Question about Gambling/Roulette
 

Do casino's get pissed off when you sit at the roulette table & wait for it to hit red 3 times...then bet 500$ on black?

Is this against the rules or what?

:Graucho

Always, always go for red.

LOL. :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

This is my official 100th worthless post here on GFY. :321GFY

seriously is this against the rules?

someone who knows gambling...please fill me in

No, it is not against the rules. Remember, though, the ball does not have a memory. It could land on red a thousand times in a row.

:thumbsup :thumbsup

yeah, u can do that, but I wouldn't suggest it

try that on Hoyle and see how quick you go broke

hahaha

do you seriously think that if it came red 3 times in a row there is a higher than 50% chance that it will be black on the 4th time?

lol, go back to college or something, take a statictics course

Well i only lost once using this method, & its because it landed on 00, or 0 i forget, one of the green ones.

thank you jedi master

its random just like dice, they don't have a memory -- bet $500 on the don't pass line on a cold craps table if you want the best chance of doubling your money!

If it worked for you, it was pure coincidence and/or luck. The roulette wheel has, let's say, 37 spots on it for the ball to land in (varies slightly by casino; "0" only or "0" and "00"). When that wheel gets spun, there is a 1/37 chance of that ball landing in any given spot. There is approximately a 1/2 (again, the 0's tip the odds against you) of it landing on black. That <B>does not change</B> no matter how many times you spin the wheel. Every single spin is a 1/2 chance of either color coming up. It doesn't matter if it lands on red 500 times in a row, the 501st time you spin that wheel there is exactly the same chance of the ball landing on black as there was in the previous 500 spins.

You may think you see patterns in the short term, but it's an illusion. After a billion spins, you're going to have very nearly 500,000,000 red and 500,000,000 black (disregarding the 0's).

Bottom line: there is <B>no</B> correlation between the ball landing on any given color and the colors it landed on before that.

SpaceAce

never play insides on roulette unless u want to waste moola,
and yes its all the same shit like said above 50/50,

couldnt u figure that out?
casinos dont give a fuck wat u bet,
they have odds on every game in the house or it wouldnt b there,

the 0,00 gives them the slightest odds.

they'd love it if you did that...

they would hate if you had a system of doubling each time you lost, but thats why they have the limits, odds are they will get a run and clean you out.

I dont think they allow the double system, at least not for long.

Play blackjack its the best odds...

What he said. You are thinking of it over short term betting. This in no way works. Now if you had known what the ball had landed on say the last 100,000 times, your theory would be more accurate. Roulette is one of the shittiest odds in a casino regardless of where or how you bet. I think the percentage is 3 to 4% in favor of the house and in gambling that sucks.

Are you kidding? Casinos love it if you double up every time. First of all, the double-up system is one of the most popular and least useful methods of gambling ever invented. Keep in mind that if you double a penny 30 times it comes up to over $10,000,000. So, go ahead and start with your $5 bet and keep doubling it. You'll be into the trillions of dollars in no time. Even assuming you win within a reasonable number of bets, you basically win back all the money you bet before that and you break even. The casinos love the doubling method.

SpaceAce

agreed, thats why they put the "recent numbers" screen up, to create the illusion of a certain number or set of numbers to come up

No it is not against rules,go gambling :thumbsup

Like many people have said, the roulette ball has no memory. But what does that mean?

Say the roulette table is a fair table (no tricks or flaws cause the ball to fall onto any slot more often than any other slot). Say that there is a one-in-a-billion situation where red was hit 200 times in a row (200 times in a row is realy rare... don't feel like doing the math so I'll just pretend it's one in a billion chance of that happening). Ignoring 0 and 00, what are the odds that the next ball will fall in red after 200 reds in a row? Remember, it's one in a billion that the previous run of 200 reds would happen.

Answer: 50/50 (assuming 1/2 the slots are red and the other slots are black... remember, I'm ignoring the 0 and 00 for now). The ball doesn't give a shit if it had a streak of 200 reds before; it'll fall wherever physics tells it to fall. Thus, the ball has no memory. It's operating on the laws of physics and the randomness that the roulette table introduces on purpose. Runs happen naturally, and runs DO NOT change the probability of a future outcome. Runs can last 2 times, 3 times, 6 times, even 200 times... but each next outcome is not dependant of the previous outcome. Mathmatically, it's called "Discrete Probability" I'd throw up a link, but all of the ones I've found rely on mathematical formulas and not logic to prove their case. I don't think most folks here want to resolve a formula for proof :)

So if the outcome is 50/50 for red and black, you'd make money if you only bet black and a black streak happened to occur while you were betting. If you bet red while a red streak occured, you'd make money too. So how do casinos make money given these even odds? There *are* no even odds in casinos. Thus the 0 and 00 on a craps table. There are 35 numbers to bet on, and 37 places that the ball can fall into... 35+2 (2= 0 and 00)=37. They typically pay out as if there were only 35 places for the ball to fall into, and they keep the difference when it falls into a 0 or 00. And if they allow you to bet on a 0 or 00, they *still* pay out as if you only had a 1 in 35 chance to win, and not the true 1 in 37 chance. Some casinos are worse, and always pay out as if you have a 1 in 30 chance to win (less of a payout)... which means that the casino pockets over 3 cents for every dollar you bet. Doesn't sound like much, but if you consider the billions of dollars bet in casinos, I'd take 3% of that in a heartbeat.

Slots are even worse; some take over 15% of the money poured into them. Craps and blackjack are better, if you know some "rules" to follow... they can limit your losses to under 1%. But no matter what, unless you know enough to stop gambling when you're ahead, if you play long enough, you *will* lose. It's all a matter of how much you will lose in the long run, based upon a percentage of how much money you put on the table.

Great post, Baal. http://www.kduk.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk...leidung089.gif

that idea works, but only in theory

I have seen far too many 30-40 straight red/black streaks to ever bet that way again

I'd imagine if you were to do it 3or4 times in a night they would even give you a free room....:)

that is a very common strategy for roulette, but the magic number is usually around 6 not 3, and casino's can't get pissed off, there's nothing wrong with playing one roll then taking a break. It's kinda like when someone sits out a few hands in blackjack to try to change the cards that the dealer is getting, except in blackjack, when you do that you also change the hands that other people are getting which can piss people off unless they start winning because of it.

me and my mates used the "double up" strategy for a couple of months. got a couple of grand up on the casino. that soon came right back down to a couple of hundred profit. i ended up $300 ahead of the casino. i havent been back.

they will always get you in the end so i decided to stay ahead of them.

actually, I read somewhere there's less thAN 0.50% of chances for the ball to NOT skip a turn after 8 shots (IE if you be red-black-red-black-red-black etc.)

That's why you see most of the casino's have a limit on roulette... that is most of the time...

AND... most of the time, it gives you 5 turns..


for example, say you bet 25.. you loose.. then you bet 50, you loose, then you bet 100, you loose, then you bet 200, you loose... well, you'd have only one more time at 400 to bet... that's 5 times you can do that.... so the house keeps the odds...


off ocurse, that % is also depending on if there's 0 and 00

Hey Wizzo... How does it work in Casinos really... with the comps I mean... do ya have to ASK for it, or they just wake up and give you something at some point?

dunno.. was gambling at the Belagio last month... and some guy just said he wanted some free pass to eat, and some buffet passes...

how does that shit work?

have to take into consideration that with roulette you can play corners or sides for a 1/4 or 1/2 chance as well, so the odds are actually a bit better then 1/39 (including green)

I've never walked away from a roulette table having lost money. roulette's the easiest game in the casino

I'll share some of my knowledge...

red could come up a million times in a row....

but wont happen (i have seen several 12 in a row)

in theory 37 (singlezero) different numbers can show up in 37 spins but in average only 22 different numbers will show.

Law of the third....

now I have gone thru statistics of several million real casino spins and never have I seen more than 31 (only once) different numbers show up in 37 spins....

goto:
http://www.spielbank-hamburg.de/spie...rmanenzen.php4

all the casino numbers are uploaded daily from the casino from all tables.

Thats how you learn to play the game of roulette (or read my ebook at www.roulettebucks.com )

Rgds
Vegas

Casinos don't give a shit because the odds are in their favor... don't forget the 0 and 00 and table limits which prevent doubling.

Don't bother with casino games. As others have pointed out, they're all mathematically impossible to beat in the long run. If you must feel that rush that comes with gambling, following a good handicapper and bet on sports.

Smart words, If only I didn't live 1000 feet from a casino maybe their gravity and oxygen jacked air wouldn't suck me in!

No fucking rules... Just do it!

I have seen full table of red or black many times.

Nope. Casino is gonna love you to death. Go ahead and follow that strategy. They will LOVE you to become a regular customer. Watching you lose money will make them VERY happy!!

Sorry but it is impossible to change the odds on roulette regardless of how you play. You are probably just smart and take off when you are ahead. Roulette is in the house favor much more than some games and you can bet all the corners and halves you want.

By no means am I saying you can't win consistantly, I do it on blackjack all the time and have people argue with me all the time when I tell them my record. I live by casinos and I don't just go there to piss my money away like most people. I don't drink while I play, I pay attention, I win, and I leave while I'm ahead.

Statistics class made my head hurt.

same here, i am a 5 minute walk from one

if that were true you would be a multi-billionaire

what, do u count cards? u from miss. or louisiana?

i think 4 chances of winning as opposed to 1 chance of winning on 1 bet does increase the odds of winning. Obviously the more ground you cover with minimal bets is going to give you a better chance of winning. Then just placing a stack of chips on #12

yes i know the odds are always stacked in the casino's favor, but there are methods to help make the odds a little better for you.

maybe if i was throwing down 10,000$ bets on every spin, but my balls aren't that big yet and I don't like casino's all that much, I'm not big on gambling

I don't suppose there's an English version of that site. I would like to check it out.

I don't want to bash your ebook but I have to point out that no matter what strategy you use, the house ALWAYS has the odds in roulette. It doesn't matter if an average of 22 numbers come up in 37 spins because you don't know ahead of time <B>which</B> 22 numbers they will be. Also, 37 spins is simply not statistically significant.

Even if you watched the table for 22 spins to see which 22 numbers are going to come up, it wouldn't do you any good because then you only have 15 spins left in your 37 spins, plus you don't know when/where the "first" of the 37 spins was (since the wheel is spun constantly) so your "counting" could overlap two sets of 37 spins. Finally, it still doesn't matter what the minimum/maximum and average are because your odds of hitting the number are still 1/37 and the payouts are still around 35:1.

You can follow a strategy of always making the bets with the best percentages and in the short run the ball could take a couple of hops in your favor but over time you will lose, period. For every "streak" you get on and win, someone at the casino next door got on one and lost. There is no magic and all the analysis in the world doesn't change the fact that each spin has exactly the same odds of doing any given thing as the spin before it did. The only things that makes it look like streaks hot/cold/black/red/even/odd streaks is exist are superstition and small smaples (even if you stand around the table for 1,000 spins, it is not a significant number to work with).

Your point about red not coming up a million times in a row may be true, but that isn't because it came up red too many times before, it's simply because that (approximately) 1/2 chance went one way instead of the other. Red won't come up a million times in a row because the odds of that are (disregarding 0's) 1/2 * 1/2 * 1/2 * 1/2 * 1/2 * 1/2 * 1/2... out to a million. That is only important if you are betting on a combination of spins, though, like betting at the beginning "I bet $500 red won't come up 50 times in a row." Then, the number of times red comes up in a row affects your bet, but the important thing to remember in roulette is that those odds add up as a factor of 1/2 because <B>every single spin has a 50% chance of coming up red and a 50% chance of coming up black</B> no matter what happened before that. In case someone reads this without reading the rest of the message, I <I>know</I> it isn't 50%. I am not including the 0's.

SpaceAce

Nevermind.

SpaceAce

They don't care, I've seen people use this system. It sometimes works, sometimes doesn't. It basically allows you to trade a bunch of small wins for a few huge losses (when you can't double your bet due to the casinos max bet or your bankroll)

That being said, if you watch a table, and think their is a flaw in the table it could work

If your lucky it could work

This is the best site I've ever found about gambling, the guy who runs it is an Adjunct Professor of Gaming Math at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas and an Actuary & Consultant

http://www.wizardofodds.com/

Best advice on every casino game, odds best way to play the game etc...

Heres his quote about this mentioned system.


"This method, known as the Martingale, only works if you have an infinite supply of money and there is no maximum bet. In real life you will eventually either run up against the limit of your bankroll or the maximum bet size. Like most gambling systems this one trades a lot of small wins for a few huge losses. In the long run you will lose. "

Getting comped: think of it as frequent flyer miles. If you have a players card (FREE with your personal info!) they can rate your play. Your comp rating depends on three things:
1) the average amount you bet
2) the amount of time you play
3) the type of game you're playing

Some games have more action than others. For instance, an hour at the craps game averages 140 bets, an hour at the blackjack table averages 70 hands, so you'll get more 'comp' playing the faster games like craps and not the slower games like Pai Gow Poker.

Basically they take your average bet * number of hours played * percentage kickback = your comp.

I tend to play craps, so I usually get

$75 avg bet * X hours played * 20% (craps) = $15 kickback per hour.

Different casinos will rate you better (off the strip) or worse (on the main strip) so your avg bet could vary at each place.

I play craps with full odds (higher the better) because casino edge falls to less than 1/10 of 1%, plus I get free rooms, food, shows, etc. Money management is the most important thing, especially on craps. So far every year I've ended up between $-1500 and $11k from casinos, with overall being +low thousands. I'm rare. Most people lose because they don't know the best way to play/bet/manage money.

It's fun too. At least for me. I've seen some people go ballistic because they're playing with money they can't afford to lose. Don't be like that.

Oh, and the double up strategy is known as the 'Martingale System'.

I hear what you say but Im still ahead on the roulette table (behind on the bj table) It's still a gamble thats why i don't play 24/7 thats why I just sell my information (which to the average and above player will help them understand more and make them a better player)

I have a strategy that in theory will BEAT the roulette table but it is impossible to play both online and offline... but in theory it wins.

im ready to bet against anyone inhere that if we were to start a roulette tournament then I would either:

a. be the winner or
b. be the last one with bankroll left.

and thats with a betting on all spins rule :P

time to sleep here!

Night night!
Vegas

wait til it hits red three times, then put all your money on black,

HAHAHAHAHAA


The casino will be MORE than happy to allow you to do that.

It's people's inability to understand the dynamics of probability that make the casino's so much money. Well, that and greed.

i used to live with 2 ppl in a share house that did work in a casino they can roll a ball if they have any skill into a part of a wheel but not into 1 # or colour

on the side of a table u have whats called a race track means u can bet on part of a wheel ie 1/4 of the wheel well if they r good at there job they can drop the ball into the part or not

wheres my dvd player :winkwink:

If you say that, I don't doubt it. One person is not a significant study, though. If you play long enough you must lose because there is <B>no</B> roulette bet with odds in your favor. That means you <B>will</B> lose in the long run. The only way to avoid that is to not play enough to constitue a "long run" in which case you need to rely on luck and the best possible odds (all of them being against you) to stay ahead.

Well, I'm not looking to purchase any ebooks but if you want to discuss it here, I'm game. I do not believe there is any twisting of mathematics that can ever, ever, ever "beat" a roulette table. Probability is simply not in your favor. You can only beat the table as long as your 22 numbers keep coming up or the ball doesn't land in the green. There is nothing you can do to turn the odds in your favor. The 22-number thing, streaks, etc, are all <I>illusions</I>, they don't exist. No matter how many millions of spins you study and see that 'x' numbers came up in a row this many times or only 'y' numbers came up in so many spins, taken out across enough spins all those numbers will come up equal numbers of times. 37 spins on one table may yield only 22 numbers, but once you factor in the thousands of tables being spun all around the world at that moment, you'll see that all the numbers came up in what will be reasonably close to a 1/37 probability.

Losing the least is not the same as winning.

SpaceAce

spaceace is right.
u cannot beat the casino.