Chargebacks and Refunds, same thing

Can you ICQ me please

18314311

AM Jeff

<center><img src="http://www.thickstrippers.com/411/thewaronterror.jpg"></center>

OK... now I don't like it... how's a refund the same as chargeback...? You ppl are jokers...

Lexx...I talked to Steffie and explained things to her.
She swears that's what CCBill told her.

I told her...Then CCBill, if thats the case are fucking their webmasters. Any programs that treats refunds, declines as chargebacks are fucking their clients and they need to get the fuck away from them.

Yup...it was news to me too..lol

nuclei,

You are correct. Having a merchant account and the control is the way to go.

A refund is only considered a chargeback if excessively used to avoid disputes, not chargebacks. For example, if you receive a retrieval request from the merchant bank (which will ultimately turn into a chargeback if not handled), and you issue a refund, it may count towards your chargeback ratio. I have not seen this in the past with Visa, only Mastercard.

An undisputed refund does not count as a chargeback, at least not with your own merchant account.

Mitch

is this confirmed? i find it hard to believe that 'declines' are now counted as actual chargebacks?? pls tell me this is but jest...

Totally not true....

Mitch

So if you think thats only CCBill thinking that way think again. The most fucked up thing is that if you call ibill and whine you get refunded no questions asked. I am done with those fuckers.

It is very much forbidden for industry leaders to talk about pricing. CCBill, IBill and Epoch clearly broke US law by doing so. I hope those fuckers will be sued for every dime they ever got out us adult webmasters.

Read todays Ibill Statement..

REFUNDS AND CHARGEBACK

and I quote

iBill must provide Visa with monthly sales, chargeback and
refund data on each Sponsored Merchant for Visa's review. Sponsored Merchants not performing to Visa standards can be terminated directly by
Visa.

So again,, I called, god they are so sick of hearing from me

Yes, Chargebacks and Refunds are counted

Not declines,, nothing else

But I think thats enough. I guess I can now remove the police of my site, refund given if not satisfied!!

i'll do my best giving you for the refunds as a small

Every day the "rules" lean a little more in the processor's favor.
It's almost like they're reading the boards and seeing people going "well thank god THIS at least is spared"...
And then... wham! A letter comes out or a processor rep comes in and says "Oh btw just to clarify, THIS is also considered a no-no..."

Anyone else seeing this????

Has ANYONE called Visa to verify these rules? The exact verbage of these rules? The exact fees? Whether or not this and that are counted?

Or are you ALL going to just sit there and let someone else say to you:
"I'm here to tell you that Visa said this and that. And now you owe Visa money. And you owe me money. And you can't use my competition, or Visa will ban you. And so will I. And you can't leave to go to my competition, or Visa will ban you. And so will I. You can only use the people I list in my Good Ol' Boys network. And if you're overseas, you have to establish a full-fledged business complete with a living body to answer the phone in the US. No, I won't give you the proof of this. Just take my word for it. Visa said so. Now I'm saying so. So pay up."

Hello???

I believe it was Kimmy Kim who said that Mastercard reserves the right to consider refunds the same as chargebacks on any accounts that they want to. The new Visa rules probably allow them to do the same.

Those of you that are saying it's not allowed, or it's not going to happen, are probably quoting the old rules.

Just like Dodge, "The Rules Have Changed."

You are completely right. I posted a few posts about .002, now with refunds (myself included, testing accounts) it puts me at:
.0125. If I dont count myself: .00918, dangerously close.

This is COMPLETE Bullshit.

nice.

I completely agree here. First off why would these third party processors tell us anything in favor of us getting our own merchant account... thats like a car salesman telling us the benefits of taking the bus. Yeah right.

I seriously doubt visa is completely trying to fuck over this industry. I am trying my best to see the light at the end of the tunnel and think this can only make things better in the end. I tell myself that since ccbill *still* processes sites for little pre-teen kids in bikinis that live in other countries, that perhaps this is a reason VISA wants a list of url's they process for. Duh.

Something else I am wondering about in regards to large internet companies that are already using their own merchant accounts: Do they report their url's to visa already? Has visa already approved their sites or is this something that is new also?

If their sites to not comply then will companies like these be penalized now *even though* they have already been processing their own sales? Does this make sense?

Because something tells me, that if some big companies will not be affected by this because they already do not use third party billing and have given visa all their info, well then what do we have to worry about? I understand the risks of bad customer service with visa, but does this not apply to other businesses already somehow? I would think so.

The internet, including the adult part, is all about making money. Everyone wants their piece of the pie, that is a given.

I just cannot imagine visa will completely fuck over anyone that does not have it coming to them. It just does not seem right and I hope that I'm correct. The big difference now, as with ANY business, is they are charging us fees.

Did anybody contact Visa itself?

I haven't been able to find a press release from Visa, anyone else?

I would love to hear what Lensman, Ernesto, SixNine, or any of the other big players have to say about all of this.

There is no need to contact Visa really. It is not just the big three saying it anymore. verotel, globill, and more than a few others are posting the same info, just that *they* are taking measures to not let it affect their webmasters as badly.

As for something someone above said about those of us with our own merchant accounts, no visa does not ask that we give them every url we process for or thru.

I really don't get why people think its such a bad thing that visa will monitor refunds.

They know they are a bit higher on average. They like that.

But they also know if a paysite suddenly has an enormous growth in refunds that that paysite is fucking up. Maybe they didn't pay their hosting bill. Now you imagine the chargeback ratio when peoples statements arrive.

I am somewhat upset with the visa rules because I have to spend $1k+ to register a US corp, and $750 to visa, plus extra tax maybe.

But for god sake I think its great that someone wants to enforce quality control on paysites because mine are all good value for money.