This is how you should view all cops and Search & Seizure.
 

This is in regard to this news story:
http://www.theneworleanschannel.com/...83/detail.html

I came up with theory years ago after watching many Dracula movies as a kid.

You should view all police as Vampires.

If you recall in the old movies and some of the new ones, Dracula could never enter your house unless you invited him in.

Same way with police officers. This is why they always ask if they can come in when there is trouble nearby.

This allows them to do a cursory search. Once something that is in plain view that is clearly against the law or signs of something amiss are spotted then the search can and will expand.

However the tricky part is the rules of the invite.

If someone calls 911 to report an incident within the home then you've pretty much invited them.

If it's just your neighbor calling to complain about noise, barking dog etc they have no reason to be in your house, but they will want to come in so they can see if you've left your crack pipe or bong laying about.

If they ask to come in, tell them no and continue talking to them at the door or step outside and shut the door behind you.

If you rent your landlord cannot give consent to search.

However if you're away for a day or two and someone calls your landlord to report water flowing out of your house and he comes in and during an emergency repair discovers your meth lab you're fucked.

Your roommate cannot give consent to search private areas.

He may give the police consent to search the living room, kitchen, all public areas etc but your bedroom is pretty much off limits.

My suggestion take it a step further and go out and get a doorknob with a lock and key, this will further prove that your roommate did not have general access to your private areas and therefore cannot give consent.

Anyway I am not a lawyer and of course none of this is going to be 100% applicable to every situation or state law.

But these are general things you should consider when dealing with local law enforcement.

I always tell them to "get a fucking warrant pig". Seems to work ok.

Yeah but you're a bit smarter than most in the world.

Watch cops and watch how many times they just kind of bully and trick people into thinking they are there to help them but in fact they are trying to hurt them.

I remember this one time they went around to the back of a house where no one was home and saw a meth lab in the kitchen...this woman was trying to get her stuff out of the house but was locked out...she was only a friend staying there...so the cops told her if she would just crawl through a window and let them in they wouldn't touch her but let her go.

Stupid bitch fell for it.

The cops had no reason to be in the back of the house so there was no real probably cause at that point, but once she let them in and of course they went right to the kitchen and then lectured her on how she could not have lived there without knowing what was going on and then arrested her.

When being interrogated cops can say anything they want in order to get a confession from you.

They can lie even, say witnesses have signed affidavits against you claiming they know it was you who committed the crime.

They can say they have pics, videos whatever they want none of it has to be true.

I know this from experience, the bastards!

I was joking about the warrant shit, I don't have cops visiting me at home. Don't have anything to hide anyhow.

Also a lot of people don't know once you give consent to search you can at any time take that consent back up until the time they find something.

Once they find something you're fucked...so what's the lesson...NEVER give consent.

Well it's not about having anything to hide, it's about protecting your freedoms from unlawful search and seizure.

I wouldn't let them in regardless. I'm a paranoid bastard.

Cops don't get into my palce ever unless they have a warrant and only after I call my lawyer.

So they would pretty much have to raid me to get in,
and since I do nothing that is illegal, that will never happen.

You're on GFY, You're in the porn biz. You have plenty to hide. You think this admin and others approve of porn? You think that one picture on your hard drive that might be CP caused by an exit page won't land you in jail? On any day surf the news and you find many scary things. Civil rights are meant to be used and exercised.

Suggest you be respectful of the police when you tell them no. It's a shit job and they don't all deserve to be called pigs.

Yeah I seen this on some special on HBO once. It amazes me that they can do this bullshit.

If it's a shit job they can quit, no ones stopping them.

Someone has to preseve social order. Have met nice cops. A friend that was also a cop found a dead baby (few months old) in a trash can once. He was a mess for a long while over that.

I've been treated like shit from the police and at other times treated with respect. Just like everything else, ya can always find a fair share number of assholes.

All jobs suck sometime, including porn.

I agree with pretty much with what you're saying...my post was not intended to start a I hate cops thread but just to let people realize that part of a cops job is to find crimes. they are not there to be your buddy they are not there to be your social worker...your therapist whatever..they are there as you said to maintain order.

we would like to step inside to talk to you about this.

im sure you fuckin would, but its a nice day right here outside. so speak your mind or im going inside without you.

do you have something to hide?

yes, i like to wear womens underwear and swing from a home made trapezze ive made, but that isnt any of your consern.

The fact remains that the law is the LAW so they basically can do whatever the FUCK they want to do.

WHen u take it to court it will be a cop's word vs ur word and thats not gonna do much imo.

they got my stupid friend and me on this... he was the one who believed them and signed a full explanation of what we did (we were 15)... i told him i didn't know what he was talking about.... we got owned.... mopping floors for 50 hours at the YMCA sucked ass

and i was bashed for hating pigs :)

:thumbsup

We've had a robbery, so they have to come, now you have no choice - they are gonna find out you j/o with panties on.

not sure about this, maybe different from state to state, but if the apartment is furnished (came with the apt) they can give consent.

no reason to be in the back of the house? Sounds like she called them, right? Or else why were they there in the first place?

The eyes can not trespass. If she called them there to help her, and they see a meth lab, they then have probably cause to enter

I honestly don't recall exactly why they were there...I don't remember if she called them or not...and they did not have probable cause which is why they asked her to crawl through a window and open the door for them and let them in...it was clear from the get go what they were pulling but she was too stupid to realize it.

They told her things like we know it's in there just let us in and we won't arrest you for it...etc.

so, they just happened to be walking thru back yards with a film crew, and stumbled on to this lady that was locked out of her house?

That was pretty convenient. The meth lab was icing on the cake.

I edited my post...I don't recall the exact situtation that brought them there...but the simple fact is they did not have probable cause..it was evident...if they had they would have crawled through the window themselves but they didn't they tricked her into doing it for them..and then opening the door and letting them in.

Now that shit is just crazy, I hope it gets over turned.

Equal Access Necessary to Override Refusal to Consent


Law enforcement officers who conduct a search based on an
individual's consent that follows another individual's refusal to
consent must be careful to determine that the consenting
individual has, at least, equal access and control over the area
being searched. Only a consent given by a person with equal or
superior access and control over an area can supersede another's
refusal to consent.


In United States v. Impink,23 for example, a landlord, who had
retained the right to access leased premises for the limited
purpose of storing a piece of equipment, noticed some suspicious
glasses, flasks, and burners on the property. The landlord
subsequently notified the police and gave an implied consent to a
search of the premises. This consent was followed by the tenant's
specific refusal to consent. When 50 pounds of methamphetamine
subsequently were found on the premises, the tenant was arrested
and ultimately convicted.


When this case reached the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth
Circuit, the court noted that the landlord's right of access was
extremely limited and considerably inferior to that of the
tenant. Given the landlord's unequal right of access, coupled
with the tenant's refusal to consent, the court held that the
search of the premises pursuant to the landlord's consent was a
denial of the tenant's fourth amendment rights and suppressed the
evidence.24


Because only a person with an equal or greater right of access
can override another's refusal to consent, law enforcement
officers must be careful to develop facts that would allow them
to reasonably conclude that the person giving consent has such
equal or greater right. Once this reasonable conclusion is drawn,
officers can act on the consent, despite the protest of the
nonconsenting party.

I said it before, and I'll say it again..

I have respect for cops who work the tough neighborhoods - the areas with high crime and cops really do live in a danger world. it's the cops at colleges/universities, nice suburbs, etc that get me.

here on campus, if i told you how many kids here get arrested you would not believe me.. I think I know of at least 100 kids who have been arrested for "illegal consumption" (underage drinking) - about 20-30 kids get arrested for this every weekend. how? simple, they choose to walk home instead of driving, and a cop sees kids walking home, pulls over - and breathilizes all of them..

I was standing outside my apt a few weeks ago talking to some friends when a cop car pulled up next to us and turned on their lights, so i start walking away - thinking, hey i did nothing wrong - another cop pulls up and cuts off my walking lane - and then they proceeed to interrogate the 3 of us..

"hey boys, what are you doing out here" -- um, i live right across the street, im going to my fucking car..

they proceed to breathilize the 3 of us, one of us blew like a .05 (a few beers from dinner an hour or 2 before), me and the other one blew 0.00 - at that point, there were 4-5 cops there, all acting like big time jackasses..

it was a good thing it was a fat ass hick lady cop talking all this shit with like 4 backup male cops - i would've told her straight up if all of us had blown 0.00 - "you're the reason why woman shouldnt be cops.. you need 4 backups to handle 3 nice kids who aren't doing anything but talking on a street corner across from our building."

i could go on and on, but ill stop, unless you want to hear more :mad:

eros, if none of us had done anything wrong, and i said that shit to her like "you're the reason why females shouldn't be cops" - you think she could have legally arrested me for anything..


cause i guarantee you if i had said that shit, i would've been thrown to the ground and arrested.

she could have always lied.

Lots of issues in this thread:

1. Americans have never had a serious threat against their freedom and unlike people in many other free societies they actually have a constitution. Yet many seem paranoid about losing their freedom, to the extent that they would rather have a murderer escape punishment, than have his weapon discovered by "illegal" means.

2. These same people willingly carry photo IDs as a matter of course, quote their social security numbers at every turn, and accept a general lack of privacy of information beyond what most Europeans would tolerate.

3. When and how did the police, who are supposed to be public servants, become the enemy?

4. If they warrant the attitude prevelant in this thread so far, is the original concept of police to "serve and protect" no longer relevant in today's world? We appear to be saying they are an additional threat, rather than protection against threat...

5. Other than working overtime on reinforcing the concept of them and us, what are the anti-police people doing? Your taxes pay for law enforcement. Your representatives create the laws. If a situation is bad, it's because you allow it to be. What are you doing to change it?

6. How many barrack room (or should I say message board) lawyers would fold and say yes sir, no sir, if they actually got a knock on the door?

Well to address your comments:

#1 Our legal system and our protections from it was set up so that 10 guilty men go free rather than 1 innocent man go to jail...instead of the other way around and rightfully so.

#2 I don't always give up my information so easily. However I do know that an officer has a gun and know not to bring a knife to a gun fight.
When asked to do things I don't feel comfortable with I comply while expressing that I am doing so unwillingly. That I am not giving consent.

#3 When did they become the enemy? Why don't you ask them the same question. I know many police officers and people within the criminal justice system who looks upon their fellow citizens as the enemy, who question everyone's motives.

#4 There is no "attitude" in this thread, it is a discussion on how to protect your civil rights. And anyone who stands between me and my rights is an additional threat.
Police officers serve a dual purpose other than just to protect and serve. They are there to investigate, they are there to arrest and will use whatever tactic to accomplish this if a crime is committed.

#5 No anti-police people here...well not all of us ;) And people are doing what they can, this is a message board and people are sharing their thoughts which could very well translate into ideas, and then into action.

#6 A lot of people would fold, but so far I haven't been one of them.
I was 18 when I had my first confrontation with a police officer. A friend of mine made a left turn from the right lane.
He had his gym bag for his jui-jitsu class in the back of his seat it was a pick up truck.
No way he could reach it. It had his practice weapons in it.
The cop asked us to get out of the car and started to search. I informed him that since my friend did not give him consent that he had no right to search.
His only answer was pulling me to the side so his trainee couldn't hear...and he told me "listen man I'm just trying to train this guy and I don't want to argue with you or anything about the law."
He then let us go.

Cops are people..they are human beings. They are not infallible, they are not perfect.
There are good cops and there are bad cops. But history has proven time and time again you have to keep the powers that be in check and always question everything they do.