How do you wysiwyg people do it?
 

Every year or so, I decide I'm missing something and install my copy of Dreamweaver 3.0.

Once I install it, I always try to make a quick little page of some kind, and I can't finish it... I can't even get past making a text page. I start typing...wrong font. Find all the f'n drop down boxes for the various font properties and start clicking and dragging and all sorts of crap.

Great! I got my font picked! Type up the first paragraph, hit return. Type some more. Crap. Selected font info is gone. Select it all again, hit another button and the shit's gone again. Type, drag, drop, select, drop downs, check boxes, highlight and select this, highlight and select that, oops, forgot to highlight this and go back and do that.

The SHIT IS HORRIBLE! How do you people make a full site in that crap?!? I would kill myself if I had to make an entire site with a wysiwyg editor.

I must be retarded because I can bang out an entire page with all sorts of complex tables and forms and other assorted crap in a text editor faster than I can make a fucken paragraph of text in Dreamweaver.

DREAMWEAVER AND FRONTPAGE ARE HORRIBLY HORRIBLY GAY!

There. I uninstalled my Dreamweaver, ranted my rant and I'm going back to work now. In my nice little Cute HTML text editor with the purty colored text.

Notepad rules :thumbsup

I know it sounds funky, but I use the Coffee Cup HTML editor, and it's great. You won't have ANY of the described problems if you switch to it. There is a risk-free trial version and if you decide to buy it at the end of the trial, it's not very expensive.

They serve a purpose for somethings like image mapping and maybe flash, but I think that is about the extent of it.
Any designer that uses solely wysiwyg editors and doesn't know how to code in HTML should be fucking shot and taken out of this business. It is like a car sales man pretending to be a mechanic. May look like good on the outside but it is complete shit on the inside and he is fucked if he needs to fix anything..
www.cutehtml.com has been my companion for 5 years, it was the very first thing I learned when I got in this biz, and the first and most important thing I recommend to people in this biz..
I can't stand those fuckers that are too lazy to learn it and go for the shortcut.. and I fucking HATE dreamweaver.. what a waste of code that peice of shit is..
May as well go to geocities and use their prissy little user friendly webpage creator for all I am concerned

TextPad is better!

Ill second that!

Amen!

Frontpage irritates me. It adds so much extra coding that clutters things...buttt...I won't rant about that.

I love my cuteHTML... but I use Fireworks for rollover buttons... don't hate me. :)

Anyone here us Netscape Composer?? Or am I the only one???
:1orglaugh

I live on netscape composer, Ill build my page that way and when its time to edit i use the notepad inside my ftp program to make the changes i need, I hate front page and dreamweaver, I've tried them both and I keep coming back to netscape, its got to be the easiest thing to use. I even taught the other half how to use it now hes trying to make me some templates

I dig myself some EditPlus. That works great for me. Just a great ASCII editor.

I basically use notepad and CuteHtml but I will use Netscape Composer when I want to take a look at the preview. The only problem there is after using Netscape to preview I have to go back and use Cute to remove all the damn coding Netscape puts in...:feels-hot

Twilite

No offense to all you hand-coders still using notepad, but if you can't get Dreamweaver or Frontpage to work for you, then it's just because you don't have the patience to learn the tool.

I can code in notepad too, but i prefer Dreamweaver or even Frontpage for one reason... it's just a waste of time to hand code a complex, nested table layout in notepad by hand when it can be done in less than 5 min. in Dreamweaver or Frontpage if you just know what you're doing.

The most common gripe about these HTML editors is all the "unnecessary" code that's added automatically behind the scenes. Hmmm. So instead of your page weighing 50KB, it weighs 60KB without graphics. I can see that making a difference if your site is pushing 200K uniques a day, but otherwise, who cares? The surfer doesn't care. So long as it looks good an loads quickly. If the extra 10k or 15k is gonna clog your pipe, then you might need a bigger pipe.

Someone who knows how to use these editors well can design a very good looking page in half the time you can by hand.

:winkwink:

Very true. I love Homesite 4.5 but can get things done much faster with Dreamweaver. Just takes a little time to get used to it.

I use mostly FrontPage to do my stuff ... I would be lost if I had to code tables and shit in NotePad. I think FP is pretty easy to learn and fast to build up entire page. I am gonna try this Dreamwaver soon to see what that tool really does ..
anyway I sometimes use NotePad too for some small quick work

I agree with FATPad. I had a mainstream client that required me to use Dreamweaver -- he only knew how to set up the FTP access using DW, or some such shit, because when I tried to FTP files to his server using WsFTP I got couldn't get access -- and I hated it. The same problems with fonts, etc. I ended up uninstalling it...it was just eating up space on my comp.

I use NoteTab Lite -- I just like having multiple files open in tabs and flipping back and forth. I'm gonna check out CuteHTML though, see what kind of features it offers.

So yeah, maybe I'm a hand-coding fool, wasting my time laying out pages from scratch, but I get exactly what I want that way...I just don't have the patience to retrain myself to use DW or that kind of stuff when I already know how to get the effect I want with NoteTab.

UltraEdit32 - best text editor on the planet (it's got that purty colored text, too)!
Plus you can hit a little button and it will pop open your default browser to show you what the page looks like at its present state.

You WYSIWYG users - you might want to check your sponsor linking codes for the ascii equivalent of '&' rather than the exact code your sponsor gave you. If it's there, you're not being credited for some hits and possibly signups...

But that's okay, because it saves you a whole 5 minutes over coding by hand!:1orglaugh

Microsoft Front Page


i know its lame, but i've been doing all my sites with it since day 1

all other editors seem too complicated for me.

I have the latest DreamVeawer and HomeSite but there are too many buttons. :helpme

The only time that would fuck up an affiliate code is if your incompetent and don't know how to use the tool. Something that applies to you?

Personally I don't have the time to spend 20 mins on something I can do in 5 mins that works 100% fine and is maybe a couple of k bigger than a hand coded page. Mind you I also make my living from building sites and quickly and don't have the luxury to play at this and waste that much time each day.

metapad is better :winkwink:

dreamweaver of course....font problems? use css styles...simple

notepad sucks.. why wasteing time with it?
I'm using homesite 5.0 it really kick ass!
I love it!
has notepad, ultraedit, textpad, metapad or whatever program you are using a function to replace texts in documents in a whole directory?
I bet they don't...

I made my money with pagemill. :1orglaugh

I'm with you on this one..textpad rocks

You guys are funny (rolls his eyes)

ah, pagemill...

I write my webpages by hand with paper and pencil, and then scan the using OCR technology.

Funny to read this!
I'm still using an old version (from the stone age) of Hotdog 3! It's a bit like the freeware arachnophilia editor with colored tags, etc., and switches to nominated browser for preview - it works well for me and I get pages done which won't crash older browsers!
But nevertheless I'm using CSS and the lot - just have my templates sitting in a \dir ready to copy.

I actually bought a copy of Dreamweaver 3 - never installed it. Now with the MX version out I think it'll be a waste of time to learn it - MX is so different... I just got a copy, but as with 3.0 it's laying on my desk serving as a paper weight --- one day...
Just dare the steep learning curve of new software - how much time will I spend learning it which I could have put into page writing?

If you had the choice of building a house yourself or having 10 workers do it for you would you still do it yourself?

There's no right or wrong answer here there's just different types of people. One type is usually more successful than the other monetarily but the other is more content with himself at the end of the day.

Dream... what? Never heard of it! :evil-laug

Now notepad, that's what I know. :thumbsup

(self serving post... blah blah blah... yea I know, whatever, GFY)

Claris Home Page (wysiwyg) does every thing I need. So dam easy 2 learn, this 5th grade drop out had his 1st page up in less than 1 day. I have Dreamweaver, tried it many time, just 2 much stuff in it for me, wouldn't and didn't use 1/3 of it. Frontpage one huge pile of crap. Am not a designer, so all I use Notepad for is Note's.

I use all the tools I can - Mostly the HTML editor in Front Page so I can easily and quickly see the pages as I'm working on them but have no problem swithing to Ultraedit and uploading to the server or "reverse engineering" in Note Pad
But my graphic skills still suck he he he

edit - but you have to remove the bloated shit from what Front Page does if you use it as a wysiwyg

notepad & vim

Well,

My first suggestion for anyone, has always been, learn the code before you jump to a tool.

Which I do know.

I bounce between, DW MX, FW MX, and TextPad.

I like to write my PHP, .ASP in textpad, and have it roundtrip into my DW site, I have just used TextPad forever for that stuff, although MX does a lot of the simple stuff for you already, so I find myself bouncing back and forth between the two apps even less.

Patience is the key for DW, and if you get the MX version, and run it in MX mode, it is a lot like Homesite.

Anyways, enjoy

MacroGuru

heres the lates page i threw together


1011000011010101001010101110101010101
101010101010100010101
001010101010100101010010101011
01010101101
11010101
010101000101011101010101010101010

Yeah! Yeah! Kill em' all and let god sort em' out!

:eek7

I have Macromedia Studio MX and I think it's the shit.:thumbsup

Stones Webwriter :thumbsup

nice