Sen. Tom Coburn-Ass Of The Year

[cwd]

Oklahoma Republican Sen. Tom Coburn will not allow a proposal that would cover health-care costs for Ground Zero workers to go through the Senate before Christmas, a Coburn aide told Washington Wire this morning.

The bill?s sponsors, New York Democratic Sens. Charles Schumer and Kirsten Gillibrand, say they have the votes to get it passed, but opponents can put up procedural hurdles.

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2010/1...sponders-bill/

"This should not be seen as a Democratic or Republican issue. It shouldn't even been seen as a fiscal issue. This is a matter of morality, it's a matter of obligation," (former New York City Mayor Rudy)Giuliani said on an appearance on a local Fox affiliate.

And last week, former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee said that "every Republican should vote for this bill."

Current New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, an independent, also urged the Senate to reach an agreement, saying Monday that the "time for excuses is over."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/1..._n_799699.html

[beerptrol]

the rich need their tax cuts more than Ground Zero Workers need their health-care costs covered

[JFK]

Larry Flynt should put him in Hustler, as Ass of the year

[Brujah]

Well, obviously Huckabee and Guiliani are playing at the emotional issue and only Tom Coburn has the intelligence to do what's best for "the American people."

[cwd]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

the rich need their tax cuts more than Ground Zero Workers need their health-care costs covered

yeah, some said they would not see any other legislation until those tax cuts were extended, which they now are.

yet still, people who rushed into falling, burning buildings cannot get the medical assistance they need and are dying because they tried to help others.

[marketsmart]

Originally Posted by Brujah

Well, obviously Huckabee and Guiliani are playing at the emotional issue and only Tom Coburn has the intelligence to do what's best for "the American people."

guiliani feels guilty because he knew that the air was filled with poison, but washington wanted that mess cleaned up asap...

i hope to see in my lifetime a dirty bomb dropped in the center of DC when congress is in full session....



.

[Vendzilla]

Last July, before it was commonly expected that the Republicans would have sweeping victories in the November elections -- elections subsequently characterized by Obama as a "shellacking" -- the Democrats decided to introduce this Zadroga 9/11 bill in the U.S. House of Representatives. But the Democrats chose a method too clever by half: namely using a procedural method that required a two-thirds majority vote.


The vote total in the House was 255-159, with twelve Republicans voting for it -- and that meant the bill was defeated, even though it was well over fifty percent. The "cleverness" of the Democrats in not allowing the Republicans to add, subtract, or debate both amendments and the body of the bill resulted in this fiasco. The Democrats apparently thought that Nancy Pelosi's famous line, that "we have to pass the bill so you can find out what's in it," was the new standard in the U.S. Congress. Others thought not.

So go ahead and blame the republicans on this, it's been up for a vote before, blame it on politicians as a whole

[12clicks]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

the rich need their tax cuts more than Ground Zero Workers need their health-care costs covered

odd to see the rabble muddy the water by talking about the rich

[cwd]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

So go ahead and blame the republicans on this, it's been up for a vote before, blame it on politicians as a whole

First off, all politicians should be ashamed for not getting this bill passed earlier to aid those who need it most.

Now, Sen Gillibrand went to some Senate Repubs and tried to find a way to get them to change their vote to yes, working on a different way for it to be paid for, which was their main concern. They worked together, got it set so they would have the votes to pass in the Senate. Now this guy says he will not allow it to even come up for a vote. Its a disgrace.

Now that the media is finally starting to report on this story hopefully it will get done.
http://video.foxnews.com/v/4469087/n...or-911-heroes/

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by cwd

First off, all politicians should be ashamed for not getting this bill passed earlier to aid those who need it most.

Now, Sen Gillibrand went to some Senate Repubs and tried to find a way to get them to change their vote to yes, working on a different way for it to be paid for, which was their main concern. They worked together, got it set so they would have the votes to pass in the Senate. Now this guy says he will not allow it to even come up for a vote. Its a disgrace.

Now that the media is finally starting to report on this story hopefully it will get done.
http://video.foxnews.com/v/4469087/n...or-911-heroes/

I think it's a disgrace that the insurance for cops and firemen doesn't cover them.
How many people does this effect anyways? I see where it's going to cover people that live around it too, not just the responders.

Hell for 7 billion dollars, they should be able to build a really nice hospital and staff it

[cwd]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

I think it's a disgrace that the insurance for cops and firemen doesn't cover them.
How many people does this effect anyways? I see where it's going to cover people that live around it too, not just the responders.

Hell for 7 billion dollars, they should be able to build a really nice hospital and staff it

Well, according to the video in the link I posted, there are approximately 100,000 people who would be helped by this. First responders as well as those who came in the months after to help with the clean up and those who lived nearby and were told by Govt officials it was safe for them to return.

The insurance companies fight the claims, saying there is no proof that the cancer and other diseases these people are fighting came from their work there, which is idiotic. If you are really interested in what is happening, watch this clip. I realize it is from the Daily Show, a comedy show, but there is a 10 minute discussion with members of the NYPD, FDNY, DOT and a rep from the engineers union.
http://www.indecisionforever.com/201...sponders-bill/

As for the cost, they have already cut 1.2 billion (was going to be used for a victims compensation fund) from the original 7.4 billion.

Coburn has even claimed that this has not had a proper hearing, yet there was a hearing in June that he did not attend.

[Brujah]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

I think it's a disgrace that the insurance for cops and firemen doesn't cover them.
How many people does this effect anyways? I see where it's going to cover people that live around it too, not just the responders.

Hell for 7 billion dollars, they should be able to build a really nice hospital and staff it

It was mentioned in the other thread but please try to get this through that thick skull of yours if only temporarily. Not everyone in 2010 is an active cop or fireman with perfect health coverage. Many were volunteers without any benefits and unpaid, had health coverage dropped by insurance companies, are no longer eligible or able to work, are already dead, wen't from New York, and a slew of other reasons, etc... Yes, I'm sure plenty of active servicemen have coverage but obviously aren't as sick or in need as the former. While you argue to deny them coverage because it costs too much or you think they all should have had sufficient coverage (in some perfect utopian healthcare world that you're always arguing against anyway), how about devoting just 1/2 as much time to dealing with the $2+ trillion per year the Pentagon can't even tell you what they've done with it because they aren't accounting for it? Just 1 year of that is enough to cover 285 years of $7bn for everyone. It's been going on at least 10 years now which gives you $7bn for 2,850 years.

[cwd]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

odd to see the rabble muddy the water by talking about the rich

pretty sure that comment was in reference to Republicans stance that no bill would see a vote until the tax break extensions were passed for all brackets.

but since that has now passed, there should be no reason not to help these people that need it most, right?

[12clicks]

Originally Posted by cwd

pretty sure that comment was in reference to Republicans stance that no bill would see a vote until the tax break extensions were passed for all brackets.

but since that has now passed, there should be no reason not to help these people that need it most, right?

no there shouldn't be.
I just find it cute to see which of the rabble have bought into the class warfare of the idiot left and its leader, obama

[Tom_PM]

Tax cuts for the rich.. another way to say "redistribution of wealth"?

Just trollin' on by.

[cwd]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

no there shouldn't be.
I just find it cute to see which of the rabble have bought into the class warfare of the idiot left and its leader, obama

well, I just hope that the "idiot left" and their counterparts, the idiot right, will finally do the right thing and get this passed so these people can fight the diseases that are afflicting them while they still may have a chance.

[Tom_PM]

Agreed. Thats really so simple it should not be a political football. Neither should unemployment insurance extensions. People pay into those weekly. It's not a political point to be made, but recently it was. Disgraceful.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Brujah

It was mentioned in the other thread but please try to get this through that thick skull of yours if only temporarily. Not everyone in 2010 is an active cop or fireman with perfect health coverage. Many were volunteers without any benefits and unpaid, had health coverage dropped by insurance companies, are no longer eligible or able to work, are already dead, wen't from New York, and a slew of other reasons, etc... Yes, I'm sure plenty of active servicemen have coverage but obviously aren't as sick or in need as the former. While you argue to deny them coverage because it costs too much or you think they all should have had sufficient coverage (in some perfect utopian healthcare world that you're always arguing against anyway), how about devoting just 1/2 as much time to dealing with the $2+ trillion per year the Pentagon can't even tell you what they've done with it because they aren't accounting for it? Just 1 year of that is enough to cover 285 years of $7bn for everyone. It's been going on at least 10 years now which gives you $7bn for 2,850 years.

Excuse me for questioning what the government does.
Too bad Obamacare can't take care of the problems.

This thread was started attacking Coburn for not wanting to pass this, why did the democrats play the way they did in July? If they didn't, it would have already passed

[12clicks]

Originally Posted by PR_Tom

Agreed. Thats really so simple it should not be a political football. Neither should unemployment insurance extensions. People pay into those weekly. It's not a political point to be made, but recently it was. Disgraceful.

Oh please......no one should be getting 3yrs if unemployment checks.
Also, I doubt anyone collecting for that long paid in enough to cover it

[Brujah]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Excuse me for questioning what the government does.
Too bad Obamacare can't take care of the problems.

This thread was started attacking Coburn for not wanting to pass this, why did the democrats play the way they did in July? If they didn't, it would have already passed

Why? You want that repealed too don't you, and it hasn't even taken effect yet really.

True, this thread was an attack on Coburn, in opposition to Giuliani and Huckabee (and I think even Limbaugh favors the Zadroga bill). You're always playing partisan politics (anti-Obama on everything) Vendzilla, which is the worst kind. Some things are just the right thing to do, no matter if a lot of people you dislike are in favor of it too.

[cwd]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Excuse me for questioning what the government does.
Too bad Obamacare can't take care of the problems.

This thread was started attacking Coburn for not wanting to pass this, why did the democrats play the way they did in July? If they didn't, it would have already passed

Really? See, this is why things like this don't get done. Always needing a "win" at the expense of the other party.

A similar bill failed last year because New York wanted help in paying for it, as there were volunteers from every state in the nation. So, in June of this year, a new bill was offered. The original cost of the bill was 12 billion. Some balked at the cost. It was whittled down to over 7 billion. There still was not enough votes. So, Sen Gillibrand went back to Repubs, got it down to 6.2 and looked to have the votes needed. Now, ONE Senator (Coburn) says he will keep from having a vote on this bill. While more people die.

Just so one side can "beat" the other.

[cwd]

and by the way, I could give a shit if Coburn is a Republican, Democrat, Independent, Whig...

this is a bill that should pass. period.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Brujah

Why? You want that repealed too don't you, and it hasn't even taken effect yet really.

True, this thread was an attack on Coburn, in opposition to Giuliani and Huckabee (and I think even Limbaugh favors the Zadroga bill). You're always playing partisan politics (anti-Obama on everything) Vendzilla, which is the worst kind. Some things are just the right thing to do, no matter if a lot of people you dislike are in favor of it too.

Again, where did I say I was against this bill? You talk about partisan politics, but you can't pull your head out of Barry's ass. And anything that's against the left is for the right with you, you're a fucking moron playing into the left vs right ideology!!!

The democrats fucked this up in July and now you're blaming the republicans

The healthcare law has over 200 companies and unions that got waivers from it, tell me it's still a good law? This got front row on everything for a year while the economy got worse and it's a bad law. Thats why I'm anti Barry.

Originally Posted by cwd

Really? See, this is why things like this don't get done. Always needing a "win" at the expense of the other party.

A similar bill failed last year because New York wanted help in paying for it, as there were volunteers from every state in the nation. So, in June of this year, a new bill was offered. The original cost of the bill was 12 billion. Some balked at the cost. It was whittled down to over 7 billion. There still was not enough votes. So, Sen Gillibrand went back to Repubs, got it down to 6.2 and looked to have the votes needed. Now, ONE Senator (Coburn) says he will keep from having a vote on this bill. While more people die.

Just so one side can "beat" the other.

Again, where did I say I was against the bill, I just question it.

And if everyone is so gung oh about blaming one Senator, where were the democrats that were in total power for a year, 8 years after 9/11 happened?
Remember all this is going on during the lame duck session, all the things that should have happened during the last year is all pushed into a couple weeks and you guys are blaming one senator. I blame all of those bastards for not getting off their collective asses and doing their job.

[Brujah]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You talk about partisan politics, but you can't pull your head out of Barry's ass.

LOL really? So everyone (Huckabee, Limbaugh, Giuliani, etc..) in favor of Zadroga is in Barry's ass? I rest my case. You're a hopeless cause and I don't know why I bother responding to you sometimes.

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

... you're a fucking moron playing into the left vs right ideology!!!

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Brujah

LOL really? So everyone (Huckabee, Limbaugh, Giuliani, etc..) in favor of Zadroga is in Barry's ass? I rest my case. You're a hopeless cause and I don't know why I bother responding to you sometimes.

Only reason you don't respond is lack of reason on your behalf

Again, ONE MORE TIME, where did I say I was against the bill?
Please tell me, I don't have magical mushrooms like you seem to.

[baddog]

Originally Posted by Brujah

It was mentioned in the other thread but please try to get this through that thick skull of yours if only temporarily. Not everyone in 2010 is an active cop or fireman with perfect health coverage. Many were volunteers without any benefits and unpaid, had health coverage dropped by insurance companies, are no longer eligible or able to work, are already dead, wen't from New York, and a slew of other reasons, etc...

You are wasting your time. I had to add him to ignore, it was not worth the trouble dealing with his double-talk.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by baddog

You are wasting your time. I had to add him to ignore, it was not worth the trouble dealing with his double-talk.

What double talk?
I never said I was against it and you kept asking me why I was against it, I asked where I said that and you never replied

[arock10]

Republicans are blocking this because they want to wait, along with several other bills up for vote now, to vote them through when the new congress is in session. This way they can claim credit for them

I still think its fucked up ESPECIALLY that republicans wont vote the 9/11 bill through, since 9/11 related shit has been what they've been pushing forever.

[Bryan G]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

What double talk?
I never said I was against it and you kept asking me why I was against it, I asked where I said that and you never replied

Jesus go read your posts again you tard. Its quite obvious what you were saying.

[kane]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Excuse me for questioning what the government does.
Too bad Obamacare can't take care of the problems.

This thread was started attacking Coburn for not wanting to pass this, why did the democrats play the way they did in July? If they didn't, it would have already passed

First, most of Obamacare doesn't go into effect until 2014. It might cover these people, but not until then.

Second.The democrats used this procedure so that people could not add amendments (pork) to the bill. The way it often works is you go to someone who might not vote for a bill and you make a deal with them. If you add their pork to your bill, they will vote for it. The democrats were sick of the republicans blocking everything so they wanted a vote just on this bill with nothing added to it. The idea was that it would force republicans to answer why they voted no on this bill. Of course once it failed the spineless democrats then failed to call out those who voted against it.

Of course a month later the republicans tried to force the bill back to committee and that effort failed and it was brought up for a simple vote and passed without any amendments added to it. So both sides assumed the other was going to somehow screw them and they played politics with the bill instead of reading it and voting on its merits.

[Relentless]

If a catastrophic attack takes place in the US again, as pretty much every expert predicts will happen at some point, it will be interesting to see whether first responders are less willing to come to the aid of people in distress.

Running into a collapsing building is hard enough. Doing it while knowing your health costs might not be covered and your family may be bankrupted as a result is something else entirely.

This bill isn't a matter of morality, it's a matter of necessity.

[Coup]

Originally Posted by directfiesta

haha, I know right? dude is the most unintentionally hilarious motherfucker on earth.

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by Relentless

If a catastrophic attack takes place in the US again, as pretty much every expert predicts will happen at some point, it will be interesting to see whether first responders are less willing to come to the aid of people in distress.

Running into a collapsing building is hard enough. Doing it while knowing your health costs might not be covered and your family may be bankrupted as a result is something else entirely.

This bill isn't a matter of morality, it's a matter of necessity.

sure is ... was said in another thread of a day ago where Vendzilla was vomitting the same pointless so-called arguments, again mixing in his hate for Obama as well as his belonging to the right talking points.

What a pity ...

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Bryan G

Jesus go read your posts again you tard. Its quite obvious what you were saying.

Maybe I can get an address to send you a gift of hook on phonics, I never said I was against the bill, but you're too fucking ignorant from a bad education I guess.

Originally Posted by kane

First, most of Obamacare doesn't go into effect until 2014. It might cover these people, but not until then.

Second.The democrats used this procedure so that people could not add amendments (pork) to the bill. The way it often works is you go to someone who might not vote for a bill and you make a deal with them. If you add their pork to your bill, they will vote for it. The democrats were sick of the republicans blocking everything so they wanted a vote just on this bill with nothing added to it. The idea was that it would force republicans to answer why they voted no on this bill. Of course once it failed the spineless democrats then failed to call out those who voted against it.

Of course a month later the republicans tried to force the bill back to committee and that effort failed and it was brought up for a simple vote and passed without any amendments added to it. So both sides assumed the other was going to somehow screw them and they played politics with the bill instead of reading it and voting on its merits.

I'm not attacking just the democrats on this, both parties are to blame. This thread is jumping on the hype that it's one party thats at fault.

Originally Posted by directfiesta

sure is ... was said in another thread of a day ago where Vendzilla was vomitting the same pointless so-called arguments, again mixing in his hate for Obama as well as his belonging to the right talking points.

What a pity ...

Originally Posted by Coup

haha, I know right? dude is the most unintentionally hilarious motherfucker on earth.

You guys should get a room, one more time, since I have to talk slow to you both, where did I say I was against this bill? Go ahead, I know it hurts your little brains, but show me, just one place, anywhere, I'm waiting

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Relentless

If a catastrophic attack takes place in the US again, as pretty much every expert predicts will happen at some point, it will be interesting to see whether first responders are less willing to come to the aid of people in distress.

Running into a collapsing building is hard enough. Doing it while knowing your health costs might not be covered and your family may be bankrupted as a result is something else entirely.

This bill isn't a matter of morality, it's a matter of necessity.

I'm sure if we get attacked again, Obama will apologize to the attackers

But it sucks that partisan politics has kept prisoners in Gitmo without trail yet and kept the responders from getting the help they need. Maybe with the new congress some shit will get done finally?

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by arock10

Republicans are blocking this because they want to wait, along with several other bills up for vote now, to vote them through when the new congress is in session. This way they can claim credit for them

I still think its fucked up ESPECIALLY that republicans wont vote the 9/11 bill through, since 9/11 related shit has been what they've been pushing forever.

SO it's the republicans fault that this was pushed to the lame duck session?

It's both parties faults, the democrats fucked it up the first time this was voted on, they could have had it going in July, they had the votes then, but decided to play politics instead of getting it done, now they are using this against the republicans. Politics as usual

[cwd]

at least it looks like they will get the bill passed. its watered-down from the original, but hopefully the people who need it most will finally get the assistance they need.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/1..._n_800326.html

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by cwd

at least it looks like they will get the bill passed. its watered-down from the original, but hopefully the people who need it most will finally get the assistance they need.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/1..._n_800326.html

It's just sad that it took this long, there is so much bureaucracy that nothing gets done anymore and partisan politics doesn't help.

Still trying to figure out why the prisoners in Gitmo are still waiting for trial, they should have been shot by now

[Bryan G]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Maybe I can get an address to send you a gift of hook on phonics, I never said I was against the bill, but you're too fucking ignorant from a bad education I guess.

LOL, sure send it on over but it's HOOKED on phonics, not hook. Fuck you're an idiot.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Bryan G

LOL, sure send it on over but it's HOOKED on phonics, not hook. Fuck you're an idiot.

I miss spelt something, you got it completely fucking wrong and you call me an idiot? You don't rate that high.

So again, where did I say I was against the bill? moron.......

[Relentless]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

I'm sure if we get attacked again, Obama will apologize to the attackers. But it sucks that partisan politics has kept prisoners in Gitmo without trail yet and kept the responders from getting the help they need. Maybe with the new congress some shit will get done finally?

This has what to do with funding medical benefits for first responders whose health was damaged by their work trying to rescue innocent people from an attack in the past?

Try and focus. If you are for providing health coverage to 9/11 first responders you are against what Tom Coburn is saying... /thread

All the rest is not relevant to this specific topic.

[Relentless]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

Oh please......no one should be getting 3yrs if unemployment checks. Also, I doubt anyone collecting for that long paid in enough to cover it

And the people who have paid in more than enough to cover it?
Unemployment is a fund people pay into with every paycheck... not a handout.
Surviving on 300-400 a week may be possible, but you wont find too many living in the lap of luxury on that amount in any case.

What does need some serious attention is the misuse of unemployment by people working off the books, organizations that use it as part of a furlough program to maximize the benefit in 'work sharing' programs etc... but that's a matter of curtailing abuse of the program, not a reason to curtail the program as a whole.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by Relentless

This has what to do with funding medical benefits for first responders whose health was damaged by their work trying to rescue innocent people from an attack in the past?

Try and focus. If you are for providing health coverage to 9/11 first responders you are against what Tom Coburn is saying... /thread

All the rest is not relevant to this specific topic.

I am focused, it should have passed in July. They had more than 50% of the vote to pass it, but the democrats did it in a way that required 2/3rd's vote to pass so that no one could add, delete or even debate it.

And I have a hard time with everything getting shoved thru during a lame duck session.

I question why the insurance for these people is not paying up and why 9 years later this is still an issue. It should have been taken care of. Our president has been too busy passing healthcare reform that over 200 companies and unions has got wavers from.

Just like Gitmo, why do we still have prisoners that have not gone to trial?

[kane]

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

I am focused, it should have passed in July. They had more than 50% of the vote to pass it, but the democrats did it in a way that required 2/3rd's vote to pass so that no one could add, delete or even debate it.

And I have a hard time with everything getting shoved thru during a lame duck session.

About 6 weeks after the vote in July it did pass the house. The senate, for whatever reason has been dragging its feet on it. The democrats are pushing it now for two reasons. 1. they fear if they don't it won't get through later when there are more republicans in the senate and 2. they want to look good.

I question why the insurance for these people is not paying up and why 9 years later this is still an issue. It should have been taken care of. Our president has been too busy passing healthcare reform that over 200 companies and unions has got wavers from.

As has been stated several times, many of these people no longer have health insurance. Because of their health problems they have lost their jobs or they were denied workman's comp because they were unable to prove beyond a shadow of doubt that their illness is 9/11 related. So they have no health insurance to pay for this.

You can hammer Obama all you want for ignoring them and it is a legit argument, but, as you say, this has been going on for 9 years. 7 of them were Bush's years and he didn't do jack shit for them either.

Just like Gitmo, why do we still have prisoners that have not gone to trial?

I agree on this one, but it has nothing to do with the 9/11 healthcare bill.

[Vendzilla]

Originally Posted by kane

About 6 weeks after the vote in July it did pass the house. The senate, for whatever reason has been dragging its feet on it. The democrats are pushing it now for two reasons. 1. they fear if they don't it won't get through later when there are more republicans in the senate and 2. they want to look good.

Making them look good, I think that ship has sailed

As has been stated several times, many of these people no longer have health insurance. Because of their health problems they have lost their jobs or they were denied workman's comp because they were unable to prove beyond a shadow of doubt that their illness is 9/11 related. So they have no health insurance to pay for this.

Like I've said several times, I'm for this bill. And against the insurance companies that are denying the claims

You can hammer Obama all you want for ignoring them and it is a legit argument, but, as you say, this has been going on for 9 years. 7 of them were Bush's years and he didn't do jack shit for them either.

I realize that, Bush, the republicans, Obama and the democrats are all to blame.
Obamacare could have added them, 2300 pages already, what's 10 more pages?

I agree on this one, but it has nothing to do with the 9/11 healthcare bill.

A side comparison, nothing seems to get done unless they can get sort of political gain out of it