Gun Control...hahaha - GoFuckYourself.com

katman · 10-17-2003, 12:39 AM

CD posted this on another board and I had to laugh. I agree but I still had to laugh.

I have lived in places where guns were generally prohibited and places where they weren't. I have always felt safer in the later.

Here it is:
************************************
You mean banning guns doesn't work??
From: Ed Chenel, A police officer in Australia

Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from
Down Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia
were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be
destroyed by our own government, a program costing
Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.

The first year results are now in: Australia-wide, homicides are up
3.2 percent, Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent;
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
In the state of
Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now! Up 300 percent.
(Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals
did not ! and criminals still possess their guns!)

While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in
armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the
past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey
is unarmed. There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and
assaults of the elderly.

Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has
decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in
"successfully ridding Australian society of guns." You won't see this
on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the
state Assembly disseminating this information.

The Australian experience proves it. Guns in the hands of honest
citizens save ! lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect
only the law-abiding citizens. Take note Americans, before it's to
late!

This comes as no surprise at all to me.
************************************************** *
(ME NOW)

Instead of being sheep and listening to statistics, how about using your own brain.

Let's just say for a second, that you really were a criminal. It's not that difficult. All of us look for opportunities every day in this world. Doesn't have to be illegal situations. I know you're capable of logical thought.

If you WERE a criminal with a gun, *You don't care about the law remember* Who would you rob? A house where you may get shot or a safe place? Any idiot knows to go for winning situations.

If it were me, I would rob places I knew had no guns. Why get shot and killed?

These people who want to take the firearms away are some of the biggest idiots. Of course it would be great if they were ALL gotten rid of, but they keep forgetting the criminals DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE LAW!!!!!! That's why they are called criminals...DUH!!!

Jeeze. I can't believe any of these people got through first grade alive.

sacX · 10-17-2003, 01:17 AM

yet the US still has much higher homicide rates, and 10x higher gun homicide rates... HmmmM

bhutocracy · 10-17-2003, 01:22 AM

must suck to believe everything you read on the internet

sacX · 10-17-2003, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by katman
CD posted this on another board and I had to laugh. I agree but I still had to laugh.

I have lived in places where guns were generally prohibited and places where they weren't. I have always felt safer in the later.

Here it is:
************************************
You mean banning guns doesn't work??
From: Ed Chenel, A police officer in Australia

Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from
Down Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia
were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be
destroyed by our own government, a program costing
Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.

The first year results are now in: Australia-wide, homicides are up
3.2 percent, Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent;
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
In the state of
Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now! Up 300 percent.
(Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals
did not ! and criminals still possess their guns!)

While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in
armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the
past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey
is unarmed. There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and
assaults of the elderly.

Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has
decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in
"successfully ridding Australian society of guns." You won't see this
on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the
state Assembly disseminating this information.

The Australian experience proves it. Guns in the hands of honest
citizens save ! lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect
only the law-abiding citizens. Take note Americans, before it's to
late!

This comes as no surprise at all to me.
************************************************** *
(ME NOW)

Instead of being sheep and listening to statistics, how about using your own brain.

Let's just say for a second, that you really were a criminal. It's not that difficult. All of us look for opportunities every day in this world. Doesn't have to be illegal situations. I know you're capable of logical thought.

If you WERE a criminal with a gun, *You don't care about the law remember* Who would you rob? A house where you may get shot or a safe place? Any idiot knows to go for winning situations.

If it were me, I would rob places I knew had no guns. Why get shot and killed?

These people who want to take the firearms away are some of the biggest idiots. Of course it would be great if they were ALL gotten rid of, but they keep forgetting the criminals DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE LAW!!!!!! That's why they are called criminals...DUH!!!

Jeeze. I can't believe any of these people got through first grade alive.

also quick google search finds no evidence of those quoted stats. Do you have a reference or just a msgboard post?

smack · 10-17-2003, 01:23 AM

finally the reality of banning firearms comes to light. the problem with people who are for banning guns is that they do not realize that criminals use ILLEGAL GUNS anyways. if they're already breaking the fucking have an illegal gun, what's taking away LEGAL guns going to do? give them free reign with firearms. jesus christ it's so fucking simple.

and another thing. anti-gun people do not realize that banning something will not neccisarily make the problem or the danger go away.

if you want to really protect your children from guns here is what you do.

speak to them intelligently, make sure they know how to SAFELY operate a firearm. as with anything education is your STRONGEST weapon to combat it.

guns are tools, very efficent dangerous tools. like any tool you must respoect them and have knowledge of their use and operation.

education is the key.

sacX · 10-17-2003, 01:27 AM

"Drop in state's crime rate the biggest in 10 years
Victoria has recorded its biggest drop in reported crime for a decade, with a 6.8 per cent fall in the overall crime rate over the past 12 months, according to figures released yesterday."

hmmm

SpaceAce · 10-17-2003, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sacX
"Drop in state's crime rate the biggest in 10 years
Victoria has recorded its biggest drop in reported crime for a decade, with a 6.8 per cent fall in the overall crime rate over the past 12 months, according to figures released yesterday."

hmmm

While you're "hummm"ing, consider the term "overall crime."

Congratulations, Victoria, you didn't give out as many jaywalking tickets this year.

Until someone digs up _details_ on the new supposed crime figures, there's nothing useful to go by.

SpaceAce

sacX · 10-17-2003, 01:33 AM

haha you idiot armed robbery was DOWN 30%

bleh link didn't work

statistics -> crime stats

bhutocracy · 10-17-2003, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SpaceAce

While you're "hummm"ing, consider the term "overall crime."

Congratulations, Victoria, you didn't give out as many jaywalking tickets this year.

Until someone digs up _details_ on the new supposed crime figures, there's nothing useful to go by.

SpaceAce

these AREN'T NEW FIGURES read the post - one year after the ban - ie this text is 6 years old.

some things have gotten worse.. some things have gotten better.

Veterans Day · 10-17-2003, 01:53 AM

bhutocracy · 10-17-2003, 01:54 AM

Also the American mindset that "criminals will be more active now they know people don't have guns" doesn't work here. Guns have NEVER been part of mainstream society.. Farmers have them.. I grew up around them and know my way around a rifle. But I literally NEVER saw a gun growing up outside of a rural area. Criminals have ALWAYS been able to attack people here relatively sure they wouldn't encounter someone with a gun.

bhutocracy · 10-17-2003, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by katman

how about using your own brain.

it would be nice if you did, because it's not working to your advantage in this situation. Not only is your logic flawed for the Australian situation, the post you are referencing is full of shit. In fact I think the author INCLUDED the mass murder that caused the gun control into the murder rate!

But hey.. who's to let facts and ACTUAL STATISTICS get in the way of a unverified post on the internet you happen to agree with - as you already said - don't worry about statistics - after you have just based your argument on flawed ones!

It's sad you're so biased with your agenda.

Gun control hasn't really done wonders nor has it done any detriment here and thats the truth of the matter.

bhutocracy · 10-17-2003, 02:21 AM

As an Australian it would be hard for me to be able to comment on the American situation because of the prevelence of guns in your society, I would appreciate the same level of recognition of your own ignorance. What works here may not work there and vice versa.

SpaceAce · 10-17-2003, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bhutocracy

these AREN'T NEW FIGURES read the post - one year after the ban - ie this text is 6 years old.

some things have gotten worse.. some things have gotten better.

That doesn't change what I say because old figures mean shit. If you want to include six years ago, you would also need details on every year from then until the most recent statistics were compiled in order to get anything resembling a useful picture.

SpaceAce

katman · 10-17-2003, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bhutocracy

it would be nice if you did, because it's not working to your advantage in this situation. Not only is your logic flawed for the Australian situation, the post you are referencing is full of shit. In fact I think the author INCLUDED the mass murder that caused the gun control into the murder rate!

But hey.. who's to let facts and ACTUAL STATISTICS get in the way of a unverified post on the internet you happen to agree with - as you already said - don't worry about statistics - after you have just based your argument on flawed ones!

It's sad you're so biased with your agenda.

Gun control hasn't really done wonders nor has it done any detriment here and thats the truth of the matter.

Actually, "using your brain" was a reference to logic. Maybe gun control works in some areas. But if my first post was really read, i.e. who would you rather rob, someone with a gun or someone without, you'd have to be a moron to choose the former. Don't you think? Quoting statistics just tells me you spend all your time on the internet and not living. I have personally seen the difference having lived in areas with and without guns.

Once again I repeat...Use your brain and not just blindly follow off some statistics. Does anyone know how to still do that?

That first post was just what I said it was...a quote from another board. I have no first hand knowledge as to Australia's statistics. Nor can anyone's peice of paper tell me that paper can stop the reality of logic. Always remeber there are many variables when dealing with statistics. You guys may think completely different that those of us in the U.S. ???

Answer that question about what YOU personally would do...rob a home with a gun or one without before you post any more statistics.

bhutocracy · 10-17-2003, 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SpaceAce

That doesn't change what I say because old figures mean shit. If you want to include six years ago, you would also need details on every year from then until the most recent statistics were compiled in order to get anything resembling a useful picture.

SpaceAce

i agree with you on your previous post regarding year to year and overall crime figures.

com · 10-17-2003, 03:40 AM

Everyone I know in aussie at the time of the ban, cashed in their shitty arms, and burried the good ones.

-Brendan

CamChicks · 10-17-2003, 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by katman

Answer that question about what YOU personally would do...rob a home with a gun or one without before you post any more statistics.

all guns weren't banned.
you can still defend your television set with a shotgun.

so which would rather live in?

1) a society in which every white trash meth freak,
wannabe gangsta with something to prove, and
emotionally-disturbed jerkoff having a bad day,
can legally carry around easily concealable semi-automatics;
rapid firing capable of killing many people within a minute.

2) a society in which the only guns are 1-2 shot rifles,
kept for hunting and home defense.
(to deter your hypothetical robber)

personally, I intend to move to #2 ASAP.

CDSmith · 10-17-2003, 05:11 AM

As I have said elsewhere.... One indesputable fact that always remains in these arguments is that <i>completely</i> disarming the law-abiding sect of any civilian population does only one thing. It makes it easy for Joe break-in and Johnny holdup to bend you over at will. Period. If they happen to take a fancy to your wife or your daughter while they are cleaning out your silverware drawer they will bang the shit out of her right in front of you as well. Why? Because they have the guns and you don't.

Something changes when crooks THINK people might carry or have a gun in the house. That alone makes it tougher for crooks, not easier. I am in favor of making it tougher for crooks to pull their shit, not easier.

CamChicks · 10-17-2003, 05:21 AM

The only people I've ever head mention completely disarming law abiding citizens are the gun-nuts making alarmist arguements .. to defend their "right" to wave an AK-47.

If you can't feel confident with a rifle/shotgun under the bed,
then you probably have bigger issues bigger guns won't resolve.

try penis pills. I'm sure you can find a link in someones sig . .

(yeah, it was cliche cheapshot)

Odin88 · 10-17-2003, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Everyone I know in aussie at the time of the ban, cashed in their shitty arms, and burried the good ones.

Quite true actually.

iroc409 · 10-17-2003, 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CamChicks

1) a society in which every white trash meth freak,
wannabe gangsta with something to prove, and
emotionally-disturbed jerkoff having a bad day,
can legally carry around easily concealable semi-automatics;
rapid firing capable of killing many people within a minute.

in most states in the US it is not legal to conceal a firearm. in the states that it is legal, most of them require a permit that takes some time to get, thus _generally_ not used for illegal purposes.

crimes in the US are probably primarily consisting of illegal firearms, or someone carrying them illegally. somebody should dig up the numbers, but fully automatic weapons are also not legal in the US without a permit that's a huge pain in the ass to obtain. last statistic i found, there were only 2 known cases of a crime committed with a legally-owned fully automatic weapon. this is going back several decades.

nobody would go through all that to legally obtain the weapons to commit mass murder.

the problem in the US isn't with the legally owned weapons, and generally not with a legally owned semiautomatic handgun or rifle.

the problems are the weapons that are illegally traded on the street, including what would normally be legal, and what normally would not.

a fully automatic AK is not legal without the proper paperwork.

CamChicks · 10-17-2003, 05:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by com
Everyone I know in aussie at the time of the ban, cashed in their shitty arms, and burried the good ones.

-Brendan

I don't know why anyone would object to buried?
ya know .. just incase of an alien invasion or zombie armageddon or whatever.

I'm just tired of drunk guys with mullets saying nasty shit,
while there's a pistol grip sticking out of their pants,
. . and all I'm trying to do is buy some candy or a slurpee.

really, this white trash wild west stuff should be ok at 7-11?
people are actually defending this?

CamChicks · 10-17-2003, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by iroc409

a fully automatic AK is not legal without the proper paperwork.

iroc409 · 10-17-2003, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CamChicks

what's so amusing about that line?

CamChicks · 10-17-2003, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by iroc409

what's so amusing about that line?

really? you dont see something just a little bit funny
about being able to own an AK-47, assuming you've
filled out all the right paperwork? The fact that you
can say(type) that with a serious demeanor shows
just how oblivious some people are to the insanity of it.

what possible reason could you have to need an AK-47?

if you don't see the humor, try this:

Quote:

a grenade launcher is not legal without the proper paperwork.

? no ?

Quote:

Originally posted by iroc409

in most states in the US it is not legal to conceal a firearm. in the states that it is legal, most of them require a permit that takes some time to get, thus _generally_ not used for illegal purposes.

Once someone is murdered, the concealed weapon violation is a bit irrelevant.

You can't carry a shotgun into the grocery store, or bar/pub/club,
without immediately being noticed / asked to leave / arrested.

However, you can carry a pistol anywhere all the time
until the moment you decide to use it. That's the problem.

Technically, yes, it may be illegal . . but you're unlikely to get caught (until someone is dead). Millions of people in the US do it every day.

but maybe I'm biased?

One of my friends from highschool worked at Subway,
nextdoor to the Ross 'Dress for Less' I was working at.
Until a 'robber' wandered in, pulled out a pistol,
and blew his face off; also murdering another co-worker.

All the guy ended up taking was a few sub sandwiches.
(it clearly wasn't planned)

This sort of thing is an hourly occurence in the US.
Americans are completely desensitized to it,
so much that they just accept it as normal ..
a part of life, like car accidents and heart attacks.

Of course you can still murder someone with any gun,
but IMO it would decrease all these random murders
and arguements-turned-assasinations if everybody didn't
have legal access to handguns.

Far more people are murdered because people carry guns,
than are saved because someone had one 'ready'.

Because people are not divided into criminals and non-criminals.
People just make bad decisions (often while intoxicated)
and they don't become "criminals" until the crime.
I'd bet that most murder weapons were originally purchased
because the owner felt he needed to defend himself.

btw,
I am fully aware the USA is too far fucked to fix this mess now.
One of the many reasons I intend to move as soon as I can afford it.

iroc409 · 10-17-2003, 08:29 AM

well, ok, i still have plenty of work to do, but a couple of things.

if you realized what generally goes about to obtain the appropriate licensing to legally purchase things such as fully automatic weapons is extremely intense. i've questioned local gun dealers about it out of utter curiosity, i see no use for such items. some people collect them for historical value.

however, it can be summed up by saying a lot of time, a lot of paperwork, several thousand dollars and the ability for the government to drop in on you basically whenever they please. it's not exactly as easy as filling out a form and they hand you an ak.

look at the history of legally owned automatic weapons. it's practically spotless.

you're talking about the legal access to handguns. i'm saying that although it is a problem, it is miniscule in comparison to the illegal weapons on the streets.

as far as i know in most, if not all states, to purchase a handgun there is a two-week waiting period while background checks are performed on the individual purchasing. in nebraska, you can get a permit from the sherriff that allows you to bypass this system, which takes 3 days and an investigation into your background, etc. if approved they send it out to you.

even purchasing a rifle in nebraska, a check is done in the store through the fbi. it only takes a few minutes, and there is not the same waiting period. again, if you have the county permit, it is not necessary.

all firearms legally purchased are filed with the local law enforcement, so if it is used in a crime, it can be easily tracked to its owner (or in some cases - last _legal_ owner).

as well, any sort of felony record, violent or not, you can not own a firearm, period. you would have to own and illegally purchase a firearm to have it.

i'm just saying, yes it's easy to get a firearm in the US. but, it's easier to get them illegally. the mac10's and ak47's used in drive by shootings and bank robberies were not obtained legally, or owned legally.

the problem is with the illegal firearms in the country. we don't need more laws, we need better enforcement of the existing laws.

10-17-2003, 12:39 AM	#1
katman Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Tombstone, Az Posts: 230	Gun Control...hahaha CD posted this on another board and I had to laugh. I agree but I still had to laugh. I have lived in places where guns were generally prohibited and places where they weren't. I have always felt safer in the later. Here it is: ********************************** You mean banning guns doesn't work?? From: Ed Chenel, A police officer in Australia Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from Down Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The first year results are now in: Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent, Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent; Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)! In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now! Up 300 percent. (Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not ! and criminals still possess their guns!) While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed. There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the elderly. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in "successfully ridding Australian society of guns." You won't see this on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the state Assembly disseminating this information. The Australian experience proves it. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save ! lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect only the law-abiding citizens. Take note Americans, before it's to late! This comes as no surprise at all to me. ************************************************ * (ME NOW) Instead of being sheep and listening to statistics, how about using your own brain. Let's just say for a second, that you really were a criminal. It's not that difficult. All of us look for opportunities every day in this world. Doesn't have to be illegal situations. I know you're capable of logical thought. If you WERE a criminal with a gun, You don't care about the law remember Who would you rob? A house where you may get shot or a safe place? Any idiot knows to go for winning situations. If it were me, I would rob places I knew had no guns. Why get shot and killed? These people who want to take the firearms away are some of the biggest idiots. Of course it would be great if they were ALL gotten rid of, but they keep forgetting the criminals DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE LAW!!!!!! That's why they are called criminals...DUH!!! Jeeze. I can't believe any of these people got through first grade alive. __________________ I don't have fantasies, I live them.

10-17-2003, 01:23 AM	#5
smack Push Porn Like Weight. Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Inside .NET Posts: 10,652	finally the reality of banning firearms comes to light. the problem with people who are for banning guns is that they do not realize that criminals use ILLEGAL GUNS anyways. if they're already breaking the fucking have an illegal gun, what's taking away LEGAL guns going to do? give them free reign with firearms. jesus christ it's so fucking simple. and another thing. anti-gun people do not realize that banning something will not neccisarily make the problem or the danger go away. if you want to really protect your children from guns here is what you do. speak to them intelligently, make sure they know how to SAFELY operate a firearm. as with anything education is your STRONGEST weapon to combat it. guns are tools, very efficent dangerous tools. like any tool you must respoect them and have knowledge of their use and operation. education is the key. __________________ Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

10-17-2003, 01:53 AM	#10
Veterans Day Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: The Windy City Posts: 8,403	__________________ Build a Massive Traffic Network, Hands FREE, Totally Automated

10-17-2003, 03:40 AM	#17
com Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 4,541	Everyone I know in aussie at the time of the ban, cashed in their shitty arms, and burried the good ones. -Brendan __________________ Real. Professional. Hosting. .:Expect Nothing Less:. 320-078-843 :: www.realprohosting.com :: [email protected]

10-17-2003, 05:11 AM	#19
CDSmith Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Location: My network is hosted at TECHIEMEDIA.net ...Wait, you meant where am I located at? Oh... okay, I'm in Winnipeg, Canada. Oops. :) Posts: 51,460	As I have said elsewhere.... One indesputable fact that always remains in these arguments is that <i>completely</i> disarming the law-abiding sect of any civilian population does only one thing. It makes it easy for Joe break-in and Johnny holdup to bend you over at will. Period. If they happen to take a fancy to your wife or your daughter while they are cleaning out your silverware drawer they will bang the shit out of her right in front of you as well. Why? Because they have the guns and you don't. Something changes when crooks THINK people might carry or have a gun in the house. That alone makes it tougher for crooks, not easier. I am in favor of making it tougher for crooks to pull their shit, not easier. __________________ *Promote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!* ALWAYS THE HIGHEST PAYOUTS: Big Bux/ImLive SIGNUP ON NOW!!! Put some PUSSYCA$H in your pocket. ICQ me at: 31024634

10-17-2003, 01:17 AM	#2
sacX Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: New Zealand Posts: 2,998	yet the US still has much higher homicide rates, and 10x higher gun homicide rates... HmmmM

10-17-2003, 01:22 AM	#3
bhutocracy Not making A Comeback Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 10,218	must suck to believe everything you read on the internet

10-17-2003, 01:27 AM	#6
sacX Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: New Zealand Posts: 2,998	"Drop in state's crime rate the biggest in 10 years Victoria has recorded its biggest drop in reported crime for a decade, with a 6.8 per cent fall in the overall crime rate over the past 12 months, according to figures released yesterday." hmmm

10-17-2003, 01:33 AM	#8
sacX Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: New Zealand Posts: 2,998	haha you idiot armed robbery was DOWN 30% bleh link didn't work statistics -> crime stats

10-17-2003, 01:54 AM	#11
bhutocracy Not making A Comeback Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 10,218	Also the American mindset that "criminals will be more active now they know people don't have guns" doesn't work here. Guns have NEVER been part of mainstream society.. Farmers have them.. I grew up around them and know my way around a rifle. But I literally NEVER saw a gun growing up outside of a rural area. Criminals have ALWAYS been able to attack people here relatively sure they wouldn't encounter someone with a gun.

10-17-2003, 02:21 AM	#13
bhutocracy Not making A Comeback Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 10,218	As an Australian it would be hard for me to be able to comment on the American situation because of the prevelence of guns in your society, I would appreciate the same level of recognition of your own ignorance. What works here may not work there and vice versa.

10-17-2003, 05:21 AM	#20
CamChicks Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: godless northwest Posts: 1,552	The only people I've ever head mention completely disarming law abiding citizens are the gun-nuts making alarmist arguements .. to defend their "right" to wave an AK-47. If you can't feel confident with a rifle/shotgun under the bed, then you probably have bigger issues bigger guns won't resolve. try penis pills. I'm sure you can find a link in someones sig . . (yeah, it was cliche cheapshot) __________________ camchicks.com Last edited by CamChicks; 10-17-2003 at 05:25 AM..

10-17-2003, 08:29 AM	#27
iroc409 Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: midwest side, yo Posts: 4,728	well, ok, i still have plenty of work to do, but a couple of things. if you realized what generally goes about to obtain the appropriate licensing to legally purchase things such as fully automatic weapons is extremely intense. i've questioned local gun dealers about it out of utter curiosity, i see no use for such items. some people collect them for historical value. however, it can be summed up by saying a lot of time, a lot of paperwork, several thousand dollars and the ability for the government to drop in on you basically whenever they please. it's not exactly as easy as filling out a form and they hand you an ak. look at the history of legally owned automatic weapons. it's practically spotless. you're talking about the legal access to handguns. i'm saying that although it is a problem, it is miniscule in comparison to the illegal weapons on the streets. as far as i know in most, if not all states, to purchase a handgun there is a two-week waiting period while background checks are performed on the individual purchasing. in nebraska, you can get a permit from the sherriff that allows you to bypass this system, which takes 3 days and an investigation into your background, etc. if approved they send it out to you. even purchasing a rifle in nebraska, a check is done in the store through the fbi. it only takes a few minutes, and there is not the same waiting period. again, if you have the county permit, it is not necessary. all firearms legally purchased are filed with the local law enforcement, so if it is used in a crime, it can be easily tracked to its owner (or in some cases - last _legal_ owner). as well, any sort of felony record, violent or not, you can not own a firearm, period. you would have to own and illegally purchase a firearm to have it. i'm just saying, yes it's easy to get a firearm in the US. but, it's easier to get them illegally. the mac10's and ak47's used in drive by shootings and bank robberies were not obtained legally, or owned legally. the problem is with the illegal firearms in the country. we don't need more laws, we need better enforcement of the existing laws. __________________ <a href="http://www.iroc409.com/"><img src="http://www.iroc409.com/adv/120x60.gif" border=0></a> icq: 1 7 6 4 2 0 9 6 0 Gallery templates for ONLY $25! w00t!