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Content Buyers - Step Inside :::
Just curious to know - how many of you folks that buy content on a regular basis have actually been on a set and seen how content is created. It's funny when I get emails from people who want high-quality material like they've seen me post on the boards - but then have a heart attack when I start talking numbers with them. I think some of these people would have a better understanding of pricing (mine or anyone elses) if they were to see how difficult this stuff is to produce and how much time, effort, energy and equipment it takes to produce it.
That old adage "you get what you pay for" rings true...even when your talking about content :thumbsup Discuss* |
This is dead on. Part of the reason I think is the bargain basement content places. Most of which are in economys that the pay rate is ridiculously low compared to the U.S. and other countries. Dont forget how much work is done post shoot too Dean. :winkwink:
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I buy and also produce.
sometimes producing given content is cheaper... so I do it... and sometimes it's cheaper to buy it.. so I buy it. It's all about the profit margins. Of course, I always take in consideration post production time and effort needed to convert the raw camera shots into something usable. |
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Post production does suck huge IMHO:disgust |
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it's a huge mistake to shoot just exclusive - imho
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Well glamour is alot more expensive than other types of content to produce, if that's what you're referring to.
Plus U.S. models cost alot more than Czech, Polish, German, Brazillian, etc models. So when comparing a Dean Capture Twisty's shoot to a regular shoot of a foreign model I imagine the price difference is very significant. |
it is true, the prices are so much down right now! I go since 5 years month for month shoot! And when i talk with the models, they told me, yeah a lot of new producers come with very low budget stuff, like 199$ cameras and with lights from supermarket! So it is much content on market!
But the girls want money, make up artist, location is not easy to find for low budget!!! The models in czech or hungary are also not more cheap, they know what is going! Nobody must think for a hand full$$$$ the want work!!!! No, no!!! But the business must going on, so I go next time and shoot again! |
Post production work sucks =(
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I shoot 90% exclusive custom content these days, and am making very good money. I cannot be bothered to have a pay site - i like taking 4 months off per year How is that a mistake? I think it boils down to lifestyle and consumer demand.:2 cents: |
not sure if you know this, but we pay about $1100 a day for a girl doing 2 b/g and 2 solo scenes. in Czech Republic. and just the girl.
i'm not so sure if that is much different to the US - maybe compared to LA, but not outside large cities. |
Very true Dean... Most of the time when I give numbers I never hear back from them again. So at least the people you're talking to give you a response... :1orglaugh
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don't think we would be 7 people then like we are now |
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The very best girls here in Prague are asking for and often getting 1000USD + for one scene |
Dean's content is top shelf. If you want that quality, be prepared to pay for it.
A lot of people who have never worked on a shoot as involved as some of these glamour shoots can be have no idea of the amount of set up involved to get great images. They assume it's the same as grabbing their digital rebel and snapping away at the model. |
I agree with Dean
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How are you man??? |
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comments ? |
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I also try to make it clear to potential clients that I am only interested in producing a certain style of work and if this style is not what they are after - we shouldn't work together. I've had clients try to change the flavor of my work by requesting me to change things about the shoots that I was not comfortable changing. I explain to the clients that I have a vision about the type of work that I want to produce and if our visions don't align, we should not be working together. This is a completely different mindset than what a non-exclusive shooter would posses. This type of shooter will shoot whatever flavor the client wants as long as they get paid. Money is important to me but is not "and" has never been the reason I got into this business. For me it's all about producing quality work and doing what pleases me. If I'm not enjoying myself - I get bored and do not do my best. Most non-exclusive shooters don't care that much about doing what pleases them.....but rather what pleases the client. Interesting thoughts here - keep'm coming :thumbsup |
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and we developed our abilities in cooperation with our clients - the result is the "style" we shoot now. Is it good? is it bad? the people who buy from us decide. but we stand behind our product just as you do |
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I heard that some of the most praised works of art were produced commisioned, meaning someone actually paid the artist (in this case i think it was da vinci) to produce an art piece.. It was not some vision he was tinkering with while he was starving.. nope he was out there making some money doing what he liked.. Personally, I am a bit of a mix of dean and madalton.. yes i have some visions, but i also work for money, and will shoot something despite it is not exactly inducing my creative side(s). A couple of years ago, i would have worked for free if it was a hot enough model..and i still may do, if I can have rights to the material, but in most cases, i only work for money, even if i like the work ;) |
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you're definitely right on this: mostly everything we nowadays consider great art from people like da vinci was ordered and paid by the church or rich people. like the Mona Lisa, which was simply a paid potrait of the wife of a rich venetian merchant it's not that we don't like our work - and i can spot in the sets whether my guys liked the girl or not - but i treat this strictly as a business. if a job does not make profit then we don't do it. even if it might be fun or the girl has nice brown eyes. |
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The year that I spent as an exclusive shooter for Twistys was amazing in a sense that here I had a company that believed in my vision and gave me pretty much unlimited funding in order to pursue that vision. I was given almost complete artistic freedom to create whatever I wanted and experiment with locations & lighting and anything else I wanted to. This is about the best situation that you could ever have. A company that pays you a salary, gives you big budgets, gives you total creative control and let's you experiment, practice and do whatever else you need to do to get your work to a higher level. The work that I produce now... looks different than it did a year ago - it's better, tighter and I have more control over it. This is in part thanks to Twistys and in part because I took that opportunity to grow and ran with it. Every shoot I did for them was an experiement and I learned something new every day that we shot for them. That is simply an experience that you can't put a price on. Shoot a few days a week for a year adds up to a hell of a lot of practice and a hell of a lot of opportunities to fine tune your skills :thumbsup |
MaDalton, my posts above were in no way meant to shine a negative light on non-exclusive shooters, producers or distributors. A few years ago I had my own content store and shot non-exclusive material. I sold picture sets to raise money so I could shoot more stuff and get more practice. I never pushed the site that hard and never made any big money with it. If I made enough to cover another shoot - I was thrilled. It wasn't about the money - it was about practicing photography!
I tell my friends that I've spent almost 20 years learning photography instead of learning about business. I remember going to workshops & seminars and they would start them off talking about the business of photography - I would just sleep thru that stuff. I was only interested in technique and gear. I thought if I could shoot beautiful photography the money would come. After almost 20 years of doing this - I'm finally seeing some light at the end of the tunnel. Had I spent as much time and energy learning about business as I did about photography, I'd be much better off financially now than I am. Much respect to you for being able to launch a successful content store with your limited knowledge of photography. As everyone can tell - you've done a hell of a job with it :thumbsup |
Location: $600 low end
Make-up: $200+ Photo Assitant: $100+ (each) Model: $700+ Post production: Depends |
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you have no idea how often i took your pics and told my guys: that's how it's supposed to look like :1orglaugh but i have to admit: the way we work and the way we schedule our jobs doesn't allow experimenting a lot. but we still have fun with what we do and to see sites with our stuff that are successful makes us proud |
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I cant help but think of a guy i met a few years back, he was in the same erotic photographers yahoo group as i was. You could tell on his post that he had never been on an adult set but was very very interested, and a solid photographer, he was a local guy so i invited him to come shoot with me, i had hired a model for a day shoot and could freely invite whomever I wanted. He came with some really nice gear, he had the canon d1 mark 2 with ul lenses and really nice strobes..much nicer equipment than mine. We did the photo shoot, I preferred to take turns shooting, rather than "double team" her, i like to be the only one giving my models instructions when i shoot. When it was his turn, he had some trouble positioning the model and getting any angles. But with my assistance and guidance he got some nice sexy photos. i introduced him to some of the people in the business, and before I knew it he was shooting daily for a mutual friend he met that first day. i thought it was great. One day, the friend pulls me aside and says..he does good work, but he wont listen to what we want, he only wants to shoot it the way he thinks is good.. Shotly after, the guy was back out of the adult content production, simply because he was not able to mix the two. He was not at the level as Dean, where he could demand this creative freedom. last I heard he was looking to sell his canon mark d's etc... |
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it sounds like a perfect thing for you.. I have been wanting to shoot for twistys and send them samples and videos etc. I was told they would give me a shoot..but nothing so far. |
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It is amazing how clueless some are as to the cost of shooting ============== as per this post - speaking for myself, I come form a musical background and like alot of different styles of music (from classical to punk) and thats applied to the way i shoot or try to (glamour to amateur) some clients are on the same page artistically and aesthically, some not yet they have their vision of what they want, like what I do, so I give them what they want. Liken it to a music producer. sometimes thats cool because your doing something new and it broadens the scope and on the other hand you may end up pulling the hair form your head wondering HTF did i get myself into this. |
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Thats exactly how i look at it, and i have plenty of paid work but when i set my sight on something like shooting Twistys, i am going to make it happen. Good to hear you're still shooting for them also. |
I have to say this Dean is also a great teacher besides shooter.
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As a content provider we shoot for the broad market not a particular client, for exclusive we shoot for a client. I would say the content store reflects what most of the non exclusive content market wants. Personal style? I can spot my work a mile off. As for having individual talent. this is not a talent competition and depends what talent are you talking about? We shoot for magazines, sets that will make $2,000 or more. Yes a solo girl set that sells non exclusive for $2,000. also on the content store and in the paysite. plus we might have the video sold on DVD. Tell me the other exclusive shooters who are doing that. Dean most of the people who contact us don't have a clue what's involved in shooting porn. They think most people can pick up a camera and point it at a naked girl and hey presto you have porn. We price exclusive content on what what it's worth in the store. I would say we would be a lot more expensive than any of the normal exclusive shooters. I'm in this business to make money, never had any artistic talents and getting laid was never a problem. Started to get out of massive debt, stay to make money. |
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very busy, signed a couple of big deals -11 movies for Private Media, -6 movies for Micheal Ninn, plus i have 2 big television projects coming. I am looking for help, do you shoot BG hard Video? |
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Sounds like you've got your hands full with all those projects - good luck with that man :thumbsup |
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You are good at marketing yourselves..very nice. Many talented photographers are not.. Personally I am also pretty good at marketing, but probably not as perfected as you at this. I have photos published in Mayfair and Club, also some scandinavian and australian + us magazines.. yes these are non exclusive, but I dont mass sell the photos also..just not for me. |
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The content is crap, does not work, does not convert, gets put on magazine front covers, gets used on tours, gets bought and bought all because I am a great marketing man. And all my customers are idiots. Or they buy because it works and you're the idiot. :1orglaugh |
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Somehow I deleted 1 pic from 1 set and you sent it to me. :1orglaugh Now THAT's service. http://www.eazytraffic.com/gfy/image...y-approved.gif |
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I still see some of that content on tgp sites occasionally. Funny, that shit will be around forever :1orglaugh |
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Its possible I am the idiot, but sofar I am pretty content with what and how i do my production. The clients I have are long term and the list keeps growing. |
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