Webmaster: "designers work your magic" Is just not enough information.
 

LOL I get this so often to questions like..."what exactly are you needing?"

"I don't know, just work your magic!."

This the beginning of a communication breakdown that will ultimately lead to you as the client being unhappy with the finished product more often than not.

Designers...or gallery makers..banner makers etc. We are there to translate your vision from though to reality.

It is not our vision you want, my vision will more than likely differ from yours.

So what's the point?

If you wish to contract a new designer/gallerymaker etc. Sit down and really think out what it is exactly you are wanting.

What is it you sell.

What ideas, thoughts, statements are you trying to convey.

What colors work best on your site, what fonts, what text?

Give this all to whoever it is you decide to work with and I guarantee you in the end you'll be much more happier than if the designer just worked his/her magic.

Good advice Eros:thumbsup

these are the worst!

great post eroswebmaster


:1orglaugh

I try to be really clear when I spec something out like this..

Not that I have ever needed a lot of graphic design type stuff done.. but there has been some over the years. :)

i cast level 3 eroticism on this thread

i simply do ther work and they never seem to complain when they say that.

"do your magic"

thats all i hear, just sit back and do it.

barbers get it, hairstylists, everyone with a service with any talent gets told "do your magic" see it in music studios and effect studios all the time ;)

just do it!

:thumbsup

Hmm... I like being able to give someone a project, say "do what you think is best", and come out with something good.

"Do your magic" works fine for me. Designers must have an easy time picking up on what I like/dislike.

But who is to blame when they fail?

Eros, I can give you as much information to go on as you want, if you are interested in working on our TGPs - please ICQ me if you are interested: ICQ 125667290 , Vanessa - Adult Action Cash

Thanks god i'm not the only one that gets that shit. :winkwink:

quite a good few professional relationships have been cut short because people do not know what they want. what they do know, however, is that it is nothing that you have showed them.

Why would you entrust the vision of YOUR site to someone else?

that's like going into a car dealership with $40k in cash, handing it to the man and saying, yeah i was a car, just pick me something good.

Who says I blame anyone? I work with the designer to find something that we both like and think will work well. I'm too busy to run around blaming people for problems.

Ahh..but you are now saying you "work with the designer," to find something that will work well..that's far different than just saying..."work your magic."

I look at the portfolio and when I like what he does I'll tell him he should do it like he always does it,if I would really know what I want I wouldn't hire somebody to do it :winkwink:
If I wouldn't like certain parts I'm sure most designers would be happy to correct it,but I don't think it'll ever happen.

Vanessa Marc my project manager is going to contact you right now. :)

"Do your magic" = "I aint paying if I don't like it"

No. First I say "work your magic". If it isn't what I like, then I "work with the designer".

we're nott alking about cars and 40k, we're talking about galleries and graphics.

I get the "do your magic" all the time too and have never seen anyone complain on this board.

I dont even see what the big rush is about.

I use to help paint murals on walls during art school, the people didnt pick us to do it because we could "do what they wanted" it was because they trusted us in our own performance to do a good project.

I have watched interviews with effect studios regarding lets say Jason VS Fredy, and its the effect studio who makes the cool pinball scene, not the director, you trust the guy you pay to create, not simply read your mind.

maybe we all work different, I prefer to be left to just create more often than told what to do per inch.

the more i am limited the slower i work.

:thumbsup

Why waste your time?
Sure you may have not had issues just yet...but why not go ahead and be prepared?

Why waste the designers time?

This has nothing to do with talent..it has everything to do with communication.

so very true... and I've said this same thing for years.

But.... the hard truth is alot of them really don't know what they want, and it then falls on you to try and extract as much information as you can, information that they may not be able to think of themselves or even regard as important to the project, (because you are the expert, not them) and use it to "work the magic"..... or as we designers like to call it, "build a composition that fits exactly into the clients strategy and purpose for needing the site in the first place".

I have found that if you grill them for too many technical/incidental details like fonts and shadows, etc.... you will only end up with a frustrated client that is convinced you can't think for yourself and need someone to hold your hand every step of the way.

So, you're function should not be to read their mind about every detail, but to squeeze a general basic idea and plan out of them and think up the rest yourself, keeping the client's best interests in mind throughout the project.

They're function should be to be able and willing to give you that basic idea, and be available for questions you may need answered along the way. If someone is extraordinarily particular about controlling every last detail, they will do that from the start. They will tell you they want 12 point Arial at the top saying "Bitches that fuck like beasts!". They will tell you they want Periwinkle Blue. So, with the exception of the occasional control freak, yes..... "working the magic" actually does fall on you.

How am I wasting my time when my main designer hits it perfect almost every time? I'd be wasting time if I spent 2-3 hours prepping a design project for him since he already has a fairly clear idea of what I want.

Couple weeks ago he built me a FPA. I had absolutely no idea what I wanted. I gave him some basic specs and things that I expected. He came back with a pretty good FPA, I had him make a couple text changes (took 5 minutes of my time) and bam, project complete and it only took 10 minutes of my time.

Had I planned out "exactly what I wanted", how much time do you think I would have wasted? A lot.

To me, a designer is more of an architect than a house painter.

Of course I only used things like fonts for example...I normally don't ask about such things unless I show something and they say..."I don't like the font." Then I try to get an idea of what it is they want or are looking for...and even at times ask if they have something in mind.

If this is someone you work with on a regular basis then we're discussing apples and oranges.

Sure that person has an idea of what it is you're looking for...but if you're working with a new designer you're going to have to give them some kind of direction.

I think it has to do with the experience level of the client. People that have been around, tend to say "work your magic" and not complain about the end result. Mostly, I think, because they know it's a numbers game. The more galleries they push the more traffic they get. Thus it only wastes their time to complain over a background color. And wasted time means wasted traffic. They'd rather just hire somebody else to do them if they're not happy with the end result.

On the other hand it seems that new people are often the cheapest and bicker over the smallest detail in the end result. I think they haven't figured out yet that it's a numbers game. One gallery means so much more to them than to somebody that orders 30.

:2 cents:

The upside to the "work your magic" guys are they tend to be easier to deal with and please. When someone shows up with an exact list of what they want and how they want it, expect delays and redo's, because in their mind they envision something and you need to make it exact. I like these "magic" guys because they allow you creative freedom, whereas the other guy will put you in a box. I prefer to be creative and not guided.

That's true too.

This is very true.

I don't think anyone here is looking for the control freak to work with on either end..designer or client.

But I do enjoy those guys that order like 100+ galleries and not one single complaint out of them :)

Bang. Dead on the money.

Given that the client is experienced, and the designer is experienced, there may be normal minor changes here and there, but usually nothing extreme unless something is just obviously really wrong.

But the inexperienced (both client and designer) just like you said, tend to nipick over every last pixel. And this doesn't mean someone should do sloppy work instead, but 14 color & font changes to decide which one you like best is absurd and the mark of inexperience. (on both sides)

i love being left to create, but i like to make sure that the website/gallery/logo i'm making has a good deal of personal feedback from the buyer. because in the end, that site or piece of art you make represents them.

and i know if i had someone creating something for me, that i would want my hand in it from step one to completion.

but i tend to be a control freak about anything of my own. :winkwink:

So far this hasn't been my experience.

The easiest people to work with are the ones who are ready.

They have images/videos all zipped up..psds..fonts...tour links etc and shoot them to you without even asking.

It's the ones who say..."work your magic," that I have to come back and draw all of the info out of them.

The point is moot now for me...we have an order form that pretty much gathers all that info now...and my project manager works with the client until everything is ready to hand over to me.

Someone work this in there design business model philosophy and watch someone in this thread end up riddled with a complaint on a "Work your Magic" order next week on GFY:1orglaugh

LOL we see it daily here...complaints in one form or another and it all derives from lack of communication.
oh and scammers...LOL

One thing to keep in mind is everybody works differently, both clients and designers. Some designers barely need anything more than a user name and password, while others need a great deal of "stuff". I've worked with both.

Of course..I can deal with both..but the point still stands..communication or lack of is one of the main downfalls of business transactions..outside of scammers or course.

Yeah it sucks when magic translates into reading their mind.

Or the best is when someone wants a good deal, but uses another designer's killer tour design (more $$$$) as an example of what they are looking for. Especially when you don't even design like that and are not charging those prices either. That's the best type of client :1orglaugh

For the designers, keep in mind, if you do a comp for someone and they don't like it for whatever reason, you don't need to look at that as a failure. Stick that comp away in your toolbox because someone somewhere WILL like it. You simply adapt it to the new guy, drop in his content and logos, and there ya go. Save everything you do whether it sells or not. If it sells, it's best to keep copies of everything for obvious reasons, and if it doesn't sell.... someday it will.

And thus the advantage of working with the same designer over a period of time, or the experienced designer that you've really taken the time to go over their portfolios.

i'm like that on graphics. I lack imagination when it comes to designs, so it's very good if the designer has ideas to share and create.

As long as your shit doesn't become too templated. That's one of the big disadvantages of referencing your old work to do new stuff. It becomes easier to copy old ideas, than think fresh.

Why can't I say "work your magic"?

Many people are forced to wear many hats in this business. Designers get to be like an advertising studio, heck they actually should be called that instead of designers.

If I was running a large company and wanted exposure for my widgets. I would go to a design firm and tell them here are my widgets help me sell them. They may ask what kind of ads I will be running or they may suggest a package that they think is best.

They then will try to get some information from me about the widgets. Then they go and do their thing. They come back with a few concepts and I would say yes that is it, or no change this and so on.

They should not be asking me what font I desire for my ad, or what pictures should I use to sell my product. They shouldnt have to ask what copy to use or what shade of baby blue do I want.

I may not be a creative type, I may not get what consumers like or dislike. I should be able to leave that vision to professionals in their field. If it does not work, yes it is either the ad firms fault or my product just sucks. I then have the choice of trying another firm or eventually relizing my product has no future. It just is not my duty to hold the ad companies hand throughout the project giving my 2 cents every step of the way.

where would all the rock bands be without engineers and producers?

Mutt Lange must hate it when people tell him to "work his magic"

but Back In Black sounds sooo good!

:winkwink: