Cliff Notes on AFF using Zango

[will76]

The campaign was run by AdultFriendFinder Media. Will76 witnessed his cookie being overwritten by a cookie placed by the ad.........
There is no reason to believe that AdultFriendFinder had malicious intent; it has a long history of being proactive and protecting the interests of its affiliates. In fact, when the potential conflict was brought to the attention of AdultFriendFinder and Zango (at about the same time), AdultFriendFinder stopped the campaigns in question and reconfigured them to avoid the potential of having a cookie overwritten or a home page targeted. In short, much ado about very little.

AdultFriendFinder from time to time as a small part of its advertising budget places ad buys with companies which some people might call ?adware"......
One of the motivating factors in AdultFriendFinder placing such adware ads is to effectively compete in the online dating marketplace - namely if AdultFriendFinder does not place such ads our competitors will make deals with the adware companies to place such ads to our detriment........
This scenario certainly makes us uncomfortable and creates a catch-22 for us ? if we stop buying the contextual adware ads our competitors? sites will pop up and we may lose sales and if we keep buying adware ads we may find from time to time our ads will pop up near our affiliate?s ads for our sites.

....this notion of the adware ad ?collisions? that has recently been raised does make us feel somewhat uncomfortable ? in other words we find ourselves sympathetic with those who have not been happy with this bizarre result.

SexSearch made us do it:

I would not say support I would more say forced into read this (sex search targeting AFF using zango)

Zango is the same as a pop up:

a timed pop up has the same effect as adware pops. but was common practice among most if not all large paysite companies for years. where was will then ?

When asked " What are you doing with Zango?":

Buying pop up ads.

I disagree just like any pop up the surfer can choose to ignore the pop up and continue on surfing where he was at. And if the surfer really does not want any more pop ups they simply uninstall the adware and the pops ups are gone.

We do not pop the same site over the same site, and we use URL Tracking not cookies to determine who gets the sale. Affialites are getting proper credit for all sales. And I might add are quite happy with the huge checks we send out, and will be even happier this month when we up the pay even more.

Note: they would pop up cams.com over aff.com and vice versa, and with their affiliate code not yours.

Lars down playing zango, that it is a small amount of traffic, no big deal:

no we are talking about less than 1/2 of 1 % and then the user can close the pop up if they dont like and continue surfing what they were doing.

More Sex Search made us do it, and we are doing it to protect from our affiliates, ie. we steal from them and then give it back to them in "higher payouts":

as was shown if we do not pop cams then sexsearch buys the pop. If sexsearch buys the pop then our affilaites lose becuase we lose money. If we make money off of a cams pop then that money is filtered back into the payouts in the form of bonuses and higher percent and affilaites in the end make more money. If we let sexsearch buy the popup then we would have to reduce payouts as we would be less competative, and our affilaites would make less money. So do our affilaites want us to buy the pops or do tehy want sexsearch or 10 others buy the pop ? I say affilaites would rather us buy it.

Funny thing to note here. Lars stopped buying Zango traffic, but yet I think they are still raising payouts or at least they have stayed the same.... more lies from Lars.

Oh and we are talking about one half of 1% of traffic. As long as I raise payouts more than one half of 1 % then the affialite is making more money overall. Oh and look I raise payouts all the time.
So the end result is Our affilaites are making more money than anyone else and you cant stand it.

More lies that using zango is not stealing traffic/sales from anyone else.

we dont steal anything from anyone, but we do pay more than anyone else for traffic and so thats why the traffic all comes to us ! You can hate all you want but money talks and hate walks.

Calling people sheep:

We are not stealing anything from anyone. I think you have been turned into a sheep.

The level of sheep and heard mentality on this board is AMAZING!

When asked how long AFF has been using Zango:

for years and we are aliing about 1/2 of 1% so a drastic decline in conversions or signups has nothign to do with adware.

When asked if anyone had questioned him person about zango:

Yeah like 3-4 people asked me about it, once I explained the issues they were all like oh ok I get it now. Mostly there has been a lot of bullshit being slung around here.

The surfer has downloaded and accepted to get ads for use of software, you and I might think why would someone do that, I would not do that. Well I would not buy porn on the internet but I sure am glad somebody does.

Zango, Inc. Settles FTC Charges - Will Give Up $3 Million in Ill-Gotten Gains for Unfair and Deceptive Adware Downloads: http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2006/11/zango.htm



Lars saying my posts about him/AFF using Zango was " personal " and self serving:

Will is pimping up his board presence, so he can be a bigshot, plain and simple his attacks on me and my company have gone above and beyond anything reasonable, and that was pointed out to me by a lot of people at teh trade show.

My bullshit comments from Lars trying to discredit me:

I am beginning to think that will does not make the kind of , money he spouts off about. I think he is full of it as part of his self promotions, he pumped himself up big and that as cams.com continues to whip the shit outta ifriends. He just can not take it that we are kicking ifriends ass and so he is pissed off.

I never called affiliates sheep I said that people who just jump onto whatever is said on gfy withought finding out facts is a sheep, if people do their homework install zango and then find that its still a problem for them then I am happy to listen to them..

And that was the last day Lars posted for 4 months.... until:

With all the promotion of Zango over the last few months so many new affiliates and ad buyers have signed on to promote and buy ads from Zango, they have driven the price of traffic up so much that it is no longer profitable for us to continue buying ads from Zango.

So what happens to your traffic now that Sex search will buy it all up? You claimed you were forced to buy it so they wouldn't get it. But now you say that you are stoping because it is not profitable.


Sometimes words are not needed when you can quote the source, hard to argue with what you said yourself Lars.

[martinsc]

sigspot secured.

[Bro Media - BANNED FOR LIFE]

i'll park my sig here

[will76]

Lars says we were " promoting" zango as to imply we were the ones doing damage here but yet they were the ones buying the traffic and fucking people, but they make no reference to them doing anything wrong. No apologies. No nothing. Kinda sounds like AFF was a victim here. Poor AFF was making money from stolen traffic but because of the " promotion" here their deal become unprofitable. Awe, that's too bad.

If you really believe a lot of people signed up to " promote " zango, then you people really are sheep. Educating affiliates of the harms of Zango is like letting people know that the burgers at some fast food restaurant is contaminated with mad cow. The only people that would promote zango installs are either complete morons who do not promote any other affiliate programs, or people who already do installs. If Lars really believes that " so many affiliates have signed on to promote Zango" from the promotions here maybe he could name a few. Can any of you just name a few, and I am not talking about idiots like Frank or Dork Jedi who just trying to get attention. Prove me wrong, point out all these people, because obviously for you to make a statement like that you must have some evidence, surely you wouldnt be lying or guessing. Even if a few did, there was a good bit of people who were doing zango installs that had no idea how they worked and have stopped because of the " promotions " here. I can guarantee you more good than harm was done from the Zango installing side, don't let Lars try to spin this and try to make others look bad so he can try to make himself look better. Don't forget this is the guy who said " sex search made him do it, and it's only a pop up".

The second part is correct. Apparently a lot of people didn't know they could by traffic from Zango and because of the " promotions " here ran up the ad prices. That was a side effect of educating people. Either you say nothing, and uneducated webmasters do zango installs, or you educate people and help reduce the number of installs. If you say nothing, than the installs only get worse. The installs are the things that really hurt us. If some shady fuckers heard the message and went and bought zango traffic, what can you do.... 1. Now they are exposing themselves and everyone can block them and treat them the same way AFF was treated. 2. They are running up the cost of the traffic, fine, I am glad AFF and others had to pay more for the traffic they are STEALING from me. It's my traffic, it at least makes me feel a little better you are profiting less and less off of MY traffic. Unfortunetly Zango makes more, but maybe the FTC fines will be bigger next time, and soon or later they will be sued, so hopefully they will lose that money one way or another. There is no win win situation here. If you speak up, some shady people will buy traffic, if you don't speak up no one knows about the problem and more people do installs...... Don;t let sheep hearders try to tell you that we caused the problem.... if you have two braincells and comprehend what i posted here, you will be able to see through the bull shit.

So If you read what Lars posted in this thread you see he is trying to blame the people here for " promoting " zango. To say they stopped because we weren't making money is just shitty. You think they would just lie and say we decided to do the right thing. Hey Lars, looks like our " promotion" made your profitable zango do not so profitable. Glad to know we cost you money, just like you been costing us money.

I am not an affiliate of AFF, so I don't give a fuck if AFF stopped using zango 3 months ago on their own urls that have aff ids. What about the rest of us? What about all the clickcash affiliates, fling, dating gold, iwantu, etc... affiliates. You still targeted those sites and hijaked sales from those affiliates. Your reply to this in the past has been " I am trying to protect our affiliates". Which is bullshit. 1. How do you protect your own affilaites by stealing my ifriends traffic and sending it to AFF? 2. Do you realize that a lot of people that promote AFF also promote these other affiliate programs as well. SO most people aren't just YOUR affiliates.

I guess Sex Search made them do it, and Will76 and GFY posters made AFF stop. Funny how a company that makes 100+ million a year gets pushed around so easily.

Someone pisses on you for a year, runs out of piss, and tries to blame the beer for the reason they pissed on you, and then expects you to dry off and forget. Whatever. Promote AFF if you want, use zango if you want, but at least fucking use your brain and don't buy the shit they spew. If you are only concerned with money and dont care how you make it or who you associate with thats your call, but at least be aware of what you doing.

The other funny thing with this " it is not profitable for us now " bull shit. Aparently Lars was lieing a few months back when he said he lost money using zango. SO if you were losing money 5 moths ago, why not stop then? I am sure someone can dig up the threads where that was posted. Lets say we believe you now, and it just became un profitable now, and you were lieing then and making money from it back then... ok, so you say you stopped targeting your own affiliates 3 months ago, and now you say it is not profitable. Looks like when you stopped taking your affiliates sales you started making less money... how nice.

.............

[OzMan]

you forgot to thank him for dropping zango

[QuaWee]

you forgot to thank him for dropping zango

..........

[xclusive]

AFF is bad for business. They don't care how or who pushes them traffic.

[FreeHugeMovies]

Early Siggy

[darnit]

I dont have a sig but that was an interesting rebuttal to an interesting issue.

Shit, ban me all ready.

[dougeetx]

Sig spot!

[Daruma]

my non-sig sig spot

I'd put $ on a bet that AFF will eventually go back to Zango

[will76]

you forgot to thank him for dropping zango

According to him, I should thank myself. He only dropped it because I (and others here promoted it - according to him) to the point he couldn't make any more money from it.

Thank Him? fuck him.


Thank him? what are you a retard, seriously... thats like thanking the guy who is shooting you with an automatic riffle for stopping because he ran out of bullets.


How many people think like Ozman? Lars stopped making money/sales (our sales) because Zango was not profitable to him anymore. Should we thank him for stopping ?

[OzMan]

Will I know you have good intentions but you are losing focus. Where do you go from here?

Would you rather AFF use Zango or not? Sure you don't like the reasons why they started or stopped but aren't you at least glad that they stopped?

To use your analogy, I would be very glad the guy ran out of bullets and concentrate on who is firing at me now rather than continuing to yell at the guy with no bullets while other guys are shooting at you

I would assume you are indeed glad and will now concentrate on whoever is popping over you now if your intentions are to stop whoever is stealing your surfers now.

That will be kinda hard though since pretty much no sponsors who use zango will engage in a dialogue on the boards but you can't blame them as they were quite happy to let Lars take the heat for them.

So it won't be as much fun as it was but yeah Will don't give up now, there are still a gajillion sponsors left who still support zango for you to make sure everyone knows about.

[Kard63]

We still like cams better than ifriends.

[QuaWee]

We still like cams better than ifriends.

speak for yourself

[OzMan]

Also, while we are on the subject of acceptable reasons for starting or stopping zango let's look at Clickcash / Al Hadhazy (Praise be his name)

According to you they canned some rogue affiliates for using zango four months ago because of their deep concern for the welfare of all mankind.

However the evidence points to them doing it directly for years judging by the email they sent and by the zango account names I saw. I assume it was profitable for them until they dropped it as you said they didn't drop zango because one lil' affiliate like you asked them to.

Did they actually drop zango for (shudder) financial reasons or something even worse if possible?

We will never know as they don't lower themselves to being responsive to open criticism on boards, again as I said above, in the same manner as all the sponsors who currently still support zango.

[will76]

Will I know you have good intentions but you are losing focus. Where do you go from here?

Would you rather AFF use Zango or not? Sure you don't like the reasons why they started or stopped but aren't you at least glad that they stopped?

.

Glad they stopped. Yes.

But being glad they stopped and thanking them for stopping is two totally different things.

You said I forgot to thank them. I don't feel they should be thanked for that they did. If you would have asked if I was glad they stopped my reply would have been simply " yes ".


Losing focus ? wtf, Lars just made this announcement a couple days ago, I am just getting back in town to reply. I did a little little recap so people wouldn't lose focus.

Where do we go next.? I don't know, How about this.

$5 (epass) to anyone for each site they find that is promoting zango installs. Post the url here and I will pay you for finding it. I am curious which sites promote zango cash.

[OzMan]

...$5 (epass) to anyone for each site they find that is promoting zango installs. Post the url here and I will pay you for finding it. I am curious which sites promote zango cash.

You better contact Michael from epass asap to increase your daily transfer limit as no matter what it is now as once the sig whores see this it will be like piranhas. Hell if it was $7.50 I'd do it

[will76]

Also, while we are on the subject of acceptable reasons for starting or stopping zango let's look at Clickcash / Al Hadhazy (Praise be his name)

According to you they canned some rogue affiliates for using zango four months ago because of their deep concern for the welfare of all mankind.

However the evidence points to them doing it directly for years judging by the email they sent and by the zango account names I saw. I assume it was profitable for them until they dropped it as you said they didn't drop zango because one lil' affiliate like you asked them to.

Did they actually drop zango for (shudder) financial reasons or something even worse if possible?

We will never know as they don't lower themselves to being responsive to open criticism on boards, again as I said above, in the same manner as all the sponsors who currently still support zango.

hunh.???.. please if it was " according to me " quote me so i know what you are talking about. Can you post the email too ? You have a tendency to exaggerate things.

Post the info and I can give you a more accurate reply, but from my conversations with clickcash, they weren't aware of zango and no one had complained to them about affiliates using zango traffic. They had never used zango themselves. When i told them about it they investigated it for weeks, and when they were satisfied with their investigation (from a programming, legal, and TOS) standpoint, they took action.

Good ole Ozman trying to make it a " fair " playing field. Trying to throw out some " clickcash has to be bad too " comments like if it really makes a fucking difference to me or not. If I say too much about AFF, he wants to make sure that Clickcash gets some attention too. Whatever floats your boat, you are not hurting me any by posting about clickcash, i don't own the company and i haven't referred an affiliate through me in over a year. I don't understand you people and your clickcash comments. I am an affiliate of them, I like the company. You don't hurt my feelings if you have something bad to say about them. But while you are mentioning others, because good forbid AFF gets too much of the attention, why don't you point out sex search and the rest of them so you can truely be fair, or did fair have anythign to do with it and you felt like you were hurting me by posting about Al Hadhazy and trying to save mankind ?

[mikeyddddd]

[zigx]

i want in!

[DamageX]

AFF will always be worthy of a shitlist spot.

[zalka]

I'd put $ on a bet that AFF will eventually go back to Zango

Ill second that!

[scottybuzz]

bump for will

[OzMan]

I'm not trying to hurt you Will and for someone who it doesn't bother, you sure seem to get your feathers ruffled whenever I mention Clickcash. If you were truly concerned with stopping zango you would want everything out in the open.

Thanks to you most people who glance over these threads probably think AFF is the only sponsor who used zango and now the problem is solved.

Who cares what is "fair" or not? I can post what I like as can you. You have painted AFF out to be the devil and I think it is very relevant here to point out that your main sponsor is not only not beyond reproach but also indeed had their hand in their affiliates cookie jar so to speak. To what extent we will never know.

Use the search to find the exact info, basically the email was from Stacy I believe to an affiliate when asked about a zango campaign they did from a couple years ago. She stated words to the effect of "we only did it once and we didn't inhale"..that they tried zango briefly but didn't like the results (not profitable?) and would never do that kind of thing again.

Fast forward two years and according to you they were currently using zango. According to you it was indirectly via rogue affiliates but I don't buy that idea as I stated originally given clickcash account names like "180SOLUTIONS" which don't exactly fly under the radar.

So apparently Clickcash was lying? No say it isn't so.

You said you would drop Clickcash if they were supporting zango. You didn't keep that promise by saying their involvement was temporary and indirect (again which I dispute) and therefore didn't count.

Anyway moving forward. You have now decided to go after zango installs rather than targeting other companies using zango. What happened to the "take out the biggest sponsor and the others will fall" plan? All your time and effort to continually point out AFF using zango and when they stop you would rather bitch about why they stopped rather than moving on to Sexsearch or whoever is popping over you now.

Instead you want to now go after installs which will do nothing to stop those installs already in place. You are moving further and further away from the source and might as well go after joe surfer one by one with zango uninstall info.

So have you noticed any increase in income since AFF dropped zango or is it too soon to tell? ...and who is popping over your sites now?

[DamageX]

I'm not trying to hurt you Will and for someone who it doesn't bother, you sure seem to get your feathers ruffled whenever I mention Clickcash. If you were truly concerned with stopping zango you would want everything out in the open.

Thanks to you most people who glance over these threads probably think AFF is the only sponsor who used zango and now the problem is solved.

Who cares what is "fair" or not? I can post what I like as can you. You have painted AFF out to be the devil and I think it is very relevant here to point out that your main sponsor is not only not beyond reproach but also indeed had their hand in their affiliates cookie jar so to speak. To what extent we will never know.

Use the search to find the exact info, basically the email was from Stacy I believe to an affiliate when asked about a zango campaign they did from a couple years ago. She stated words to the effect of "we only did it once and we didn't inhale"..that they tried zango briefly but didn't like the results (not profitable?) and would never do that kind of thing again.

Fast forward two years and according to you they were currently using zango. According to you it was indirectly via rogue affiliates but I don't buy that idea as I stated originally given clickcash account names like "180SOLUTIONS" which don't exactly fly under the radar.

So apparently Clickcash was lying? No say it isn't so.

You said you would drop Clickcash if they were supporting zango. You didn't keep that promise by saying their involvement was temporary and indirect (again which I dispute) and therefore didn't count.

Anyway moving forward. You have now decided to go after zango installs rather than targeting other companies using zango. What happened to the "take out the biggest sponsor and the others will fall" plan? All your time and effort to continually point out AFF using zango and when they stop you would rather bitch about why they stopped rather than moving on to Sexsearch or whoever is popping over you now.

Instead you want to now go after installs which will do nothing to stop those installs already in place. You are moving further and further away from the source and might as well go after joe surfer one by one with zango uninstall info.

So have you noticed any increase in income since AFF dropped zango or is it too soon to tell? ...and who is popping over your sites now?

[Sosa]

lol this is something to wake up to on a Monday

[RawAlex]

my non-sig sig spot

I'd put $ on a bet that AFF will eventually go back to Zango

The reality is that AFF has just gone "one degree of seperation" on it. Now instead of buying the stuff themselves. they allow thier affiliates to do the buying. Instead of coming out and clearly stating "we don't accept scumware / spyware / malware / asterixware traffic" they came up with a lame (but understandable) "it's too expensive for us to use".

The moment that the price drops below whatever bar they have set, they will be back all over zango like a webmaster on a free convention beer.

[DaddyHalbucks]

See mee seeg:

[JD]

w00t first page sigmund!

[will76]

Thanks to you most people who glance over these threads probably think AFF is the only sponsor who used zango and now the problem is solved.

LOL most people, I doubt more than 10 people on this entire board think that AFF was the only company to us Zango. " most people" more exaggerations from you.

You have painted AFF out to be the devil .

LOL you are something else. All my posts have been quoting what Lars has said himself. If anyone is painting AFF to be a bad company it was Lars. So I point out what Lars says and I am making AFF look like the devil ???? that makes a lot of sense.

Use the search to find the exact info, basically ....according to you .....So apparently....

Funny I quote people and you say I am painting them to look like the devil, but yet you make posts like " according to you" "apparently" assuming, etc. Like I said, if you want to quote me or post the email you are making reference to I will reply. You and damian seem to use the same logic " use the search".

[Jon Clark - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Damn dude... You just don't quit

[DamageX]

Damn dude... You just don't quit

Neither do you, but at least his posts make sense.

[Jon Clark - BANNED FOR LIFE]

Neither do you, but at least his posts make sense.

That is like calling pot calling the kettle black

[porno jew]

Cliff Notes: Aff Rocks. Clicktrash Sucks.

[CDSmith]

Would you rather AFF use Zango or not? Sure you don't like the reasons why they started or stopped but aren't you at least glad that they stopped?

What about being outraged that they ever started?

[_Richard_]

Why don't you make him more money?

R

[RawAlex]

Would you rather AFF use Zango or not? Sure you don't like the reasons why they started or stopped but aren't you at least glad that they stopped?

"when did you stop beating your wife?"

"when did you stop taking heroin?"

"when did you stop getting blowjobs from that intern?"

The point isn't that they stopped. The point is that they started at all. Had the issue not come up on the boards, they would likely still be using Zango, and the moment the cost of using Zango drop back down into their range, they will be right back on it like frat boys onto a kegger.

Other interesting point is that they name Zango specifically. I would be really itnerested to see how many another of these "asterixware" companies they are buying ads from, but just don't talk about.

Lars? Would you care to share that info with us?

[tranza]

Here we go again....

[Quickdraw]

Why don't you make him more money?

R

What is Sexbankroll's budget for Zango and similar scumware? How much traffic are you stealing from webmasters on this board using scumware like Zango?
You stated on another board that SBR doesn't use Zango and the like, and even said you cancelled the account from sbrjmp.com(an SBR domain even, lol), yet, that account still seems to function just fine..
sbrjmp.com/m2/15.html

How come you never went back to that thread after more questions were asked?

[Alex]

Shit this is still going on?

[Bro Media - BANNED FOR LIFE]

double first page sig spot secured!

[will76]

What is Sexbankroll's budget for Zango and similar scumware? How much traffic are you stealing from webmasters on this board using scumware like Zango?
You stated on another board that SBR doesn't use Zango and the like, and even said you cancelled the account from sbrjmp.com(an SBR domain even, lol), yet, that account still seems to function just fine..
sbrjmp.com/m2/15.html

How come you never went back to that thread after more questions were asked?

No shit, that site is all over zango.

I am surprised they could be so stupid to make a post in this thread.

[DamageX]

That is like calling pot calling the kettle black

Eat shit, sigwhore.

[will76]

Why don't you make him more money?

R

How much money does Sexbankroll make from zango traffic. Do you do it yourselves or is it your affiliates ?

[Quickdraw]

Post the info and I can give you a more accurate reply, but from my conversations with clickcash, they weren't aware of zango and no one had complained to them about affiliates using zango traffic. They had never used zango themselves. When i told them about it they investigated it for weeks, and when they were satisfied with their investigation (from a programming, legal, and TOS) standpoint, they took action.
...

Just thought I would mention that I talked with a sponsor yesterday about the use of Zango on their sites.

One of the affiliate accounts using Zango on this sponsor was 180solutions(metricsdirect) themselves. There are supposed to be lawyers involved now, so I guess I can't say anymore.

But for anyone to believe that 180 Solutions/Zango/Seekmo/Metricsdirect/Hotbar would be above using their own software to steal traffic seems a little silly.

[will76]

Just thought I would mention that I talked with a sponsor yesterday about the use of Zango on their sites.

One of the affiliate accounts using Zango on this sponsor was 180solutions(metricsdirect) themselves. There are supposed to be lawyers involved now, so I guess I can't say anymore.

But for anyone to believe that 180 Solutions/Zango/Seekmo/Metricsdirect/Hotbar would be above using their own software to steal traffic seems a little silly.

I suspected this as well, but 180 solutions strongly denied this. One of the clickcash accounts that was shut down, the account name was 180solutions. Could have been someone just naming it that since that is where the traffic was coming from but who knows. I am sure a few subpenas could get to the bottom of it.

[Quickdraw]

Oh, here are a couple sites pushing zango installs, off the top of my head anyway.

wank.net
boysfood.com
xtoplist.com
aboutsexxx.com
freephotoseries.com
lickin.net

[will76]

50 lame ass quotes by a fucking moron with a funny hat


ok it was a really delayed 50, but it is still 50

[Nicky]

fiddy cliff notes