Moral Question
 

If you start start service with a company - say a landscaper at your home - and after six months of service you notice they haven't billed you.... What would you do?

Pay the man his money, you will feel better about the deal in the end.

That's a hard one - Is the LandScaper a big national or a guy with a lawnmower?..

I lived in a flat in London for 5 years and never paid a gas bill - I took it over from a guy who had not paid it for a lot longer than that - I will admit I occasionally woke up worrying about it.....


A landscaper is a bit different - Karma is a bitch - Pay it - Possibly...

Pay the man! I bet i would do that.

Some companies are so stupid. How can you go 6 months and not get paid?

True story.
My Dad once employed someone to put a new window in the side of his house. The guy came and measured up. The work included installing a new window, and decorating. The quote wasn't peanuts.

Anyway, the guy came and did the job. Was there about 4 full days.

As the guy completed my Dad asked how he wanted to be paid. Cash he said and I will call and collect.
A couple of weeks passed and he never came so my Dad called him up and asked him to call round for payment.
Another couple of weeks passed and he had still not seen the builder so he called him up again and again..

This went on for almost 6 months until my Dad just stopped calling. The guy never came to collect his money.

In this case it's not a landscaper, just an an example....

We did have the same issue with our landscaper when we first moved here. We had multiple houses, multiple landscapers, and every month we paid "multiple landscapers" just never noticed we weren't paying the one for the house here in California. This went on for three years; They added us to the route to be serviced but not the billing. When we figured it out we brought it to their attention and it turns out it was a huge company.... The general manager was a complete and utter dick - I was pissed. They would have cut my grass until the end of time if I didn't tell them they weren't billing me. They stopped service the following week, and the more we emailed each other the more hostile he got. I dragged it out as long as possible just to fuck with him because I can be a dick too.

I'd pay the guy.

Fair's fair.

It was a funny story with that gas bill as well - I knew the guy who had the flat before us - He was an old fashioned gentleman - He called the gas company so many times and practically begged them to take his money - They point blank refused...

I wasn't so charitable - The couple who took it from us still live there 15 years later - They still have free gas - I see them regularly.....

I had no idea that paying someone what they were owed was such a dilemma. Having this question alone already shows where morals lie.

what difference does it make? so when company is over certain size it somehow becomes ok to fuck them over?

You just spent several posts arguing with 12clicks in regards to whether or not he screwed people over. And here you are saying that if the other guy is rich, sure, screw him over?

I would pay them, or at least tell them I hadn't gotten a recent bill so they could go back and check their mistake.

Many years (back in about 2000 or 2001) I signed up with a hosting company that never billed me. I contacted them a few times and asked about the bill and they said they would get back to me. After 4-5 months of me contacting them at least twice a month I gave up. I had sites on their network for about 2 years before they went out of business.

It didn't shock me that they went under. I tried to pay them and they wouldn't take my money.

You would be amazed how many big companies refuse to take your money - I had a credit card and they misspelled my name - Because I could not prove that I was DamiEn and not DamiAn it went all sorts of fucked up - I never did pay it...

Sometimes you have to use judgement - Are they just being stupid - If they are a big company that are being stupid because they are too big to manage then fuck them - They would do it to you in a blink of an eye...

Comparing that to 12Clicks is ridiculous - The guy is a scavenger preying on individuals weaknesses...

Your argument is the following: 12clicks is evil because he takes advantage of those too stupid to know better. You are not evil because the other party is too stupid to charge you.

And you don't see the correlation. Shocking.

If the obvious answer isn't "do the right thing" then its clear where the problem is in this equation.

I've had this problem with my propane company. It is a huge hassle to track them down to pay the bill, then when I finally do pay, they start telling me the previous paid one is overdue and such. I'm about to switch companies because of it.

That's the simplistic answer - 1+1=2 - Its a great way of making a point but not always accurate because the equation is not always that simple in real life...

Basic ethics are rather simple. Either you're honest...or not.

I think Sly makes a good point.

So 100% honesty is the way to go - Even Jesus thinks that's BS - 'Let he without sin cast the first stone' - Or something like that...

It might not have even been Jesus - You know what I mean though.....

Monday I sent out two dozen emails to Dating Factory affilaites that are due a payment, but haven't filled in their billing details. To date only one of them got back me.

I've always maintained that honesty is the best policy, yes.

Jesus? Jesus? (sorry, the reference is lost on this atheist...but I get the antiquated proverb you were aiming for).

But this wasn't as much about honesty vs. dishonesty - but the rather apparent contradiction Sly was pointing out.

All due respect...you're a good guy and all - just having a little fun watchin' you squirm on this one. :winkwink:

OK - I'm a hypocrite - I admit it:helpme...

I knew I was going to lose this battle - :error.....

You are. You argue with those that you believe are thieves, yet you feel it's okay for you to be a thief so long as it fits within your view. For all you know, that payment that you didn't want to pay because the rich guys already have enough money, could be the payment that gets somebody fired.

How does that fit in with your view?

ETD PWNED.

But yeah, pay the mofos their money big company or small.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

I'm quite sure I have a few hypocrisies in my own inventory of opinions and statements over the years. :winkwink:

At least you honestly admit to it.

I have one hosting company not billing for months, I notified them, they said "ok we will fix the issue and bill you", but nothing.
It seems like they are concentrating on their new venture (other hosting company) and deserted this one, although they still reply to tickets (which you must submit through their new company as primary company's ticket system is broken).
My account their is only few bucks a months there though.

You pay him...its the right thing to do and you dont need the karma

not paying him puts you in the same category of scumbags as Fabian, Bob Rice, Feras Antoon, and that lot...

if they did a good job and yer happy with it you pay em

intradesting thought processes here. How many in this thread have EVER torrented a movie? Ripped a song from youtube and burned it to a cd?

How many of those same people (ie everyone) would rob £10 off a granny?

I torrent films/music all the time, and don't feel even the slightest bit guilty. I'd chase/pay the guy who did some landscaping for me every time. I'd fuck over British Gas or Thames Water every time if I could, and lose zero sleep over it. I'm practically begging a coder, 4 weeks after he did a job for me, to send me an invoice for $50 so I can tip him. I would feel no guilt whatsoever if I didn't pay Sky for years but still got all their channels. And so on :)

Thank god for that - I was thinking about writing a letter and confessing my sins...

Since you bring up payments, why doesn't DatingFactory.us offer checks as an option?

I've never done that.

The only songs I've ever downloaded have been through Rhapsody or iTunes; I was very late to transition over to digital music and when I did I ripped my 500+ CD collection so that gave me a huge start. From there buying music was no big deal at .99 cents each.

The only movies I've ever downloaded have been to my Kindle using Amazon, and I just recently signed up for Netflix.

Dating Factory is located in the UK, and the accounting office cuts the checks. They would come from the UK which take a long time. In the event there is an issue, checks would have be returned to the UK, and then a new check issued.... It will take forever.

Paypal and bank wire are the way to go.

Here is another example... When I bought my house I went to have the power turned on in my name. I gave them my address and it turns out they had no such address in their system. It took us months to figure it out... My house was a model home, and was built before there the streets were named. The power to the house was turned on under a corporate account listed in Sacramento.

I'm guessing I could have left the power on in their name and no one would have been any wiser.

ok how about:

watched a copyrighted show/clip on youtube or listened to a copyrighted song on youtube
used a cracked software version
watched a copyrighted porn scene on a porn tube
kept the over-change in a store
kept quiet/didn't go back knowing you were under-charged in a store
gone home from work early/arrived at work late/took a longer break than entitled to
declared less than every penny earned to the taxman

Sucks when you do the right thing and the world does not give you back the goodness you deserve.

I don't think there is a huge difference between a big company and a small one, in this scenario, other than that sometimes a small one will appreciate your honesty more, while a lone employee at a big one might just be peeved that he had to do paperwork or you showed up his mistake.

Or promised that you wouldn't come in her mouth.

Shit, I could have spun that argument and taken the round...

Next time.....

Always remember that when a big company takes a hit, THEY never take the hit. They pass it on down the line. Some sub contracting wage slave (cleaning crew, lunch ladies or whatever) gets their hours cut. Shareholders and CEO's dont lose out. Some smaller fish gets fucked.
Last big film I was on almost every department lost hours or lost staff because funding was reduced because it was expected to not make as much money because of piracy. Company passed that shit on, they still made their money while the crew all had less work than what they signed on for. I said no to a European tour for that fucking film.
Big company or small, make every effort to pay the man. If they go out of their way to make it hard for you to do that... well, fuck em.

Was Jesus the name of the Landscaper, and was he perhaps Mexican by any chance???