commenting had some experience with gaming, and suggestions there was a comment or two about how it?s a waste of time.

This got me thinking?ok granted, there might be better uses of one?s time, but everyone needs a certain amount of entertainment and nowadays that can be across many different mediums. I still play at my age, fingers move a bit slower, but I enjoy it and I enjoy reading up on the gaming industry, new trends, etc?

Now there?s no question our industry in particular has undergone some changes or shifts over recent years. Common conventions, billing models, what users are prepared to pay for among other factors have changed for online adult users?as it has for many content driven industries.

What can the video game industry teach us? Or what parallels can we see even today?
Many would probably agree with me that things like piracy, etc have been better handled in gaming than over other mediums (ok sure there are plenty of ways to get free games, especially PC, but ask 10 random people to download a movie/music, then ask them to crack a game?chances are with nearly any demographic the success rate will be far lower)
Now for a large part this is related to console security and other technical roadblocks, easier to implement with an installed game, but for many game franchises, going to an online, mmo, community or subscription based system has been the answer. Again, giving an experience that is hard or difficult to reproduce?in adult, I feel that is represented by the focus on cams, dating and the like?

Speaking of online games, there has been another shift, more directed at payments?the trend of free-to-play. There have been examples in the gaming industry of failing mmos tripling their monthly revenue by shifting away from a subscription model, to focus on micro transactions. Sometimes this is not as successful, eve online for example or in the case of wow, double-dipping by billing on a subscription model and providing a cash shop?it?s a bit of a tightrope?

DLC (downloadable content) ads another element, and in some games (cough..black ops) online experience is really affected if you don?t get all the packages?essentially doubling your investment in the game?but maybe that?s the key as well, more transactions after an investment of time and money has already occurred.

Now, in recent months a fairly large adult brand made a big change that raised some eyebrows, I won?t name names, don?t need to?but in that case seemed to follow this free-to-play model, still providing exclusive content to free subscribers, yet allowing for various micro transactions within the product?even our own dating sites at loadedcash, and many others do follow a somewhat similar system with a free reg option. So do you feel this is simply a sign of the times?do we need to start moving away from a subscription-based system all together? Does this seem to de-value games in general? Any thoughts?

And finally I wanted to bring up one other trend that I think has done very well for the gaming industry when helping with retention?either retention for online subscription fees, for a particular console system or a game itself and that?s the concept of achievements or trophies.
Now this is more for those with adult communities, so dating etc?but I personally I?ve found the achievement/trophy awarding system in games now to be a great retention tool ? I love having more than the other folks on my list, and up until this point, I would only have this mental list in my head of the games I?ve completed?recording, sharing this info online drives competition and honestly is related to that drive in mmos like WOW (world of warcraft) to have better stuff than the person next to you..its a basic human drive.

In our case, in some of our more adult sites we used to list top active users, top uploaders, etc to give this greater sense of community and competition. Does anyone here think that giving users a more structured achievement or reward system based on actions in an adult community can help with retention? And in this case, I?m talking less tangible rewards like a pixel trophy?I think it would, especially with 20 to 35 yr old demographic.

Sorry, I know this one went one for a bit, I just wanted to get some folks talking?if there is any part of the discussion above you agree with or disagree with...hey just talking about emerging trends, where we might apply some tested processes to our own systems, etc..
So anyone else notice something applied well to both games and our industry?
And to anyone thinking we probably should not draw exact parallels with our industry here?I really do feel there is an important relationship between all entertainment sectors?realistically we?re all promoting our products to people, real people that have limited time, money or resources for entertainment?I think keeping a lot of the same conventions across all of those mediums keeps it simple for ?em?

Now, knowing where I posted this, flame on!

[bronco67]

I think the "free to play" model can work for anything, as long as you have a stellar product. If you get people hooked on something that's great, and they love it, they'll be more than willing to pay for it eventually -- even if they have the ability to get it for free. At least that's the way my brain works. I want the creator to get my money, so he can go on to create more of the stuff I love to consume. If everyone could have that mindset, maybe digital theft wouldn't be such a problem.

Problem is, most people create crap and wonder why no one wants to pay for it.

[DoubleD]

Originally Posted by bronco67

I think the "free to play" model can work for anything, as long as you have a stellar product. If you get people hooked on something that's great, and they love it, they'll be more than willing to pay for it eventually -- even if they have the ability to get it for free. At least that's the way my brain works. I want the creator to get my money, so he can go on to create more of the stuff I love to consume. If everyone could have that mindset, maybe digital theft wouldn't be such a problem.

Problem is, most people create crap and wonder why no one wants to pay for it.

thx bronco...I agree for the most part and Ive heard something similar from the perspective of the game company...more content, more interactions will cost more, simple as that and yea I'll agree the creative minds should be awarded, i think one problem i have is double-dipping in this regard, more thinking dlc than free-to-play here, but ill give an example...

now before rocksmith, i was all excited to get rockband 3 with pro quitar, keyboards, etc knowing that the songs there can support the hardware...getting to the dlc songs, i then grabbed a couple of pro guitar songs for a standard price, but if i also wanted to be able to play the pro keyboards, well there was an additional 99c upgrade fee...

my question is, ive already paid for the game itself, and in this case the dlc...the game was made to support the details of the pro hardware..so why should a user need to then upgrade to access code that should already be in place? This is just one example, a bit different than what i listed above..but wow harmonix, just wow

[porno jew]

porn just doesn't map over well to any other entertainment mediums, mostly because it's a masturbation aid.

[DoubleD]

Originally Posted by porno jew

porn just doesn't map over well to any other entertainment mediums, mostly because it's a masturbation aid.

hey man, I hear ya, why i wanted to pose the question...the relationship i feel is more about available time, etc...I'll be honest i only have so much time for anything... if its late in the evening and i need to choose between a game or a fap...well often i choose a game, hell no one is giving me a trophy for fapping...those on my friends list cant see how effective my fapping is (yea i know going a bit crazy with that one)

but my point was just if we can lump it into entertainment in general, free time, free resources, should we align common conventions to make it all work better?

[Fletch XXX]

have seen the topic come up a few times over the past decade of gfy, and always like seeing whats up with latest designs in this area

[CIVMatt]

Video games can read to school children... end of story

[DoubleD]

Originally Posted by CIVMatt

Video games can read to school children... end of story

Sasha Grey?

[DoubleD]

hey thanks folks for feedback so far just wanted to try to think and move discussions into different paths...my thought originally was no matter the type of entertainment, porn, sex, games, great movie, etc all release some endorphins or alter brain chemstry in some way to say, "hey i liked this, i want more of this" - so at its base is not all entertainment basically the same? or resulting in the same effect? so is there value in aligning processes, features, pricing, etc or I guess can we learn from each other?, have we already?

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by porno jew

porn just doesn't map over well to any other entertainment mediums, mostly because it's a masturbation aid.

very true, everybody who wants to blame the downfall of the online porn on us webmasters for being slow to adapt to how the internet works now is off base, what succeeds in mainstream can rarely be applied to porn.

[FlexxAeon]

Originally Posted by porno jew

porn just doesn't map over well to any other entertainment mediums, mostly because it's a masturbation aid.

pretty much

while the OP has some interesting if not valid points, porn is just a different beast. consumption is more of a private activity, and even those who enjoy the bragging rights of being a "top uploader" or whatever still expect some sort of anonymity. not to mention the fact that it's for adults only cuts a huge chunk out of your customer base. a 13 year old can play MW3 but they can't subscribe to bangbros.

there are a few companies that are attempting to bank off of some gaming parallels but they are few and far inbetween, and they can only go so far with it because, it's still porn at the end of the day.

and porn is just not as valuable as some of us still think it is.

[DoubleD]

Originally Posted by Mutt

very true, everybody who wants to blame the downfall of the online porn on us webmasters for being slow to adapt to how the internet works now is off base, what succeeds in mainstream can rarely be applied to porn.

Hey Mutt, well I was just thinking more along the lines would this be as effective or more effective, but I can't help but notice a shift over the years...back in the day when a bunch of us started a lot of online traffic was going thru adult sites, i think we shaped online conventions across the net based on volume and helping develop technologies that helped view content, etc - eg streaming videos

now fast-forward a few years, how has this changed? are we still setting and defining these online conventions, processes, etc or has usage of the net changed? and this is more of a numbers game...more people use the net this way, so we'll change design and processes to match...honestly I don't feel its adult shaping these conventions any longer..its social media, games and the like