Just got robbed by CCBill
 

I needed some cheques reissued because they had expired. Contacted support and they said a stop payment fee of $20 for each cheque would be required or to send the physical cheques back to them to reconcile them and resend them out next billing cycle. A month later nothing in the mail so I contacted them again. Now I'm doing email tag with them. They just need reissue and send back. Anyone else experienced this? Is this how we do business now?

CCBill is a big company, would never trust mailing them checks physically back would make it to the right people.

thank the assholes who got new checks and cashed the old ones. :2 cents: have the company re issue the checks. the title is bullshit :2 cents: :disgust

Wrong title, man ...

Rather than play email tag, just call them and work it out over the phone. Usually much much faster.

Also there's nothing unusual about what they're doing. Yet you think it necessary to use "Just got robbed by CCBill" as your post, what the hell?

I predicted Nostradamus' death, just moments before he died.

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Thank you, and god bless.

I had exactly the same issue, I forgot to tell them I moved, 4 years ago, I've got a tiny affiliate account but still worth a few hundred bucks.

I gave up in the end and just pulled the links.

$20 per weekly check over 4 years made it ridiculous.

Cunts.

Most banks charge $20 to stop a payment on a check. I would bet that Merrick bank, who processes for CCBill, charges them exactly $20 per stop check. You moved and forgot to tell them to send to new address? That's 100% your fault.

Why weren't the checks just forwarded with the rest of your mail?

Since they will get a stop payment fee for each and every check from their own bank, it is perfectly reasonable to pass that charge on to the payee if CCBill is not at fault. There is also a labor cost for them reissue checks. Their only obligation is to send a check on time, to the address they have on file.

The thread title is extremely misleading since you forgot to deposit the checks. They'd only be robbing you is they refused to re-issue the check even if you're willing to pay their expenses for doing so.

Why didnt you cash the checks?

intresdating

interesdating

Did it 2 times and never had an issue. Yeah its a big company with a Billing department and thats what they do.

You were expecting them to take on around $4000 in bank charges to get you paid? You're right, that is ridiculous.

For reals, I don't understand how someone could be indignant about this. Especially someone like DJ who fancies himself the smartest & commen sensest guy in the room.

Also if the checks averaged over $20 each wouldn't you still be getting a net profit when all was said & done?

people who demand the check back, or a stop fee, for expired checks are cunts, and that's a fact :2 cents:

As much as I can't stand Damian, why exactly would the bank charge someone for re-issuing checks that are expired? There's no $4k involved at all :)

do youself a favour and register wire transfer, this way they cant rob you.
mistitle.

I know that you aren't American so you may not understand how American banks work with checks, but they always charge you a cancellation fee. And checks don't really "expire", despite the "void within X days" written on the check, it depends on a variety of factors.

So yes, there is $4000 involved, if there really were weekly checks for 4 years. It's probably more than $4000 if they all needed to be canceled.

Just to back up what Sly says, that expiration date isn't always 100% binding and in any event CCBill could put themselves at risk for various fees if someone tried to deposit them.

It'll be nice when checks are phased out altogether, at this point they're pretty much obselete.

Yeah I thought that might be the case actually after I posted :thumbsup

It's pretty unfathomable for us in the UK anyway at least, for a check that when presented at the bank which cannot be cashed, there'd be any kind of fee to 'stop' that uncashable check.

While we're on the subject though, what is the absolute need to 'stop' the check? As in, I've been turned down before now to write VOID in big red letters all over the front, rip it in half, and scan it, so there's zero way for it to actually be presented at a bank, but this wasn't proof enough that I wasn't going to attempt fraud, and the issuer still needed to put a stop on the check. I mean, how the fuck does the bank know what is owed and what is not - surely you'd write another check and simply not inform the bank?

The check could still be copied or counterfeited in some way, shape, or form. I personally would never reissue a check without canceling it. There are too many potential risks over what amounts to $20-25 in cancellation fees. Some companies will let you return a check and then not officially "cancel" the check, but that can often cause paperwork issues and "policy" issues.

If you run a company of any size, you try to streamline your business as much as possible to keep expenses down and revenue up for everyone. This streamlining means the dreaded implementation of "policies." Typically policies work for the betterment of everyone, but occasionally someone may lose.

It is 100% the discretion of the bank. And it can sometimes create a mess for sure. I speak from experience - years ago I worked as a case manager for a bank's loss prevention unit for checking account fraud. There are so so many scams and snafus possible, that's why I said it'll be nice when checks are phased out.

Thing is, even a stop payment isn't foolproof - some banks only honor them for 6 months or another arbitrary period of time.

Thanks guys, that's enlightened me somewhat. I'll leave it at "american banks are a bit more fucked up than UK ones" :D

Why didn't you cash your checks?

checks expire in 12 months unless it says something different on the check.

good luck trying to deposit a 2 year old check

How is this CCBills fault at all ? :error

It's unfortunate but not CCBill's job to hold your hand and check you are on top of handling your personal finances or updating your contact details which can be done online in about 2 mins from anywhere 24/7

Raise your minimum payout and switch to electronic wire,this way your money will follow you if you move unless you change banks.

Not CCBILL's fault at ALL! Definitely not "robbery"...
If a girl who has a split of % coming to her from one of my websites moves...doesn't give me her new address - AND I TELL THEM FROM THE VERY BEGINNING "IF YOU MOVE I HAVE TO HAVE YOUR NEW ADDRESS FOR YOU TO KEEP GETTING YOUR CHECK..." - and then her checks stop coming and her $$$$ accumulates in CCBILL until I eventually know I am never getting her new address, or any contact whatsoever...
The eventually forfeits back to me (as agreed in our website agreement)...well that's not me robbing her...
It is her not being smart enough to change her address and collect her checks.
DUH!

I agree. You ask ANY company to reissue checks and it's a hassle.

CCBill is pretty good.

Damn I was about to contact them for the same reason. Thanks for letting me know.

Be happy that ccbill have actually agreed to reissue them - one sponsor grudgingly agreed to reissue a check that was something like 9 months old, but said that going forward they would no longer reissue a check that was more than 6 months old.

IOW, if it's over 6 months old, my payment is effectively lost for good.

I have done this with CC bill a few times over the years. It's not there fault just get new checks issued and if you have them send back the old checks. Last time I did this was recently took about 6 weeks and I live in Australia.

This :2 cents::2 cents:

Me too.

I knew American banks screwed over their customers, but had no idea of the extent!

I apologise for saying CCBill were to blame!

No real worry, only a few hundred bucks anyway.

My thoughts exactly. Not ccbill's fault.:upsidedow

Sounds like CCBill gave you all of the available options honestly. Mail them physically back (maybe by certified mail next time or other "signature required" by recipient method) or pay the stop fee.

So much fail...

eMonk : Starting a "CCBill Robbed me" thread makes you look bad. Really bad.

It's very simple. The bank is not responsible for a lost check, so they charge the issuer to put a stop payment on it. If the issuer mailed it to the address that you provided to them, they transfer the cost of any stop payment you request on to you.

If you sent a check to to someone and they gave you the wrong address, or moved without telling you, you would have to pay for a stop payment then spend the time to issue a new one, and make the changes in your accounting at the same time. Now imaging doing that for thousands of people. The costs add up fast.

CCBill didn't rob you. You made a $20.00 mistake. Simple as that.

sly, ccbill needs to hire you :)

But it's DamianJ. Certainly they can make an exception for him.

Huh? This isn't a British vs American thing. UK banks will also charge a stop payment fee, and if your billing company or sponsor is based out of the UK they will also pass that charge on to you (and rightfully so). Some banks (regardless of the country) will waive occasional fees like this if they happen infrequently for personal accounts or whatnot, but not for a large billing company that issues thousands of checks each week. This is just how it works.

I'm surprised this is such a new concept to some of you guys, but there ya go.

If I'm CCBill and I choose to do business with X bank, you're damned well sure they're waiving the fucking fees. lol. :winkwink:

Damn you!

I came in here looking for drama and now I'm hungry. :)

We don't have an expiry date, which is where the heart of the confusion with the UK peeps is coming from :thumbsup I, at least, considered an expired check as a void check that cannot be cashed. Previous posters have said why that's not the case, so in that respect yes, you'd have to cancel the check as in both instances the check is 'live', so to speak :)

This scenario wouldn't arise with a UK check, as it would never expire, hence the slight dumbfoundedness (on my part anyway) as to the whole charging to stop a useless check - which this thread has cleared up is not useless after all. So yeah, US banks are fucked up :winkwink:

Yeah, it is kind of confusing all around.

Also, here in the US not all personal or business checks have an expiration dates, it's not like that is some automatic requirement - it's just something CCBill (and other businesses) choose to print on their checks. A UK company could certainly choose to do this also and some of them do. IMO it's smart policy for CCBill or any payment processor, because of the nature of their business - issuing thousands and thousands of checks to random contractors that may or may not have their shite together.

Those expiration dates aren't even technically completely binding, again any check can be cashed (or not) at the discretion of the individual banks. Back when I worked in the bank loss prevention department I definitely saw "expired" checks that someone let through the process, though of course this usually wound up being a pain in the ass for all involved, so it's in their best interest to pay attention to them.

Actually many banks will hesitate to honor a check that's more than 6-12 months old even if there's no expiration date. And I know for a fact from my previous work experience many UK banks have that policy as well. 6 months is often standard.

Not that I'm defending the honor of the US financial industry by any stretch :1orglaugh Just trying to explain that this practice is maybe more universal than some of you guys think.

Fun fact: CCBill has a 15-20% decline rate on cards.

and a 12% form submission rate cap....depending on who you are you may qualify for the handy dandy 15% form submit cap, but the 12% cap is for VIP's like me:thumbsup

Correct. UCC only allows them to decline stale dated checks. It does not require a bank to do so. Any bank will recommend that you put a stop payment order on any check you do not wish to have paid if presented.

Even the "void after XX days" is just a request, as banks do not have to honor any signature lines. It's like that so that they do not have to worry about a million variables when processing a million checks a day. That and with Check21, many checks are never seen by bank personnel unless it ends up in the exceptions pile.

Do you have a source or evidence for that?