Christians aren't gonna like this much...
 

Awesome news!
the less christian, the better...
now, stand back devil boys, some of you guys are as full of shit as the Christians......

Fresh back from a trip to Scotland to lift an old hex from the Loch Ness Monster, he warned teenagers against joining witch covens too young. ?There are some bloody weird people out there,? he said.

oh man, that had me rolling! :thumbsup

No offense to any Pagans about but I just gotta say - that dude is insane. Nothing to do with his religion, but he lives in our town and goes the the same doctor that I do. He's off his trolley and addicted to painkillers. :2 cents:

Ironically they have an ad of harry potter in the same page.

Soaring Pagan numbers have churches worrying and calling for stricter controls on cult TV programs and films that celebrate sorcery like ?Harry Potter,? ?Buffy the Vampire Slayer? and ?Sabrina the Teenage Witch.?

:1orglaugh

Ban TV, movies, and books, maybe that will help.

Pagans are worse than Christians how? Fucking idiots.

Cool ! My magic wand import business is booming.

Time to make a stand anyway.

PAGANS RISE.

ive shaved my head in preparation of this new decade.

this one is ours.

http://www.lamb-of-god.com

'I'm a monster so don't walk my way.
Don't trust my smile my teeth are like knives.
I'll drag you down & suck you dry.
Don't laugh at my jokes- the punchline is murder.
Don't enjoy my touch, every caress hides a chokehold.
I'm only happy when I've ruined everything I see.
Believe everything you've ever heard about me- suck it up.
If you see me coming don't stop, just turn & walk the other way.
I will not lie about what I have done, I will not lie about what I will do to you, the sweat of
my exertion is pure poison, I'm hell...'

The New American Gospel.

sounds like he would fit right in here. :Graucho let's get him a name.

I love it! The old religions are much more fun and no more nonsensical than the current favorites.

Well, I don't know if I'd call it progress... more like sideways movement. We need to replace religion with science... not another religion.

hahah I am in that group

An if it harm none, do as you will.

That's a fucking powerful quote. Insane or not, at least they have figured some really great shit out. I'd almost prefer Pagans ran this country, better than fucking christians. Isn't water into wine a spell, oh, no, wait, um if we call it a MIRACLE it will seem so much more normal.

Listen, raising a hex off of Loch Ness maybe funny, but at least these people are just dancing and telling people not to hurt each other. I wish more of the world was like this, even if it does mean going insane.

We'd have a lot less problems selling porn, if everyone lived by that slogan.

TarPy

As IF they actually all follow that rule.

I'm sure there are just as many selfish little pagan pricks as there are selfish little christian pricks.

So their beliefs are no more important than "do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

Indeed!!

I'm agnostic at best, but let's be honest, I'm a damn atheist. One of the religious right nutbags here decided that since I didn't believe in God, I'd go to hell.

"If you don't believe in the power of God, our Father and mighty Lord, then you're a demon-worshipping Satanist, and I don't want you around my kids!" I'm not kidding you, that's what this woman was yelling at me in a Wal-Mart.

I just started laughing my ass off at her. You see, if one doesn't exists to me, then other one certainly doesn't. So how can I worship something that in my eyes doesn't exist? No thanks, I'll worship myself. I'm in the process of writing my own Bible, just for me. Narcissism rocks!

The most alarming part of the story?

<b>TELEVISION, THE INTERNET, environmentalism and even feminism have all played a role in the resurgence, they say.</b>

Hello, my name is Cthulu. Mind if I rape your dimension?

I like the pagan one better. The other one sounds a bit, i dunno, selfish.

"I did that joke in Alabama, and these three rednecks met me after the show. "Hey buddy, c'mere. Hey Mister Comedian, c'mere." Yeah, I love that move (makes shoving motion) "C'mere!" Not a physics major, I think that's a safe bet. "Mister Funnyman, c'mere. Hey buddy, we're Christians and we don't like what you said." I said, then forgive me. "

- Bill Hicks

christians need better marketing. They need to hire a good PR firm.

Catholics have become kinda cool because of all the rowdy sex orgies going on in the churches, maybe christians should work harder at exposing their fetish for young boys.

No, it means pretty much the same thing.

Just treat those around you as you would want to be treated.

Yea, since people know that a certain rock is 100 million years old. I trust science. I'm sure they were alive back then to give an accurate age of a rock.

Paganism is a little better than Christianity...but I've had a few friends that STILL tried to push their beliefs on me just like a Christian. I think if it became mainstream...it would become as intolerant as any other religion.

Not at all. One is saying to not bother people, the other is saying be nice to other people just so that they will be nice to you. I like the former much more. Kind of like "be nice to people regardless".

:1orglaugh

Why is this alarming? Just curious....

No, it doesn't.

An Harm None, Do What Thou Will.....means follow ONLY what your 'will' is in life.....and do not mess with other peoples wills when you do it. ;)

Christanity is a horribly INTORALENT and PREJUSTICE religion that installs hatred and fear into a lot of otherwise innocent people.

I would hate to see it, but I sort of have to agree.....

For lack of a better term....Absolute power corrupts absolutely....

A large part of Paganism lies in it's tolerance for other paths though....I would be hopeful it would stay that way....but if we learn from history.....

Something to fear more....

http://www.harpers.org/online/jesus_plus_nothing/?pg=1

Long article but worth the read.... These christian assholes can play that jesus card and take over.... This is some scary fucking shit.

This is just laughable. Those shows are nothing more than entertainment and hollywood. They resemble nothing of true Paganism.....oh how confused those churches are....

The only show I know of that comes close was the movie 'The Craft'. They got several things right.....but of course they had to 'Hollywoodize' it with flying witches and laughable spells....

This is not new, paganism was always strong in Britain but suppressed and hidden, by such methods as outlawing festivals at Stonehenge, etc.

Actually if pagan rituals were 'main stream', porn industry would go down I'm sure. We bank on the 'sin factor' and the fact that people will 'sin' in private.

It depends what you mean by 'pagan' of course. There are many ancient gods.

Let's find out if paganism is more rational than Christianity. Has Christianity changed its mind about anything based on factual data? Yes: A lot of Christian sects (not all) have at least tried to adapt to the findings of science.

When was the last time the Wiccans or the Druids changed their beliefs based on scientific fact?

IMHO allowing the Wiccans or Druids to be ambassadors of 'paganism' (see my post above) is like saying Hamas is in charge of Opec. Maybe arab world is better analogy.

Good point....sex would no longer be sinful...it would be something celebrated.

And yes, it would depend on what type of Paganism we are discussing....

Okay, which paganism sects or religions would you put forward instead?

Well, that's the thing, because of Christian and Muslim suppression there is no real 'paganism'. People practice privately or have incorporated old ways into modern christianity. I personally see no conflict with science. The problem is rather we have lost knowledge of some of the ancient ways. No scientist ever said that just because it hasn't been proven yet, it can' be proven in the future.

Mine's, Ithiqua; nice to meet you :thumbsup

Btw Unseen you have a real eye for picking out the 'witchy' girls. It's an interesting niche :Graucho

Can you give examples of scientific fact that was instrumental in some type of change...and what that change was please? I personally can't think of any right now....

Paganism is rooted in nature.....the moon, the earth, the air etc....at this point, I don't see anything scientific that contradicts most Pagan belief systems. (Please note I say 'most')

The majority of Pagans understand that the gods, goddesses and symbols are only tools to aid in the manipulation of energy. They help one focus.

Taking the words in the bible as 'truth' is far different. You most certainly can prove with science that Adam and Eve were NOT the first humans on earth.....

Well I don't think that's been proven yet, but neither has it been proven that Thor doesn't actually fly through the sky bashing giants when it thunders..

Need to spice up the bible. Like instead of just the virgin mary has a kid, how about, the virgin mary does her first gangbang, and then theres like some moral to it.

Some kinda adult bible. Pure hardcore biblical action.

Unfortunately, I'll probably have to pick this conversation up tomorrow after I get to Las Vegas, but what is the rational pagan belief about the afterlife, which is congruent with scientific fact?

I grew up in the Episcopal Church, and the Episcopal Church accepts science as fact, claiming only that God was the author of Nature no matter what we discover about Nature. Most MAJOR Christian sects (other than, say, the Baptists) do no claim that science is wrong, but that science only reveals God's genius and his plan. (I think it's revisionist BS, but that is what most Christian sects say about science.)

I personally think there is enough scientific proof to dismiss Adam and Eve. I also think there is enough scientific proof to dismiss Thor's escapades when it thunders...lol. ;)


Again though...I guess it is my personal opinion. Scientific 'fact' is only as factual as you want it to be I suppose....there will always be someone to refute even a very stable theory.

here's a good summary
http://www.religioustolerance.org/scirel_ov.htm

That depends a lot on what you're defining as a scientific fact.

How about (Christian) Bibles being taken faaaaaaaaaar less literally ?


ref:
http://www.faithreason.org/index.html

And another

Effect:
Creation of the Lutheran church maybe ?

That and the Renaissance. But a lotta things changed then.

And no, I'm not Christian, but I took 12 years of private christian education on the chin, so I know a thing or 2 about it :)

Wow, that does sound interesting. I am not at all familiar with the Episcopal Church. I haven't seen this line of thought in the ever prevelant 'Fundamental' Christian groups out there. So I'll have to plead ignorance here...lol. But I'd be interested to hear more about the relationship between the Major Christan sects you speak of and nature/science.

Have a safe trip to Vegas!

Interesting articles kveldulv...thanks. :)

The religious tolerence website is a good one...I've been there many times before.

I'm a little disappointed this time though...as that article says nothing about Christians adapting due to science...even though that is what the article is 'suppose' to be about??

Religious beliefs, particularly those based on a sacred text, change much more slowly. In fact, many faith groups stress the unchangeable nature of their beliefs. There are three main methods by which religions modify their teachings.

In Christianity, for example: Some Biblical passages that were once considered to be literally true are now interpreted symbolically. Heaven is no longer considered to be somewhere "up there." Hell is no longer believed to exist inside the earth.

Does the bible actually say that Heaven is 'up there' and Hell is 'down there'? Just curious....

Over the past century, Bible passages that describe torture methods inflicted on Hell's inhabitants (worms, pain, flogging, heat, thirst and flames) have been downplayed and often treated as symbolic. They are viewed as representing a person's isolateion from God.

his has nothing to do with science?

Some Biblical passages are ignored. We no longer burn some prostitutes. Sections of the Bible that condoning and regulate slavery are no longer followed. The Bible contains dozens of passages that are profoundly immoral by today's secular and religious standards of behavior. These verses are largely ignored today.

Again, nothing to do with science, but a moral shift in society.

Still other passages are interpreted as perhaps being valid for the culture and age for which they were written, but not binding in a different society or era. Male control over women, restrictions on female ordination, prohibiting women from certain professions, etc. have being largely rejected as sexist by mainline and liberal Christians.

Yet again, a moral basis for change, not scientific.

I haven't read the other articles yet, as my eyes are starting to play games so it's time to hit the hay....but I'll try to get to them tomorrow.

Thanks for the links.

Top of mind, there are some references to it in versions of the bible. Again, it is very much in the teaching of it IMO

As demonstrated here

These guys are pretty sure it's in the depths of the earth.
I remember Pastors at my high school were of differing opinions as to where it was too.

I think that science influenced christianity indirectly more than directly.

IMO, The main effect of science has been on how much people understand about the world around them. This has meant they spend less time looking elsewhere for answers; a common source of fresh blood for religions.

A direct cause-effect relationship is too simple a relationship to look for when trying to quantify changes like this.

That being said, it's friday arvo here and I'm off :)

Have a good weekend all