Are the days for free AVS numbered? - GoFuckYourself.com

UniqueMovies · 02-18-2003, 10:02 PM

So many problems with billers that its near impossible to generate signups. Most if not all free AVS use the same biller called babenet and they have been having serious issues.

I seriously think I will give-up promoting free AVS sponsors. I was wondering if anyone knows good paysite sponsors that give 35$ /signup and that convert well.

My #1 compliant is the pop-ups that paysite tours generate. I would like a program that has none.

Any input on this is greatly appreciated.

Thanx guys

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 10:08 PM

Ummmm, Sexkey and Freenetpass both use CCbill, not babenet.

UniqueMovies · 02-18-2003, 10:15 PM

Yes but those are different from the free scam AVS sponsors. They are free with a purchase of some paysites lol

ex:

universalpass.com
agerated.com
adultticket.com
access4ever.com
masterfreepass.com
freeadultavs.com

The list goes on... these sponsors usualy payout 20-25$ /signup and offer free hosting, compared to 15$/signup thru sexkey and freenetpass with no hosting.

muchmoreporn · 02-18-2003, 10:16 PM

sexkey and freenetpass are also the oldest known avs sites out there. wake up.

my mother has less milages

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 10:22 PM

Oh you don't want a "free" avs, you want one that's free IF you pay $40 for one month to a plug in farm?

Yes, I hope those programs days are numbered. Along with all of the paysites whose free trials aren't really free and all of that other shady billing bullshit.

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by muchmoreporn
sexkey and freenetpass are also the oldest known avs sites out there. wake up.

my mother has less milages

Actually they're the most well known "FREE" avs's.
Freenetpass hasn't been around that long, but they're solid.

As for the oldest and most well known AVS I'd have to say Adult Check hands down.

muchmoreporn · 02-18-2003, 10:40 PM

i agree freenetpass is the best one out that for the longest time, this is the avs i have started with, and did very well with. i tried them recently thou and didnt do so well.
like 1:1000 compared to 1:100 with other bullshit avs sites.

not sure about you but seems like everyone needs to rip ppl off to make money. these avs sites are just one way you dont like, im sure paysites got more than 1 trick up there sleves that i dont need to go on and on to mention.

bottom line is that what sells. im in this for money, arent we all or am i confused.

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by muchmoreporn
i agree freenetpass is the best one out that for the longest time, this is the avs i have started with, and did very well with. i tried them recently thou and didnt do so well.
like 1:1000 compared to 1:100 with other bullshit avs sites.

not sure about you but seems like everyone needs to rip ppl off to make money. these avs sites are just one way you dont like, im sure paysites got more than 1 trick up there sleves that i dont need to go on and on to mention.

bottom line is that what sells. im in this for money, arent we all or am i confused.

Can I get that translated please?

UnseenWorld · 02-18-2003, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lenny2

Actually they're the most well known "FREE" avs's.
Freenetpass hasn't been around that long, but they're solid.

As for the oldest and most well known AVS I'd have to say Adult Check hands down.

Yeah, I've been in this industry from the beginning, and for a long time there was only AdultCheck.

Backov · 02-18-2003, 10:54 PM

Even the "legit" free avses, like Sexkey and Freenetpass still are essentially a free trial, and then a hefty rebill.. IIRC, FNP was a $50 rebill.

I can't imagine that doesn't generate a lot of chargebacks. I assume they've either got to disclose like crazy and have their retention from trial go through the floor, or eventually die from chargebacks.

I actually expect them to die, I don't think the free trial has a future in Visas world.

Cheers,
Backov

slapass · 02-18-2003, 10:55 PM

<a href="http://www.sexkey.com/join.cfm?id=id150110">Sex Key</a> now pays $20 per signup.
Comments from this baord a while ago:
"does AVS still work?"
"it quit working last Tuesday or so"
Smartass comment but the point is still valid. Sexkey is great to me and i will promote it until they close.

muchmoreporn · 02-18-2003, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lenny2
Can I get that translated please?.

freenetpass and sexkey SUCK

now babenet is FUCKED

and what are the next best things

IDIOT

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by muchmoreporn

freenetpass and sexkey SUCK

now babenet is FUCKED

and what are the next best things

IDIOT

If babenet is fucked and not processing right now, then which program really sucks?

asshole

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Backov
Even the "legit" free avses, like Sexkey and Freenetpass still are essentially a free trial, and then a hefty rebill.. IIRC, FNP was a $50 rebill.

I can't imagine that doesn't generate a lot of chargebacks. I assume they've either got to disclose like crazy and have their retention from trial go through the floor, or eventually die from chargebacks.

I actually expect them to die, I don't think the free trial has a future in Visas world.

Cheers,
Backov

Right, but you can cancel the free trial, and still keep the AVS pass. And the disclosure on both of thier join forms is very open and honest. (Unlike the ones where you get a free avs pass IF you pay $40 a month to a paysite)

Fantasyman's free trials convert to monthly at $50 a pop, and the trial to monthly conversions I get with those sites is pretty close to the same as I get with other partnerships.

I don't think free trials will go away, but the rules about disclosure will probably tighten up for sure.

muchmoreporn · 02-18-2003, 11:10 PM

lol

alot of free avs sites were using babenet. obsiously you dont know as much as you thought, your in the wrong post to be making comments on.

Backov · 02-18-2003, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lenny2

Right, but you can cancel the free trial, and still keep the AVS pass. And the disclosure on both of thier join forms is very open and honest. (Unlike the ones where you get a free avs pass IF you pay $40 a month to a paysite)

Fantasyman's free trials convert to monthly at $50 a pop, and the trial to monthly conversions I get with those sites is pretty close to the same as I get with other partnerships.

I don't think free trials will go away, but the rules about disclosure will probably tighten up for sure.

Yes, but you've missed the point. They pay per sale - whether the user cancels before he rebills or not. FNP for instance pays $15 per. The rebill is $50, for a totally shit site (so no rebills after the first).. Top that off with the fact that they don't OWN the site (Last I checked it was a sexhit site).. So they're actually affiliates. So they get a fair chunk of per sign money.. But is it enough to cover 3 or 4 out of 5 of their trials cancelling? If it's 4, that means they paid out $60 to webmasters (or shaved) - and lost $10..

Like I said, I don't see them lasting much longer. Disclosure will kill the biz.

Cheers,
Backov

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by muchmoreporn
lol

alot of free avs sites were using babenet. obsiously you dont know as much as you thought, your in the wrong post to be making comments on.

Yeah but you're missing the point, they weren't really "FREE" AVS's.
The 2 "free" avs's I use process with CCbill, so I have no worries.
I know enough to know that if a program is fucking the surfer 6 ways to sunday they're not going to be around that long.

Snake Doctor · 02-18-2003, 11:24 PM

Backov, I see your point.
There are lots of ways to make money owning an AVS program even if you lose money on the initial transaction. (don't most pay per sign up paysites lose in the first month or two?)

They have a giant database of emails to spam.....errrr, market to. Emails that belong to people who will gladly use their credit cards to buy porn.
FNP also has a premium site program that rebills at $20 a month.
The full page ads people have to go through before they actually get to the AVS site, plus you know they're filling the links list up with a lot of "house" sites to make upsells on.

Plus there's probably a lot of trade secrets that I don't know about.

Just my

Backov · 02-18-2003, 11:31 PM

All the after sales wonder doesn't help worth a damn if Visa cancels your account for excess chargebacks. ;>

I do agree they have lots of other avenues for making money, but if you're thinking 20% of their signups retain from trial I'd say it's probably more like 10%. Stretching it pretty thin I'd say.

Cheers,
Backov

Quote:

Originally posted by Lenny2
Backov, I see your point.
There are lots of ways to make money owning an AVS program even if you lose money on the initial transaction. (don't most pay per sign up paysites lose in the first month or two?)

They have a giant database of emails to spam.....errrr, market to. Emails that belong to people who will gladly use their credit cards to buy porn.
FNP also has a premium site program that rebills at $20 a month.
The full page ads people have to go through before they actually get to the AVS site, plus you know they're filling the links list up with a lot of "house" sites to make upsells on.

Plus there's probably a lot of trade secrets that I don't know about.

Just my

baddog · 02-19-2003, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by muchmoreporn
sexkey and freenetpass are also the oldest known avs sites out there. wake up.

my mother has less milages

oh yeah? I am sure AdultCheck (for one) might disagree just a little

Sarah_Jayne · 02-19-2003, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by UnseenWorld

Yeah, I've been in this industry from the beginning, and for a long time there was only AdultCheck.

and then age check before it became cyberage. Sexkey and FNP are good but they aren't the oldest.

McSpike · 02-19-2003, 06:36 AM

Every AVS sucks if you don't know how to sell it.

Every shit sucks if you don't know how to sell it. Fact is some people know how to sell, some don't, some know how to sell certain things better than others and the opposite.

I make a decent coin using one of the mentioned AVS. Even if I told you which it is it would mean shit to you, because you have to know how to sell it first.

Talking about 4free programs, AVS, free trials, per signup, partnership there are will always be people that will have problems with one or the other.

People laugh at 4free programs and some some make decent coin out of it. I sell 4free programs better than 1:10. I bet many never saw such numbers which doesn't mean 4free sucks. It's just you gotta know how to sell it and who to sell it to.

I also sell one of Lightspeed's sites at 1:25 which totally doesn't mean that Lightspeed will do good for you.

It's all a matter of marketing. Period.

Mr.Fiction · 02-19-2003, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by UnseenWorld

Yeah, I've been in this industry from the beginning, and for a long time there was only AdultCheck.

They should have patented AVS business model just to be fuckers.

Snake Doctor · 02-19-2003, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction

They should have patented AVS business model just to be fuckers.

Shit you think its hard to get a site listed there now? God help us if they were the only one

<IMX> · 02-19-2003, 08:56 AM

Two types of "free" avs systems.

1.) You pay for a membership to a site first, then get access to the link list level of sites for a period of time.

I guess those "babenet" frontend avs systems fall into that category.
They must use the same backeend as sexpromote, piecash, matrixbucks etc.
these guys pay a one-time payout. like 30 or something...

Then you have
Accessforlife
FreeAgeCard
These guys per active like $25 convert from trial, 20 recurr.

2.) Real "free" which work just like most paysites with cross-sells. A savvy consumer can get away without paying anything for access to the "free level."

Not quite sure why you are comming down on AVS systems that do cross sales, most paysites either have cross sells or a funky 3 day trial which may bill you on the last day. (which I think is a bit shadier)

As folks have said time and time and time again, mainstream does this with any damn thing that is a "club." go look at book of the month, cd, dvd, movie, steak, wine, clubs etc... They all offer a low trial and recurr the hell out of you.

Look at free gifts from magazines... etc...
This is a fact of life. The terms of service are there and a lot easier to find on cross-sells than most other models, because they are RIGHT there on the billing page.

BuckLover · 03-13-2003, 09:07 PM

Well I know one thing is for sure many of those systems were using babenet, and when Babnet failed to pay them, they in turn screwed the webmasters, I have been dealing with UP and now AR which are owned by the same guys "I think" and they have been great, my checks did not miss a beat! and they have been around since 1997! So they say! No worries!

Fletch XXX · 03-13-2003, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by UniqueMovies
So many problems with billers that its near impossible to generate signups. Most if not all free AVS use the same biller called babenet and they have been having serious issues.

hahah

yeah ok.

Theo · 03-13-2003, 09:13 PM

$35 for free avs with no popups is too much dont you think?

BuckLover · 03-13-2003, 09:17 PM

Yes, they have had some problems, but they are running on thier own MID now and I am getting much better results! sales were hurting for about 3 weeks, I was getting ready to throw in the towel, but where am I gonna go! frigging Adultticket???

Gutterboy · 03-13-2003, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by McSpike
Every AVS sucks if you don't know how to sell it.

Yep. I don't think I ever built a SexKey or Cyberage site that averaged over 1:50 on signup page clicks at any time during the last 3 years.

Even though I'm moving away from the AVS game I still push my old sites. Same tours, same galleries. The conversions have gotten worse over the last 2-3 years, going from 1:30 to 1:40, but AVS stil sells if you know how to market it right.

EDIT:

This thread prompted me to check my SexKey stats.. something I don't do often anymore. Still bumping along at 1:40 this payperiod.

02-18-2003, 10:08 PM	#2
Snake Doctor I'm Lenny2 Bitch Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: On top of my soapbox Posts: 13,449	Ummmm, Sexkey and Freenetpass both use CCbill, not babenet. __________________ sig too big

02-18-2003, 10:16 PM	#4
muchmoreporn Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 784	sexkey and freenetpass are also the oldest known avs sites out there. wake up. my mother has less milages __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-18-2003, 10:22 PM	#5
Snake Doctor I'm Lenny2 Bitch Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: On top of my soapbox Posts: 13,449	Oh you don't want a "free" avs, you want one that's free IF you pay $40 for one month to a plug in farm? Yes, I hope those programs days are numbered. Along with all of the paysites whose free trials aren't really free and all of that other shady billing bullshit. __________________ sig too big

02-18-2003, 10:40 PM	#7
muchmoreporn Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 784	i agree freenetpass is the best one out that for the longest time, this is the avs i have started with, and did very well with. i tried them recently thou and didnt do so well. like 1:1000 compared to 1:100 with other bullshit avs sites. not sure about you but seems like everyone needs to rip ppl off to make money. these avs sites are just one way you dont like, im sure paysites got more than 1 trick up there sleves that i dont need to go on and on to mention. bottom line is that what sells. im in this for money, arent we all or am i confused. __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-18-2003, 10:54 PM	#10
Backov Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Cat Detector Van Posts: 1,600	Even the "legit" free avses, like Sexkey and Freenetpass still are essentially a free trial, and then a hefty rebill.. IIRC, FNP was a $50 rebill. I can't imagine that doesn't generate a lot of chargebacks. I assume they've either got to disclose like crazy and have their retention from trial go through the floor, or eventually die from chargebacks. I actually expect them to die, I don't think the free trial has a future in Visas world. Cheers, Backov __________________ <embed src="http://banners.spotbrokers.com/button.swf" FlashVars="clickURL=http://banners.spotbrokers.com" quality=high pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/shockwave/download/index.cgi?P1_Prod_Version=ShockwaveFlash" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="120" height="60"></embed>

02-18-2003, 10:02 PM	#1
UniqueMovies Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 1,691	Are the days for free AVS numbered? So many problems with billers that its near impossible to generate signups. Most if not all free AVS use the same biller called babenet and they have been having serious issues. I seriously think I will give-up promoting free AVS sponsors. I was wondering if anyone knows good paysite sponsors that give 35$ /signup and that convert well. My #1 compliant is the pop-ups that paysite tours generate. I would like a program that has none. Any input on this is greatly appreciated. Thanx guys

02-18-2003, 10:15 PM	#3
UniqueMovies Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 1,691	Yes but those are different from the free scam AVS sponsors. They are free with a purchase of some paysites lol ex: universalpass.com agerated.com adultticket.com access4ever.com masterfreepass.com freeadultavs.com The list goes on... these sponsors usualy payout 20-25$ /signup and offer free hosting, compared to 15$/signup thru sexkey and freenetpass with no hosting.

02-18-2003, 10:55 PM	#11
slapass Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 14,625	<a href="http://www.sexkey.com/join.cfm?id=id150110">Sex Key</a> now pays $20 per signup. Comments from this baord a while ago: "does AVS still work?" "it quit working last Tuesday or so" Smartass comment but the point is still valid. Sexkey is great to me and i will promote it until they close. Last edited by slapass; 02-18-2003 at 11:11 PM..

02-18-2003, 11:10 PM	#15
muchmoreporn Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 784	lol alot of free avs sites were using babenet. obsiously you dont know as much as you thought, your in the wrong post to be making comments on. __________________ SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

02-18-2003, 11:24 PM	#18
Snake Doctor I'm Lenny2 Bitch Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: On top of my soapbox Posts: 13,449	Backov, I see your point. There are lots of ways to make money owning an AVS program even if you lose money on the initial transaction. (don't most pay per sign up paysites lose in the first month or two?) They have a giant database of emails to spam.....errrr, market to. Emails that belong to people who will gladly use their credit cards to buy porn. FNP also has a premium site program that rebills at $20 a month. The full page ads people have to go through before they actually get to the AVS site, plus you know they're filling the links list up with a lot of "house" sites to make upsells on. Plus there's probably a lot of trade secrets that I don't know about. Just my __________________ sig too big

02-19-2003, 06:36 AM	#22
McSpike Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 1,042	Every AVS sucks if you don't know how to sell it. Every shit sucks if you don't know how to sell it. Fact is some people know how to sell, some don't, some know how to sell certain things better than others and the opposite. I make a decent coin using one of the mentioned AVS. Even if I told you which it is it would mean shit to you, because you have to know how to sell it first. Talking about 4free programs, AVS, free trials, per signup, partnership there are will always be people that will have problems with one or the other. People laugh at 4free programs and some some make decent coin out of it. I sell 4free programs better than 1:10. I bet many never saw such numbers which doesn't mean 4free sucks. It's just you gotta know how to sell it and who to sell it to. I also sell one of Lightspeed's sites at 1:25 which totally doesn't mean that Lightspeed will do good for you. It's all a matter of marketing. Period.

02-19-2003, 08:56 AM	#25
<IMX> Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 2,728	Two types of "free" avs systems. 1.) You pay for a membership to a site first, then get access to the link list level of sites for a period of time. I guess those "babenet" frontend avs systems fall into that category. They must use the same backeend as sexpromote, piecash, matrixbucks etc. these guys pay a one-time payout. like 30 or something... Then you have Accessforlife FreeAgeCard These guys per active like $25 convert from trial, 20 recurr. 2.) Real "free" which work just like most paysites with cross-sells. A savvy consumer can get away without paying anything for access to the "free level." Not quite sure why you are comming down on AVS systems that do cross sales, most paysites either have cross sells or a funky 3 day trial which may bill you on the last day. (which I think is a bit shadier) As folks have said time and time and time again, mainstream does this with any damn thing that is a "club." go look at book of the month, cd, dvd, movie, steak, wine, clubs etc... They all offer a low trial and recurr the hell out of you. Look at free gifts from magazines... etc... This is a fact of life. The terms of service are there and a lot easier to find on cross-sells than most other models, because they are RIGHT there on the billing page. __________________ $$$ Check out NICHE PAY the leader of Micro Niche Sites! They offer $1 Trials! $$$ $$$ Check out 10 FREE TRIAL SALES equals 1 FREE LAP TOP ! $$$

03-13-2003, 09:07 PM	#26
BuckLover Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: I'm everywhere Bitches!! Posts: 1,656	Well I know one thing is for sure many of those systems were using babenet, and when Babnet failed to pay them, they in turn screwed the webmasters, I have been dealing with UP and now AR which are owned by the same guys "I think" and they have been great, my checks did not miss a beat! and they have been around since 1997! So they say! No worries! Last edited by BuckLover; 03-13-2003 at 09:09 PM..

03-13-2003, 09:13 PM	#28
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	$35 for free avs with no popups is too much dont you think?

03-13-2003, 09:17 PM	#29
BuckLover Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: I'm everywhere Bitches!! Posts: 1,656	Yes, they have had some problems, but they are running on thier own MID now and I am getting much better results! sales were hurting for about 3 weeks, I was getting ready to throw in the towel, but where am I gonna go! frigging Adultticket???