porn versus obscenity
 

As I understand it, Porn is legal in Ca and NY, while obscenity is not legal in any State (including CA and NY).

dave

I believe you're correct.

So whats obscenity? It's determined by the local government. In some places Max Hardcore is considered obscenity

Porn becomes obscene when it happens in a public area.. or near one or two nosy neighbors

Or when some religious group decides it is and tries to take you to court for having an adult business to close to their homes.

I'll type out the entry from Black's Law Dictionary (of which I happen to have an old copy of in my library) before I hit the sack here:

"Obscenity: The character of quality of being obscene; condunct tending to corrupt the public morals by its indecency or lewdness.

Material is Obscene if, considered as a whole, its predominant appeal is to prurient interest, that is, a shameful or morbid interest, in nudity, sex or excretion, and if in addition it goes substantially beyond customary limits of candot in describing or representing such matters. Predominant appeal shall be judged with reference to ordinary adults unless it appears from the character of the material or the circumstances of its dissemination to be designed for children or other specially susceptible audience. Undeveloped photographs, molds, printing plates, and the like, shall be deemed obscene notwithstanding that processing or other acts may be required to make the obscenity patent or to disseminate it. Model Penal Code 251.4

Federal laws prohibit the mailing, transportation for sale or distribution, importation, and broadcasting of obscene matters. 178 U.S.C.A. 1461 et seq."

"Obscenity." Black's Law Dictionary. 5th ed. 1979.



I'm sure a more recent edition would focus more on electronic distribution matters... but there ya have it. I'm sure the definition is kept obtuse on purpose.

I agree with you!

actually not all states have obscenity laws like alaska and currently my state GA because the old was thrown out in court and they havent gotten around to making a new one.

Porn is protected expression, but obscenity violates community standards and is illegal.

Where to draw the line? Nobody knows...

Back in the day porn was obscene.
porn

noun
creative activity (writing or pictures or films etc.) of no literary or artistic value other than to stimulate sexual desire

So, adult film makers would put stories /plot lines / bad acting into their films in order to argue the artistic / free expression points.

This was pretty standard fare for almost all adult movies, and then the tides changed. You started to see in the height of the VHS era, compilation videos of nothing but cumshots, fucking etc with no plot lines, no stories. Nothing of artistic value.

Things have changed quite a bit, and not necessarily for the better.

Also, the X rating when first created was much like the NC-17 rating.

It was not created to signify porn. Movies like The Midnight Cowboy, and A Clockwork Orange were rated X.

The rating was created just to distinguish movies from an adult R rated film, that may be okay to take someone under 18 to, to one that was clearly only intended for mature audiences due to the subject matter.

Pornographers co-opted the concept, giving their movies triple X ratings as a marketing ploy to create interest in their product.

In the not-too-distant past here in Canada, the OFRB (Ontario Film Review Board) considered the following obscene:

1. Facial cumshots
2. Actresses in pigtails (implied CP)
3. Slapping (even in fun)
4. DP
5. Bondage (any sort of bondage no matter how mild)

We were forced to edit out all those scenes when I worked for AOV (except for releases to Quebec).

When they loosened restrictions and allowed tripleX - it became pretty much anything goes.

Interesting how times change.

obscenity is all relative.

Your obscene relatives - are they photogenic?

People know obscenity when they see it.

In essence everything is legal until a jury tells you that you have broken some unknown line in the sand.

Produce not what your not willing to defend in a very church like setting even with wooden pews, in some bible belt community (choice of venue), in front of an assortment of locals who will look at it and decide your fate. In the end there are two winners, your lawyer and the DA as you can beat the rap but can not beat the ride as so many FBI agents have said. Even if you stay out of jail, you are guilty in the eyes of the public forever and odds are you spent most of your money in the process.

Hey Dave -- I dont think its legal in NY. In California we have Freeman, whats the case for NY ?

There was a prostie case were the madam was trying to equate prostitution to adult entertainment, but I dont think the judge agreed. He basically stated that the production of adult content was a First Amendment issue and prostitution/pandering wasnt protected. But thats not controlling, lawyers call that dicta.

If there's another case please let me know.

As far as I know, its still illegal to produce hardcore content in every state except for California.

Very true...yet sad at the same time.

The easiest way for me to define obscenity is this:

Take a hardcore scene or image.. Look for other works like it. If you can't find any, then it is likely obscene. Mainstream porn has little to worry about anymore, in fact past AG Gonzales admitted that "some adult content is protected speech". If you play in the middle of the field, boy meets girl boy fucks girl stuff, then you don't generally have much to worry about.

Oscenity in the US is still based on the the Community Standards test, which means there are still variations from place to place. What would be acceptable in San Francisco might not fly in Salt Lake City.

If you don't push the envelope, you aren't going to have many issues that I can see.

There is a huge grey area but I think we'd all agree that a guy masturbating in public is obscene, even if he's doing it in his front lawn on his own property.

Was with Sweet Entertainment while we changed the "Obscenity law" here in Canada .. from what i got out of everything is that Obscenity is based on community standards .. our issues were with BDSM content .. never with watersports...fisting or anything between 2 NOT RESTRAINED individuals ... community standards

This thread is indeed interesting. What's obscene for some may not be to others, it's such a gray area.

Not sure what you mean by "porn is legal in CA and NY."

"Porn" is legal everywhere in the U.S. unless it is "obscene," because until it crosses the line of "obscenity" it is protected speech under the First Amendment.

Shooting porn is legal (not considered pandering or prostitution) in CA, and I don't know about NY.

Unfortunately, you don't know if your content is "obscene" until some jury tells you it is applying their interpretation of local community standards. I say the whole thing should be scrapped and there should be nothing illegal. If you don't want to see a girl in bondage getting choked by a big dick while someone rams a baseball bat up her ass, then you know how to avoid seeing it.