Chargebacks and Refunds, same thing

[steffie]

last week we had some problems with our billing and I signed up on 4 of our paysites to check. I signed up with my Visa Card and than refunded myself.

When I received the email from CCbill it reminded me of what I did and I called them to ask. Here is there answer.

Chargebacks and Refunds are now the same thing!

So if you refund a customer money, or if have him charge back it all falls into the same pot with Visa, no difference there.

Yikes!

[Brown Bear]

that makes it more difficult to keep under 1%

[[Labret]]

There is no way in hell they can count refunds as chargebacks. Nobody will stay below 1%.

You have to have misunderstood.

[Lexxx]

When the customer cancels his trial - it's a chargeback too...

I shit you.

not.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by Lexxx
When the customer cancels his trial - it's a chargeback too...

I shit you.

not.

[Brown Bear]

Originally posted by Lexxx
When the customer cancels his trial - it's a chargeback too...

I shit you.

not.

Where did you hear that?

[FATPad]

There is no way chargebacks and refunds will be counted the same.

[FATPad]

Originally posted by Lexxx
When the customer cancels his trial - it's a chargeback too...

I shit you.

not.

hahaha

[Theo]

lol

tonight we'll have some massive suicides if this is true since none will manage to keep under 1%

[Theo]

suppose it's true,which i doubt,you forget the word refund no matter what then. haaaaa

[Amputate Your Head]

we're all fuckin' doomed.

[EscortBiz]

so im fucked? how about regular businesses that give refunds? makes no sense

[Brown Bear]

You guys need to post some proof of these claims.

[Amputate Your Head]

Why doesn't the Sun ever explode when you really need it to....

[Lexxx]

It's gonna be $1000 per half the chargeback... thus $2000 per a full chargeback... and therefore $3000 per 1.5 chargebacks...

[kenny]

Isnt there some official release from VISA? Something that puts it all in black and white?

[AM Jeff]

IF CC Bill...and I said, IF...they are counting chargebacks same as refunds.

You need to find a new processor.
Because your getting fucked.

There is NO way in hell a chargeback is the same as a refund.

Chargebacks, you also get socked $25 normal fee for one.

Better double check your story and if true.

Get the fuck away from CCBill.

[FATPad]

Originally posted by Lexxx
It's gonna be $1000 per half the chargeback... thus $2000 per a full chargeback... and therefore $3000 per 1.5 chargebacks...

I've also heard anything charged on a Wednesday is considered a chargeback.

This is gonna be rough.

[Amputate Your Head]

are declines also counted as chargebacks?

[Lexxx]

Originally posted by FATPad
I've also heard anything charged on a Wednesday is considered a chargeback.

This is gonna be rough.

Indeed.

[Lexxx]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head
are declines also counted as chargebacks?

2.51 chargebacks...

[KingK7]

If a customer THINKS about taking out his credit card, but then decides not to, it's a chargeback.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by Lexxx


2.51 chargebacks...

damn..... what if someone is on the join page thinking about it and then decides not to join? Another chargeback?

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by KingK7
If a customer THINKS about taking out his credit card, but then decides not to, it's a chargeback.

hahaha.... you barely beat me to it...

[SpeakEasy]

Originally posted by steffie
last week we had some problems with our billing and I signed up on 4 of our paysites to check. I signed up with my Visa Card and than refunded myself.

When I received the email from CCbill it reminded me of what I did and I called them to ask. Here is there answer.

Chargebacks and Refunds are now the same thing!

So if you refund a customer money, or if have him charge back it all falls into the same pot with Visa, no difference there.

Yikes!


I heard the same thing

[Lexxx]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head

damn..... what if someone is on the join page thinking about it and then decides not to join? Another chargeback?

You'll get added to the Terminated Merchants File... for life!

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by Lexxx


You'll get added to the Terminated Merchants File... for life!

man.... the rules are gettin' fuckin' TIGHT!

[Theo]

lol

[[Labret]]

I just spoke to my iBill rep over the phone and they told me that by next month, all email receipts will also contain a link to a page where the customer rates your sites quality and customer service quality.

If you consistently suck, you will be cut from iBill.

[kenny]

You guys have it all wrong every RAW hit that doesnt convert into a sale is considered a chargeback

[KingK7]

THIS JUST IN FROM A RELIABLE SOURCE:
If you have over 2.5% chargebacks, VISA will now put out a contract on your life.

[Lexxx]

Originally posted by [Labret]


If you consistently suck, you will be cut from iBill.

No wonder all the pornstars are not welcome at iBill

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by KingK7
THIS JUST IN FROM A RELIABLE SOURCE:
If you have over 2.5% chargebacks, VISA will now put out a contract on your life.

wouldn't surprise me at all.....

[AM Jeff]

You people have No clue what a chargeback is...

A chargeback is when a consumer calls his bank to dispute a charge on his or her CC.
The the bank forwards the inquiry to VISA and Visa sends it out to you or your bank, then to you. From the date of the letter, you have 10 days to either dispute and provide info regaurding the chargeback or give a credit.

A Refund is NOT a Chargeback.
Declines are NOT a chargeback.
Cancelled trials are NOT a chargeback.
Sales taken in on a certain day and hour are not considered chargebacks.

Now too much caffine or crack is A CHARGEBACK. MAYBE NOT TO visa, but to your brain.
Failing to bath once a day IS a chargeback, Not to VISA...but to others.

Anymore weird questions?

[Brown Bear]

Originally posted by [Labret]
I just spoke to my iBill rep over the phone and they told me that by next month, all email receipts will also contain a link to a page where the customer rates your sites quality and customer service quality.

If you consistently suck, you will be cut from iBill.

So you can signup to your competitions sites and rate the site crappy so you can get IBill to give them the boot. YAY!

[FATPad]

Originally posted by AM Jeff

Anymore weird questions?

Yea.

"THIS JUST IN FROM A RELIABLE SOURCE:
If you have over 2.5% chargebacks, VISA will now put out a contract on your life. "

Is that true?

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by AM Jeff
Anymore weird questions?

is it true that Visa will now be requiring all site owners to hire, at their own expense, a Visa representative to stand over their shoulder and monitor their productivity on a 24 hour basis? Failure to produce at the accepted Visa level will result in immediate extermination?

[Lexxx]

Originally posted by AM Jeff

A Refund is NOT a Chargeback.
Declines are NOT a chargeback.
Cancelled trials are NOT a chargeback.
Sales taken in on a certain day and hour are not considered chargebacks.

I heard otherwise. I show proof. Any minute now I do.

[FATPad]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head

is it true that Visa will now be requiring all site owners to hire, at their own expense, a Visa representative to stand over their shoulder and monitor their productivity on a 24 hour basis? Failure to produce at the accepted Visa level will result in immediate extermination?

Well, geez, wouldn't that just be convenient?

Chargebacks hit 2.5% and whamm, you're dead within seconds.

[kenny]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head

is it true that Visa will now be requiring all site owners to hire, at their own expense, a Visa representative to stand over their shoulder and monitor their productivity on a 24 hour basis? Failure to produce at the accepted Visa level will result in immediate extermination?

Yes, plus you have to have a spare room in your place of buisness for the VISA representative to live.

[vik]

Everyone, I went through this bullshit once already. In December of 1999, (actually it wasn't until January of 2000 that I found out when the first $3,000 check from him bounced) $8K a month down to zero in ONE MONTH because my 3rd party had his account frozen by both Visa and MC. That included all re-bills. THEY ARE GODS!!

But most of you are right about the chargebacks. I was working closely with my old merchant (actually it was his daughter who did all their fucking paperwork, and it drove her crazy), and YES, REFUNDS ARE THE FUCKING SAME THING AS A CHARGEBACK. So do you think I cared if I ever gave some asshole his money back after that. Hell no - I only do it now if they ask politely, and then I just hope maybe they'll come back later, but don't piss me off, or I won't do the refund and then they can fight with their own credit card bank. Why the hell should I care when Visa and MC don't care? They look for any goddam excuse to rape the common person. Just look at the interest rate on your current cc cards. Paying 25%, probably you were ONE DAY LATE with your payment. They are bottom feeders who should be reigned in by the federal government - oh wait, the guys who vote on our banking laws get their big PAC money from the cc companies . . .

And around and around and around we go.



vik

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by kenny



Yes, plus you have to have a spare room in your place of buisness for the VISA representative to live.

I'm just grateful to be able to use their service and that they haven't yet required mandatory foot massages for the in-house Visa Death Agents.....

[kenny]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head

I'm just grateful to be able to use their service and that they haven't yet required mandatory foot massages for the in-house Visa Death Agents.....

I forgot to mention,

Foot massages are required along with oral/anal sex and if you cant afford a escort to be on call 24/7 the service must be preformed by the webmaster personally.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by kenny


I forgot to mention,

Foot massages are required along with oral/anal sex and if you cant afford a escort to be on call 24/7 the service must be preformed by the webmaster personally.

well, it was only a matter of time.... guess I will comply.

[AM Jeff]

Well Vik, you were fucked by your bank becuase, 99% of the banks out there do NOT count refunds as chargebacks.

If that was the case, Amazon.com and many..many others would have been out of business by now.

Bottom line is folks.

If your processor or bank counts refunds, declines and calcellations as chargebacks.
get the fuck away from them because they are stealing from you.

Read what VISA and MC regulations on what are considered chargebacks.

They will state that those are NOT chargebacks.

Vik...sorry...but you were fucked by your bank.

[nuclei]

we have our own merchant accounts and I have never heard of anything of the sort. We credit people before they CB to make sure we keep our ratios. Refunds have never affected us.

[AM Jeff]

nuclei...I know..neither have I...hahaha
I had one too and never heard of it.

Like I said...if thats what their processor or bank is doing.
They need to get the fuck away from them.

Cuz they are being fucked.

[steffie]

Call CCbill and ask

1 888 906 0666

thats their 24/7 line.

I asked them over and over, what if I refund the money, will this be counted against me in my Visa Chargebacks and the answer is always yes.

Did you even bother reading the letter they send out? and I quote

"IPSP?s are required to provide Visa with monthly sales, chargeback and credit data for their review, by Sponsored Merchant and down to the URL of each Sponsored Merchant site. Sponsored Merchants who are out of compliance on chargeback and / or credit ratios may be terminated at Visa?s discretion. Please Note: Your ratios at all IPSP?s will be evaluated by Visa. "

Do you notice the Chargeback and / or Credit Ratio

Why would I make that up? eh? I want to stay in business. I refunded myself my own credit card I used as a test and now they are telling me its counted against me!

[AM Jeff]

Well CC Bill is fucking their people.

Go read VISA and MC rules and regulations.

It'll define what is a chargeback and what is not.

You'll see that CCBill is fucking you.

CCBill maybe doing this to make a few extra bucks from Webmasters.

Bottom line is......
CCBill is NOT VISA and make up the rules.
Normal banks and processors do NOT rule declines, refunds, the same as chargebacks.


Sorry...but your being fucked there.

I was with CC BIll a while back and didn't like their practices...so I left and went to Jettis.

Too many BS things going on with IBill, CCBill and Epoch,
I been with Epoch and CCBill and they fucking scare me.
IBill...heard too many bad things about them and saw too many questionable practices with them.

Like I said...go read VISA rules and guidelines and you'll see what I am talking about.

[AM Jeff]

Oh...that maybe CCBills policy to list them the same.
But not banks and other processors.


God...Some of these processors get away with anything.