Proven way to shave with CCBill! - GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum

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swedguy

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#1

Proven way to shave with CCBill!

02-09-2005, 01:11 PM

Since no one from CCBill wanted to comment on my question here: http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showth...=3#post6554988 I decided to try it out myself.

I clicked on my CCBill link code. Went to the join form and clicked JOIN and was sent to CCBill. When I viewed the source, my ID was there. Everything looked normal.

Now I clicked on my CCBill link code again. Went to the join form that had an added form variable that had another persons webmaster ID in it. Clicked JOIN and was sent to CCBill. Now MY webmaster ID in the form was changed to the other persons ID.

The cookie had my ID in it and the CCBill join form had the other persons ID. Now I wanted to see who actually got the credit. After I had bought a membership, THE SIGNUP WAS CREDITED TO THE OTHER PERSON.

1. I send surfer to sponsor A
2. Sponsor A adds a hidden form variable with their own webmaster ID on 10% of the surfers.
3. The cookie has MY ID in it, but the sponsors hidden form variable overrides the cookie.
4. They get the full credit for those surfers

Conclusion. It is possible for shady CCBill sponsors to shave signups from honest webmasters.

I don't see a legit reason for this behavior. CCBill care to shed some light on this?
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Jay_StandAhead

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#2

02-09-2005, 01:13 PM

CCbill will shed some light on this, hopefully it's a misunderstanding or an error

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brand0n

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#3

02-09-2005, 01:13 PM

drama......

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#4

02-09-2005, 01:13 PM

Wow I want to know this too.

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Basic_man

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#5

02-09-2005, 01:13 PM

See sig for NATS program !

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Relish XXX

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#6

02-09-2005, 01:15 PM

Originally posted by Basic_man

See sig for NATS program !

There are people complaining about NATS as well. There will never be a system that keeps 100% of the world happy.
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clickclickclick

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#7

02-09-2005, 01:17 PM

if this is drama, im pluggin my wu tang seo shit.

if you need more than 3 clicks to get to a join page, something is wrong ;)

p.s. i still bring the sales whores here.
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#8

02-09-2005, 01:23 PM

Originally posted by Basic_man

See sig for NATS program !

NATS is great. But it's stupid to think that with NATS you CAN NOT shave. It's harder, maybe very hard. But some ppl will cheat, no matter what software

Last edited by justsexxx; 02-09-2005, 01:25 PM.

Questions?

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TMM_John

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#9

02-09-2005, 01:30 PM

Originally posted by justsexxx

NATS is great. But it's stupid to think that with NATS you CAN NOT shave. It's harder, maybe very hard. But some ppl will cheat, no matter what software

You're exactly right. No one should ever have blind faith becuase of one factor.

However, if someone is to ever be caught with proof that they are trying to shave (or have managed to shave) while running NATS they WILL be shut off. Thats what sets us apart.

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TheSenator

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#10

02-09-2005, 01:31 PM

bump...want to know more....CCBILL reps post reply here

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Furious_Male

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#11

02-09-2005, 01:33 PM

Interesting find.. I would like to see the response as well.

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#12

02-09-2005, 01:33 PM

this outta be interesting...

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#13

02-09-2005, 01:34 PM

this sucks
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#14

02-09-2005, 01:34 PM

Thanks for the tip
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Harmon

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#15

02-09-2005, 01:35 PM

Interesting stuff. See sig for your VOD needz

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KRosh

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#16

02-09-2005, 01:35 PM

Originally posted by swedguy

Since no one from CCBill wanted to comment on my question here: http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showth...=3#post6554988 I decided to try it out myself.

I clicked on my CCBill link code. Went to the join form and clicked JOIN and was sent to CCBill. When I viewed the source, my ID was there. Everything looked normal.

Now I clicked on my CCBill link code again. Went to the join form that had an added form variable that had another persons webmaster ID in it. Clicked JOIN and was sent to CCBill. Now MY webmaster ID in the form was changed to the other persons ID.

The cookie had my ID in it and the CCBill join form had the other persons ID. Now I wanted to see who actually got the credit. After I had bought a membership, THE SIGNUP WAS CREDITED TO THE OTHER PERSON.

1. I send surfer to sponsor A
2. Sponsor A adds a hidden form variable with their own webmaster ID on 10% of the surfers.
3. The cookie has MY ID in it, but the sponsors hidden form variable overrides the cookie.
4. They get the full credit for those surfers

Conclusion. It is possible for shady CCBill sponsors to shave signups from honest webmasters.

I don't see a legit reason for this behavior. CCBill care to shed some light on this?

show me where you did this?? i tried with several different links to ccbill to no avail.

ICQ 115433750
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swedguy

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#17

02-09-2005, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by KRosh

show me where you did this?? i tried with several different links to ccbill to no avail.

No. But I can show it to a CCBill rep.
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skillfull

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#18

02-09-2005, 01:38 PM

i cant wait to hear the "this is a glitch" answer

mind at underdark dot cc
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#19

02-09-2005, 01:41 PM

interesting for sure

I don't use ICQ anymore.
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#20

02-09-2005, 01:45 PM

bumppppppp

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Rorschach

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#21

02-09-2005, 01:46 PM

good one swedguy
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KCat

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#22

02-09-2005, 01:54 PM

There was some kind of trojan discovered months ago that did the somthing similar. Ran in the background & would replace your cookie with its own.

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KRosh

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#23

02-09-2005, 01:55 PM

Originally posted by KCat

There was some kind of trojan discovered months ago that did the somthing similar. Ran in the background & would replace your cookie with its own.

that's why i asked him where it was so I could duplicate his issue.. I bet his machine is taken over

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Rui

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#24

02-09-2005, 01:55 PM

Nice finding, I'm curious about what will be the answer to this one
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swedguy

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#25

02-09-2005, 02:00 PM

Originally posted by KRosh

that's why i asked him where it was so I could duplicate his issue.. I bet his machine is taken over

This has nothing to do with a trojan or ANYTHING like that.

I could change the webmaster ID to what ever I (read: sponsor) wanted to set it to. If it would be a trojan, it would set it to THEIR ID.
And this webmaster ID change has nothing to do with changing the value of the cookie.

If you want to replicate it, all the info is in my post. But I'm not going to say straight out what form variable you need to add. But it's very easy to find.
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#26

02-09-2005, 02:01 PM

Sig spot

Jon
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#27

02-09-2005, 02:05 PM

wow, this is gonna be dramatic
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#28

02-09-2005, 02:05 PM

No wonder I havn't gotten a sale in 3 months...

Trump haters gonna hate. that's all they can do
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swedguy

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#29

02-09-2005, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by pornstar2pac

No wonder I havn't gotten a sale in 3 months...

You know you have to send traffic, right?
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#30

02-09-2005, 02:08 PM

Originally posted by TheMob

wow, this is gonna be dramatic

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#31

02-09-2005, 02:22 PM

does that explain the 0:10000 ratio that i have with one specific site?
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swedguy

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#32

02-09-2005, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by Jay[neX]

CCbill will shed some light on this, hopefully it's a misunderstanding or an error

Let's hope so.
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modF

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#33

02-09-2005, 02:45 PM

What makes you think that this can't be done with EVERY processor? The sponsor could just change the link code to the join page from the tour to another affiliate code. Would you ever know if you never looked? Why does this have to be a CCBill issue?

I do things
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swedguy

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#34

02-09-2005, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by modF

What makes you think that this can't be done with EVERY processor?

Don't know. Haven't checked them out. I'll do them another day.

Why does this have to be a CCBill issue?

Because they are allowing a sponsor to be able to add form variable that will override the cookie that holds the info WHO sent the surfer. So the problem is their way of handling form+cookies that are sent.
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#35

02-09-2005, 03:01 PM

Bump for swedguy.

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#36

02-09-2005, 03:04 PM

this isn't fake drama, is it?

fine... I'll bring the:

like to see how this one plays out.

.
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fedfest

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#37

02-09-2005, 03:05 PM

To me this really just proves that CCbill's system is the best system if you want to awoid beeing cheated..

Lets face it, if a program want's to cheat allways can, one way or another, but with CCbill hosting the join page they would just be too dumb to do so as you can allways check if your reff code is there or not.

I've allways encuraged affiliates to check for this (even have it in our faq's that affiliates should check up on us that way) as this really is your safest way to ensure you're not being shaved.

Btw. can't really see that CCbill's tracking is at fault here, If you got a sponsor using a script to change the code then the sponsor is the problem and he's the one you should expose, If not here then at least report him to CCbill as i'm sure they must be just as interested in stoping such cheat as the rest of us are.

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swedguy

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#38

02-09-2005, 03:10 PM

Originally posted by fedfest

Btw. can't really see that CCbill's tracking is at fault here, If you got a sponsor using a script to change the code then the sponsor is the problem and he's the one you should expose, If not here then at least report him to CCbill as i'm sure they must be just as interested in stoping such cheat as the rest of us are.

Instead of going after individuals that are cheating, isn't it better to stop it at the source?
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Dirty Dane

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#39

02-09-2005, 03:11 PM

It can be done.

But why dont you post the site, so others can double check it?
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Pornopat

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#40

02-09-2005, 03:12 PM

Are you sure you are linking to the official sign up page?

Asking this because I have been allowed to put up mu own signuppage for example. In also use the hidden cookie because I dont want other webmasters to use my signuppage and bandwidth...
I know others who have done the same.

https://stripcash.com/sign-up/?userI...fff832eb95ab6a
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Anna_O

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#41

02-09-2005, 03:14 PM

This could get very interesting... Bump for a fellow swede.

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Dirty Dane

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#42

02-09-2005, 03:22 PM

Go through this link:

http://refer.ccbill.com/cgi-bin/clic...agirl.com/aff/

can you find the affiliate ID on the signup page source?
I can't with IE.
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FiReC

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#43

02-09-2005, 03:23 PM

Originally posted by fedfest

Btw. can't really see that CCbill's tracking is at fault here, If you got a sponsor using a script to change the code then the sponsor is the problem and he's the one you should expose, If not here then at least report him to CCbill as i'm sure they must be just as interested in stoping such cheat as the rest of us are.

word, this can be done with just about any affiliate tracking software out there, it's not CCBills problem, its the shady programs who choose to use it.

Bottom line, if you don't trust your sponsor don't use them.

One more point, as far as I know, the ccbill tracking works with cookies or IP stamps if cookies aren't allowed. Most programs out there use some sort of combination of session/cookie tracking. I think its a blessing that they allow us to override the cookie with a session/form variable to ensure that the affiliate gets credit regarless of IPs or cookies, i sure hope they don't change this.

it's the reason the nubiles links look like:

http://refer.ccbill.com/cgi-bin/clic...?coupon=611105

so in turn, this option is benefiting you for programs who choose to use it by crediting you sales that might not get credited by the cookie / ip tracking.

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#44

02-09-2005, 03:28 PM

Originally posted by Dirty Dane

Go through this link:

http://refer.ccbill.com/cgi-bin/clic...agirl.com/aff/

can you find the affiliate ID on the signup page source?
I can't with IE.

No I can not find it...
btw
The memberslink links here: http://www.netfreaks.com/members
There is no such site!

https://stripcash.com/sign-up/?userI...fff832eb95ab6a
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#45

02-09-2005, 03:28 PM

There is absolutely no way to prevent shaving.

Why do people keep hoping otherwise?

Our medium of delivery is the world wide web. There is no way to enforce what you guys are looking for. It's not going to happen. If you don't trust your sponsor, their affilate software is not going to help you.
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fedfest

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#46

02-09-2005, 03:32 PM

Originally posted by swedguy

Instead of going after individuals that are cheating, isn't it better to stop it at the source?

Definetly.. And Imo. the source for this cheating is the program that cheats, not the prosessor, as he could propably do this on any prosessor.

It's like asking if we should build roads narrow so the cars won't drive too fast, or if we should catch those that do the fast driving..
Well, even on a narrow road you will see some sucker drive too fast.

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swedguy

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#47

02-09-2005, 03:32 PM

Originally posted by Dirty Dane

Go through this link:

http://refer.ccbill.com/cgi-bin/clic...agirl.com/aff/

can you find the affiliate ID on the signup page source?
I can't with IE.

The PA has to be signed up for that sponsor, otherwise it will not set a cookie = will not show the ID in the join form.

http://refer.ccbill.com/cgi-bin/clic...irtydaisy.com/

Try that one instead (found it through Google).
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#48

02-09-2005, 03:33 PM

No Corvette?
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Dirty Dane

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#49

02-09-2005, 03:36 PM

Originally posted by swedguy

The PA has to be signed up for that sponsor, otherwise it will not set a cookie = will not show the ID in the join form.

Im signed up, and it does not work with my ID either. And the account is active.
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swedguy

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#50

02-09-2005, 03:39 PM

Originally posted by Dirty Dane

Im signed up, and it does not work with my ID either. And the account is active.

Then I don't know why you don't see your ID there. I see it on all the other join pages I've looked at.
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